Death Battle! Goku VS Superman Disscussion Thread

[TheMightyOzaru]

Ki is force. Characters like Cell and Vegeta have taken planet to multi planet busting punishment head on to there bodies. Then there is the whole deal with Cell being a possible solar system buster so he can supposedly take star busting punishment. While Z-fighers may not be able to lift skyscrapers they do have some very impressive endurance. I dont think Superman can simply rip Goku in half.

[TheMightyOzaru]

I would assume that folks are referring to physical attacks being these "busting" (ugh, that phrase is driving me nuts...!) attacks, rather than ki-based attacks, and specifically projectiles.

That being said, we've seen Goku infuse his finger with ki when he was blocking Trunks' sword swings right after their mutual arrivals, so there's absolutely nothing out of the question in terms of Goku infusing his fist with some amount of ki to enhance that type of attack.

I think a lot of comes down to durability. How well could Goku handle a physical hit from a guy like Superman especially the stronger versions? Perhaps Goku does enhance his physical attacks with ki and maybe even his defense with ki and so do his opponents. But Goku is hurt by those attacks and those physical attacks aren't usually breaking up planets (I recall the kai planet getting wrecked but wasn't that more from the ki and only shown as local damage?) and no one in Dragonball has ever shown physical strength thats even close to some of the stuff Superman has done. Best show of physical strength I can remember from DB was Goku and Vegeta holding up a skyscraper but that was end of GT with them being SS4 and they struggled to do it. And I would imagine a guy that can travel so fast that he flys through whole universes and has to be told to stop by God (basically) and can move multiple planets across the universe is probably capable of hitting pretty hard. I don't know how big those mulitple planets were or how big that building was but the Earth is something like 20,000,000,000,000,000x the weight of a large skyscraper like the empire state building so unless there is a better show of physical strength Goku is way out classed there.

Superman has been shown to live through huge explosions and powerful energy attacks and stuff that could compare to the ki attacks of DB(Z/GT) but has Goku shown he can handle the physical power of Superman? Even if Superman for some reason can't hit as powerful as he can lift theres still the option of crushing or ripping Goku apart if he gets a hold of him (which I think he could).

Death Battle is using current Superman not these overpowered varients like Pre Crisis. You also have to remember that GT has inconsitencies. From what I can gather they are simply using SSJ4 not GT logic.

[dario03]

I would assume that folks are referring to physical attacks being these "busting" (ugh, that phrase is driving me nuts...!) attacks, rather than ki-based attacks, and specifically projectiles.

That being said, we've seen Goku infuse his finger with ki when he was blocking Trunks' sword swings right after their mutual arrivals, so there's absolutely nothing out of the question in terms of Goku infusing his fist with some amount of ki to enhance that type of attack.

I think a lot of comes down to durability. How well could Goku handle a physical hit from a guy like Superman especially the stronger versions? Perhaps Goku does enhance his physical attacks with ki and maybe even his defense with ki and so do his opponents. But Goku is hurt by those attacks and those physical attacks aren't usually breaking up planets (I recall the kai planet getting wrecked but wasn't that more from the ki and only shown as local damage?) and no one in Dragonball has ever shown physical strength thats even close to some of the stuff Superman has done. Best show of physical strength I can remember from DB was Goku and Vegeta holding up a skyscraper but that was end of GT with them being SS4 and they struggled to do it. And I would imagine a guy that can travel so fast that he flys through whole universes and has to be told to stop by God (basically) and can move multiple planets across the universe is probably capable of hitting pretty hard. I don't know how big those mulitple planets were or how big that building was but the Earth is something like 20,000,000,000,000,000x the weight of a large skyscraper like the empire state building so unless there is a better show of physical strength Goku is way out classed there.

Superman has been shown to live through huge explosions and powerful energy attacks and stuff that could compare to the ki attacks of DB(Z/GT) but has Goku shown he can handle the physical power of Superman? Even if Superman for some reason can't hit as powerful as he can lift theres still the option of crushing or ripping Goku apart if he gets a hold of him (which I think he could).

Death Battle is using current Superman not these overpowered varients like Pre Crisis. You also have to remember that GT has inconsitencies. From what I can gather they are simply using SSJ4 not GT logic.

When did they state that? And post Crisis has shown planet moving strength anyways. Plus the GT inconsistencies don't matter to much for my point since I was just talking about the best show of physical strength that I could recall.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Moving planets isnt really impressive in this case. Like I stated its been shown that Scouter Vegeta can take planet busting punishment head on to his body. If Modern Superman can punch a planet apart then Vegeta can still take it since he took a force strong enough to destroy a planet head on. This is just Scouter Vegeta with a power level of 18,000 . SSJ Goku(Frieza Saga) can take punishment literally over 8,000x greater than that. They dont really have to state which varient they're using since everything other than Modern has been pretty much retconned from the current continuity.

[dbzfan7]

Does it matter what the real multiplier is? This is death battle they think SSJ forms are just a 500% increase on top of each other because they are very uninformed. BTW thats a 625x multiplier for SSJ4 >_>. Seriously go through the death battles and look up some legitimate info on the character they pit against each other, they get a lot of stuff wrong. I'm actually a little baffled they choose to make up there own shit for the sake of having info for the fights =/. I wont be surprised if they get a lot of stuff on this one wrong too.

They fixed SSJ back to 50x. Kanzenshuu gave the death battle crew loads of info. The whole fight really depends on what Superman facts they go with. Pre Crisis, Cosmic Armor, Prime, 1,000,000, and sword of Superman are way out of Goku's league. Post-Crisis is the most popular Superman and most mainstream. He is right around Goku. I say with a fight Goku could take it. Though Post-Crisis also has some inconsistency problems. That's why this death battle isn't exactly easy since Superman isn't straight forwardly written like Goku.

Superman is the definition of inconsistent sadly. When did they fix the multiplier? Also do they still think its a 5,000% increase on top of each transformtion incorporating this fix? Multiplier mistake aside they still think Vegeta can punch the moon out of orbit =/. They also think Super forms in Sonic the Hedgehog are a 1,000%, thats a 10x boost, increase even though this is stated nowhere and they probably got this idea when Hyper Knuckles and Super Sonic said they had recieved a 1,000x increase in everything, which most likely is just insinuating a massive power increase not meant to be taken literally. This is character dialogue that is negated by Ian Flynn straight up stating that the chaos force is a pool of limitless power. Super Sonic is invulnerable for reason, he has unlimited chaos energy around his body. They also think that Super forms are under a time limit via rings even though that is entirely untrue based on evidence from Sonic Advanced and the fight with Knuckles Enerjak. Super Sonic lasted for an entire week with no ring collection in Advanced and in the fight with Enerjak he lasted for hours. Shadow should have won that fight and this is coming from a huge Vegeta fan. Seriously the biggest face palm moments in that fight are when Shadow doesnt just chaos control Vegeta into the core of the sun. Then Shadow's chaos blast stops after reverting even though he can still use chaos blast in base and its just as strong as in base as it is his super form. As you can probably imagine I dont take Death Battle seriously.

Moving planets isnt really impressive in this case. Like I stated its been shown that Scouter Vegeta can take planet busting punishment head on to his body. If Modern Superman can punch a planet apart then Vegeta can still take it since he took a force strong enough to destroy a planet head on. This is just Scouter Vegeta with a power level of 18,000 . SSJ Goku(Freeza Saga) can take punishment literally over 8,000x greater than that. They dont really have to state which varient they're using since everything other than Modern has been pretty much retconned from the current continuity

They stuck to game shadow mostly since he is the mainstream version. Game Shadow is different then the one from archie comics who is much more powerful.

Post Crisis has a hard time moving Warworld which is the size of Pluto while sun dipped, He also couldn't move earth with Wonder Woman and green lantern helping.

[dbzfan7]

When did they state that? And post Crisis has shown planet moving strength anyways. Plus the GT inconsistencies don't matter to much for my point since I was just talking about the best show of physical strength that I could recall.

Because they don't use god wave Wonderwoman, Cosmic Spiderman, God Spawn, End game Cloud, King Thor, etc. They only stuck with the mainstream versions.

[dario03]

Pre crisis was mainstream Superman its just from years ago.

Moving planets isnt really impressive in this case. Like I stated its been shown that Scouter Vegeta can take planet busting punishment head on to his body. If Modern Superman can punch a planet apart then Vegeta can still take it since he took a force strong enough to destroy a planet head on. This is just Scouter Vegeta with a power level of 18,000 . SSJ Goku(Freeza Saga) can take punishment literally over 8,000x greater than that.

We are talking about physical attacks not ki attacks. DB ki attacks are impressive however their physical attacks are not.

[TheMightyOzaru]

They stuck to game shadow mostly. Game Shadow is different then the one from archie comics.

Even in the games he has still taken down a Super Dimensional God who has wiped out every universe across every time line =/. Sonic Advanced is also game proof he doesnt require rings. Shadow without his inhibitor rings is still as threatening as his super form. Furthermore even game Shadow can use chaos control to move him to the core of the sun. There is so much wrong with that death battle and they even referenced Archie in the credits.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Pre crisis was mainstream Superman its just from years ago.

Moving planets isnt really impressive in this case. Like I stated its been shown that Scouter Vegeta can take planet busting punishment head on to his body. If Modern Superman can punch a planet apart then Vegeta can still take it since he took a force strong enough to destroy a planet head on. This is just Scouter Vegeta with a power level of 18,000 . SSJ Goku(Freeza Saga) can take punishment literally over 8,000x greater than that.

We are talking about physical attacks not ki attacks. DB ki attacks are impressive however their physical attacks are not.

Ki is force dude. Its just as lethal as a punch.

[dbzfan7]

They stuck to game shadow mostly. Game Shadow is different then the one from archie comics.

Even in the games he has still taken down a Super Dimensional God who has wiped out every universe across every time line =/. Sonic Advanced is also game proof he doesnt require rings. Shadow without his inhibitor rings is still as threatening as his super form. Furthermore even game Shadow can use chaos control to move him to the core of the sun. There is so much wrong with that death battle and they even referenced Archie in the credits.

Well he did beat that being with chaos spears(which seem like ki blasts) and a weak point anyone could exploit. Advance is also one game against many more that do require rings. I don't deny chaos control to the sun, but he never used did that before. They only referenced archie comics for the fall I think. Also the didn't do anything special in the battle besides normal attacks, no reality warping was used as an attack. If he did he probably would have easily killed the hedgehogs.

[TheMightyOzaru]

They stuck to game shadow mostly. Game Shadow is different then the one from archie comics.

Even in the games he has still taken down a Super Dimensional God who has wiped out every universe across every time line =/. Sonic Advanced is also game proof he doesnt require rings. Shadow without his inhibitor rings is still as threatening as his super form. Furthermore even game Shadow can use chaos control to move him to the core of the sun. There is so much wrong with that death battle and they even referenced Archie in the credits.

Well he did beat that being with chaos spears and a weak point anyone could exploit. Advance is also one game against many more that do require rings. I don't deny chaos control to the sun, but he never used did that before. They only referenced archie comics for the fall I think

Rings as well as "weak points" are game mechanics. In Sonic Unleashed he doesnt use rings to maintain his super form either. His chaos blast at the end of the battle should have still gone off effectively killing Vegeta.

[dario03]

Pre crisis was mainstream Superman its just from years ago.

Moving planets isnt really impressive in this case. Like I stated its been shown that Scouter Vegeta can take planet busting punishment head on to his body. If Modern Superman can punch a planet apart then Vegeta can still take it since he took a force strong enough to destroy a planet head on. This is just Scouter Vegeta with a power level of 18,000 . SSJ Goku(Freeza Saga) can take punishment literally over 8,000x greater than that.

We are talking about physical attacks not ki attacks. DB ki attacks are impressive however their physical attacks are not.

Ki is force dude. Its just as lethal as a punch.

If anything, in DB its more lethal, thats the whole point. DBZ has shown impressive destructive force with ki attacks but their physical strength isn't shown to be all that high but yet they hurt each other with it. So if Goku can be hurt by a guy that can barely lift a building what will happen to him when a guy that can move planets hits him with a unrestricted physical punch?

[dbzfan7]

Rings as well as "weak points" are game mechanics. In Sonic Unleashed he doesnt use rings to maintain his super form either. His chaos blast at the end of the battle should have still gone off effectively killing Vegeta.

Sonic is a game series first. It's a game so of course they count. It's even further proven when they couldn't kill Solaris, those weak points are what gave them victory. They clearly reference the weak point all the time as it is canon. Eggman says standard attacks don't work on Solaris. That weak point is what kept Solaris anchored in the dimension. So I don't think they beat Solaris like they beat Chaos as Solaris can't be defeated by standard attacks. They defeated Solaris by attacking his weak point which kept him anchored in their dimension.

In Unleashed the ring mechanic was taken out and switched with a health bar. So now Super Sonic isn't even invincible.

He loses rings in sonic advance, I just saw the final battles. He slowly loses rings like normal.

Game mechanics are stuff like running out of time, several lives, cheat codes. Weaknesses are not game mechanics.

If Super Sonic/Shadow was like how you said in the games then the Final Levels would be entirely pointless with absolutely no risk for anything. The Comics are a different story.

[TonyTheTiger]

The rock gag was anime only.

I personally don't care. I generally just take most everything as a total package provided there isn't any absurd conflict of logic, even things I hate like Cell tanking a Kienzan. As an avid comic book reader I pretty much have to be like this for the sake of sanity. Plus the whole "manga only!" thing just strikes me as too...to ape a Smash Bros. meme..."No items, Fox only, Final Destination." Particularly in the scope of a vs. match like this.

Superman is the definition of inconsistent sadly.

I really think this gets blown out of proportion, mostly because there's a standing justification. Granted, it's a bit of a deus ex machina, and bad writers can take it too far, but Superman's fear of his own power is constantly brought up as a reason why he doesn't just go all out in every situation. So many of those instances where he gets smacked around by things he should, in theory, be able to vaporize is often the result of him worrying about collateral damage as well as the more philosophical concerns about his proper role in the universe*, neither of which is a major issue for Goku.

*As an aside, this is one of the reasons Superman getting accused of being boring is one of my berzerk buttons because, outside of a very superficial glance over, he's one of the most complex and thought provoking characters in comics since his entire schtick is to demonstrate that power isn't everything.

I think a lot of it comes down to durability. How well could Goku handle a physical hit from a guy like Superman especially the stronger versions? Perhaps Goku does enhance his physical attacks with ki and maybe even his defense with ki and so do his opponents.

This is why I wonder how someone's power scales as they move up the Super Saiyan ladder. Is it universal? Like a Super Saiyan can tank 50x more force than at base? Can resist 50x more heat? Can move 50x faster? Or is it mostly about power output in which the kind of power they can put into their attacks increases by that much while their other abilities scale up but do so differently. Kinda like leveling up in an RPG. At level 50 you don't just multiply each of your level 1 attribute values (HP, Magic Defense, Evade, etc.) by 50.

[TheMightyOzaru]

If anything, in DB its more lethal, thats the whole point. DBZ has shown impressive destructive force with ki attacks but their physical strength isn't shown to be all that high but yet they hurt each other with it. So if Goku can be hurt by a guy that can barely lift a building what will happen to him when a guy that can move planets hits him with a unrestricted physical punch?

You do realize they put Ki behind there punches right? Trunks vs Goku comes to mind when demonstrating putting Ki behind physical blows.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Rings as well as "weak points" are game mechanics. In Sonic Unleashed he doesnt use rings to maintain his super form either. His chaos blast at the end of the battle should have still gone off effectively killing Vegeta.

Sonic is a game series first. It's a game so of course they count. It's even further proven when they couldn't kill Solaris, those weak points are what gave them victory. They clearly reference the weak point all the time as it is canon. Eggman says standard attacks don't work on Solaris. That weak point is what kept Solaris anchored in the dimension. So I don't think they beat Solaris like they beat Chaos as Solaris can't be defeated by standard attacks. They defeated Solaris by attacking his weak point which kept him anchored in their dimension.

In Unleashed the ring mechanic was taken out and switched with a health bar. So now Super Sonic isn't even invincible.

He loses rings in sonic advance, I just saw the final battles. He slowly loses rings like normal.

Game mechanics are stuff like running out of time, several lives, cheat codes. Weaknesses are not game mechanics.

If Super Sonic/Shadow was like how you said in the games then the Final Levels would be entirely pointless with absolutely no risk for anything. Comics are a different story.

By the logic you are presenting cities have loopdy loops and weird structure design making it impossible for humans to get around =/. You do realize that rings would fall under the same category as lives right? They are game mechanics designed to make the final bosses a little harder. Character dialogue doesnt help your point in the slightest for example a character that says press x to do this is clearly not part of the canon. The same is applied to weak spots. Furthermore why would a super dimensional God have a glaring weak spot? Even furthermore Shadow isnt even hitting a weak spot =/. Sega Sonic's super form consistency in terms of power and endurance are explained through Tikal's prayer. The chaos emeralds turn thoughts into power. In other words Sega Sonic is as strong as he needs to be to win assuming said character can be beaten via traditional manner. Then we have Darkspine Sonic whom can destroy and reestablish dimensions with the wave of a hand and he doesnt hold a candle to Super Sonic. Shadow again should have won that battle.

[dbzfan7]

Rings as well as "weak points" are game mechanics. In Sonic Unleashed he doesnt use rings to maintain his super form either. His chaos blast at the end of the battle should have still gone off effectively killing Vegeta.

Sonic is a game series first. It's a game so of course they count. It's even further proven when they couldn't kill Solaris, those weak points are what gave them victory. They clearly reference the weak point all the time as it is canon. Eggman says standard attacks don't work on Solaris. That weak point is what kept Solaris anchored in the dimension. So I don't think they beat Solaris like they beat Chaos as Solaris can't be defeated by standard attacks. They defeated Solaris by attacking his weak point which kept him anchored in their dimension.

In Unleashed the ring mechanic was taken out and switched with a health bar. So now Super Sonic isn't even invincible.

He loses rings in sonic advance, I just saw the final battles. He slowly loses rings like normal.

Game mechanics are stuff like running out of time, several lives, cheat codes. Weaknesses are not game mechanics.

If Super Sonic/Shadow was like how you said in the games then the Final Levels would be entirely pointless with absolutely no risk for anything. Comics are a different story.

By the logic you are presenting cities have loopdy loops and weird structure design making it impossible for humans to get around =/. You do realize that rings would fall under the same category as lives right? They are game mechanics designed to make the final bosses a little harder. Character dialogue doesnt help your point in the slightest for example a character that says press x to do this is clearly not part of the canon. The same is applied to weak spots. Furthermore why would a super dimensional God have a glaring weak spot? Even furthermore Shadow isnt even hitting a weak spot =/. Sega Sonic's super form consistency in terms of power and endurance are explained through Tikal's prayer. The chaos emeralds turn thoughts into power. In other words Sega Sonic is as strong as he needs to be to win assuming said character can be beaten via traditional manner. Then we have Darkspine Sonic whom can destroy and reestablish dimensions with the wave of a hand and he doesnt hold a candle to Super Sonic. Shadow again should have won that battle.

It's a game. Solaris was anchored in the dimension by his weak point. By your logic every thing in games such as Mario new rackoon suit that brings forever invincibility must not be a game mechanic, Kratos overpowering big monsters while struggling opening doors is the norm. Game Sonic follows different rules then comics. That God was anchored in the universe by that weakspot. He wasn't harmed in the slightest by the hedgehogs. Weaknesses are weaknesses. There is nothing more to discuss if you can't tell the difference. By your logic Solaris would have wiped them out of existence in 2 seconds, Shadow would have killed anyone with a chaos control, Mario would just have the Super Tanooki suit giving forever invincibility, Bowser would be dead, and the list goes on. Game universe is different from Comics. Janemba must be held back by a plot mechanic since he can warp reality, items, so why not people.

[TheMightyOzaru]

It's a game. Solaris was anchored in the dimension by his weak point. By your logic every thing in games such as Mario new rackoon suit that brings forever invincibility must not be a game mechanic, Kratos overpowering big monsters while struggling opening doors is the norm. Game Sonic follows different rules then comics. That God was anchored in the universe by that weakspot. He wasn't harmed in the slightest by the hedgehogs. Weaknesses are weaknesses. There is nothing more to discuss if you can't tell the difference. By your logic Solaris would have wiped them out of existence in 2 seconds, Shadow would have killed anyone with a chaos control, Mario would just have the Super Tanooki suit giving forever invincibility, Bowser would be dead, and the list goes on. Game universe is different from Comics.

Solaris is Omnipresent with time. He isnt anchored in the dimension by his weak point =/. Mario's white Tanooki suit is a game mechanic because its a life saving last resort. Do you ever see Mario use that suit in the continuity? No. Solaris wiped out existence when he came into existence =/. All that was left was a time space rift with the chaos emeralds keeping a few things in tact. Need I remind you that Shadow wasnt hitting a weak spot =/. He was hitting Solaris' arm.

[dbzfan7]

It's a game. Solaris was anchored in the dimension by his weak point. By your logic every thing in games such as Mario new rackoon suit that brings forever invincibility must not be a game mechanic, Kratos overpowering big monsters while struggling opening doors is the norm. Game Sonic follows different rules then comics. That God was anchored in the universe by that weakspot. He wasn't harmed in the slightest by the hedgehogs. Weaknesses are weaknesses. There is nothing more to discuss if you can't tell the difference. By your logic Solaris would have wiped them out of existence in 2 seconds, Shadow would have killed anyone with a chaos control, Mario would just have the Super Tanooki suit giving forever invincibility, Bowser would be dead, and the list goes on. Game universe is different from Comics.

Solaris is Omnipresent with time. He isnt anchored in the dimension by his weak point =/. Mario's white Tanooki suit is a game mechanic because its a life saving last resort. Do you ever see Mario use that suit in the continuity? No. Solaris wiped out existence when he came into existence =/. All that was left was a time space rift with the chaos emeralds keeping a few things in tact. Need I remind you that Shadow wasnt hitting a weak spot =/. He was hitting Solaris' arm.

He was clearly beaten because he was anchored by the weak spot. That is what is said. The hedgehogs sever his tie to the universe. Until I see the creators or a guidebook come out and say otherwise, that is what happened. Mario white tanooki is still a power up, it's just set as a game mechanic for if you die too much, it's still a power up. Don't pick and choose what works and what doesn't. Also no shadow was hitting the weakpoint. Your talking about the outer shell. By your logic Solaris would have wiped the hedehogs out in 5 seconds, he was clearly more powerful. He would have wiped them out of the universe, he has several ways of doing so since he is in past, present and future. And can wipe them out of existence with his reality warping abilities. By existing as all of time he could kill everyone at any point.

Sonic is in a game world. The rules apply differently, it's like trying to bring logic to cartoons. Logic works differently.

[TheMightyOzaru]

It's a game. Solaris was anchored in the dimension by his weak point. By your logic every thing in games such as Mario new rackoon suit that brings forever invincibility must not be a game mechanic, Kratos overpowering big monsters while struggling opening doors is the norm. Game Sonic follows different rules then comics. That God was anchored in the universe by that weakspot. He wasn't harmed in the slightest by the hedgehogs. Weaknesses are weaknesses. There is nothing more to discuss if you can't tell the difference. By your logic Solaris would have wiped them out of existence in 2 seconds, Shadow would have killed anyone with a chaos control, Mario would just have the Super Tanooki suit giving forever invincibility, Bowser would be dead, and the list goes on. Game universe is different from Comics.

Solaris is Omnipresent with time. He isnt anchored in the dimension by his weak point =/. Mario's white Tanooki suit is a game mechanic because its a life saving last resort. Do you ever see Mario use that suit in the continuity? No. Solaris wiped out existence when he came into existence =/. All that was left was a time space rift with the chaos emeralds keeping a few things in tact. Need I remind you that Shadow wasnt hitting a weak spot =/. He was hitting Solaris' arm.

He was clearly beaten because he was anchored by the weak spot. That is what is said. The hedgehogs sever his tie to the universe. Until I see the creators or a guidebook come out and say otherwise, that is what happened. Mario white tanooki is still a power up, it's just set as a game mechanic for if you die too much, it's still a power up. Don't pick and choose what works and what doesn't. Also no shadow was hitting the weakpoint. Your talking about the outer shell. By your logic Solaris would have wiped the hedehogs out in 5 seconds, he was clearly more powerful. He would have wiped them out of the universe, he has several ways of doing so since he is in past, present and future. And can wipe them out of existence with his reality warping abilities. By existing as all of time he could kill everyone at any point.

Sonic is in a game world. The rules apply differently, it's like trying to bring logic to cartoons. Logic works differently.

Umm dude the Super Hedgehogs were traveling across the past, present, and future making them nigh Omnipresent with time. They did not sever his tie to the Megaverse. Its a non canon power up my point is still stands =/. I dont pick and choose what does and doesnt work I'm just telling you what really is and isnt part of the continuity. Well apparently the Segaverse works in terms of killing one timeline doesnt affect the other like DBZ does. Its stated that Solaris wiped out all existence across time. The Super Hedgehogs are Nigh Omnipotent just like Solaris thats how they weren't defeated by him. As to how all the protagonist and Eggman survived, I have no idea. Clearly Sega had there heads up there ass and decided to let them live for whatever reason. PIS I tell you. Thats why Sonic 06's story sucks.