Unpopular DB opinions

[Scsigs]

I don't think so. Pretty sure when Toei comes up with filler scenes they don't imagine their idea might end up in the manga somehow. Kinda lazy right now to do some research, but I think the driving school scene was shown way before we see Goku driving in the manga.

Yeah, considering that was right at the beginning of the Androids Saga & Goku driving as a Super Saiyan is right before the climax of it. That's a large gap of time in terms of when both came out, so it's most likely that they just made a filler episode that ended up being better in retrospect than just being a goofy filler episode to fill time where they thought they could.

[MyVisionity]

But...did they know that he'd be driving later on? I doubt Toriyama even did.

I don't think so. Pretty sure when Toei comes up with filler scenes they don't imagine their idea might end up in the manga somehow. Kinda lazy right now to do some research, but I think the driving school scene was shown way before we see Goku driving in the manga.

Driving School episode aired in January 1992 followed by the pre-Cell Games driving manga chapter in September 1992 followed by the anime episode of that chapter in January 1993. In the anime version, there's a scene where Chichi explains how Goku and Piccolo failed the test but then Goku later retook the test and passed.

So I guess maybe the writers took advantage of their old filler episode to pad out the later episode.

[Grimlock]

it's most likely that they just made a filler episode that ended up being better in retrospect than just being a goofy filler episode to fill time where they thought they could.

That's what I think too. Might be one of those cases where Toriyama liked so much that he incorporated it in the manga, though just by depicting Goku randomly driving one day. Which is preferable, I guess. You don't drag the manga with unnecessary things, so you let the explanation up to Toei and then, if you feel like, show the result in your work where is possible.

Anyway, personally, almost all fillers with the Saiyans/King Vegeta are meaningful (except the Dragon Ball Z Episode 20's one since it's been contradicted). Also, they are the only scenes where I can see more of them anyway.

Driving School episode aired in January 1992 followed by the pre-Cell Games driving manga chapter in September 1992 followed by the anime episode of that chapter in January 1993. In the anime version, there's a scene where Chichi explains how Goku and Piccolo failed the test but then Goku later retook the test and passed.

So I guess maybe the writers took advantage of their old filler episode to pad out the later episode.

Yup, not feeling lazy anymore so I went to check it and to watch that scene. I think it's safe to say that Toriyama certainly was inspired by the anime scene to show Goku driving. So that's one case of filler being meaningful to some extent. Wish that were more of those, to be honest.

[Mad Swami]

Zeno and the new god stuff is my least favorite part of Super. Kale, Caulifla, and Kefla may be stupid, Frieza's return silly, and Super Saiyan Blue lackluster, but nothing really puts me off of Super quite like Zeno. At first I thought "Yeah that's so Toriyama, that is so fitting with his style of humor and story" However after seeing more of Zeno and the space he occupies I thought "This doesn't feel very Dragon Ball"

I don't think DB benefits from someone like Zeno. He is just there to be funny. That isn't a bad thing, but his lore is too important. He is the supremest destroyer. He trumps everyone. I don't know it just takes some of the magic out of the quest to get stronger. I feel like Whis and Beerus were one level that for me at least was fine but Zeno is a little much. I remember that episode where the G.O.D's battle on the T.O.P arena as like a test. The fight was super boring and overall the atmosphere was, terrible. I felt so exhausted after finishing it, it might be my least favorite episode of Dragon Ball ever.

I don't hate this side of DB or Zeno it just is off putting. The new Moro arc is so good and is exactly what I wanted from Super.

[SupremeKai25]

Zeno and the new god stuff is my least favorite part of Super. Kale, Caulifla, and Kefla may be stupid, Frieza's return silly, and Super Saiyan Blue lackluster, but nothing really puts me off of Super quite like Zeno. At first I thought "Yeah that's so Toriyama, that is so fitting with his style of humor and story" However after seeing more of Zeno and the space he occupies I thought "This doesn't feel very Dragon Ball"

I don't think DB benefits from someone like Zeno. He is just there to be funny. That isn't a bad thing, but his lore is too important. He is the supremest destroyer. He trumps everyone. I don't know it just takes some of the magic out of the quest to get stronger. I feel like Whis and Beerus were one level that for me at least was fine but Zeno is a little much. I remember that episode where the G.O.D's battle on the T.O.P arena as like a test. The fight was super boring and overall the atmosphere was, terrible. I felt so exhausted after finishing it, it might be my least favorite episode of Dragon Ball ever.

I don't hate this side of DB or Zeno it just is off putting. The new Moro arc is so good and is exactly what I wanted from Super.

I wouldn't call him funny, when he has no problem erasing literally the entire multiverse... while creepily smiling nonetheless.

DB Heroes also developed an interesting plotline with Hearts, a mortal who seeks to dethrone Zeno because he believes no being should hold so much power in their hands. While Hearts is basically a generic evil monster and 90% of his personality comes from his final 5 seconds, his motivations in the end were quite compelling and I wouldn't mind if Super took a few notes from Heroes in that regard.

That being said, I still want to know how the God hierarchy came to be, if Zeno was always there since the beginning of creation, and what his relationship with Zalama/Grand Priest might be.

[Tai Lung]

I do not consider Cheelai and Lemo necessary .... many like these characters and although they are not bad their existence feels forced I think that anyone could replace the role they had ... goten and trunks, caulifla and kale or bulma


Besides, cheelai should have a lot of power to steal the paragus so fast that he didn't even realize

I am not against new characters but they could have developed more those who already had

[Mad Swami]

Zeno and the new god stuff is my least favorite part of Super. Kale, Caulifla, and Kefla may be stupid, Frieza's return silly, and Super Saiyan Blue lackluster, but nothing really puts me off of Super quite like Zeno. At first I thought "Yeah that's so Toriyama, that is so fitting with his style of humor and story" However after seeing more of Zeno and the space he occupies I thought "This doesn't feel very Dragon Ball"

I don't think DB benefits from someone like Zeno. He is just there to be funny. That isn't a bad thing, but his lore is too important. He is the supremest destroyer. He trumps everyone. I don't know it just takes some of the magic out of the quest to get stronger. I feel like Whis and Beerus were one level that for me at least was fine but Zeno is a little much. I remember that episode where the G.O.D's battle on the T.O.P arena as like a test. The fight was super boring and overall the atmosphere was, terrible. I felt so exhausted after finishing it, it might be my least favorite episode of Dragon Ball ever.

I don't hate this side of DB or Zeno it just is off putting. The new Moro arc is so good and is exactly what I wanted from Super.

I wouldn't call him funny, when he has no problem erasing literally the entire multiverse... while creepily smiling nonetheless.

DB Heroes also developed an interesting plotline with Hearts, a mortal who seeks to dethrone Zeno because he believes no being should hold so much power in their hands. While Hearts is basically a generic evil monster and 90% of his personality comes from his final 5 seconds, his motivations in the end were quite compelling and I wouldn't mind if Super took a few notes from Heroes in that regard.

That being said, I still want to know how the God hierarchy came to be, if Zeno was always there since the beginning of creation, and what his relationship with Zalama/Grand Priest might be.

I remember the heroes plot with Hearts. It's silly ending was well silly but overall I actually thought it wasn't half bad. Gogeta Blue beating Hearts was the silly part. Regardless yeah I do think you can do good with him. He just isn't appealing for me but that's me

[Kiyoharu]

Caulifla and Kale are one of the worst shits in the entire franchise.

Is that an unpopular opinion?

[Kataphrut]

I do not consider Cheelai and Lemo necessary .... many like these characters and although they are not bad their existence feels forced I think that anyone could replace the role they had ... goten and trunks, caulifla and kale or bulma


Besides, cheelai should have a lot of power to steal the paragus so fast that he didn't even realize

I am not against new characters but they could have developed more those who already had

I think they're totally necessary. Aside from driving the plot by finding him Broly and bringing him to and Paragus, they're the ones who facilitate his growth and eventual escape. Sure it's easy to say an existing character could have done what they did but in the context presented, it makes more sense for two scouting Freeza soldiers to find him and form a connection than any of the characters you mentioned. Especially the ones that don't live in that universe.

Also, it wouldn't surprise me if Toriyama enjoyed creating and writing them more than he did Broly. Original characters, funny banter, one's a cute girl and the other one looks like him. They express personality and make you care for Broly more than Broly himself does.

[Mad Swami]

I think Gogeta's cannon debut should of been in the Zamasu arc. My reasoning is mostly due to thematic cohesion. Zamasu is all about killing mortals and how divine beings should not share a universe. Trunks at the end gives his fine speech which is all about how mortals possess so much potential and while sure they can do bad things they are capable of helping one another. However, I think it would be really fitting if instead of Vegito they use Gogeta. Shin shouldn't be there. He does absolutely nothing and just makes me annoyed due to him being used in a similar fashion to how people clown on Krillin. He is just there to cough up his earrings. However, that isn't my main reason. My main reason is it would be really fitting if the way they challenge Merged Zamasu was from using a mortal technique to create Gogeta, the Metamoran dance. In a way, Gogeta could demonstrate the power of mortals as they are capable of coming together to be stronger.

Not to mention I would really love to see a moment where maybe Vegeta is a little off put by the dance and instead requests they quickly try and get the earrings only for Bulma's death to put an end to that silly idea and give him the conviction to perform the dance.

Finally I think it would be better since in original cannon Metamoran was stated as the weaker fusion technique. I bring this up because SSBKK20 was able to land a solid kick that actually phased a cocky Zamasu. And I have to believe Vegito Blue is far more then 20x. (Not saying Goku was as strong as him but it at least showed kkx20 was not nothing to Zamasu)

While it's cool seeing the beautiful animation of the Broly movie give Gogeta his appearance, what connection does it have to the story. It makes sense sure but over all ties into the narrative rather clunky and feels fan servicey. I don't know what the alternative should have been, that's a different can of worms. All I know is Gogeta made more sense to appear in Zamasu arc

[John Pannozzi]

You know our boss Mike LaBrie has/had a hard time pronouncing "Kuririn"?

Maybe he should try pronouncing it like "Kurillin", i.e. a cross between "Kuririn" and "Krillin".

That's sort of how its annunciated in Japanese, and it preserves the "kuri" pun.

I've wanted to say that for years, honestly.

EDIT: Oh, and this probably isn't that unpopular, but its a crying shame that none of Dr. Slump movies/TV shows have been licensed in English-speaking territories, beyond DIscotek's DVD of the first five movies.

[LoganForkHands73]

I think Gogeta's cannon debut should of been in the Zamasu arc. My reasoning is mostly due to thematic cohesion. Zamasu is all about killing mortals and how divine beings should not share a universe. Trunks at the end gives his fine speech which is all about how mortals possess so much potential and while sure they can do bad things they are capable of helping one another. However, I think it would be really fitting if instead of Vegito they use Gogeta. Shin shouldn't be there. He does absolutely nothing and just makes me annoyed due to him being used in a similar fashion to how people clown on Krillin. He is just there to cough up his earrings. However, that isn't my main reason. My main reason is it would be really fitting if the way they challenge Merged Zamasu was from using a mortal technique to create Gogeta, the Metamoran dance. In a way, Gogeta could demonstrate the power of mortals as they are capable of coming together to be stronger.

Not to mention I would really love to see a moment where maybe Vegeta is a little off put by the dance and instead requests they quickly try and get the earrings only for Bulma's death to put an end to that silly idea and give him the conviction to perform the dance.

Finally I think it would be better since in original cannon Metamoran was stated as the weaker fusion technique. I bring this up because SSBKK20 was able to land a solid kick that actually phased a cocky Zamasu. And I have to believe Vegito Blue is far more then 20x. (Not saying Goku was as strong as him but it at least showed kkx20 was not nothing to Zamasu)

While it's cool seeing the beautiful animation of the Broly movie give Gogeta his appearance, what connection does it have to the story. It makes sense sure but over all ties into the narrative rather clunky and feels fan servicey. I don't know what the alternative should have been, that's a different can of worms. All I know is Gogeta made more sense to appear in Zamasu arc

B-b-b-b-but then the Broly movie would have one less marketing draw! A-a-and we wouldn't have thousands of identical Gogeta Blue artworks clogging subreddits! How will we cope?

In all seriousness, cracking idea right here, wish it would have happened. While I like Vegito and Gogeta about equally, Vegito's appearance in the Zamasu Saga left a sour taste in my mouth. It felt like the most pointlessly fleeting, fanservicey thing in Super just shoved in there because "Zamasu fused with Potara, so the Saiyans better do the same". I don't mind the revision about Vegito defusing naturally but there should be something else to distinguish Potara from Metamorran fusion - I always prefer the idea that Potara is superior in almost every way with the only downside being the difficulty of acquiring the earrings. Even if Potara is impermanent, at least give it a longer lifespan or something. Either way, Vegito just feels like too extreme to resort to whereas Gogeta not only feels more thematically appropriate, but it would give a better sense of Zamasu's intended power since Gogeta (used to be) perceived as weaker - Toriyama wanted Zamasu to only be a Super Saiyan Blue tier threat even after fusing which is why Goku could contend with him solo.

Furthermore, Vegito's appearance was all Toyotaro's idea explicitly for fanservice and he literally went against his beloved Toriyama-sensei's wishes to do it. I think that summarises that while they may draw similarly, they have very contrasting ideas about storytelling. I think Toriyama again felt pressured to include Gogeta in Super: Broly to complete the "old Z Movie celebration" theme which is why it felt quite hastily added to the script. It really does come completely out of nowhere. However, what would be your alternative?

[SupremeKai25]

If it was Gogeta instead of Vegito, that'd mean Gowasu also wasn't there to give his earrings to the saiyans. And it doesn't feel right at all to not include Gowasu in the final fight with Zamasu.

[Melee_Sovereign]

Caulifla and Kale are one of the worst shits in the entire franchise.

Is that an unpopular opinion?

It actually isn't.

[Matches Malone]

Caulifla and Kale are one of the worst shits in the entire franchise.

Is that an unpopular opinion?

Nope, not at all. They're pretty high up on the list of worst DB characters for a good number of fans. It's a shame they were written the way they were, as fans had been waiting for years to see Female Saiyans who can hold their own with everyone else.

[WittyUsername]

I don’t know how unpopular this one is, but I don’t think Toyotaro’s writing is true to the spirit of Toriyama’s. Toriyama’s writing has an actual sense of personality and quirkiness to it, while Toyotaro’s writing (at least for Super) is extremely barebones and generic. I’m not exactly a big fan of the anime version of Super, but I don’t get the people who say that the manga version is better, or that it’s the “definitive” continuation of the manga. The Dragon Ball Super manga was made specifically to promote the anime, not the other way around, and it shows.

[LoganForkHands73]

Here's potentially a real stinker. I don't think Toriyama's "modern" art style is that bad. It's an extremely broad term thrown around but it's usually used to refer to his late-2000s digital work and his growing preference for slimmer, less detailed character designs. It may not stand up to the detail of his previous work, but there's something appealing about it and it's interesting to see how his style has evolved, even if many see it for the worse. I don't know, I guess I find the simplicity quite charming. I enjoy his Dragon Quest XI art for example.

[Grimlock]

I also like Toriyama's modern style. But that's the point, since it's different, it's not suitable for some circumstances. While Jaco, the Galactic Patrolman has a good art style, Dragon Ball Minus doesn't. Because Saiyans themselves aren't supposed to be thin. It's really odd to see them like that, it's like they haven't been eating or something.

[Mad Swami]

If it was Gogeta instead of Vegito, that'd mean Gowasu also wasn't there to give his earrings to the saiyans. And it doesn't feel right at all to not include Gowasu in the final fight with Zamasu.

I'm not saying he can't be there. In fact maybe he tries to give the earrings but Zamasu destroys them. Hell he could even hold Zamasu off by talking to him long enough buying time for Goku and Vegeta to fuse

[Mad Swami]

Here's potentially a real stinker. I don't think Toriyama's "modern" art style is that bad. It's an extremely broad term thrown around but it's usually used to refer to his late-2000s digital work and his growing preference for slimmer, less detailed character designs. It may not stand up to the detail of his previous work, but there's something appealing about it and it's interesting to see how his style has evolved, even if many see it for the worse. I don't know, I guess I find the simplicity quite charming. I enjoy his Dragon Quest XI art for example.

Honestly his art has always been great, the only thing I am not a huge thing of is DBS animation. It's a lot less cozy then Z and even GT. I think it could just be nostalgia but there is something I am not a huge fan of. However in the recruitment arc of the T.O.P I really love the animation style they had.

http://en.yibada.com/articles/193539/20 ... oilers.htm

I sent a link to some article that just has a picture of what I'm talking about. I don't know how to insert images.