FUNimation DBZ TV Blu-ray Official On-Going Thread

[SSJMan]

That's not dark detail, that's crushed blacks. It's actually an example of what's frequently wrong with how movies are presented now, as far as I'm concerned. The contrast is upped so much you can barely see the walls!

Not to be mean but If you believe that is crushing and not dark detail, and other Blu rays are doing the same thing. Then you need a new TV or computer monitor. I can see the walls

[Zestanor]

I have come across this before. Dark detail was never really allowed for SD TVs. Manly because they did not have a large enough contrast ratio. Therefor the luminance and color levels would be squashed together for a dvd. When Blu rays/HD TVs came out, dark detail was allowed because the contrast ratio Was higher and could be seen properly. So now you will have a separation of darker detail and brighter detail. Instead of it all being bunched together. Cheap Hd TV may not show dark detail and squash the colors back together or just show the picture poorly. Here is an example of dark detail on Batman Beyond Return of the Joker Dvd and Blu ray.

Nope. What you have there is a crap quality DVD (actually that does look like an internet video) and a black crushed Blu-ray (of which I must also doubt the credibility.) On both DVD and Blu-ray, on a number scale of 0-255, full black is 16, and white is 235. The numbers left out help compensate for overshoot/undershoot. "Squashing" the luminance range would be a complete waste of... of... luminance range!

[SSJMan]

I have come across this before. Dark detail was never really allowed for SD TVs. Manly because they did not have a large enough contrast ratio. Therefor the luminance and color levels would be squashed together for a dvd. When Blu rays/HD TVs came out, dark detail was allowed because the contrast ratio Was higher and could be seen properly. So now you will have a separation of darker detail and brighter detail. Instead of it all being bunched together. Cheap Hd TV may not show dark detail and squash the colors back together or just show the picture poorly. Here is an example of dark detail on Batman Beyond Return of the Joker Dvd and Blu ray.

Nope. What you have there is a crap quality DVD (actually that does look like an internet video) and a black crushed Blu-ray (of which I must also doubt the credibility.) On both DVD and Blu-ray, on a number scale of 0-255, full black is 16, and white is 235. The numbers left out help compensate for overshoot/undershoot. "Squashing" the luminance range would be a complete waste of... of... luminance range!

seriously guys? I feel insulted right now. My job is blu rays. Its my profession. I feel like I can't have an intelligent conversation with people. I have explained dark detail intelligently to some of you. And I feel if I say anything to the contrary that I will Get attacked. This is why I don't like forums. I only came on because I love DBZ. I know I'm not lying about the Batman dvd. In fact I've shown you pictures of it. If you guys believe that Blu Ray (luminance, detail) should be just like the dvds, then we get no advancements in technology. You guys make me feel like I did not do a good enough job explain it to you. But I know I went Above and beyond a good enough job.
To some of you (not all of you) Its about who is right and who is wrong. And you always needing to be right.

[bkev]

To be honest the second shot looks like it could be legitimate to me, but the first definitely is not from a DVD. Maybe from a rip you made yourself that's been compressed, but certainly not the real thing. And I know other blus do the same thing; in fact, I even stated that I find it a rather annoying trend. As for a new computer monitor? I'll concede I'm just on my MacBook here, so it very well could have awful settings. But even when I set the brightness to max I can barely make out the walls the way I can in your first provided screenshot.

edit: ran his images through Tineye. He at least capped them himself rather than grabbing them from somewhere else on the internet, if that means anything.

[SSJMan]

To be honest the second shot looks like it could be legitimate to me, but the first definitely is not from a DVD. Maybe from a rip you made yourself that's been compressed, but certainly not the real thing. And I know other blus do the same thing; in fact, I even stated that I find it a rather annoying trend. As for a new computer monitor? I'll concede I'm just on my MacBook here, so it very well could have awful settings. But even when I set the brightness to max I can barely make out the walls the way I can in your first provided screenshot.

edit: ran his images through Tineye. He at least capped them himself rather than grabbing them from somewhere else on the internet, if that means anything.

DVD was 16:9 letterbox in a 4:3 screen so it did not take full advantage of the 480 resolution. That could be why it looks that way.

[Metalwario64]

DVD was 16:9 letterbox in a 4:3 screen...

And the image you posted isn't. So is that an admission that you've tampered with the image?

[SSJMan]

DVD was 16:9 letterbox in a 4:3 screen...

And the image you posted isn't. So is that an admission that you've tampered with the image?

zoomed in using cyberlink powerdvd 11 to make it easier to compare.
DVD

blu ray

[SSJMan]

As we all know The Dark knight Blu ray was celebrated for its Picture. And Is a wonderful example of dark Detail.
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Its to be expected, When you have a blu ray release that It would have a larger Spectrum between Bright Detail and Dark Detail. Having a full, more complete range of color and luminance. Piccolo ears do not worry me. It would worry me, that I wouldn't get dark Detail.
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NOW I COULD BE WRONG! about what the Dragon Ball picture should look like. But most likely what is happening is the Blu ray giving a fuller Spectrum of luminance and color.

[Raykugen]

words

>.jpg
>576p

They seem to be from illegal rips aswell, due to the colour banding.

C'mon dude

It don't care.
So, why all you guys are bother this guy supposing he has rip something? really, do you care? He don't do advertisement about nothing, he don't talks about bootleg, he just want to share information, I don't think he ripped nothing, but if he did, what!?? It's just an example, nothing more. Even if that would be a rip, he would rip them from his dvd's or whatever he has, stop acting stupid.

[TripleRach]

It don't care.
So, why all you guys are bother this guy supposing he has rip something? really, do you care? He don't do advertisement about nothing, he don't talks about bootleg, he just want to share information, I don't think he ripped nothing, but if he did, what!?? It's just an example, nothing more. Even if that would be a rip, he would rip them from his dvd's or whatever he has, stop acting stupid.

The problem isn't about bootlegs. The problem is that the images he posted don't look like proper screencaps.

I'm not even sure what the argument here is anymore, but I hope this isn't turning into a Batman thread.

[Metalwario64]

I'm not even sure what the argument here is anymore, but I hope this isn't turning into a Batman thread.

SSJMan is arguing that the Blu-Ray's footage is darker because Blu-Rays are "supposed" to have darker footage, even though FUNimation's masters for these episodes have always had darker colors.

For an on-hand example, on the movie 1 single, Piccolo's colors look nearly the same as the Blu-Ray shots (save for upped contrast, as evident by the black levels), darker shading and all, and that was on DVD, so that alone negates any "argument" that FUNimation's darkening them because they're on Blu-Ray.

[SSJMan]

I'm not even sure what the argument here is anymore, but I hope this isn't turning into a Batman thread.

SSJMan is arguing that the Blu-Ray's footage is darker because Blu-Rays are "supposed" to have darker footage, even though FUNimation's masters for these episodes have always had darker colors.

For an on-hand example, on the movie 1 single, Piccolo's colors look nearly the same as the Blu-Ray shots (save for upped contrast, as evident by the black levels), darker shading and all, and that was on DVD, so that alone negates any "argument" that FUNimation's darkening them because they're on Blu-Ray.

The Idea is that They The dark and the bright luminance levels would be brought together in post for dvd. Not Darkened for blu ray. Which I and others would do For dvd. When the image is darker on dvd, there is Way less detail. But on blu ray we are able to keep it the way that it was made because detail is not lost.
Also, the screencaps are proper.

[SSJMan]

But I'm just an encoding/Blu-ray expert, I hear that TheGreenQuality on youtube will be going over everything (in depth) in the dragon ball releases, blu rays, dragon boxs and kai. From My conversations with him he clams to be a all around video expert and an expert in everything dragon ball related. I will be eagerly waiting for that video.
But un tell the blu rays come out we can not know for sure.

[Metalwario64]

SSJMan, you keep double posting. You can just edit your post and add information if your post is the most recent in the thread. Just click the "edit" button in the bottom right of your post.

[SSJMan]

SSJMan, you keep double posting. You can just edit your post and add information if your post is the most recent in the thread. Just click the "edit" button in the bottom right of your post.

Sorry I'm new to this forum.

[MarcFBR]

Also, the screencaps are proper.

Ignoring that much of what you say isn't quite right (often it reads more like someone who read a guide on the internet but didn't further check information.)

If you believe those screencaps are proper than you honestly don't know what you are talking about.

Rather than go into a detailed explanation I'll just give the single most basic one that shows those screencaps weren't done correctly.

You showed a picture of the BD/DVD set you used to take the capture. That specific set only exists in the USA. Ignoring that your BD caps are 576 (which I'll ignore since the comparison was for black levels, not detail) the DVD caps are also 576. There is no way that a proper NTSC DVD will be screencapped and come out to 576.

So claim whatever you want, it still isn't 'proper.' And if you can't take a DVD screencap (or at least admit the cap is wrong when a mistake was noticed) then you are a professional in name only, because a real professional can admit their mistakes, especially when it's a mistake that doesn't really matter.

[SSJMan]

Also, the screencaps are proper.

Ignoring that much of what you say isn't quite right (often it reads more like someone who read a guide on the internet but didn't further check information.)

If you believe those screencaps are proper than you honestly don't know what you are talking about.

Rather than go into a detailed explanation I'll just give the single most basic one that shows those screencaps weren't done correctly.

You showed a picture of the BD/DVD set you used to take the capture. That specific set only exists in the USA. Ignoring that your BD caps are 576 (which I'll ignore since the comparison was for black levels, not detail) the DVD caps are also 576. There is no way that a proper NTSC DVD will be screencapped and come out to 576.

So claim whatever you want, it still isn't 'proper.' And if you can't take a DVD screencap (or at least admit the cap is wrong when a mistake was noticed) then you are a professional in name only, because a real professional can admit their mistakes, especially when it's a mistake that doesn't really matter.

This is exactly why I dont like Forums. Because I am not lying about anything. I am so done with this place. And for the people who ganged up on me. How are you supposed to properly decipher witch releases are better if you guys are able to find (so called) proof of absolutely anything (and I mean anything) you want. even if the thing you are finding proof for, is wrong. All I did was take screencaps using CyberLink PowerDVD 11. Thats all.

[MarcFBR]

This is exactly why I dont like Forums. Because I am not lying about anything. I am so done with this place.

Here are some properly done captures.

I did this with two different video players, with different output methods so it's possible to see the wide range of potential.

But since you are done with this place you won't see it. Others may be interested though.

http://db-destiny.net/batman-nativedvd.png 720x480, the way the image is stored on the DVD.

http://db-destiny.net/batman480.png 640x480, the way I tend to cap, for various reasons. For this we squeeze the image slightly horizontally to get the correct aspect ratio.

http://db-destiny.net/batman540.png 720x540, this method stretches the image vertically to get the correct aspect ratio. I tend to stick with 640x480 because I'd rather go down in size than up and it keeps it at 480, which keeps the vertical resolution the same as widescreen DVDs when their aspect ratio gets corrected.


But then I'm not a professional, so feel free to correct me if you are still around.

[SSJMan]

This is exactly why I dont like Forums. Because I am not lying about anything. I am so done with this place.

Here are some properly done captures.

I did this with two different video players, with different output methods so it's possible to see the wide range of potential.

But since you are done with this place you won't see it. Others may be interested though.

http://db-destiny.net/batman-nativedvd.png 720x480, the way the image is stored on the DVD.

http://db-destiny.net/batman480.png 640x480, the way I tend to cap, for various reasons. For this we squeeze the image slightly horizontally to get the correct aspect ratio.

http://db-destiny.net/batman540.png 720x540, this method stretches the image vertically to get the correct aspect ratio. I tend to stick with 640x480 because I'd rather go down in size than up and it keeps it at 480, which keeps the vertical resolution the same as widescreen DVDs when their aspect ratio gets corrected.


But then I'm not a professional, so feel free to correct me if you are still around.

Yes I'm still around. You just need to make sure that your video card form your computer is not Modifying the picture. or put the video files into sony vegas in order to find true intent (original rgb) color information. Many video cards will fix wave form and vector problems found with dvds. So it could up convert video levels to higher contrast screens. But sony vegas would be your best bet for (True intent) screen cap. I may still be done with this place. I was at one point feeling really good about being on this forum site. Oh well.

[MarcFBR]

Yes I'm still around. You just need to make sure that your video card form your computer is not Modifying the picture. or put the video files into sony vegas in order to find true intent (original rgb) color information. Many video cards will fix wave form and vector problems found with dvds. So it could up convert video levels to higher contrast screens. But sony vegas would be your best bet for (True intent) screen cap. I may still be done with this place. I was at one point feeling really good about being on this forum site. Oh well.

Which ignores the issue that your captures weren't the correct resolution and clearly had been modified. If you really are a professional you should know the resolutions things should be at, so the program taking them incorrectly is a moot argument.