Which of FUNimation's Name Changes Bother You the Most?

[Zephyr]

I mean, when I hear "Vegerot," I think "rotten vegetables." Buu, Piccolo, etc. may sound weird and all, but they don't have me thinking about the 2 year old onions in the bottom drawer of my fridge

I shudder to imagine what "Kakarot" makes you think of.

[ABED]

Even Kageta would be better than Vegerot

[Izanagi]

"Bulla", "Hercule", "Krillin", "Tien Shinhan", "Vegito", "Frieza".

I also cannot stand "Destructo Disc", "Spirit Bomb", "Tri Beam", and especially "Special Beam Cannon". What kind of stupid name is that? I liked the German "Höllenspiral" (Spiral of Hell) much better.

[Kunzait_83]

Destructo Disc and Special Beam Cannon deserve a special place at the very rock bottom of this particular barrel. Not only for not being anywhere near close to the correct names, but even way more so than that just for being unbelievably, cringingly stupid and godawful corny-ass sounding names unto themselves (contrasted in the former's case with how awesome a name Kienzan is). Those in particular have the distinct odor of Power Rangers-era Saban all over them (neither would feel the least bit out of place in any given episode of that godawful show). I don't care how much of a little kid anyone was at the time, there's ZERO excuse for having EVER thought that either of those names sounded the least bit even vaguely approaching the same zipcode as badass or cool-sounding.

All of the dub names in general though are annoying in and of themselves if only due to the senseless and totally avoidable and unnecessarily needless confusion they've brought into the wider fandom as a whole. They're just another layer of division and add more to the general sense that "we're not all talking about the same Dragon Ball series here".

I liked the German "Höllenspiral" (Spiral of Hell) much better.

Spiral of Hell is an amazing name for that attack.

[DanielSSJ]

Wanna know what's confusing? The fact that FUNimation calls the Sokidan "Spirit Ball" of all things. Not only is this not at all descriptive of what the attack does, but since it's so similar to the name "Spirit Bomb", a decent sized portion of the dub fans thinks that Yamcha can use the Genki Dama.

[MyVisionity]

Not to mention that the choice to use the -n spelling makes little sense to begin with.

What do you mean it doesn't make any sense? It makes ALL the sense! The full word isn't "Saiya" but "Saiya-jin" with "-jin" being a suffix indicating a person belonging to. Its equivalent in English is how a person from America is American. So "Saiya-jin" becoming "Saiyan" is completely valid, unless you'd prefer some other Anglicized suffix. How about Saiyaite? Saiyish? We are Saiyanese if you please?

What I mean is that there is no such place as "Saiya". Saiya is the name of the race, not its homeland. So why is there an -n attached? How does that make any sense?

[ShadowBardock89]

"Kaiō-Sama" being changed to "King Kai"
"Kaiōshin" Being changed to "Supreme Kai"

These two do not actually bother me.

[DanielSSJ]

What I mean is that there is no such place as "Saiya". Saiya is the name of the race, not its homeland. So why is there an -n attached? How does that make any sense?

Gaffer Tape made it pretty clear, if you ask me. Just as the suffix "jin" is used to denote belonging to a certain group, such as race or ethnicity in Japanese, adding an "n" at the end of a word indicates the same idea in English. A person from America would be called an American in English, but in Japanese, they'd be called an Amerikajin, mirroring relationship between the words Saiyan and Saiyajin. And you can't even place the blame on FUNimation for this. The word "Saiyan" has been used on Japanese merchandise long before Dragon Ball Z ever came to America.

These two do not actually bother me.

I don't like the way that FUNimation translates Kaio and Kaioshin on their own, but what really grinds my gears is that they left the Kaio-ken untranslated for some reason. Kaio literally named the technique after himself. If you're going to call him "King Kai" then the move should be called "King Kai Fist", though I'd personally prefer a different translation.

[MyVisionity]

What I mean is that there is no such place as "Saiya". Saiya is the name of the race, not its homeland. So why is there an -n attached? How does that make any sense?

Gaffer Tape made it pretty clear, if you ask me. Just as the suffix "jin" is used to denote belonging to a certain group, such as race or ethnicity in Japanese, adding an "n" at the end of a word indicates the same idea in English. A person from America would be called an American in English, but in Japanese, they'd be called an Amerikajin, mirroring relationship between the words Saiyan and Saiyajin.

Again, that explanation barely makes sense. America is a place. Namek/Namekku-sei is a place. Earth/Chikyuu is a place. "Saiya" is not a place, it's the name of the race. The "-n" reasoning just doesn't cut it.

And you can't even place the blame on FUNimation for this. The word "Saiyan" has been used on Japanese merchandise long before Dragon Ball Z ever came to America.

That might explain the absence of logic in FUNi's naming, but it still doesn't change the fact that they still chose to use that spelling in their dub. Or that Simmons chose to use it in his subtitles. How can anyone justify that?

[DanielSSJ]

Again, that explanation barely makes sense. America is a place. Namek/Namekku-sei is a place. Earth/Chikyuu is a place. "Saiya" is not a place, it's the name of the race. The "-n" reasoning just doesn't cut it.

A) Saiya is not the name of the race. Saiyajin is. The name of their race specifically includes the Japanese "person" suffix used to denote groups, and the closest English equivalent is the "-an" we use to denote nationality and/or ethnicity. If it bothers you that much, you could call them "Saiya people".
B)For what it's worth, it's speculated in the GT Perfect Files that before they took over Planet Plant/Vegeta, the Saiyans came from a planet called Saiya.

[PFM18]

"Kaiō-Sama" being changed to "King Kai"
"Kaiōshin" Being changed to "Supreme Kai"

These two do not actually bother me.

Yeah I appreciate those, I actually prefer them. I mean it makes sense and Kaio's same literally translates to something with "King" in it IIRC.

The worst one to me is changing "Toppo" to "Top"

[linkdude20002001]

I feel like you should probably step away and come back when you're less tired, and more able to phrase things more coherently, in terms of what you're trying to say in the second paragraph; I simply don't get what you mean as it stands.

In terms of what you say at the start, though, "Ree-koom" is better because it at least is somewhat close to the origin word. Rather than romanising the rearranged Japanese approximation of the root English word, we're looking at the original English word, cream, and basing our pronunciation off how that is pronounced. Move the C further over and add the extra syllable, and we get Reacoom. So... My point is, if you pronounce it more like "Ree-koom", with emphasis on the first syllable, we're actually paying attention to the root word, and pronouncing it in a way that somewhat suggests what the original was. It's still somewhat cryptic, but at least this way, there's a logic to it that actually respects the English root word.

Again, it's the logic of "Yes, Torunkusu is how it's said in Japanese, but Trunks makes more sense in English."

If it helps, try looking at it somewhat backwards: If we have Reacoom(Pronounced with the emphasis on the first syllable, making "Ree-koom"), and someone is trying to figure out the pun in a vacuum, they might try shifting the syllables around, giving them "Koo-ream". That then very obviously sounds like "Cream", and thus it becomes a case of "Oh, it's like they stretched 'Cream' into two syllables, then swapped it around. That's kinda cool."
In this respect, it becomes an English equivalent of what happened in the Japanese version; they got KURIMU, swapped the first and second syllables around, and put that as his name, RIKUMU.
I dare you to try to find any logic that works on the name as-is in a vacuum with Funimation's Recoome/"Ruh-koom"... Koorum? Kuroom?... As with most other romanisations that don't pay attention to the root meaning, it just doesn't work in English.

Basically, in Japanese, the English word 'cream' is still pronounced [KREEM] (or, depending on the accent, with an added "short U" like used in the word 'put': [ku-REEM]). So what Toriyama did to get from 'cream' to his character's name was: swapt the c(u) with the rea, while keeping the emphasis on the second syllabel. Thus [kuh-REEM] became [ruh-KOOM]. Changing which syllabel is emphasized simply ignores what makes it the character's name and not the English word 'cream'. And beside, the problem isn't which syllabel is emphasized, but rather...the fact that there are two vowels. If you REALLY want to make up a new name for the character based on the word 'cream', then you can't add any additional letters (Toriyama didn't). So, you can instead just swap the C and the R and get...Rceam, I guess...

What I was saying before that I think confused you is that in English, we like to make the vowels in non-emphasized syllabels "uh". Like: believe [buh-LEEV], parents [PEYHR-uhnts], balloon [buh-LOON], oxygen [AHKS-uh-J'N], etc. Some-times you can even replace the uh with ANY short vowel. Becuz it's said so quickly, no one will notice (so long as you say it at the natural speed). Example: receive [ruh/rih/reh -SEEV]. So you can pronounce 'Reacoom' as either [REE-kuhm] or [ruh-KOOM], but not [REE KOOM].

My problem with pronouncing Saiyan that way is because of the -n added onto the word makes it sound too awkward. "Kai" and "Kaiou" don't have that problem.

It would be one thing if Funi called it "Saiya" like in the original, but calling them "Saiyan" and "Saiyans" just sounds ridiculous to me with the original pronunciation. Not to mention that the choice to use the -n spelling makes little sense to begin with. So to me if Funimation is going to spell it like that then they should pronounce it in a way that sounds more natural in English.

Plus as I said before I don't think FUNi's pronunciation ultimately sounds too different from the original Japanese sound anyway.

The difference in pronunciation is the same as the difference between saying "I did it" and "A did it". But in addition to what Graffer Tape said, I'd like to say that [SEHY]-an sounds just as weird as [SAHY]-an. Maybe if "Saiya" was a place, it would seem more natural?

[MyVisionity]

Plus as I said before I don't think FUNi's pronunciation ultimately sounds too different from the original Japanese sound anyway.

The difference in pronunciation is the same as the difference between saying "I did it" and "A did it".

I don't think this is exactly true, but I understand if many hear it this way. For me the original Japanese "Saiyajin" doesn't have quite as hard of an "[AHY]" sound as you suggest, when spoken in totality.

But in addition to what Graffer Tape said, I'd like to say that [SEHY]-an sounds just as weird as [SAHY]-an. Maybe if "Saiya" was a place, it would seem more natural?

I think I agree that if "Saiya" were a place, it would sound more natural. Maybe because the "-n" wouldn't feel so unnecessary.

[Robo4900]

It seems some are trying to standardize it. The pun is sometimes super apparent (Piccolo, Oolong), and other times it's not (Saiyan, Bulma).

Bulma was a case of incompetent romanisation. By all rights, it should be "Blooma".
Saiyan is not one you can recreate in English to any degree without totally rejigging the name, since it's entirely based on Japanese words, so just doing a proper romanisation(Preferably pronounced correctly... ) will just have to do.

Basically, in Japanese, the English word 'cream' is still pronounced [KREEM] (or, depending on the accent, with an added "short U" like used in the word 'put': [ku-REEM]). So what Toriyama did to get from 'cream' to his character's name was: swapt the c(u) with the rea, while keeping the emphasis on the second syllabel. Thus [kuh-REEM] became [ruh-KOOM].

Except that doesn't make any sense, because you're saying [ruh-KOOM] instead of [ree-KOOM] or [re-KOOM]. At the very least if you're keeping the emphasis like that, you should keep the sounds the same.

Changing which syllabel is emphasized simply ignores what makes it the character's name and not the English word 'cream'. And beside, the problem isn't which syllabel is emphasized, but rather...the fact that there are two vowels. If you REALLY want to make up a new name for the character based on the word 'cream', then you can't add any additional letters (Toriyama didn't). So, you can instead just swap the C and the R and get...Rceam, I guess...

Except even if the emphasis was done as I describe, you've still swapped the vowels around, and got [REE-koom]. I don't know about you, but that doesn't sound like the English word "Cream" to me.
And don't get all weird and technical about the adding letters and things. The point is to adapt the name to an English audience. We don't have to follow the same rules Toriyama followed, we just have to reconstruct the pun in a way that makes sense. "ruh-KOOM" has absolutely no similarity to "Cream" in English whatsoever. Rearranging it will give you "koo-RUM", so "ruh-KOOM" doesn't work as an English equivalent of the name.
As I say, if you want to keep the emphasis as-is, you should still at least have it remain as [ree-KOOM] or [re-KOOM], otherwise the pun just simply isn't there. Though I personally don't see why the emphasis can't move with the vowel. Means we're pronouncing it a bit differently from the Japanese, but we also pronounce "Trunks", "Vegeta", and "Videl" differently from how it would be in Japanese. They're English-based names, so it's not a case of "Pronounce it like the Japanese", it's a case of preserving the intent of the name. Otherwise, we'd just romanise it as-is and be done(Which would, of course, give us Rikoomu, or Rikuum).

What I was saying before that I think confused you is that in English, we like to make the vowels in non-emphasized syllabels "uh". Like: believe [buh-LEEV], parents [PEYHR-uhnts], balloon [buh-LOON], oxygen [AHKS-uh-J'N], etc. Some-times you can even replace the uh with ANY short vowel. Becuz it's said so quickly, no one will notice (so long as you say it at the natural speed). Example: receive [ruh/rih/reh -SEEV]. So you can pronounce 'Reacoom' as either [REE-kuhm] or [ruh-KOOM], but not [REE KOOM].

Except you completely ignored [REE-koom] there. I have a hard time believing anyone would actually say [REE-kuhm], unless we're going to start saying [GO-kuh].
And I find your reasoning here to be fuzzy at best; changing [ree-KOOM] to [ruh-KOOM] is just being unnecessarily obtuse. You can say people tend to do that, but what about "Recoup" or "Revitalise"? Emphasise the "RE" there and they'd sound weird, so you get a pronunciation like [re-KOOP]... Sound familiar?
And sure, you could still argue that if this was an English word, it'd be more likely to change it to [ruh-KOOM] in the face of my counterarguments, but this isn't an English word. We're inventing a name here. A name for a man from space. And his name is supposed to be a pun on "Cream". When adapting a name pun, you should work under the assumption it can be made to work, and find a way to do it. Ditching the name and just saying "nah it doesn't work in english" is a last resort. If translators were so willing to give up, you'd start seeing a lot of "You are my nakama!" in anime dubs.

[ABED]

Saiyan is not one you can recreate in English to any degree without totally rejigging the name

Saiyan is a anagram of Yasai which means vegetables in Japanese.

Bulma was a case of incompetent romanisation. By all rights, it should be "Blooma".

Who's to say it's not intentional?

[Robo4900]

Saiyan is a anagram of Yasai which means vegetables in Japanese.

Yes. Therefore, the best way to do that in English is to do Saiyan, pronounced correctly, then people who are aware of "Yasai" might get it(Not totally out of the question; Japanese restaurants sometimes call vegetable dishes "Yasai", so some people may realise it). Changing it to like Tavegebs or something would just be obtuse, weird, and clunky. So, Saiyan is best left alone.

Who's to say it's not intentional?

Because her name is literally Bloomer. That English word is common in Japanese, though I believe it refers to a swimming uniform or something in Japanese usage.

[ABED]

Saiyan is a anagram of Yasai which means vegetables in Japanese.

Yes. Therefore, the best way to do that in English is to do Saiyan, pronounced correctly, then people who are aware of "Yasai" might get it(Not totally out of the question; Japanese restaurants sometimes call vegetable dishes "Yasai", so some people may realise it). Changing it to like Tavegebs or something would just be obtuse, weird, and clunky. So, Saiyan is best left alone.

Who's to say it's not intentional?

Because her name is literally Bloomer. That English word is common in Japanese, though I believe it refers to a swimming uniform or something in Japanese usage.

That's what the pun comes from, but that's not her name.

no one is saying anything about changing the Saiyans name. I was saying the naming schemes and changes (if any) when adapting it don't have to be uniform.

[Robo4900]

That's what the pun comes from, but that's not her name.

Except it is her name. "Bloomer" goes into Japanese as BURUMA, which was incorrectly rendered as Bulma on her shirt in chapter 1/episode 1.
It's not really reasonable to expect the Japanese staff to get romanisations perfect every time. It's just not something they needed to worry about. Quite funny in hindsight though, when you get stuff like "PICCORO", "KULILIN", or indeed "BULMA" written on things.

[ABED]

Wasn't "Bulma" written on her shirt in her first appearance?

[Robo4900]

Wasn't "Bulma" written on her shirt in her first appearance?

Heh. Read my post again.