Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[TheGmGoken]

I like Vegeta more than Goku. But Vegeta's done nothing to deserve this kind of win.

He gained a large vocal fan base and makes money. That's the only reason *if* he's beating Freeza.

When was the last time he beat someone? 2008 OVA?

GOKU haven't had a major win since Freeza

[fadeddreams5]

Why does Vegeta deserve to beat Freeza again? That's the part I'm not getting.

"Who gets to beat the genocidal, world-destroying alien royalty? The OTHER former genocidal, world destroying alien royalty."

Going by real world logic, nothing Vegeta has done since then justifies his past crimes. However, going by DBZ logic, he is now considered pure-hearted and good. ^.^

GOKU haven't had a major win since Freeza

Eh, I'm counting all non-canon works, including GT and Toei.

[Tennessaiyan]

Lol, for a protagonist to be a protagonist, that doesn't require them to be the hero. Every. Damn. Time.

Not trying to be rude or anything, I suppose that I've just tired of the same old same old happening in the movies... just as other fans have.

[Avenged]

When was the last time he beat someone? 2008 OVA?

GOKU haven't had a major win since Freeza

Guess we all forgot he defeated Buu.

[sintzu]

He gained a large vocal fan base and makes money. That's the only reason *if* he's beating Freeza.

Another reason is it makes sense from a story standpoint.

[Doctor.]

Goku beating Freeza wouldn't be good for Freeza's character, just saying. It would accomplish absolutely nothing if he's brought back and can''t even succeed a little bit with his plans of revenge. Then again, Vegeta is already over Freeza and him beating Freeza wouldn't make much sense from a power perspective.

I'd rather Whis or Beerus take care of him, even if it's anti-climatic.

[sintzu]

Guess we all forgot he defeated Buu.

Which was a team effort between him,Vegeta,Buu,Satan,Shenron and the people of earth.

[rereboy]

Guess we all forgot he defeated Buu.

Only technically. He lost his solo fight with Buu and he would lose again with his Genki Dama move if the Dragon hadn't restored his stamina. So...

[singsing]

Goku beating Freeza wouldn't be good for Freeza's character, just saying. It would accomplish absolutely nothing if he's brought back and can''t even succeed a little bit with his plans of revenge. Then again, Vegeta is already over Freeza and him beating Freeza wouldn't make much sense from a power perspective.

I'd rather Whis or Beerus take care of him, even if it's anti-climatic.

Having Whis one shot the newly proud and arrogant Freeza would be hilarious.

[ShadowWolf87]

Yes, aside from help Goku and/or Gohan save the world numerous times and receive no credit for it, he's certainly done nothing.

Neither was Gohan yet he beat Cell. Trunks wasn't either yet he killed Freeza. Vegeta is the second biggest character in DB aside from Goku and he has yet to get a win against a significant villain (Android 19 is not Freeza, Cell, or Buu in terms of significance). Goku and Gohan have. Goku's gotten 2.

I'm at the point where I really hope it's Vegeta who beats him as the reactions here will certainly be something to look forward to. I'm getting sick of constantly hearing how Goku should be the hero when he's had that spotlight throughout the entire manga and in the movies.

I'm curious as to who's been saying Goku needs to be the "hero" (God forbid the actual protagonist be the protagonist though) in here. I've mostly seen people questioning how Vegeta's supposed to simply straight-up win when Goku gets stomped.

And the few I've seen want Goku to get a win haven't rationalized it as "because MC".

Uh where did I say it was just on here? And this lame MC excuse doesn't fly. Gohan wasn't the MC nor was Trunks. People really should stop playing that card.

Actually, Trunks' win was nothing to write home about, it was merely done as a means of establishing dread for the next arc. "The guy that took out Freeza and his daddy without trouble came back in time cuz he needs our help to stop these other two approaching enemies that he can barely even scratch."

As for Gohan... he actually was on track to be the MC until Toriyama felt it didn't fit with Gohan's personality and personal philosophy or preferences. Kid was a bookworm scared of his own power. But that is why he got the kill there.

And since when has Vegeta not gotten credit? His legion of fanboys constantly hype him, he's one of the most popular characters for it, he actually gets to do more than go down in one hit when fighting most any of the villains... he's gotten plenty of credit. Piccolo/Krillin, however, get next to none for any of the stuff they do. Let them kill Freeza then. They both have a reason to want him dead too.

[Kamiccolo9]

Why does Vegeta deserve to beat Freeza again? That's the part I'm not getting.

"Who gets to beat the genocidal, world-destroying alien royalty? The OTHER former genocidal, world destroying alien royalty."

Going by real world logic, nothing Vegeta has done since then justifies his past crimes. However, going by DBZ logic, he is now considered pure-hearted and good. ^.^

The other thing is, everyone keeps bringing up Vegeta's relationship with Freeza, but everyone seems to be overlooking Freeza's relationship with Vegeta.

Goku may not have killed Freeza, but he might as well have destroyed him. Mecha-Freeza was a joke, a shadow of his former self. There's enmity on both sides here. That's what makes a good hero/villain relationship.

The Vegeta/Freeza relationship, on the other hand, is almost entirely one-sided. Vegeta's always been a joke to Freeza. He's a pet that occasionally tries to bite back. For all that Vegeta despised Freeza, Freeza just didn't care.

[ShadowWolf87]

Goku beating Freeza wouldn't be good for Freeza's character, just saying. It would accomplish absolutely nothing if he's brought back and can''t even succeed a little bit with his plans of revenge. Then again, Vegeta is already over Freeza and him beating Freeza wouldn't make much sense from a power perspective.

I'd rather Whis or Beerus take care of him, even if it's anti-climatic.

Having Whis one shot the newly proud and arrogant Freeza would be hilarious.

Only if he comments on how tacky his color scheme/makeup is.

[Birusu16]

Considering that it was usually his fault?

And yes, Gohan was the main character. Toriyama says as much himself.

So now we're assigning blame? Ok. Well lets see, Goku decided to spare Freeza and even give him some of his energy, which no doubt had played a part in Freeza surviving Namek's explosion. Goku decided to give Cell a sensu bean just to make it fair before his fight against Gohan.

If you want to sit here and play the blame game then we certainly can. The facts are that Vegeta has done more than enough to show he deserves a big moment.

And no, Gohan was certainly never the main character of this series. It's always been Goku. He may have been the main character for an arc, but never the main character of the entire series.

[sintzu]

Vegeta is already over Freeza and him beating Freeza wouldn't make much sense from a power perspective.

It does.

He comes back to get revenge on 2 saiyans who surpassed him in power and beat him only to have the same thing happen again by a 3rd saiyan.

[Tennessaiyan]

GOKU haven't had a major win since Freeza

Er... Buu? 0_o

Honestly, guys. Who is the one with the "major" wins. Does anyone really need to answer that?

[rereboy]

Mecha-Freeza was a joke, a shadow of his former self.

In-universe, he was stronger than he was on Namek, so hardly a joke. Out of universe, yeah, he was used just to build up other characters.

[ekrolo2]

Goku beating Freeza wouldn't be good for Freeza's character, just saying. It would accomplish absolutely nothing if he's brought back and can''t even succeed a little bit with his plans of revenge. Then again, Vegeta is already over Freeza and him beating Freeza wouldn't make much sense from a power perspective.

I'd rather Whis or Beerus take care of him, even if it's anti-climatic.

Having Whis one shot the newly proud and arrogant Freeza would be hilarious.

The movie is gonna go for the awesome but illogical route just as the Kid Buu fight went. Logically yes, Beerus and Whis should be the ones to beat him but that doesn't really sound as cool as Vegeta doing it so he's getting the honor.

[fadeddreams5]

I'm pretty sure Beerus and Whis wouldn't interfere with mortal affairs unless they directly affect them in any way.

[Kamiccolo9]

Considering that it was usually his fault?

And yes, Gohan was the main character. Toriyama says as much himself.

So now we're assigning blame? Ok. Well lets see, Goku decided to spare Freeza and even give him some of his energy, which no doubt had played a part in Freeza surviving Namek's explosion. Goku decided to give Cell a sensu bean just to make it fair before his fight against Gohan.

If you want to sit here and play the blame game then we certainly can. The facts are that Vegeta has done more than enough to show he deserves a big moment.

And no, Gohan was certainly never the main character of this series. It's always been Goku. He may have been the main character for an arc, but never the main character of the entire series.

The Buu Arc starts out with Toriyama writing "And replacing Goku as the main character is his son, Gohan."

Gohan was also more or less the co-star of the Saiyan Arc, and had way more focus on him in the early to mid Freeza Arc than Goku did. And the Cell Games were all about finishing up the hidden-power plotline that had been running since Gohan was introduced.

[ShadowWolf87]

Why does Vegeta deserve to beat Freeza again? That's the part I'm not getting.

"Who gets to beat the genocidal, world-destroying alien royalty? The OTHER former genocidal, world destroying alien royalty."

Going by real world logic, nothing Vegeta has done since then justifies his past crimes. However, going by DBZ logic, he is now considered pure-hearted and good. ^.^

The other thing is, everyone keeps bringing up Vegeta's relationship with Freeza, but everyone seems to be overlooking Freeza's relationship with Vegeta.

Goku may not have killed Freeza, but he might as well have destroyed him. Mecha-Freeza was a joke, a shadow of his former self. There's enmity on both sides here. That's what makes a good hero/villain relationship.

The Vegeta/Freeza relationship, on the other hand, is almost entirely one-sided. Vegeta's always been a joke to Freeza. He's a pet that occasionally tries to bite back. For all that Vegeta despised Freeza, Freeza just didn't care.

People also like to fall back on Vegeta needing to avenge his race and whatnot while forgetting Goku took that burden upon himself when he faced Freeza. He partly fought in their name and their memory as Vegeta had asked him to do.

Freeza was beaten by a Saiyan, and Saiyans avenged by a Saiyan. That reason is kinda already covered, so I don't see why it's brought back up constantly.