FUNI Super dub - What are your wishes?

[Ajay]

Of course. Replacement scores are a terrible practice. Comparing it to filler is a totally different beast and holds no water. The filler is part of the anime as a product. When they chopped that out and changed the score for Kai, it was an studio-sanctioned decision to create a new product. That's entirely different to what FUNimation did. They created their own version of the show and passed it off as the same thing. That's not okay.

If you directed a film and determined the music, the actors, and the overall tone of the piece, you'd be absolutely livid if someone came along and changed around all of that because they felt it didn't match their tastes or target audience. That's entirely disrespectful to your piece of art. If someone doesn't like part of your piece, that's fine, but altering said art into something to appeal to someone else is a disgusting practice. Things don't need to appeal to everyone. Your vision shouldn't be altered as a result.

I don't care about the gender of a dub actor in relation to the original cast. The idea is to retain the traits of the character as written in the original dialogue. Changing that is changing the direction of the show, and that's an outright bad practice, just as much as music replacement. A large majority of the fanbase complain about Nozawa because they're used to a totally different sound coming from the character. That's irrelevant to the argument.

I'm not saying you can't criticise a product. Of course you can. But that's my point. You're allowed to dislike an artistic choice, but to demand it be changed for an international broadcast to suit your tastes is silly.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Of course. Replacement scores are a terrible practice. Comparing it to filler is a totally different beast and holds no water. The filler is part of the anime as a product. When they chopped that out and changed the score for Kai, it was an studio-sanctioned decision to create a new product. That's entirely different to what FUNimation did. They created their own version of the show and passed it off as the same thing. That's not okay.

If you directed a film and determined the music, the actors, and the overall tone of the piece, you'd be absolutely livid if someone came along and changed around all of that because they felt it didn't match their tastes or target audience. That's entirely disrespectful to your piece of art. If someone doesn't like part of your piece, that's fine, but altering said art into something to appeal to someone else is a disgusting practice. Things don't need to appeal to everyone. Your vision shouldn't be altered as a result.

I don't care about the gender of a dub actor in relation to the original cast. The idea is to retain the traits of the character as written in the original dialogue. Changing that is changing the direction of the show, and that's an outright bad practice, just as much as music replacement. A large majority of the fanbase complain about Nozawa because they're used to a totally different sound coming from the character. That's irrelevant to the argument.

I'm not saying you can't criticise a product. Of course you can. But that's my point. You're allowed to dislike an artistic choice, but to demand it be changed for an international broadcast to suit your tastes is silly.

Well nobody's demanding, just suggesting and criticizing. Also if changing the music is bad, why is funimation changing Goku's voice not? They changed that from the original, also I don't think Toei cares. they gave Funimation free reign to do as they please. Otherwise they'd have a contract say "no replacing the music or making the men sound like men." Americanization is good for the product as it helped it grow. It's not like they changed the entire show, all they did was do what they thought was best, which was do more epic music and voices to them. It's fine if you prefer the OG version, but if Funimation had good intent, and Toei doesn't seam to mind it seams like you're getting upset over nothing. Life's to short for that my friend.

I mean at minimum they should have a alternate track for the DVD's for those who don't enjoy Japanese music. Would that be bad? I mean it's one thing if it was filled with lady gaga music and didn't fit the feel, but if all it does it help the series and doesn't hamper those who want the OG version, I see no harm.
Making people have only one way to enjoy dragonball is a bad business move and kind childish. Like "like my version or your not a true fan" kind of mentality.
Not saying that's you BTW.

[Kaboom]

No, replacing music was bad in the 90's and it would be just as bad now, period. FUNimation has thankfully outgrown that practice, and fans of the old replacement music need to outgrow it too. FUNi still (mistakenly) chooses to include the old replacement score on their newer releases of DBZ, so its fans should be content with that and stop trying to taint FUNi's treatment of new entries in the franchise for the sake of their own nostalgia.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

No, replacing music was bad in the 90's and it would be just as bad now, period. FUNimation has thankfully outgrown that practice, and fans of the old replacement music need to outgrow it too. FUNi still (mistakenly) chooses to include the old replacement score on their newer releases of DBZ, so its fans should be content with that and stop trying to taint FUNi's treatment of new entries in the franchise for the sake of their own nostalgia.

It's not tainting it man, and it's not nostalgia. If it was nostalgia I'd be saying Kai needed bruce and no yammamotto, I think Yammamotto is the BEST and he's the 2nd to newest one! It's a matter of PREFRENCE. Not everyone has to abide to the "keep it as the original" because the original Japanese version will always be there. I agree keep the script pure, and I know they won't ever go back to a unique new OST, but I still voice my plea aloud that they should. Sorry if that offends you.

However it has brought in a lot of people, and money to the franchise. The nostalgia thing can be said of the Japanese OST, but in both cases it's wrong. Just because it's your first doesn't mean you'll prefer it. Some may but not all, why else do I like funimation over ocean dub?
And the thread is about wishes, I and many others wish this. If you wish they won't then so be it, although TBH I think you should want it that way you have both ways to watch it. Three in fact.

Japanese
English with new music so everyone is happy and sales go up
English music with original OST from Japan.

If we have that everyone is happy. If we have it your way then many people won't buy the DVD's, which means less money and super being closer to being canceled. not everybody has to like the same way you guys do, and this is coming from a guy who watches dragonball with ALL the background music, from funi-ocean-kenji's score to Z's to Gt's and even Super. Our diversity is what makes the fanbase so great.

[Kaboom]

Preference has nothing to do with it. It's about having an iota of artistic integrity.

Kikuchi's score belongs in Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z because that's what its creators put there.
Tokunaga's score belongs in Dragon Ball GT because that's what its creators put there.
Yamamoto's score, then Kikuchi's score, and then Sumitomo's score are what belong in Kai because that's what its creators put there.
Sumitomo's score is what belongs in Dragon Ball Super because that's what its creators put there.

It's 2016, not 1996. Replacement scores are a thing of the past for dubs, at least for good ones.

[DragonbaIlZ]

Replacement music is absolutely a wish I have for the FUNI dub and it's terrible that FUNI has outgrown that practice. It's simple for me. I've always enjoyed the Japanese score more with the original Japanese voicing. When it comes to the english dub (FUNI or even Ocean) I've always admired the different sound. It changes the atmosphere and gives me a different experience and that is a GREAT thing. It's not fair to say replacement music is a bad practice considering the craze DBZ was in the late 90's and early 00's with Faulconer in the US. The show was wildly successful with him and a lot of those fans still exist around the world.

I don't speak for everyone, but for me personally, The Super score is beyond terrible, boring, basic, and so on. I think a lot can agree with that. Add that on top of the inconsistent animation we've had so far, it equals out to a terrible product. I honestly don't expect the series to do well at all if/when FUNI dubs it. However, I think if replacement music is added, it will give people reason to actually buy the DVDs/Blu Rays. Everyone isn't a purist, so I see no harm in having options since the original score will always exist and be an option.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Preference has nothing to do with it. It's about having an iota of artistic integrity.

Kikuchi's score belongs in Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z because that's what its creators put there.
Tokunaga's score belongs in Dragon Ball GT because that's what its creators put there.
Yamamoto's score, then Kikuchi's score, and then Sumitomo's score are what belong in Kai because that's what its creators put there.
Sumitomo's score is what belongs in Dragon Ball Super because that's what its creators put there.

It's 2016, not 1996. Replacement scores are a thing of the past for dubs, at least for good ones.

Well to me it just seams disrespectfull and LAZY not to put in a replacement score, and idiotic in terms of business savy. You think it takes integrity TO stay with the OG score, I say it takes integrity to add a NEW score. We disagree, nothing left to say.

Replacement music is absolutely a wish I have for the FUNI dub and it's terrible that FUNI has outgrown that practice. It's simple for me. I've always enjoyed the Japanese score more with the original Japanese voicing. When it comes to the english dub (FUNI or even Ocean) I've always admired the different sound. It changes the atmosphere and gives me a different experience and that is a GREAT thing. It's not fair to say replacement music is a bad practice considering the craze DBZ was in the late 90's and early 00's with Faulconer in the US. The show was wildly successful with him and a lot of those fans still exist around the world.

I don't speak for everyone, but for me personally, The Super score is beyond terrible, boring, basic, and so on. I think a lot can agree with that. Add that on top of the inconsistent animation we've had so far, it equals out to a terrible product. I honestly don't expect the series to do well at all if/when FUNI dubs it. However, I think if replacement music is added, it will give people reason to actually buy the DVDs/Blu Rays. Everyone isn't a purist, so I see no harm in having options since the original score will always exist and be an option.

I agree 100%! Plus if Toei had artistic integrity.....I think Super wouldn't be so.....let's just say flawed.

[Kaboom]

The rest of the world didn't need DBZ's music to be replaced for it to be popular. It didn't need it here, either. New fans are attracted to it in droves nowadays through Kai on TV, and that doesn't have replacement music. Dragon Ball sells in America because it's Dragon Ball, not because some little nothing studio screwed with its music back in the 90's.

Replacing music IS a bad practice, and I'm glad that FUNimation realizes that nowadays no matter how badly some fans may want them to start doing it again. Honestly this whole conversation is moot because the pipe dreams about the scores being replaced are 99.99999% guaranteed to never happen anyway.

[Kamiccolo9]

Dragon Ball did well all over the world. Let's not act like the Faulconer score was something that was necessary for it to be popular in the U.S. No other country had it, and the show did well in most of them.

Edit: Dammit Kaboom.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Dragon Ball did well all over the world. Let's not act like the Faulconer score was something that was necessary for it to be popular in the U.S. No other country had it, and the show did well in most of them.

Edit: Dammit Kaboom.

nobody said it was needed to make it popular, but it gave it a HUGE boost. You can't deny the fanbase is split up by people who

won't watch the dub

won't watch sub

won't watch dragonball without bruce's music.

those 3 groups exist and are VERY big. heck if you don't use the USA score on a video on youtube the comments are all saying it has no soul and ECT without bruce.

[Kamiccolo9]

Dragon Ball did well all over the world. Let's not act like the Faulconer score was something that was necessary for it to be popular in the U.S. No other country had it, and the show did well in most of them.

Edit: Dammit Kaboom.

nobody said it was needed to make it popular, but it gave it a HUGE boost. You can't deny the fanbase is split up by people who

won't watch the dub

won't watch sub

won't watch dragonball without bruce's music.

those 3 groups exist and are VERY big. heck if you don't use the USA score on a video on youtube the comments are all saying it has no soul and ECT without bruce.

And the fanbase wouldn't have split like that if the replacement score had never been used in the first place. What's your point?

[Gyt Kaliba]

FUNi still (mistakenly) chooses to include the old replacement score on their newer releases of DBZ

I get what it is you're trying to say, but this one part I'd kind of have to disagree with. They own the rights to the score, and it's the way a lot of people remember the show, so I don't really see why they shouldn't keep it on there. It's easy enough to do, so why not?

I'm in full agreement that we don't need a return to replacement scores, mind you, though.

[Kaboom]

And the fanbase wouldn't have split like that if the replacement score had never been used in the first place. What's your point?

You ninja'd me this time. If FUNimation had just used the original music from the start like every other non-Japanese dub on the planet before them, there WOULD be no division. There would be no modern vocal minority calling for the return of crap replacement music because there would never have been a distinction to begin with.

The divide only exists now because FUNi did use replacement music, some people became accustomed to it and the skewed tone of the series it embodied, and are now too attached to that altered version of the show to adjust to the music that actually belongs there. Even worse, they want FUNimation to screw with new material in the same way just to suit their distorted tastes and preferences.

I get what it is you're trying to say, but this one part I'd kind of have to disagree with. They own the rights to the score, and it's the way a lot of people remember the show, so I don't really see why they shouldn't keep it on there. It's easy enough to do, so why not?

Because it's just sustaining the division. I strongly believe the western DBZ fandom needs to just be weaned off of the replacement score.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Dragon Ball did well all over the world. Let's not act like the Faulconer score was something that was necessary for it to be popular in the U.S. No other country had it, and the show did well in most of them.

Edit: Dammit Kaboom.

nobody said it was needed to make it popular, but it gave it a HUGE boost. You can't deny the fanbase is split up by people who

won't watch the dub

won't watch sub

won't watch dragonball without bruce's music.

those 3 groups exist and are VERY big. heck if you don't use the USA score on a video on youtube the comments are all saying it has no soul and ECT without bruce.

And the fanbase wouldn't have split like that if the replacement score had never been used in the first place. What's your point?

My point is those people wouldn't even be there to be it's own section if it wasn't for bruce!

[Kamiccolo9]

My point is those people wouldn't even be there to be it's own section if it wasn't for bruce!

The fanbases of every other country in the world would seem to indicate otherwise.

[Gyt Kaliba]

I get what it is you're trying to say, but this one part I'd kind of have to disagree with. They own the rights to the score, and it's the way a lot of people remember the show, so I don't really see why they shouldn't keep it on there. It's easy enough to do, so why not?

Because it's just sustaining the division. I strongly believe the western DBZ fandom needs to just be weaned off of the replacement score.

I dunno...I mean, again, I get what you're saying, and I agree with it on some level...but at the same time, it's there, it exists, so it may as well still be there on most releases. There's no reason for fans of that version to not be able to watch the show, the old stuff, the way they want to. And FUNimation is never going to listen to them as far as new material goes, so it's harmless enough, at least to me.

Looking back on it though, I do kind of think they may as well have left that score off of the Dragon Boxes. There probably would have been some fans that wanted better footage than the Season Sets but still wanted the dub score that would have felt disappointed, but that would have been a good time and place to 'wean' them off - 'Here's some better visuals, but why don't you finally give it a try with the original score. Who knows, you might like it!' basically.

[Kaboom]

Looking back on it though, I do kind of think they may as well have left that score off of the Dragon Boxes. There probably would have been some fans that wanted better footage than the Season Sets but still wanted the dub score that would have felt disappointed, but that would have been a good time and place to 'wean' them off - 'Here's some better visuals, but why don't you finally give it a try with the original score. Who knows, you might like it!' basically.

They DID leave the "broadcast dub" score off of the Dragon Boxes. One of the best decisions they ever made. The English-language track with the Japanese BGM was barely even included as a bonus at all. *Hugs his complete set of 7*

[DragonbaIlZ]

Dragon Ball did well all over the world. Let's not act like the Faulconer score was something that was necessary for it to be popular in the U.S. No other country had it, and the show did well in most of them.

Edit: Dammit Kaboom.

Let's not act like replacement scores were a failure. It worked before, it'd work again. If options were a bad thing, dubs would not exist.

[Gyt Kaliba]

They DID leave the "broadcast dub" score off of the Dragon Boxes. One of the best decisions they ever made. The English-language track with the Japanese BGM was barely even included as a bonus at all. *Hugs his complete set of 7*

...Oh, that's right, they did. Ack. Well, now you can see how long it's been since I've re-watched the Z portion of the series (I've only got Boxes 1 and 5 anyway though, so curse you! *Shakes e-fist*)

That must have been what I was thinking of, was them almost not even including the dub at all. I am glad they at least included that.

[Doctor.]

So you think it's bad to have ever had faulconer?

Yes, it's an absolute insult to the original series.