Why Watch In English/Japanese...?

kvon · Post by **kvon** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:49 pm

Vekurotto wrote:
Saiyavenger2941 wrote:2.) If I want to read Dragonball, I'll read my copies of the manga. I don't understand a good bit of Japanese yet, and I'd rather pay attention to the action on screen, instead of having my focus taken away by reading the captions.
Oh come on it's not like it's like

<Snips image>

And also it's very easy to "read" subtitles and keep up with the "action". I'm not insulting you, I'm just saying that it's a pretty big misconception for people that don't watched things subbed that the subtitles fly by at light speed and that they'll interfere with the action. I mean when I watched things subbed it doesn't feel like I'm reading at all.

I feel the same way with closed-captioning. My roommates always forced me to turn them off the captions because for them, they "would miss the action." But the fact is, people miss so much by not reading the captions, yet they're way too easy to read. Unless the viewer is sitting incredibly close to a impossibly ginormous @$$ TV, in no way will the caption take the eyes away from the action. What bothered me more was the fact they actually say, "we don't like to read."

For those of you who can both aurally understand and read two or more languages with no problems, you must have run into some interesting situations. Take me for an example, if I'm watching DBZ in Chinese, there is absolutely no possible way for me to read the subtitles in English. If I can understand completely just by listening, why would I read the subtitles in a different language? I would rather read Chinese subs instead. Now, the only reason that I watch DBZ in Japanese with subtitles, besides that it is more accurate, is because I don't know the language all that well. If I can understand every single Japanese lines 100%, I would not be reading the English subs. And...

VegettoEX wrote: I've read people's reasonings for not wanting to read subtitles (such as presented in this thread), but even with explanation of those reasons, I still can't manage to really understand them.

Though I assume that you're unilingual, I think you will understand the second point I made. (English, methinks?!) Maybe you should check up on Julian, or any other multilinguals on the board, and ask them about the same issues. I'm pretty sure they'll understand as well.

BUT APPARENTLY, my second point doesn't apply here because we're talking about people who doesn't read subtitles just because they "don't like to read" in general. Just trying to make an exception about the whole subtitle issue.

Jerseymilk · Post by **Jerseymilk** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:04 pm

Expanding on what Mike said about reading subtitles, I agree. I've encountered people that have said to me they tried watching subs but they're really slow readers and miss the action. Reading is a skill, you get better with practice. You just have to give it a chance and give yourself time. One picks it up fast, trust me. Hey, if you're really worried about missing the action, I know of quite a few people that will watch an anime with the dubbed version first and then go back and watch it subbed so they get both.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:03 pm

Wow, this has really gotten pretty large since I started it yesterday.

TheGreatness25 · Post by **TheGreatness25** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:09 pm

It annoys me when reading the subtitles, that the character says something that sounds like 5 words, but you get 2 lines of subtitles and they disappear before you read them.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:13 pm

I was at school and somehow in the few hours that I was gone it changed from Japanese versus English to Subs versus English. What the hell happened here?

Post by **VegettoEX** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:14 pm

SSJ2bardock wrote:I was at school and somehow in the few hours that I was gone it changed from Japanese versus English to Subs versus English. What the hell happened here?

Could you not put this in your previous post?

What happened is that it's gone on for seven pages, and people are conversing. Just because you started the topic doesn't mean that people aren't going to bring additional thoughts and examples to the mix. Conversations change, expand, and evolve.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:16 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
SSJ2bardock wrote:I was at school and somehow in the few hours that I was gone it changed from Japanese versus English to Subs versus English. What the hell happened here?
Could you not put this in your previous post?

What happened is that it's gone on for seven pages, and people are conversing. Just because you started the topic doesn't mean that people aren't going to bring additional thoughts and examples to the mix. Conversations change, expand, and evolve.

I didn't mean for that to come off the way it did. I was just kind of confused on the whole situation. I'm glad that this thing I started has gone on to make such an interesting and diverse post.

Adamant · Post by **Adamant** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:17 pm

kvon wrote:For those of you who can both aurally understand and read two or more languages with no problems, you must have run into some interesting situations. Take me for an example, if I'm watching DBZ in Chinese, there is absolutely no possible way for me to read the subtitles in English. If I can understand completely just by listening, why would I read the subtitles in a different language? I would rather read Chinese subs instead. Now, the only reason that I watch DBZ in Japanese with subtitles, besides that it is more accurate, is because I don't know the language all that well. If I can understand every single Japanese lines 100%, I would not be reading the English subs. And...

VegettoEX wrote: I've read people's reasonings for not wanting to read subtitles (such as presented in this thread), but even with explanation of those reasons, I still can't manage to really understand them.
Though I assume that you're unilingual, I think you well understand the second point I made. (English, methinks?!) Maybe you should check up on Julian, or any other multilinguals on the board, and ask them about the same issues. I'm pretty sure they'll understand as well.

Eh, I don't know, I've never had a problem watching shows/movies with Norwegian subtitles. Given that the subtitles are hardcoded into the broadcasted version (and the VHS releases), we don't have any choice in the matter, but they rarely get disrupting even if you can understand the original language perfectly. I'll admit that I prefer English subtitles on English shows over Norwegian ones, though.

I should also mention that I tried watching some of the Norwegian Olsen Gang movies with English subtitles, but had to drop them because they got too disruptive. The horribly bad quality of those subtitles should probably take quite a bit of the blame for that, though.

Anonymous Friend · Post by **Anonymous Friend** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:33 pm

With regard to the reading subtitles issue: I always have closed captions on my TV and try to use them when watching movies. I don't have any problems with them but at times they can be distracting such as when I went to see Kung-fu Hustle in theaters. This was the first subtitled movie I had ever seen in a theater and didn't realize it until a couple of minutes before the trailers started. There were certain parts where there was dialog during fight sequences.

I have some friends who aren't as good of readers as I am and tend to read slower than I can. There are also some who just down care to read when they're watching television and would prefer to have it available in their own language.

TheGreatness25 · Post by **TheGreatness25** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:39 pm

I'm a fast reader, but obviously when there's a lot of action going on and you have to read the subtitles, you can't see everything.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:43 pm

I never understood the whole subtitle thing either.
It's not like I fix my eyes on the subtitles and ONLY the subtitles. When reading the subtitles I still see what is going on. I really don't understand, it's like people can only stare at ONE point of the screen.

Super 17 · Post by **Super 17** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:48 pm

I mainly watch the Mexican version, which typically is saying that I'm watching the Japanese Version. Mainly because I liked the music. All of it. I didn't have a problem with the voice actors, since I got the Mexican actors, who are in no doubt really good. I mean have you heard Raditz in the Mexican version? It's so raw. I currently am living in the U.S. for about 8 years and the works that Funimation is doing is pretty good, but not for a show that has already everything done to it. If Funimation created a totally new show plus Bruce Faulconer's music it would be an original show because the actors can act and Bruce Faulconer's music is not tha bad. It's just that DragonBall has been done already that their music and acting and whatever else is liked and well you know.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:52 pm

Good point, I think if it had been anything else but dragonball and Funimation did this with a show it would have been generally accepted.

Anonymous Friend · Post by **Anonymous Friend** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:59 pm

I don't know if this is the best comparison, but whenever me and my friend watch Attack of the Show, I'm able to read the Feed ticker at the bottom of the screen and watch and keep up with the main program and my friend can't. Heck I can watch TV and play videogames at the same time. Some people just can't do it like that.

NeptuneKai · Post by **NeptuneKai** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:59 pm

SSJ2bardock wrote:Good point, I think if it had been anything else but dragonball and Funimation did this with a show it would have been generally accepted.

Yeah because y'know things like mediocre voices bad character changes, name and attack name changes, minor editing, and corny jokes usually go over very well with the public as far as anime goes, just look at 4kids One Piece...oh wait.

Vegeta Jr · Post by **Vegeta Jr** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:00 pm

What's wrong with corny jokes?

caejones · Post by **caejones** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:01 pm

Demon King Piccolo wrote:The character voices are too rough, I hate the VA for Gohan and Goku as kids; however, I seem to be the only one who hates the VA. I could never see rough
kid voices developing into softer voices when they become adults. It's just never made sense to me.

Maybe to a lesser extreme, but my voice did something like that... Goku-style?

And also it's very easy to "read" subtitles and keep up with the "action". I'm not insulting you, I'm just saying that it's a pretty big misconception for
people that don't watched things subbed that the subtitles fly by at light speed and that they'll interfere with the action. I mean when I watched things
subbed it doesn't feel like I'm reading at all.

I tried reading the subtitles in Return of the Jedi and had to pause the video and press my face against the screen to read Jaba's lines. Granted, this is entirely because my vision sucks (and now it's bad enough that I don't even bother looking at the screen anymore), but... yeah, when it comes to original dialogue, I'm pretty screwed (my kick-ass grade in three semesters of Japanese hasn't earned me fluency enough to comprehend everything in the original).
And it's very rare that I like people reading the subs over the japanese so I know what's happening. -.-.

... Nevertheless, I still like listening to the japanese version, and the cutscenes from Ultimate Battle 22 are probably what got me paying enough attention to the language to begin trying to understand it.
(... and even with my sucky vision and typical disregard for the quality of video game graphics quality, I'll be glad to bash on the graphics in UB22 before anyone else.

. ).

VegettoEX wrote: wisdom

... Yeah, that.

And this is one of the reasons I like Daizex... it reveals a lot of the crap I pretty much can't know without the "GRAAA DUB SUCKS!!1!" atitude from a few years ago (which I guess Mike's admitted to presenting back while season 3 and 4 were airing...?).

(Wow, and this extended to a whole page.

Damn, I'm slow.)

(And a side note: my japanese teacher reminds me so much of VegettoEX it's scary.

)

And I'll go ahead and say what I think about voices real quick-like: For the most part I like all of the main cast in both languages. Exagerations (Dub, mostly) can get annoying real easily (Bulma, ChiChi, Vegeta, "Yeah, Burnt Toast...", narration, and half the villains that were dubbed after 2001... and with what the narration in dub DBZ has set up, it's flat-out hilarius (not necessarily in a good way) when Kyle Hebert reads "Since Goku was there, it was fun! Everyone loves Goku! Thanks, Goku!" in Budokai Tenkaichi 3... ).

Anonymous Friend · Post by **Anonymous Friend** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:19 pm

Vegeta Jr wrote:What's wrong with corny jokes?

I was gonna mention that I like some off the corny jokes and idiot lines that FUNi put in but was afraid of the backlash.

I was recently watching the Trunks episodes and really found the "Secret decoder ring" conversation funny. Now, I always cringe at the "this is something that's real world specific and none of these characters should know anthing about lines" in any show that I watch.

Soemtimes I listen to, erm ... read, criticizisms of the Dub and a lot of it comes off as "I want it so close to the original that the only way I'm satisfied would if all of the Japanese VA learned perfect english and the script was translated word for word." I'm not saying that this is wrong, it's just how it can at times come across.

When it come sto disliking a voice, I personally find this such a stupid debate although it is something that can be debated.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:44 pm

NeptuneKai wrote:
SSJ2bardock wrote:Good point, I think if it had been anything else but dragonball and Funimation did this with a show it would have been generally accepted.
Yeah because y'know things like mediocre voices bad character changes, name and attack name changes, minor editing, and corny jokes usually go over very well with the public as far as anime goes, just look at 4kids One Piece...oh wait.

That wasn't what I was saying. I was saying that if this had happened with a show that wasn't as humongously popular or well know there wouldn't be as much fuss over it.

BrollysKin · Post by **BrollysKin** » Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:53 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
BrollysKin wrote:However, my biggest peeve is when people think they are more of a fan then others because they watch the Japanese version. You're not, so shut the fuck up. I have seen this from time to time on these boards; however, most of the time people give good reasons for watching both versions.
On these boards, I very rarely see someone actually, honestly, truly, legitimately say right there in plain view: "I am a better fan than you because [insert statement here]!" That would result in an almost immediate ban. You're either making things up, remembering incorrectly, or are confusing people/posts here with people/posts made elsewhere.

I was careful to add from time to time to my post. Obviously no one comes out and says it like that. It seems like more of a underlying tone. Perhaps I should have worded it differently?

Also is there a particular reason why your being somewhat rude? I only made an observation I felt was correct and you're implying I'm making things up?

Regardless, yes in general I feel most people on these boards are very accepting of others views (as I stated before).

VegettoEX wrote:
BrollysKin wrote:Umm... Fuck
Please remember where you are, and realize that this kind of behavior will not be tolerated.

Yeah I still quite haven't figured out yet what you consider funny and what you don't. Apologies.