So yeah, adding things in blank parts of the story without affecting the story isn't the definition of retcon, at least from what I know.Wikipedia wrote:Retroactive continuity, or retcon for short, is the alteration of previously established facts in the continuity of a fictional work.
Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Nothing happened during that time, Salagir added shit in it, thus altering established facts. Also, Coola, Broli, Bojack, etc do not appear in the manga, are not part of the manga, they do not exist in that timeline, but Salagir adds them in, thus altering established facts.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:So yeah, adding things in blank parts of the story without affecting the story isn't the definition of retcon, at least from what I know.Wikipedia wrote:Retroactive continuity, or retcon for short, is the alteration of previously established facts in the continuity of a fictional work.
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DBZGTKOSDH
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
No, he didn't alter established facts, because nothing contradicts Coola's, Broli's, etc existence in the manga. He didn't alter anything, he added. And there is nothing wrong with that, because it's his fan-manga.
James Teal (Animerica 1996) wrote:When you think about it, there are a number of similarities between the Chinese-inspired Son Goku and that most American of superhero icons, Superman. Both are aliens sent to Earth shortly after birth to escape the destruction of their homeworlds; both possess super-strength, flight, super-speed, heightened senses and the ability to cast energy blasts. But the crucial difference between them lies not only in how they view the world, but in how the world views them.
Superman is, and always has been, a symbol for truth, justice, and upstanding moral fortitude–a role model and leader as much as a fighter. The more down-to-earth Goku has no illusions about being responsible for maintaining social order, or for setting some kind of moral example for the entire world. Goku is simply a martial artist who’s devoted his life toward perfecting his fighting skills and other abilities. Though never shy about risking his life to save either one person or the entire world, he just doesn’t believe that the balance of the world rests in any way on his shoulders, and he has no need to shape any part of it in his image. Goku is an idealist, and believes that there is some good in everyone, but he is unconcerned with the big picture of the world…unless it has to do with some kind of fight. Politics, society, law and order don’t have much bearing on his life, but he’s a man who knows right from wrong.
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Again, there wouldn't be if he didn't make the claims he makes, implying his doujinshi is superior to GT. By adding stuff that does not fit in the original manga, he is ret-coning it. Also you can't say that it doesn't contradict, the only story we know about Coola and Broli are the ones in the movies, which contradict with the normal continuity of either the manga or anime, by adding them, Salagir is contradicting with the manga.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:No, he didn't alter established facts, because nothing contradicts Coola's, Broli's, etc existence in the manga. He didn't alter anything, he added. And there is nothing wrong with that, because it's his fan-manga.
Lets recap;
The movies featuring Broli and Coola contradict with the manga, by adding them you have to force the contradictions, thus opening plot-holes.
The natural course of the timeline, as done by the original author, does not feature Coola or Broli, they do not exist in the manga.
By adding them you are ret-conning the manga. That's what ret-con means. You are altering the established events.
Salagir seems to imply his doujinshi is purer than GT, yet he does things like this, he contradicts not only the original manga but he goes against pre-established facts about the characters, like the overpowering of Broli and Cold.
And that's the way the cookie crumbles, whether you like it or not!
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Which is why he's saying that different versions of those movies took place. Hell, in Broli's case, he even showed that 'different version' in one of the specials.DNA wrote:Again, there wouldn't be if he didn't make the claims he makes, implying his doujinshi is superior to GT. By adding stuff that does not fit in the original manga, he is ret-coning it. Also you can't say that it doesn't contradict, the only story we know about Coola and Broli are the ones in the movies, which contradict with the normal continuity of either the manga or anime, by adding them, Salagir is contradicting with the manga.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:No, he didn't alter established facts, because nothing contradicts Coola's, Broli's, etc existence in the manga. He didn't alter anything, he added. And there is nothing wrong with that, because it's his fan-manga.
Blue wrote:I love how Season 2 is so off color even the box managed to be so.
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RandomGuy96
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Also, Cooler's movie contradicts nothing and is actually listed as part of the timeline in the Daizenshuu. Broly's does, but Salagir just loves Broly.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
But Goku can't control Super Saiyan at will and didn't learn Shunkan Ido. Also I think it's part of the anime timeline (which i think includes movie 1 which definitely can't fit).RandomGuy96 wrote:Also, Cooler's movie contradicts nothing and is actually listed as part of the timeline in the Daizenshuu. Broly's does, but Salagir just loves Broly.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
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RandomGuy96
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Nothing says Goku can't control Super Saiyan except a subjective interpretation. It was probably just PIS like in every movie and Toei base fight. So, no contradiction.dbzfan7 wrote:But Goku can't control Super Saiyan at will and didn't learn Shunkan Ido. Also I think it's part of the anime timeline (which i think includes movie 1 which definitely can't fit).RandomGuy96 wrote:Also, Cooler's movie contradicts nothing and is actually listed as part of the timeline in the Daizenshuu. Broly's does, but Salagir just loves Broly.
And no, "but it looked like his transformation against Freeza!" isn't evidence, just an interpretation.
Also, Goku references having been to Yardrat in Movie 6, so there's no reason to think that he didn't do it before Movie 5. This would further support it being PIS.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Doesn't seem like he can control it. But It's my interpretation. Goku doesn't seem to know Shunkan Ido as well. He brings it up only in movie 6 as if it was new technique he didn't have before.RandomGuy96 wrote:Nothing says Goku can't control Super Saiyan except a subjective interpretation. It was probably just PIS like in every movie and Toei base fight. So, no contradiction.dbzfan7 wrote:But Goku can't control Super Saiyan at will and didn't learn Shunkan Ido. Also I think it's part of the anime timeline (which i think includes movie 1 which definitely can't fit).RandomGuy96 wrote:Also, Cooler's movie contradicts nothing and is actually listed as part of the timeline in the Daizenshuu. Broly's does, but Salagir just loves Broly.
And no, "but it looked like his transformation against Freeza!" isn't evidence, just an interpretation.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
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RandomGuy96
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Exactly. It being in the timeline contradicts your interpretation, but nothing in the series itself.Doesn't seem like he can control it. But It's my interpretation. Goku doesn't seem to know Shunkan Ido as well. He brings it up only in movie 6 as if he just learned it.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
http://web.archive.org/web/201111040337 ... dbz05#linkRandomGuy96 wrote:Exactly. It being in the timeline contradicts your interpretation, but nothing in the series itself.Doesn't seem like he can control it. But It's my interpretation. Goku doesn't seem to know Shunkan Ido as well. He brings it up only in movie 6 as if he just learned it.
The Daiz also makes it seem like he couldn't go Super Saiyan by himself. And Goku brings up Shunkan Ido as if he never had it last time. If this fit perfectly then he shouldn't have to mention Shunkan Ido.
The Cooler movie also comes out before Shunkan Ido even existed or it was known Goku could control SSJ. Unless there was a behind the scenes tip or something.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
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RandomGuy96
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Again, just your intrepretation. Also, the Daiz isn't the movie... and if you're using that, you'd also have to go with the much more blunt thing it says about Movie 5: that it took place during the android arc training.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
The Daiz places most of the movies in places where they can't work. I treat movie 5 as an alternate timeline kinda like how the anime included Garlic jr even though he can't fit.RandomGuy96 wrote:Again, just your intrepretation. Also, the Daiz isn't the movie... and if you're using that, you'd also have to go with the much more blunt thing it says about Movie 5: that it took place during the android arc training.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
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omegalucas
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Shit just got serious!
DragonBoxZTheMovies wrote:Kanzenshuu! We annoy voice actors, get composers fired....and occasionally talk about Dragon Ball
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Well that's disappointing. I was hoping to see him at least pretend to be a cool guy for a while longer
Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
Well, Buu was always angry, when something didn`t go according to his plan, at least it never clouded his mind. so I'm sure he really have everything planned.
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Hellspawn28
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
I find it odd that he used the world "Trolled". I never thought to see a Internet term used something DB related.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
He says "controlled". Look again.Hellspawn28 wrote:I find it odd that he used the world "Trolled". I never thought to see a Internet term used something DB related.
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RandomGuy96
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
ditto. i liked what he had going, and would have thought that absorbing a huge part of his universe would at least make him more composed, but nope, standard angry villain rant.Zephyr wrote:Well that's disappointing. I was hoping to see him at least pretend to be a cool guy for a while longer
well he'll get disqualified for smacking west kaioshin, so if he's going to pull something, it's going to be right now. incredibly dissapointing, as i wanted to see him advance further.
edit: oh shit, he didn't just smack her, he punched her full force, and she's bleeding in the last panel. no way she survived that.
The Monkey King wrote:It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWokeRandomGuy96 wrote:He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.dbgtFO wrote: Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
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TheGmGoken
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse
I read that in Justin Cooks's Super Boo Voice.