Will GT Really Become "Lost" This Time?

voltlunok · Post by **voltlunok** » Fri Jul 24, 2015 11:44 am

bubibartra wrote:In my view:
Dragon ball Gt "canon of z movies 1-13" (Cooler,Gojeta,and many inconsistencies ...)
Dragon Ball Super is canon of Dragon ball Kai
Dragon Ball new films.... canon of DBZ anime ?

Which is canon of the manga? Akira Toriyama is the author of the manga, he alone can decide this.

Just wait to clarify in an interview

Except he probably won't. He's made it rather clear he doesn't care about 'canon' he just wants to write good stories and doesn't care if story A contradicts story B. There is no official canon and probably never will be. You can actively make your own head canon and at this point that's what I encourage everyone to do. Going that way actually allows for interesting discussion over differences in peoples head canons.

Hellspawn28 · Post by **Hellspawn28** » Wed Jul 29, 2015 5:29 pm

I don't think Toei, Toriyama and Shueisha really cares if they over write GT. As long if people like the show and it makes money, that all it matters to them. If Toriyama wants Super to overwrite GT then they will let him do it as long if it makes money. I mean things are going to change and cause retcons as long if the series gets new material.

coola · Post by **coola** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 7:34 pm

Sorry for necroposting in almost 6 months old topic, but, i've read not too long ago in one of topics here, that GT was told to be still cannon, by one of Toei producers i think, he said something about connection of SSJ4 and SSJG, i sadly can't remember details, but, does it mean, that GT is sill part of this new Kai-Super canon, and there is no chance for going past Uub training and show Pan and others differently than in GT?

Kendamu · Post by **Kendamu** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:06 pm

It would be awesome if you could link to a source for that.

coola · Post by **coola** » Sat Dec 19, 2015 8:11 pm

Found it

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=32494

Basaku · Post by **Basaku** » Sun Dec 20, 2015 3:50 pm

coola wrote:Found it http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/viewtop ... =7&t=32494

Me thinks they need to decide one way or another finally. No, they can't eat the cake and keep it, producing new material that ends up making GT completly incompatible while reassuring in official statements that "ohh it totally does still matter we swear".

precita · Post by **precita** » Sun Dec 20, 2015 8:57 pm

Eventually Super will contradict GT completely, most likely if there's a time skip after the tournament arc. Its inevitable.

Muffin Man · Post by **Muffin Man** » Sun Dec 20, 2015 11:24 pm

bubibartra wrote:In my view:
Dragon ball Gt "canon of z movies 1-13" (Cooler,Gojeta,and many inconsistencies ...)
Dragon Ball Super is canon of Dragon ball Kai
Dragon Ball new films.... canon of DBZ anime ?

Which is canon of the manga? Akira Toriyama is the author of the manga, he alone can decide this.

Just wait to clarify in an interview

Wouldn't it make more sense for Super to be paired with the original anime while BoG/RoF are paired with Kai, simply in terms of pacing? After all, the movies are a more condensed version of Super while Kai is a more condensed version of the original anime.

As for the manga, I don't think it really needs a version of the modern movies/show as part of its canon...

Hellspawn28 · Post by **Hellspawn28** » Sun Dec 20, 2015 11:46 pm

precita wrote:Eventually Super will contradict GT completely, most likely if there's a time skip after the tournament arc. Its inevitable.

Super and the new movies already do contradict GT. Toriyama said that Goku won't need to go SSj2 and SSj3 while in GT, he does go SSj2, SSj3 and SSj4. Both Goku and Vegeta seem to no longer need to go SSj when they have their new god forms. Not to mention Kibitoshin is not defuse in GT and he has a major role in the Bebi saga. Goku in GT said that he hans't seen Kibitoshin and Elder Kaioshin since they defeated Buu when he sees Kaioshin later on after Buu. There is also Freeza's Golden Form, Ginyu having a different body (In GT, we see him back in his original body) and Pilaf's age too.

Lord Beerus · Post by **Lord Beerus** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 11:24 am

Hellspawn28 wrote:
precita wrote:Eventually Super will contradict GT completely, most likely if there's a time skip after the tournament arc. Its inevitable.
Super and the new movies already do contradict GT. Toriyama said that Goku won't need to go SSj2 and SSj3 while in GT, he does go SSj2, SSj3 and SSj4. Both Goku and Vegeta seem to no longer need to go SSj when they have their new god forms. Not to mention Kibitoshin is not defuse in GT and he has a major role in the Bebi saga. Goku in GT said that he hans't seen Kibitoshin and Elder Kaioshin since they defeated Buu when he sees Kaioshin later on after Buu. There is also Freeza's Golden Form, Ginyu having a different body (In GT, we see him back in his original body) and Pilaf's age too.

Not to mention that Hell is completely different in GT than to what Toriyama designed Hell to be like for Resurrection F.

Basaku · Post by **Basaku** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:14 pm

And yet despite the obvious incompatibility that only gets bigger with each new part of DB, Toei refuses to flat out state "ye not canon!". They're dancing around the subject, sometimes not including GT (official 30th anniversary timeline) sometimes including it or affirming its "still matters!" status.

Maybe if Super eventually gets past EOZ and dives straight into GT timeframe territory they will be happy to 'let it go' if they something new that replaces it directly. But for now this is kind of a worse "Star Wars EU Legends" excuse, that sorta somehow Legends may still be true blah blah.

Noah · Post by **Noah** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 12:19 pm

Becoming lost or not, I doesn't matter. GT is still above Super, IMHO. Let's see if this changes in U6 Arc

Hellspawn28 · Post by **Hellspawn28** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 3:00 pm

I like Super so far better then GT. Sure the retellings of BOG and ROF are not great, but I would rather sit through them over the Super 17 saga and the Black Star Dragon Ball hunt again. Bebi saga is not that great in my opinion. Bebi may have personality unlike Yi Xing Long and Super 17, but his character still feels lackluster. I would take Beerus over any of the main villains in GT.

Basaku · Post by **Basaku** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 3:03 pm

Hellspawn28 wrote:I like Super so far better then GT. Sure the retellings of BOG and ROF are not great, but I would rather sit through them over the Super 17 saga and the Black Star Dragon Ball hunt again. Bebi saga is not that great in my opinion. Bebi may have personality unlike Yi Xing Long and Super 17, but his character still feels lackluster. I would take Beerus over any of the main villains in GT.

In particular when you compare Black Star saga to first 20 episodes of Super, the winner is very clear in every aspect except perhaps animation. Not that Super so far hasn't had its large share of flaws, but the initial arc in GT was just a complete miss, regardless of good intentions

Doctor. · Post by **Doctor.** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 3:16 pm

Yeah, I think Super!F is the worst arc in the entire series, but compared to all of the GT arcs, I still think it comes out on top. That's kinda sad, really.

precita · Post by **precita** » Mon Dec 21, 2015 10:14 pm

The Baby saga was decent, even if it wasn't as good as it could have been.

omaro34 · Post by **omaro34** » Thu Dec 24, 2015 11:26 pm

I hope GT gets lost this time. The Super Saiyan levels got way too high (SSJ4's design was cool though), and this led to crazy fan made stuff like Dragonball AF's design of SSJ5. Goku turning into a kid also annoyed me, piccolo ending up in hell forever was such an injustice it screamed failure, and the amazing ability to initiate creative wonderful story arcs filled with potential such as Baby and the Shadow Dragons and following that up with such poor execution was sad.

I hope Super finishes these re-telling Arcs soon, I want to see the new stuff.

precita · Post by **precita** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 3:48 am

Super is falling into the same problem as GT as all the focus is on Goku again. People complained GT was too Goku-centered, yet Super does the same just with Vegeta along for the ride.

DBZ passed the torch between Goku and virtually every other character. GT and Super is literally Goku 24/7 as well as Vegeta.

sintzu · Post by **sintzu** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 5:08 am

precita wrote:People complained GT was too Goku-centered, yet Super does the same just with Vegeta along for the ride.

BOG centered around Goku but that changed during RF to Goku&Vegeta and U6 will center around them, Piccolo, Buu & Monaca.

Gt from beginning to end was about Goku and Goku only so you can't really say their the same.

KentalSSJ6 · Post by **KentalSSJ6** » Fri Dec 25, 2015 7:39 am

omaro34 wrote:I hope GT gets lost this time. The Super Saiyan levels got way too high (SSJ4's design was cool though), and this led to crazy fan made stuff like Dragonball AF's design of SSJ5. Goku turning into a kid also annoyed me, piccolo ending up in hell forever was such an injustice it screamed failure, and the amazing ability to initiate creative wonderful story arcs filled with potential such as Baby and the Shadow Dragons and following that up with such poor execution was sad.

I hope Super finishes these re-telling Arcs soon, I want to see the new stuff.

You say SSJ4 brought the SSJ levels too high yet Toriyama introduces 2 more and thats ok?

Kanzenshuu

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