Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[Sandubadear]

In a way these movies are misnamed; they're called "DBZ: BoG" and "DBZ: FnF" even though they really should be considered DB movies, not DBZ. "Yo! Son Goku and His Friends Return!!" was actually titled DB and not DBZ.

Garlic Jr. movie is now canon because BoG continues DBZ, which includes the Garlic Jr. saga.

[KaiserNeko]

Just about everything created without his involvement has been mediocre to bad. That includes Episode of Bardock. Toriyama is the heart of DB. He's the one who understands the characters better then anyone else.

I think you forgot Dragon Ball Minus, which had his involvement and it has been really mediocre to bad.

And? Jaco was fantastic and Battle of Gods isn't just one of my favorite movies, it has two of my favorite antagonists in the series, by far. Minus is meh, but it's largely negligible.

[Captain Space]

In a way these movies are misnamed; they're called "DBZ: BoG" and "DBZ: FnF" even though they really should be considered DB movies, not DBZ. "Yo! Son Goku and His Friends Return!!" was actually titled DB and not DBZ.

Garlic Jr. movie is now canon because BoG continues DBZ, which includes the Garlic Jr. saga.

BoG continues the manga. It doesn't take filler into account.

[Captain Space]

Just about everything created without his involvement has been mediocre to bad. That includes Episode of Bardock. Toriyama is the heart of DB. He's the one who understands the characters better then anyone else.

I think you forgot Dragon Ball Minus, which had his involvement and it has been really mediocre to bad.

And? Jaco was fantastic and Battle of Gods isn't just one of my favorite movies, it has two of my favorite antagonists in the series, by far. Minus is meh, but it's largely negligible.

Haven't read Jaco myself. I take it you'd recommend it?

[bleed0range]

KaiserNeko knows what he be talkin about. GT can be ignored if Toriyama wants it to be. It's the equivalent of fan fiction. Like all those Star Wars novels that were written. Lucas always said he would ignore them if he continued the series. The major difference is at one point they were officially considered canon but then retracted. Dragon Ball had no official canon but the author who created reserves the right to cancel out anything else others did and his vision would replace them.

[Hellspawn28]

Anyway, regardless of what anyone thinks of the quality of GT, and whether you think it had more or less inconsistencies, yeah, the fact is it's a different continuity. It's Toei's take on continuing DBZ. This is Toriyama's. They are two separate stories.

Agree. It won't surprise me if Toriyama said that GT is a AU series that takes place in it's own universe. I mean why is it a bad thing if GT is ignore in the recent movies? I mean GT will still exist on DVD & Blu-Ray. The characters will still appear in video games. GT will be view as a AU series similar how DB Movie 1-3 and DBZ Movie 1-13 are view as a AU films.

You know, GT has less inconsistencies than the manga, BoG, and Minus

You got that from the DB wiki right? The DB wiki loves to fan wank on the DBZ anime and GT which is why that wiki is total bullshit.

[Captain Space]

(And here I thought the Saint Seiya fandom was divided about new material...want to start an argument? Go onto any forum related to the series and give literally any opinion on Next Dimension.)

(For the record, I think it's fantastic.)

[bleed0range]

In a way these movies are misnamed; they're called "DBZ: BoG" and "DBZ: FnF" even though they really should be considered DB movies, not DBZ. "Yo! Son Goku and His Friends Return!!" was actually titled DB and not DBZ.

Garlic Jr. movie is now canon because BoG continues DBZ, which includes the Garlic Jr. saga.

Garlic Jr. was never part of the original manga and DBZ is just the anime version of that.

[Dyno]

And? Jaco was fantastic and Battle of Gods isn't just one of my favorite movies, it has two of my favorite antagonists in the series, by far. Minus is meh, but it's largely negligible.

And what? He said Episode of Bardock is bad because it didn't have Toriyama in it... Well, Bardock is the main protagonist of Minus and it is horrible as well.

My statement does not have influence on Battle of Gods and Jaco. I am talking about specifically Dragon Ball Minus.

[Gianchio]

I love how anti-ROF and anti-Toriyama so many are being despite the fact that they don't really know anything about this movie. A lot of opinions about the film are being touted as fact and major assumptions are being made. I am trying to think what exactly the retcons are again that were such a big deal. I honestly am having trouble remembering them.

I've never been clear on how many wishes the dragon gives and it changes all the time so only getting one wish is not really an issue. Freeza being revived in pieces is not really an issue since we don't really fully understand the limitations of Shenrons power. Gohan going super saiyan could just be that he CAN turn SSJ if he wishes. He went mystic in the last film and SSJ only for the ritual. So it appears whether or not it makes a difference he can still turn his hair gold. Maybe he thinks it looks cooler... I mean... saiyaman.

Freeza himself does not appear to be making any jokes or being silly like Beerus. He looks dead serious to get his revenge. There will be an air of seriousness that's been missing this time around I think. The trailers suggest as much. So for those who like the serious tone It will return in some capacity likely.

Freeza being able to catch up to Goku is not really a big stretch as I have pointed out recently... Goku closed in on over a million power level in about a month. The SSJ power up was a huge power up that came out of nowhere and gave him a huge gain. You can say he "trained" to get it but he didn't even know how to get it. He just... Snapped. Freeza didn't known he could transform into a golden form but he did. I get that its a huge power up but if you think how much more ridiculously stronger Freeza was then everyone else... On average a million times stronger... Then it's not that hard to believe. Fans seem to be ready to accept Broly being able to catch up through ssj3 and this fan created "SSJ devil." Despite the fact that Broly's power level was only impressive during the Cell arc. It actually makes little sense if you think about it that Gohan as an adult would have had so much trouble with him.

Is it Hell? We've never seen Toriyamas hell. So what's the big deal? Besides maybe not every part of Hell is the same? It makes perfect sense that it wouldn't be. Maybe Freeza is given special treatment?

Is it that Freeza is being brought back? All the other times were just jokes and GT and movies never really counted anyway. Toriyama revisited the past with the red ribbon army and the cyborgs. Cell is kind of a rehash too in that he is a combination of prior characters and enemies in a new design.

I just don't see the big deal anymore. It's not thingd that warrant the cry that Toriyama shouldn't do DB stuff anymore. I also think that there's likely lots IN the movie that will make this stuff better or the movie itself will just be really good. I feel like they're keeping things from us for a reason. I'm just in shock by how much negativity there is.

Despite what everyone says, I think it's this.
And I really don't understand it. Freeza coming back is totally unexpected and new in the series (I don't count fillers and movies).
And...I mean, when I read some posts it seems like we are talking about the worst villain ever...Guys, we are not talking about some useless villain, this is Freeza! FREEZA! Man, this guy made the series! We should be happy that he is coming back.
But I guess, it's only my opinion...

[Big Momma]

He doesn't/shouldn't have to do shit in regards to GT. I hope he does all he can to retcon that story out of existence. Forget all about it, disregard it. It's not his story. I understand the problem you guys have with Toriyama creating inconsistencies with the new movies...but how on Kami's green earth can you have that mindset, yet still want GT to be recognized? GT is full of inconsistencies and plotholes.

As far as we know, GT doesn't exist in the BoG/FnF timeline. And honestly I pray that it never exists in the timeline. It doesn't belong there.

Whatever man, you you can complain all you want, but you can't change the fact that GT is indeed official if Toriyama wants to begin a new DB manga story he have all the rights to ignore GT, but when he do as animated series he must take GT into account.

It's an official property, that doesn't mean it has to/should be part of the official timeline. I'm not complaining about anything. Personally, I actually like a lot of GT. But Toriyama is in no way obligated to take it into account when making these movies. You may as well say he has to take into account Broly, Janemba, and Hildegarn.

I disagree with Vegeta's dance being a flaw. I loved it. I thought it was great that Vegeta was able to toss out his pride like that for the greater good.

"Everybody givng Goku energy to win" isn't a concept just from the movies. That happens in the series itself. And it wasn't even "everybody". It was just a handful of other people. On top of that, Goku even addresses this. He speaks about him regretting that he needed the others for his transformation. It's not like it was just "Everyone give Goku your ki so he can spirit fist the enemy for the win!"

And there's no rule saying people can't come out who are stronger than Vegetto. Hell, even if the villain wasn't stronger, you guys would just be saying "Well, why didn't they just bring out Vegetto?!" or some shit like that.

It's a flaw because it is a total mischaracterization of character, Vegeta was always depicted as a arrogant, proud and serious person, the way he fear Beerus at the point of being ridiculous without even knowing his powers (he says that in the movie) it's a plot hole.

Well, If you noticed I'm not taking Genkidama into account, just the way Goku defeated some villains in Movies and GT... He took the energy of his friends just like he did in BoG with the only difference that he didn't defeat Beerus.

It's not a plot hole. He knows that Beerus is the God of Destruction. One who is capable of destroying Earth on a whim. That's why he's worried. He doesn't want that to happen. The whole point of that dance is that he is typically a very proud and serious person. That's what makes it so funny. If it were someone like Krillin it wouldn't be as effective or funny. He's up there, doing this dance, sweating and hating himself the entire time. But he threw away his pride to keep everyone safe.

Well, If you noticed I'm not taking Genkidama into account, just the way Goku defeated some villains in Movies and GT... He took the energy of his friends just like he did in BoG with the only difference that he didn't defeat Beerus.

Genki Dama is like the only time he's done that in the main series (Again, I'm not taking into account GT and Anime-Only stuff).

[TheGmGoken]

Just about everything created without his involvement has been mediocre to bad. That includes Episode of Bardock. Toriyama is the heart of DB. He's the one who understands the characters better then anyone e

Have to disagree here. I loved EoB and 2008 OVA Pretty good stuff to me. Even Db Heroes manga is awesome! However BoG was trash. Utter shit. 3/10. But I remain faithful that RoF will be MUCH better. As BoG tried to hard but failed miserably. Jaco was average but wasn't bad. Solid 6.6/10.

[KaiserNeko]

Just about everything created without his involvement has been mediocre to bad. That includes Episode of Bardock. Toriyama is the heart of DB. He's the one who understands the characters better then anyone e

Have to disagree here. I loved EoB and 2008 OVA Pretty good stuff to me. Even Db Heroes manga is awesome! However BoG was trash. Utter shit. 3/10. But I remain faithful that RoF will be MUCH better. As BoG tried to hard but failed miserably. Jaco was average but wasn't bad. Solid 6.6/10.

You prefer Episode of Bardock and the DB Heroes manga over Battle of Gods? I'm legitimately dumbfounded to your reasoning, but eh.

[ArchedThunder]

Whatever man, you you can complain all you want, but you can't change the fact that GT is indeed official if Toriyama wants to begin a new DB manga story he have all the rights to ignore GT, but when he do as animated series he must take GT into account.

GT is an official continuation of Toei's DBZ anime with only light input from the creator of the series. These movies are the official continuation of the original manga, written by the original author. It's super simple to understand why GT is completely irrelevant to these movies.

It's a flaw because it is a total mischaracterization of character, Vegeta was always depicted as a arrogant, proud and serious person, the way he fear Beerus at the point of being ridiculous without even knowing his powers (he says that in the movie) it's a plot hole.

Except it isn't, it is a perfect extention to his character development through Z, it shows how much he's grown and how he has truly come to love Earth and his family.

[Suupaa Gohan 2]

Marked for deletion.

[Gianchio]

Whatever man, you can complain all you want, but you can't change the fact that GT is indeed official if Toriyama wants to begin a new DB manga story he have all the rights to ignore GT, but when he do as animated series he must take GT into account.

NO! He doesn't! Because Dragonball is HIS. HE CAN MAKE A NEW ANIME THAT IGNORES GT IF HE WANTS!

The idea that Dragonball "belongs" to Toriyama and that he can just flat-out abuse it any way he wants in perpetuity is an exceedingly dangerous notion. Let's not go to such a dangerous place.

Ok so we have arrived to the point that the creator of the series can't do what he wants with it...seems legit

[Captain Space]

Whatever man, you can complain all you want, but you can't change the fact that GT is indeed official if Toriyama wants to begin a new DB manga story he have all the rights to ignore GT, but when he do as animated series he must take GT into account.

NO! He doesn't! Because Dragonball is HIS. HE CAN MAKE A NEW ANIME THAT IGNORES GT IF HE WANTS!

The idea that Dragonball "belongs" to Toriyama and that he can just flat-out abuse it any way he wants in perpetuity is an exceedingly dangerous notion. Let's not go to such a dangerous place.

And the idea that it belongs to Toei and that everything new has to follow their sequel, that had exactly as much canonicity as their movies in the first place, is somehow less dangerous?

Also, your whole point just baffles me. I mean, Kami forbid we let the creator of a story continue to create that story. (I mean, I suppose it's because you think he's doing it badly, and there we just come to an impasse because I don't.)

[TheGmGoken]

Just about everything created without his involvement has been mediocre to bad. That includes Episode of Bardock. Toriyama is the heart of DB. He's the one who understands the characters better then anyone e

Have to disagree here. I loved EoB and 2008 OVA Pretty good stuff to me. Even Db Heroes manga is awesome! However BoG was trash. Utter shit. 3/10. But I remain faithful that RoF will be MUCH better. As BoG tried to hard but failed miserably. Jaco was average but wasn't bad. Solid 6.6/10.

You prefer Episode of Bardock and the DB Heroes manga over Battle of Gods? I'm legitimately dumbfounded to your reasoning, but eh.

Yup. I didn't give a reason did I? I believe I didn't... But yes it's a no contest when it comes to EoB, OVA, The Path to Power Movie, MOST of the DBz movie, and the Heroes manga vs BoG. BoG wasn't a fun experience for me honestly.

[Captain Space]

Funny, BoG to me at least was like the embodiment of fun.

[KaiserNeko]

Whatever man, you can complain all you want, but you can't change the fact that GT is indeed official if Toriyama wants to begin a new DB manga story he have all the rights to ignore GT, but when he do as animated series he must take GT into account.

NO! He doesn't! Because Dragonball is HIS. HE CAN MAKE A NEW ANIME THAT IGNORES GT IF HE WANTS!

The idea that Dragonball "belongs" to Toriyama and that he can just flat-out abuse it any way he wants in perpetuity is an exceedingly dangerous notion. Let's not go to such a dangerous place.

Oh, it's so dangerous how he continues to abuse the series! All this harm he's done! Someone call Series Protective Services!

Sorry, but this language you're using is obnoxiously overkill to me, and you come off as both entitled and pretentious. He is allowed to ignore any material he himself did not write. That includes all of GT, a series that isn't even a proper continuation of his manga, but a money-focused, poorly written, fustercluck of an anime that is popularly regarded as the worst of the three series.

Dragonball is his story. Not Toei Animation's, not yours, his.