Most Overrated Character (Besides Goku and Vegeta)?

[MyVisionity]

I'm not assuming anything. The story tells you how old they are. There's room for interpretation, of course, but it's not necessary to know their exact ages. The "teenage" realm gives enough of an idea of what kind of age gaps we're dealing with.

Are immortal creatures their numerical ages or the ages in which they were turned? I agree that those are reasonable questions.

For the record, I don't particularly find the Kuririn/18 relationship to be all that gross, I just thought it was worth noting in light of the conversation about the believability of their relationship. I agree that it helps when 18 drops the girly voice in the Boo arc and is written more maturely. And the timeskip helps.

Let's not forget that she kissed him first

This...... doesn't really excuse anything and is actually a little troubling to be honest.

It establishes how flipped the power dynamic is. The only thing troubling here is Krillin nearly being humiliated by an "18 year old"

The power dynamic isn't flipped just because "she started it". He's still a grown ass man. The power remains.

[goku the krump dancer]

Roshi is an example of how DB treats topics like sex. He's also Krillin's literal mentor. Why shouldn't he be brought up when talking about Krillin's eventual outlook on sex and relationships?

Sex isn't an integral part of the story, so how should it be treated? Also you're allowed to have multiple mentors for different things, there's no One Shoe Fits All when it comes to mentorship. Krillin sought out Roshi for Martial Arts purposes not dating advice, he also somehow knew Roshi was a perv, seeing as though he came prepared with a stack of porn mags to help sway him.

Krillin has not had multiple mentors or masters. He's had Roshi. Since he was thirteen the only parental figure in Krillin's life has been the Turtle Hermit. It shouldn't be controversial to say that Roshi has likely had a huge influence on Krillin's overall outlook.

Krillin doesn’t act like Roshi at all though, especially when dealing with women.

[PurestEvil]

This...... doesn't really excuse anything and is actually a little troubling to be honest.

It establishes how flipped the power dynamic is. The only thing troubling here is Krillin nearly being humiliated by an "18 year old"

The power dynamic isn't flipped just because "she started it". He's still a grown ass man. The power remains.

She was also several times stronger than Krillin, and would have been able to beat him near/to death.
Also, you imply that 18 is not grown up herself.

[MyVisionity]

She was also several times stronger than Krillin, and would have been able to beat him near/to death.
Also, you imply that 18 is not grown up herself.

Her strength doesn't outweigh the fact that he's a man and she's a woman. Especially in the case of a romantic relationship and not a combat situation. The social significance of gender is still there.

No, I don't consider a teenager of any age to be a "grown-up". Especially when compared to a thirty year old.

[goku the krump dancer]

Even if you say #18 was AT MOST 18 years old during the Android arc, Marron is 3 by the time we meet her at the start of the Boo arc, meaning there was four years that went by before she was conceived. We don't know when exactly Krillin and 18 started seeing each other but #18 was at least 22 years old when little Marron was born. The Cappodona is heavy in this thread right now.

[Cure Dragon 255]

I know this is pushing an american perspective onto a Japanese work but if she's literally 18 years old its okay. Besides Japan has a lower standard WHICH I TOTALLY dont abide to. But if she's 18 its okay.

[jjgp1112]

Even if you say #18 was AT MOST 18 years old during the Android arc, Marron is 3 by the time we meet her at the start of the Boo arc, meaning there was four years that went by before she was conceived. We don't know when exactly Krillin and 18 started seeing each other but #18 was at least 22 years old when little Marron was born. The Cappodona is heavy in this thread right now.

I think us older Dragon Ball fans have just run out of things to talk about for a show we probably have no reason to keep talking about (I am not exempt from this, just an observation).

[Grimlock]

I'm not assuming anything.

You're assuming Android 18 is a teenager, as no official information supports/states that.

Anyway, since we don't know her actual age, it's kinda pointless to keep discussing about this. At the end of the day you could be right, or vice-versa. But until we got a confirmation on this, what is the point? We should probably go back on-topic.

(but for the record: there's no problem in a 30-year-old man dating someone around ten years younger, as long as isn't below eighteen it's fine. Oh, and by the way, since I like accuracy: Kuririn is 31 years old in AGE 767. Or he's 32 if you put Goku's birth year in AGE 736).

[goku the krump dancer]

I think us older Dragon Ball fans have just run out of things to talk about for a show we probably have no reason to keep talking about (I am not exempt from this, just an observation).

Lol That's true. Prior to 2013 the only thing the series had going for it was mediocre video games and fan projects and even back then we were pulling teeth to talk about anything other than Super Boo vs Kid Boo. If Battle of Gods never happened I think this forum would probably be a wasteland at this point.

[MyVisionity]

Even if you say #18 was AT MOST 18 years old during the Android arc, Marron is 3 by the time we meet her at the start of the Boo arc, meaning there was four years that went by before she was conceived. We don't know when exactly Krillin and 18 started seeing each other but #18 was at least 22 years old when little Marron was born. The Cappodona is heavy in this thread right now.

...If she doesn't age, then does it really matter how many years passed before Marron was born???

But regardless, if she was a teenager when he first fell for her then that's still not a good look no matter how much she might age.

I know this is pushing an american perspective onto a Japanese work but if she's literally 18 years old its okay. Besides Japan has a lower standard WHICH I TOTALLY dont abide to. But if she's 18 its okay.

Legal/illegal is not the same as right/wrong.

I'm not assuming anything.

You're assuming Android 18 is a teenager, as no official information supports/states that.

That's not an assumption. The series itself supports this as it tells us when the characters are introduced that they are kids. The Daizenshuu books repeat this. It doesn't have to be so explicit as to say "teenager" or give an exact age.

[goku the krump dancer]

...If she doesn't age, then does it really matter how many years passed before Marron was born???

Oh my lord, even if she stays young longer, or doesnt physically age past what ever she was when she was converted, her mentality can definitely still grow and evolve. So its possible that she can be a 50 year old woman in a 20 year old body.

But regardless, if she was a teenager when he first fell for her then that's still not a good look no matter how much she might age.

Just like all of us here, he didn't know her age, hell we still don't know how old she is, this is all guessing and it REALLY doesn't matter ultimately, this is one of the most asinine conversations I've had on here in a while. Depending on how a woman develops it can be challenging to tell just how old she is between the ages of 17 to about 30.

It happens all the time where guys might see an attractive girl but then backs off after he finds out that she's a little too young for his personal preferences. It happened to me last week.

[Cure Dragon 255]

Even if you say #18 was AT MOST 18 years old during the Android arc, Marron is 3 by the time we meet her at the start of the Boo arc, meaning there was four years that went by before she was conceived. We don't know when exactly Krillin and 18 started seeing each other but #18 was at least 22 years old when little Marron was born. The Cappodona is heavy in this thread right now.

...If she doesn't age, then does it really matter how many years passed before Marron was born???

But regardless, if she was a teenager when he first fell for her then that's still not a good look no matter how much she might age.

I know this is pushing an american perspective onto a Japanese work but if she's literally 18 years old its okay. Besides Japan has a lower standard WHICH I TOTALLY dont abide to. But if she's 18 its okay.

Legal/illegal is not the same as right/wrong.

I'm not assuming anything.

You're assuming Android 18 is a teenager, as no official information supports/states that.

That's not an assumption. The series itself supports this as it tells us when the characters are introduced that they are kids. The Daizenshuu books repeat this. It doesn't have to be so explicit as to say "teenager" or give an exact age.

I know I shouldnt cast stones but GOD your posts are creepy. You constantly argue that Dragon Ball is a den of creepy creepy stuff. Like that "Sexual Assault" is a defining feature of the series. And I wasnt arguing for legality I was going by what is accepted? So should Krillin wait until she's forty?

EDIT:ALSO I know it does feature creepy creepy CREEPY stuff. But you argue IN FAVOR of this shit instead of toning it down. Like its been doing quite recently.

[Polyphase Avatron]

...If she doesn't age, then does it really matter how many years passed before Marron was born???

Oh my lord, even if she stays young longer, or doesnt physically age past what ever she was when she was converted, her mentality can definitely still grow and evolve. So its possible that she can be a 50 year old woman in a 20 year old body.

Isn't this the same excuse that people use to defend lolicon anime where the love interest with the body of a 10 - year - old girl is actually a 700 - year - old vampire or whatever?

[Skar]

The series doesn't really present Krillin and #18's relationship as awkward so it's up to the audience's interpretation. Same with Future Mai and Trunks. She's like 50 something years old but is physically only around 30 and it's presented as a normal relationship between two young adults. I never considered #18 a teenager although it's possible they were kidnapped as teenagers and have matured since then. I think there's some leeway to assume that she has the mind of a woman in her late 20s and her body looks younger because they age slower.

[MyVisionity]

Depending on how a woman develops it can be challenging to tell just how old she is between the ages of 17 to about 30.

It happens all the time where guys might see an attractive girl but then backs off after he finds out that she's a little too young for his personal preferences. It happened to me last week.

Yeah you might've backed off, but Kuririn sure didn't...

I know this is pushing an american perspective onto a Japanese work but if she's literally 18 years old its okay. Besides Japan has a lower standard WHICH I TOTALLY dont abide to. But if she's 18 its okay.

Legal/illegal is not the same as right/wrong.

And I wasnt arguing for legality I was going by what is accepted? So should Krillin wait until she's forty?

EDIT:ALSO I know it does feature creepy creepy CREEPY stuff. But you argue IN FAVOR of this shit instead of toning it down. Like its been doing quite recently.

I'm not sure that age 18 is considered acceptable so much as it's considered legal. It's too young in my view.

Also, although I enjoy them, I never argued in favor of those things. What I did was question whether or not they could be separated from the series. But that's another thread.

[Polyphase Avatron]

The series doesn't really present Krillin and #18's relationship as awkward so it's up to the audience's interpretation. Same with Future Mai and Trunks. She's like 50 something years old but is physically only around 30 and it's presented as a normal relationship between two young adults. I never considered #18 a teenager although it's possible they were kidnapped as teenagers and have matured since then. I think there's some leeway to assume that she has the mind of a woman in her late 20s and her body looks younger because they age slower.

Future MaixTrunks actually seems a lot creepier than Krillinx18 to me.

[Grimlock]

Same with Future Mai and Trunks. She's like 50 something years old but is physically only around 30 and it's presented as a normal relationship between two young adults.

I wouldn't call a thirty-year-old man "young adult", but probably that seems to vary from culture to culture as well.

Since we also don't her age, how old do you think Mai was in Pilaf saga? (Just please don't say "she was a teenager based on what the story tells" you too, that wouldn't mean anything really).

If I were to guess, she would be somewhere between 23 and 30, give it or take it. Let's go for, say, 25. That would mean she was born in AGE 724, and that would mean she would be 72 by the time Future Trunks saga takes place. It's a 72-year-old woman in a body of a 29-year-old woman (because she was turned into a baby in AGE 767, according to the manga, if I remember correctly).

People seem to have a problem with this but as far as I can tell, Trunks "is just dating" (is he really? Didn't seem like it) a very experienced woman. There's no problem in that. It's not like "mind/mentality gets old" or anything, it doesn't make sense.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Same with Future Mai and Trunks. She's like 50 something years old but is physically only around 30 and it's presented as a normal relationship between two young adults.

I wouldn't call a thirty-year-old man "young adult", but probably that seems to vary from culture to culture as well.

Since we also don't her age, how old do you think Mai was in Pilaf saga? (Just please don't say "she was a teenager based on what the story tells" you too, that wouldn't mean anything really).

If I were to guess, she would be somewhere between 23 and 30, give it or take it. Let's go for, say, 25. That would mean she was born in AGE 724, and that would mean she would be 72 by the time Future Trunks saga takes place. It's a 72-year-old woman in a body of a 29-year-old woman (because she was turned into a baby in AGE 767, according to the manga, if I remember correctly).

People seem to have a problem with this but as far as I can tell, Trunks "is just dating" (is he really? Didn't seem like it) a very experienced woman. There's no problem in that. It's not like "mind/mentality gets old" or anything, it doesn't make sense.

There's also kid Mai crushing on kid Trunks...

[goku the krump dancer]

...If she doesn't age, then does it really matter how many years passed before Marron was born???

Oh my lord, even if she stays young longer, or doesnt physically age past what ever she was when she was converted, her mentality can definitely still grow and evolve. So its possible that she can be a 50 year old woman in a 20 year old body.

Isn't this the same excuse that people use to defend lolicon anime where the love interest with the body of a 10 - year - old girl is actually a 700 - year - old vampire or whatever?

Maybe but 18 is drawn as a grown woman not a 9 year old girl with Double D boobs.

[Dr. Casey]

22 years old when little Marron was born. The Cappodona is heavy in this thread right now.

...If she doesn't age, then does it really matter how many years passed before Marron was born???

Yeah, because Age of Consent laws (along with the general concept of people beneath a certain age being unable to consent) are based around mental maturity/mental development rather than physical. It's why 18 is a common age of consent, despite both genders physically being adults in almost every regard by 16 - mental development takes longer than physical. Not to mention that 18 year olds are physically speaking almost identical to 22 year olds anyway, so she wouldn't have changed much even without slowed down aging.

For my part (not that I really care about the subject or their possible age gap either way), if a 30 year old woman came on to me when I was an 18 year old high school senior, it would have felt pretty skeevy and uncomfortable to me. By the time I was 22, or even 20 for that matter, it wouldn't have felt that way to me at all. It would just be one adult to another. (Though the same wouldn't work in reverse, for whatever reason; when I was 30 I wouldn't have felt comfortable with anyone under 24 or so.)