Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[LowRyder2005]

Dragon Ball Super: ROB (return of the bang).

[spoiler]It remains to be seen if it really means he's meant to be Ultimate because of it or... something else; then again, if not now when? I just hope they clear the Base/ SS/ Ultimate mess.[/spoiler]

[Beerus-sama]

- not related to power levels post -

[Bullza]

I completely forgot the episode was today.

The preview is interesting. So Gohan needs Super Saiyan to fight Piccolo now? But he was alright using Base before in the Universe 6 saga.

Piccolo should still be below Buu surely so if Gohan needs to use Super Saiyan against him then I suppose that wipes out the idea that Base Gohan would be above Buu.

That would almost suggest that Gohan is essentially around his normal Buu saga level.

Is Goku in Base form stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan perhaps? After all he did have an advantage over Bergamo whereas it required Super Saiyan for Gohan to be a match for Lavender.

The confusion deepens.

[Freeza9000]

Its a shame the episode thread is locked until there are subtitles or summary... I liked to give my first impressions on the episode without having any subs. Should I give them here?

I just have to say this episode was cool, I liked how 17 was all serious and all.
- the alien guy wanted to sell the minotaurus because of his blood that its said had healing attributes.
- Cell's explosion scene was remembered since that guy supposely had a bomb inside himself and wanted to self destruct with that control.
- Dende informed Goku that the bomb was fake? well, that would have been better told before when they where in the spaceship
- 18 needs to meet the 17 of today, he surely is not a child like she described him
- Also, why does Krillin is noticing Goku's ki like he was spying him on where he is or something
- Jaco appeared just to inprision the alien guy atleast he did something in this episode.

- Finally, poor Beerus, he's so worried about losing he dreamt about Goku dying, wich was a scene with him with 17 at the spaceship with the weird guy pressing the button for self destruction? How does that work?

Would be better if you post this in the "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread.

[Beerus-sama]

Would be better if you post this in the "Dragon Ball Super" Official Announcement & Discussion Thread.

I thought I was in that thread
Will post it now
Thanks for the notice

[ZombieVito]

I completely forgot the episode was today.

The preview is interesting. So Gohan needs Super Saiyan to fight Piccolo now? But he was alright using Base before in the Universe 6 saga.

Piccolo should still be below Buu surely so if Gohan needs to use Super Saiyan against him then I suppose that wipes out the idea that Base Gohan would be above Buu.

That would almost suggest that Gohan is essentially around his normal Buu saga level.

Is Goku in Base form stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan perhaps? After all he did have an advantage over Bergamo whereas it required Super Saiyan for Gohan to be a match for Lavender.

The confusion deepens.

DBZGTKOSH was right again. Base Saiyans are not that much different from their Boo arc selfs.

Piccolo > SSJ Goku >= SSJ Gohan seems very real.

Next episode also implies hard that Gohan will get his Ultimate power back meaning he wasn't Ultimate since the BoG arc.

[Triggered Vegeta]

I completely forgot the episode was today.

The preview is interesting. So Gohan needs Super Saiyan to fight Piccolo now? But he was alright using Base before in the Universe 6 saga.

Piccolo should still be below Buu surely so if Gohan needs to use Super Saiyan against him then I suppose that wipes out the idea that Base Gohan would be above Buu.

That would almost suggest that Gohan is essentially around his normal Buu saga level.

Is Goku in Base form stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan perhaps? After all he did have an advantage over Bergamo whereas it required Super Saiyan for Gohan to be a match for Lavender.

The confusion deepens.

DBZGTKOSH was right again. Base Saiyans are not that much different from their Boo arc selfs.

Piccolo > SSJ Goku >= SSJ Gohan seems very real.

Next episode also implies hard that Gohan will get his Ultimate power back meaning he wasn't Ultimate since the BoG arc.

Piccolo >\= SS1 Gohan yes... SS1 Goku < Piccolo that's a big no.

[ZombieVito]

I completely forgot the episode was today.

The preview is interesting. So Gohan needs Super Saiyan to fight Piccolo now? But he was alright using Base before in the Universe 6 saga.

Piccolo should still be below Buu surely so if Gohan needs to use Super Saiyan against him then I suppose that wipes out the idea that Base Gohan would be above Buu.

That would almost suggest that Gohan is essentially around his normal Buu saga level.

Is Goku in Base form stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan perhaps? After all he did have an advantage over Bergamo whereas it required Super Saiyan for Gohan to be a match for Lavender.

The confusion deepens.

DBZGTKOSH was right again. Base Saiyans are not that much different from their Boo arc selfs.

Piccolo > SSJ Goku >= SSJ Gohan seems very real.

Next episode also implies hard that Gohan will get his Ultimate power back meaning he wasn't Ultimate since the BoG arc.

Piccolo >\= SS1 Gohan yes... SS1 Goku < Piccolo that's a big no.

Watch episode 75 again. SSJ Gohan fought on par with SSJ Goku.

[BWri]

I completely forgot the episode was today.

The preview is interesting. So Gohan needs Super Saiyan to fight Piccolo now? But he was alright using Base before in the Universe 6 saga.

Piccolo should still be below Buu surely so if Gohan needs to use Super Saiyan against him then I suppose that wipes out the idea that Base Gohan would be above Buu.

That would almost suggest that Gohan is essentially around his normal Buu saga level.

Is Goku in Base form stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan perhaps? After all he did have an advantage over Bergamo whereas it required Super Saiyan for Gohan to be a match for Lavender.

The confusion deepens.

I'm pretty sure everyone is above Buu Saga now. I don't think the Toei staff want to hold anyone who matters back to the levels of 5 arcs ago. I think Piccolo and Gohan are easily comparable to the likes of SBG Goku from the RoF arc, though maybe a little weaker.

[Triggered Vegeta]

DBZGTKOSH was right again. Base Saiyans are not that much different from their Boo arc selfs.

Piccolo > SSJ Goku >= SSJ Gohan seems very real.

Next episode also implies hard that Gohan will get his Ultimate power back meaning he wasn't Ultimate since the BoG arc.

Piccolo >\= SS1 Gohan yes... SS1 Goku < Piccolo that's a big no.

Watch episode 75 again. SSJ Gohan fought on par with SSJ Goku.

It was a Spar just like with Krillin, Buu etc.. nothing more than that. SS1 Goku wouldn't be on par with a Rusty Gohan... makes Zero sense. Piccolo was <<< 4th form Frost who was <<< SS1 Goku.

[ZombieVito]

Piccolo >\= SS1 Gohan yes... SS1 Goku < Piccolo that's a big no.

Watch episode 75 again. SSJ Gohan fought on par with SSJ Goku.

It was a Spar just like with Krillin, Buu etc.. nothing more than that. SS1 Goku wouldn't be on par with a Rusty Gohan... makes Zero sense. Piccolo was <<< 4th form Frost who was <<< SS1 Goku.

Piccolo trained hard the past year. Goku was not going easy on Gohan in episode 75.

[dbzfan7]

Ok now I am convinced it's just an anime thing where Goku has to go Blue for no reason all the time XD. I bet if the manga covers it, he probably won't be using it nearly as much at every opportunity.

[Triggered Vegeta]

Watch episode 75 again. SSJ Gohan fought on par with SSJ Goku.

It was a Spar just like with Krillin, Buu etc.. nothing more than that. SS1 Goku wouldn't be on par with a Rusty Gohan... makes Zero sense. Piccolo was <<< 4th form Frost who was <<< SS1 Goku.

Piccolo trained hard the past year. Goku was not going easy on Gohan in episode 75.

I still don't buy it, there was a substantial gap between Piccolo & SS1 in the U6 arc... Goku has powered up a lot since then... doubt Piccolo broke that gap.

[ZombieVito]

It was a Spar just like with Krillin, Buu etc.. nothing more than that. SS1 Goku wouldn't be on par with a Rusty Gohan... makes Zero sense. Piccolo was <<< 4th form Frost who was <<< SS1 Goku.

Piccolo trained hard the past year. Goku was not going easy on Gohan in episode 75.

I still don't buy it, there was a substantial gap between Piccolo & SS1 in the U6 arc... Goku has powered up a lot since then... doubt Piccolo broke that gap.

It is what it is. Nothing indicates that he was going easy on Gohan. Gohan even managed to punch him in the gut, surprising Goku.

[Bullza]

Watching the preview again it's probably too early to say too much.

It looks like regular Base Gohan not Ultimate Gohan, fights against Piccolo with weights on. I'm guessing that Piccolo will use some form of strategy going by what I see that will force Gohan to turn Super Saiyan.

Then Piccolo removes his weights and they continue fighting. After that who knows.

If they can portray it as

Piccolo > Gohan > Piccolo with weights

It would keep some consistency with the Resurrection F saga and Gohan being stronger with Piccolo with weights there.

[ZombieVito]

Watching the preview again it's probably too early to say too much.

It looks like regular Base Gohan not Ultimate Gohan, fights against Piccolo with weights on. I'm guessing that Piccolo will use some form of strategy going by what I see that will force Gohan to turn Super Saiyan.

Then Piccolo removes his weights and they continue fighting. After that who knows.

If they can portray it as

Piccolo > Gohan > Piccolo with weights

It would keep some consistency with the Resurrection F saga and Gohan being stronger with Piccolo with weights there.

The NEP proved Gohan wasn't stronger than Piccolo in base in the RoF arc. If he was then Piccolo already surpassed Boo and that hasn't been stated.

There is a shot of SSJ Gohan having trouble breathing in the NEP. That's even before Piccolo removes his weighted clothes. Everything indicates as of now that weighted Piccolo > SSJ Gohan.

[Bullza]

They could portray it that way too I suppose.

Ultimate Gohan > Piccolo >>> Piccolo with weights > Super Saiyan Gohan?

You do see Gohan both with and without a bang attacking Piccolo so it looks like it.

Would that also mean he was stronger than Super Saiyan Goku? It wouldn't be too surprising I suppose, they made Android 17 to appear stronger but Super Saiyan Goku was made to look even stronger than Buu and he's supposed to be stronger than Piccolo.

Is Base Goku stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan? He should be and could be possibly.

[ZombieVito]

They could portray it that way too I suppose.

Ultimate Gohan > Piccolo >>> Piccolo with weights > Super Saiyan Gohan?

You do see Gohan both with and without a bang attacking Piccolo so it looks like it.

Would that also mean he was stronger than Super Saiyan Goku? It wouldn't be too surprising I suppose, they made Android 17 to appear stronger but Super Saiyan Goku was made to look even stronger than Buu and he's supposed to be stronger than Piccolo.

Is Base Goku stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan? He should be and could be possibly.

Why? I don't see that being the case without SbG.

[Bullza]

Well Super Saiyan Gohan had a tough time with Lavender, I know he was poisoned but still they did fight evenly. Meanwhile Base Goku had the advantage over Bergamo who should be the strongest of the three.

Base Future Trunks was implied to be stronger than Super Saiyan Kid Trunks so it wouldn't be unbelievable to think Base Goku would be above a Buu saga level Super Saiyan Gohan who supposedly shouldn't be that much more powerful than the kids.

He kept up with the Slim Buu who he said was faster than Fat Buu.

Obviously it was originally portrayed that Base Goku was far stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan and it's not like a retcon or two bases is a fact or anything. So it could still be the same.

If Gohan was at Buu saga levels then it wouldn't make sense for Goku to be even with him anyway when he was significantly stronger already back then. He got many times stronger in the Future Trunks too so again shouldn't be at Buu levels anyway unless you were to say all those gains were just to his God power only which would bring me back to what I was saying about how it's not really a multiplier.

[ZombieVito]

Well Super Saiyan Gohan had a tough time with Lavender, I know he was poisoned but still they did fight evenly. Meanwhile Base Goku had the advantage over Bergamo who should be the strongest of the three.

Base Future Trunks was implied to be stronger than Super Saiyan Kid Trunks so it wouldn't be unbelievable to think Base Goku would be above a Buu saga level Super Saiyan Gohan who supposedly shouldn't be that much more powerful than the kids.

He kept up with the Slim Buu who he said was faster than Fat Buu.

Obviously it was originally portrayed that Base Goku was far stronger than Super Saiyan Gohan and it's not like a retcon or two bases is a fact or anything. So it could still be the same.

If Gohan was at Buu saga levels then it wouldn't make sense for Goku to be even with him anyway when he was significantly stronger already back then. He got many times stronger in the Future Trunks too so again shouldn't be at Buu levels anyway unless you were to say all those gains were just to his God power only which would bring me back to what I was saying about how it's not really a multiplier.

Lavender and Gohan fought evenly first meaning that the poison really affected SSJ by a lot. It could also be Toei just making the fight more fun to watch.

We never saw the fight though. For all we know Future Trunks depowered and that's the reason Kid Trunks says to him "Hey, what's the matter", ending the fight.

Maybe Goku used SbG there, we would have to wait and see how Slim Boo fares against other fighters for this one. He could also be playing around with Goku.

I still don't buy that Goku got that many times stronger in the FT arc, besides Gohan got stronger too by training with Piccolo. Nothing really contradicts base Gohan being way stronger than base Goku in the U6 arc and Goku just catch up to him by episode 75.