Super Animation Catalogue 2.0

[Araki]

I hate to say it but the tournament suffers from something very important. It is uninteresting.

The art is more consistent.
Most of the cuts look good.

..

That is entirely subjective, even more than thoughts on art/animation, of course. This week i thought was nice on a technical level although meh on content, yeah, but 98 had plenty of exciting moments and no wonder was a very popular episode all around.

That said, i wasn't realistically expecting anything mind-blowing from the first few episodes. With 80 fighters, there is too many fodders to be taken out before we get to the important part.

[Mazingerdestro]

I hate to say it but the tournament suffers from something very important. It is uninteresting.

The art is more consistent.
Most of the cuts look good.

..

That is entirely subjective, even more than thoughts on art/animation, of course. This week i thought was nice on a technical level although meh on content, yeah, but 98 had plenty of exciting moments and no wonder was a very popular episode all around.

That said, i wasn't realistically expecting anything mind-blowing from the first few episodes. With 80 fighters, there is too many fodders to be taken out before we get to the important part.

None of the cuts so far have the "wow" factor. Something that makes you want to watch them over and over again.
Humans and in general non-saiyans have a huge advantage for a storyboarder and the storyteller. "They are weak". To overcome their weaknesses they have to think new and clever moves to trick their opponents. So far we saw none of the fighters actually been smart.
They might use one or two silly tricks but nothing that proves their intellect. Krillin could basically act as a decoy or even try to confuse his opponents to win.
I found the shoe attack silly but not unpredictable.
Maybe is due to the bad pacing.
If they spend this episode with Majora beating Krillin and 18 and have a brief mention of the scent ability and then next week have Krillin use the shoe maybe then it would work.
I don't get why they are rushing in such a tight schedule.
Have the character's talk.
Have Gods arguing.
Have Goku ranting on Grand Priest about the destruction and how wrong it is.
Let us absorb the first destruction by adding numerous reaction shots.
Why is super acting like they have only a limited number of episodes available???

"Rant switch off"

[Lord Beerus]

I hate to say it but the tournament suffers from something very important. It is uninteresting.

The art is more consistent.
Most of the cuts look good.

..

That is entirely subjective, even more than thoughts on art/animation, of course. This week i thought was nice on a technical level although meh on content, yeah, but 98 had plenty of exciting moments and no wonder was a very popular episode all around.

That said, i wasn't realistically expecting anything mind-blowing from the first few episodes. With 80 fighters, there is too many fodders to be taken out before we get to the important part.

None of the cuts so far have the "wow" factor. Something that makes you want to watch them over and over again.
Humans and in general non-saiyans have a huge advantage for a storyboarder and the storyteller. "They are weak". To overcome their weaknesses they have to think new and clever moves to trick their opponents. So far we saw none of the fighters actually been smart.
They might use one or two silly tricks but nothing that proves their intellect. Krillin could basically act as a decoy or even try to confuse his opponents to win.
I found the shoe attack silly but not unpredictable.
Maybe is due to the bad pacing.
If they spend this episode with Majora beating Krillin and 18 and have a brief mention of the scent ability and then next week have Krillin use the shoe maybe then it would work.
I don't get why they are rushing in such a tight schedule.
Have the character's talk.
Have Gods arguing.
Have Goku ranting on Grand Priest about the destruction and how wrong it is.
Let us absorb the first destruction by adding numerous reaction shots.
Why is super acting like they have only a limited number of episodes available???

"Rant switch off"

When Dragon Ball has any major battle the amount of cut that have had the "wow" factor are few and fare between, but also usually depends the on the quality of the animators working on the episode. We're only three episodes into the tournament and we still have no idea how long this tournament will last, so I think it's just best to wait and see how this unfolds. I will admit that none of the episode so far have look spectacular, but not every (fighting) episode has to have a "wow" factor to it. Dragon Ball and Z sure didn't.

Also, I disagree about none of the fighters being smart in the tournament. Vegeta's scuffle with Botamo and Magetta showed that all of them had learned from previous battles in the Champa arc and had developed a good amount of cunning and strategy to implement in the tournament.

[Mazingerdestro]

When Dragon Ball has any major battle the amount of cut that have had the "wow" factor are few and fare between, but also usually depends the on the quality of the animators working on the episode. We're only three episodes into the tournament and we still have no idea how long this tournament will last, so I think it's just best to wait and see how this unfolds. I will admit that none of the episode so far have look spectacular, but not every (fighting) episode has to have a "wow" factor to it. Dragon Ball and Z sure didn't.

Also, I disagree about none of the fighters being smart in the tournament. Vegeta's scuffle with Botamo and Magetta showed that all of them had learned from previous battles in the Champa arc and had developed a good amount of cunning and strategy to implement in the tournament.

I don't agree.
I am not a sakuga fanatic and usually don't care for extremely fluid cuts with unbelievable animation but I appreciate complicated choreographies and interesting movements. It feels that most fighters have abandoned their "martial arts" and focus only on blasts and heavy punches.
Krillin should still be using basic martial arts moves since he has no power ups like ssj.
Db didn't have sakuga moments but it's battles were always complex and exciting. (it helped that the characters actually stood still and we got to hear their inner thoughts)
The Magetta/Botamo/Vegeta cuts were not interesting. They were childish and borderline weird (without been interesting "weird" but rather lame "weird"). Either have them fight like a team or have Magetta just "fix" his issue by meditating. Show a funny clip of Champa insulting him (showing that Champa is a constant crybaby) or Cabba struggling to find a decent insult and as a result have Magetta overcome his weakness.
Botamo has by far the worse design in dbs and have him working with Magetta who looks extremely good makes for an awful mix.

I still struggle to see the "strategy" or "cunningness" of any of the characters.

Frost's cheapshotting Krillin wasn't shocking.... instead of having me saying "noooooo why!!!!!", I was like "Jesus.... lamest excuse ever....". Why not have Krillin seem Frost and freezing from fear?
The scenarios of these episodes lack complexity in the character interaction and development departments.

Also the "hidden potential" was a flat-out lie. Krillin didn't show ant new or unique ability.
Sorry for the rant and the long comment. I just felt that I had to explain you my opinion.

[ShinyPhanpy]

I don't get why they are rushing in such a tight schedule.
Have the character's talk.
Have Gods arguing.
Have Goku ranting on Grand Priest about the destruction and how wrong it is.
Let us absorb the first destruction by adding numerous reaction shots.

Please no, this stuff already takes up more than half the episodes. These parts are necessary for the tournament to exist without looking garbage, however I think that they have enough of it as it is. Adding anymore would destroy the pacing IMO, and would stretch the tournament out far longer than it needs to be.

Also the "hidden potential" was a flat-out lie. Krillin didn't show ant new or unique ability.

A little off topic, however, herms said on twitter "that "true power" is a potentially misleading translation of 底力, and indeed here it refers to his strategy and determination." So blame this more on Crunchyroll subs.

[HybridSaiyan]

I don't think I'd have a problem with Vegeta's art if he was back in his buu saga attire. The saiyan armor in this artstyle makes him look..."different?" I'm not sure what It is...but something always feels off with him.

[Basako]

Also, I disagree about none of the fighters being smart in the tournament. Vegeta's scuffle with Botamo and Magetta showed that all of them had learned from previous battles in the Champa arc and had developed a good amount of cunning and strategy to implement in the tournament.

Totally, Vegeta knew how to handle Botamo, by disabling his arms. Magetta and Botamo used teamwork, they look kind of friends and Magetta has overcame his weakness. Botamo covered his ears too.

Krilin used the Kiezans to affect the parrot's wings, then Roshi blasted him out. Krilin and 18 used a cool tenis type move that worked great. Krilin again used the best strategy against the guy whose strength was smelling. It's kind of a joke, but it's fun and old good DB humour.

Gohan's strategy is very defensive, it's not cool, but it works, it grants the weakest members of the team are protected. Sooner or later, they will have to fight.

Frost is a sneaky bastard again, but, hey, no mercy, it's a battle royale. Krilin should have been more aware he was still in the edge of the stage.

There was some good writing here.

[FortuneSSJ]

I loved the teamwork scene with Krillin/C18 vs Shosa. That was original!

[precita]

As we've said many times, these are all just fodder fights. I wouldn't expect any truly amazing animated scenes until we have maybe 10 fighters left in the tournament. They're not going to blow their animation budget on Krillin fighting a fox man.

[Artorias]

After rewatching, I've come to realize that first part with Vegeta looks really bad...like... dare I say almost...Resurrection of F arc bad.

It doesn't look great, but it doesn't look anywhere near as bad as the F arc.

Yea, that I was a bit of hyperbole, because I then watched a dubbed episode of RoF, and I was like "Oh shit no, this is still MUCH worse". It looks better in my mind than it actually does whenever I go back and see a clip.

[ArchedThunder]

Yea, that I was a bit of hyperbole, because I then watched a dubbed episode of RoF, and I was like "Oh shit no, this is still MUCH worse". It looks better in my mind than it actually does whenever I go back and see a clip.

Watching old episodes really drives home how far the show has come.

[precita]

I can't believe the early episodes were made in the modern year of 2015. 1980's animation looks better than them.

[Hit!!]

Yea, that I was a bit of hyperbole, because I then watched a dubbed episode of RoF, and I was like "Oh shit no, this is still MUCH worse". It looks better in my mind than it actually does whenever I go back and see a clip.

Watching old episodes really drives home how far the show has come.

True!!

But then i watch My Hero Academia and realize how much room there still is for improvement.

[ArchedThunder]

True!!

But then i watch My Hero Academia and realize how much room there still is for improvement.

Regardless they aren't comparable shows, MHA is a seasonal show, not a long running show.
MHA also has an insanely good schedule, like beyond great.

[Hit!!]

True!!

But then i watch My Hero Academia and realize how much room there still is for improvement.

Regardless they aren't comparable shows, MHA is a seasonal show, not a long running show.
MHA also has an insanely good schedule, like beyond great.

That's true and i agree completely. Yet i believe that Super, being a weekly long running show, can achieve that level of quality. It would take time, but i think it's possible. Look at Pokemon.

[MisteryOne]

The simple fact that some seconds of Vegeta vs Botamo were way better than the whole fight in the Champa arc speaks for itself. Great episode in almost every term (it had a couple of nonsensical moments, but in terms of animation it was cool).

[ArchedThunder]

Aww man, the booru deleted Freeza's transformation from episode 94.

That's true and i agree completely. Yet i believe that Super, being a weekly long running show, can achieve that level of quality. It would take time, but i think it's possible. Look at Pokemon.

Pokemon also has the benefit of simple designs on top of its amazing schedule and large, talented staff.
Super will continue to get better, but also try to keep expectations in check.

[Mazingerdestro]

The simple fact that some seconds of Vegeta vs Botamo were way better than the whole fight in the Champa arc speaks for itself. Great episode in almost every term (it had a couple of nonsensical moments, but in terms of animation it was cool).

Nobody can argue that the series' quality has increased.
Just look 17 vs Goku.
That battle rivals or even surpasses Goku x 10 kaioken.

Super's staff is quite talented. Just check any of Tu's scenes. The guy provides such good looking cuts almost constantly.

My problem is mainly the plain storyboards (sometimes not always) and the weird childish decisions.
Even in a tournament were everyone could possibly die, Toei doesn't allow the writers to write darker scenes


Also please guys don't forget that dbs is weekly and the best looking shows like MHA are seasonal. It's not a fair comparison. It wouldn't be even if Super had Pokemon's schedule (which would be dreamy). As much as dbs deserves better animation or even been turned to a seasonal anime, it's a weekly series so we just have to enjoy what we have.
At least as time goes on and the animators have more spare time to work, they can have time to try more innovative ideas and make their cuts more complex.
Maybe at some point, we can at least have all the major battles constantly looking good with complex choreography (which is my main issue with the show. The characters have still no iconic moments in Super. Not many new finishing moves or weird combos)

[JazzMazz]

The simple fact that some seconds of Vegeta vs Botamo were way better than the whole fight in the Champa arc speaks for itself. Great episode in almost every term (it had a couple of nonsensical moments, but in terms of animation it was cool).

Nobody can argue that the series' quality has increased.
Just look 17 vs Goku.
That battle rivals or even surpasses Goku x 10 kaioken.

Super's staff is quite talented. Just check any of Tu's scenes. The guy provides such good looking cuts almost constantly.

My problem is mainly the plain storyboards (sometimes not always) and the weird childish decisions.
Even in a tournament were everyone could possibly die, Toei doesn't allow the writers to write darker scenes

Super production is very different to what it was in the Champa arc, I don't think anyone's going to contest that. Goku vs 17 was far better than the Kaio-ken x10 in the Champa arc, which while good for the time, really doesn't compare well from an animation stand-point comparison to Tate and even Tu's work on #86.

#99

It was pretty dull for the most part but also completely serviceable, aside from some really noticeable tweening here and there.

It was interesting to see Tate on the episode, which makes me a little concerned, though I'm sure it's nothing to worry about considering the amount he actually did.(Really hope Tate delivers for his episode, hopefully he'll be able to get the tone of the tournament across more effectively than what we've currently gotten)

Tu and Highashide are really keeping this tournament together from a visual stand-point, though for the most part are keeping it conservative with the exception of some special scenes.

Aside from there being a noteable cut in an Ishikawa episode, not much else to say from a visual stand-point.

So far, we've had one worrying episode in 97 and two completely mediocre ones. This arc better pick up soon or some people here are going to grow tired of being served mediocrity when we saw it do so much better in the earlier episodes of the arc. The NEP really doesn't seem to be changing that trend, with the fighting having the typical Yashima Stiffness and art, with only one competent rotation appearing in it. Hopefully I'm wrong and the episode actually does have something going for it(literally anything would be fine).

Some of my other gripes with this tournament so far, is that I don't feel like the direction of the fights has really pulled through. This episode had a completely competent script, with nothing truly offensive about it. However, I found myself often getting bored, and I think that has to do with there being no momentum between each battle. The tournament hasn't picked up on making the situation feel serious, and when it does, the tone is quickly obliterated with stupid jokes. Even the Champa arc got serious at a point, namely during #38, and generally continued with that tone for the rest of the tourament,and there wasn't even anything at stake during that arc!I don't expect super-flashy animation like from better produced shows, I just think that they should adopt a more serious tone throughout the rest of the tournament(make the characters also adopt that serious tone and stop messing around), and visuals that at least match up with what we got for exhibition tournament and the recruitment arc.(Also keep the script competent, that would also be nice)

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Regular yellow Super Saiyan just doesn't look great at all, I don't know what it is but it just looks so off to me especially when they go aura-less the colour just doesn't look right. With Aura it's tolerable I guess but this is one of the biggest problems with modern DB I have.

Anyway, good looking episode on the majority. Them re using some reaction shots of the gods just with different dialogue is pretty smart.