Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[TheMightyOzaru]

go to page 98.

[dbzfan7]

How come you think SSJ God is a little stronger then the opponent it faces. Isn't Birus above SSJ God Goku. Also you may want to include SSJ with God power as its stated to be weaker then the initial SSJ God, but it ain't too far behind.

[TheMightyOzaru]

How come you think SSJ God is a little stronger then the opponent it faces. Isn't Birus above SSJ God Goku. Also you may want to include SSJ with God power as its stated to be weaker then the initial SSJ God, but it ain't too far behind.

I think SSJ God should work like that IMO, it likely doesn't but I can dream . Birusu is above the SSJ Goku with godly powers, I don't think Birusu is stronger than the initial God Goku but We'll have to wait and see. Yeah I probably should include that, thanks for reminding me .

[dbzfan7]

How come you think SSJ God is a little stronger then the opponent it faces. Isn't Birus above SSJ God Goku. Also you may want to include SSJ with God power as its stated to be weaker then the initial SSJ God, but it ain't too far behind.

I think SSJ God should work like that IMO, it likely doesn't but I can dream . Birusu is above the SSJ Goku with godly powers, I don't think Birusu is stronger than the initial God Goku but We'll have to wait and see. Yeah I probably should include that, thanks for reminding me .

I would like it to work like that, but i'm certain it doesn't.

[ZombieVito]

I will put Vegeta base on your numbers at 30,000,000,000. He did said he would be Goku soon.

[RandomGuy96]

Okay, a few things.

*You made Selypa the only person in that special that is weaker than Raditz? Sexist!
*Cooler and Goku in Movie 5 should be a lot higher. Goku especially. Like, Goku should be 300,000,000 and Cooler can stay at 200,000,000. It just seems like there was a pretty big gap between Movie SSJ Goku and Cooler.
*King Cold is officially weaker than Freeza (and by extension, Cooler), so making him stronger pre-Mecha doesn't make a lot of sense.
*Considering his feats, how can Salza possibly be lower than a million?
*Why is Future Gohan so much stronger than Trunks? I believe that it was said that Trunks was equal to him before going back to the past.
*Why is Trunks so close to Vegeta and Goku in the Android Arc? He had about a quarter of the time to train and started out noticeably weaker than Goku. He also showed himself to be A LOT weaker than Vegeta when he got one-shotted by an android while Vegeta held his own.
*I'm pretty sure zenkais just don't happen after the Freeza saga.
*I guess it's just a matter of personal preference, but what makes you think Super 13 is stronger than 16?
*Piccolo one tenth the strength of a Cell Junior and weaker than Semi-Perfect Cel?...yeah, I'm just gonna say I disagree with that one.
*Why is there such a huge gap between SS and SS2 Gohan? Not using official multipliers?
*Videl at 68? I really don't think she did anything impressive enough to be considered that strong... and I'm pretty sure bullets can still hurt her.
*Pui Pui at 24,000 seems kind of wrong... he's supposed to be one of the most powerful warriors in the universe, and Babidi sends him against someone he knows killed Freeza.

...there are other things, but I don't feel like listing them right now.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Okay, a few things.

*You made Selypa the only person in that special that is weaker than Raditz? Sexist!
*Cooler and Goku in Movie 5 should be a lot higher. Goku especially. Like, Goku should be 300,000,000 and Cooler can stay at 200,000,000. It just seems like there was a pretty big gap between Movie SSJ Goku and Cooler.
*King Cold is officially weaker than Freeza (and by extension, Cooler), so making him stronger pre-Mecha doesn't make a lot of sense.
*Considering his feats, how can Salza possibly be lower than a million?
*Why is Future Gohan so much stronger than Trunks? I believe that it was said that Trunks was equal to him before going back to the past.
*Why is Trunks so close to Vegeta and Goku in the Android Arc? He had about a quarter of the time to train and started out noticeably weaker than Goku. He also showed himself to be A LOT weaker than Vegeta when he got one-shotted by an android while Vegeta held his own.
*I'm pretty sure zenkais just don't happen after the Freeza saga.
*I guess it's just a matter of personal preference, but what makes you think Super 13 is stronger than 16?
*Piccolo one tenth the strength of a Cell Junior and weaker than Semi-Perfect Cel?...yeah, I'm just gonna say I disagree with that one.
*Why is there such a huge gap between SS and SS2 Gohan? Not using official multipliers?
*Videl at 68? I really don't think she did anything impressive enough to be considered that strong... and I'm pretty sure bullets can still hurt her.
*Pui Pui at 24,000 seems kind of wrong... he's supposed to be one of the most powerful warriors in the universe, and Babidi sends him against someone he knows killed Freeza.

...there are other things, but I don't feel like listing them right now.

Iv'e thought about all the above things and this is where I feel comfortable putting everyone. I'm not sexist, I just don't see a reason to put Selypa above Raditz =/. King Cold is not officially weaker than Freeza, if he is by all means show me an official source claiming this. Salza has no feats. The armored squad all got owned by Piccolo, they do not have to be in the millions. They also beat Gohan because they ganged up on him. Gohan has been training for years, he should be stronger than Trunks by a good deal. Trunks had just as much time to train as everyone else did. He is also a Saiyan/Human hybrid, he gets stronger faster. Zenkais were said to have gotten smaller and less noticeable. Well Super 13 is the combination of 3 fairly strong androids. I honestly don't see how he isn't stronger than 16. I don't see how Piccolo could have gotten much much stronger in the ROSAT. The Cell Jrs are toying with the lot. Gohan get's a rage boost so he is 4-8x stronger than his SSJ form, depending on how angry he is. Bullets couldn't hurt Goku at a level of 10 because A Dragon Ball is a gag manga and B he is a Saiyan, he is physically superior to humans. You can have a tremendous power level and still be hurt by bullets, or SSJ Goku's case, a rock that Krillin threw at him. Yeah I don't think Pui Pui should be that strong considering he finds 10Gs impressive. 24,000 is pretty high considering...

[ZombieVito]

Piccolo to even ask if he stood a chance against Perfect Cell put him way over USSJ Vegeta.

[RandomGuy96]

*I know, that was a joke. I actually like your positions for Bardock's squad; a lot of people put them way too close to Nappa.
*His Daizenshuu 7 character bio says: "King Cold; Freeza's father. He is a shadowy presence in the organization, and nobody knows of his existence apart from his family and his direct subordinates, not even the Ginyu Special-Squad. Though he's the head of the strongest family in the universe, he is somewhat inferior to Freeza."
*Salza knocked out 200,000 Gohan in one hit and fought evenly with Piccolo. He also cannot be weaker than Doore, as he deflected two blasts from Piccolo when one quickly engulfed and killed Doore.
*Pretty sure it was flat-out stated that Trunks had reached his level before travelling to the past.
*I thought Trunks only had 8 months while everyone else had 3 years? He was also shown to be weaker than Vegeta against the androids.
*There's just no real reason to put him above 16. All he did was beat up some pre-ROSAT saiyans and Kamiccolo, and he actually got budged a few times.
*Nope. Cell ordered the Juniors to stop screwing around and kill everyone. On the next few panels, Piccolo is still standing. He should've been one-shotted by your numbers. And if Trunks and Vegeta made such ridiculous gains, I don't see why Piccolo wouldn't. He also asks Goku about his usefulness against Perfect Cell, which he wouldn't do if he already knew he was far weaker than Semi-Perfect Cell.
*What justifies placing Videl so insanely high, higher than masters who have trained their entire lvies? She didn't do anything that would warrant that level.
* A. that was filler and B. he was caught off guard. Sleeping.
*Gravity feats (and the ability to lift things in general) can't really help in determining power level strength. Otherwise, kid Trunks is weaker than 90,000.

[ZombieVito]

Can anyone explain to me how can Vegeta at 250,000 do this?

http://view.thespectrum.net/series/drag ... 25&page=96

At 530K he should kill all of them, Freeza didn't even need to transform if Vegeta was at that level, which brings me to my next point: how the hell did Vegeta thought a guy with 75K and a kid with 100K be of any help to fight Freeza? makes no damn sense.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Gohan was fatigued. No, it's never stated that Trunks surpassed his master before he returned. Trunks still gains faster being a Saiyan/Human hybrid. I literally added all 3 of the androids' power levels and it came out to be over Android 16... Yet Yamcha, Tenshinhan, and Krillin are still alive... My point still stands, they can be hurt by bullets and rocks when their guard is down. I don't see a reason for Pui Pui to be so strong.

[Bussani]

Piccolo to even ask if he stood a chance against Perfect Cell put him way over USSJ Vegeta.

He didn't ask. What he said was more along the lines of: "Don't talk down to me. I've gotten stronger than I was, but it won't do any good against Cell." He already knew Cell was out of his league.

Can anyone explain to me how can Vegeta at 250,000 do this?

The most logical answer to that seems to be that Freeza wasn't even trying. Vegeta looks like he gives it all he got during the clash, and he's left panting after they jump back from one another; Freeza, on the other hand, shows no sign of effort and stands there like nothing happened afterwards.

At 530K he should kill all of them, Freeza didn't even need to transform if Vegeta was at that level

Oh, he definitely didn't need to. He did it because Vegeta asked him to, and probably because he wanted to see the look on his face when he realized how horribly mistaken he had been.

[ZombieVito]

Freeza powered up, he had no reason to not go all out there.

He even got surprised Vegeta managed to catch his attack: http://view.thespectrum.net/series/drag ... 25&page=95

Vegeta said he will transform regardless, that statement wasn't contradicted. That 250K makes no sense.

I only seen one source saying Piccolo didn't asked (Herms), while:

Piccolo: How about being candid with me? I may have become stronger, but it still won't be of any use against Cell, right?
Goku: Nope. It's no use, all right.
Piccolo: You really did put it candidly.

and this:



Sorry but I'm going with the official translations.

[Bussani]

He even got surprised Vegeta managed to catch his attack

That doesn't mean much if he wasn't giving it his all. Whether he powered up or not, it's clear that he didn't exert himself to the same degree as Vegeta.

Vegeta said he will transform regardless, that statement wasn't contradicted.

Whereabouts did he say that?

I only seen one source saying Piccolo didn't asked (Herms)

Sorry but I'm going with the official translations.

He didn't ask in Viz's translation, either. But I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree, because I trust Herms's purposely-literal-for-the-sake-of-this-sort-of-thing translations more.

[RandomGuy96]

Gohan was fatigued. No, it's never stated that Trunks surpassed his master before he returned. Trunks still gains faster being a Saiyan/Human hybrid. I literally added all 3 of the androids' power levels and it came out to be over Android 16... Yet Yamcha, Tenshinhan, and Krillin are still alive... My point still stands, they can be hurt by bullets and rocks when their guard is down. I don't see a reason for Pui Pui to be so strong.

Explain Piccolo. Salza not only effortlessly defeated Gohan, who's supposed to be way stronger than him going by those numbers, but also fought evenly with Piccolo and even deflected two of the same blasts that killed Doore. That does not match up with him being weaker than Doore and Gohan.

I think Bulma said that he wasn't that much stronger than Gohan when he was preparing to fight the androids, and Trunks agreed, implying that he was stronger at the time.

That was never implied. If you're using Gohan and Goten as a baseline, then by the time he's that age Trunks should already be way stronger than the androids to begin with. He started out the weakest and got the least time to train, so there's no reason he should be so close.

The humans and Goku were also on the ground. Piccolo was still with Trunks and Vegeta, standing and fighting.

I don't think adding them together is the most reliable way to gauge power, but eh, I guess it works in the context you put it in, so it's just personal preference.

Have we ever seen Videl get hit by a bullet and shrug it off? Have we ever seen her do ANYTHING that would justify placing her in the same tier as Dragon Ball-era martial artists like Chappa?

Pui Pui was said to be the strongest fighter in the southern quadrant, and was recruited to fight a guy who killed Freeza. There's no reason that he'd be weaker than a nobody like, say, Zarbon.

[TheMightyOzaru]

I guess I'll raise Pui Pui, I've taken into consideration the above and I put everyone where I feel they should be. A lot of these problems you have with my levels are subjective.

[Kamiccolo9]

I guess I'll raise Pui Pui, I've taken into consideration the above and I put everyone where I feel they should be. A lot of these problems you have with my levels are subjective.

Pui Pui was said to be the strongest fighter in the southern quadrant, and was recruited to fight a guy who killed Freeza. There's no reason that he'd be weaker than a nobody like, say, Zarbon.

Zarbon wasn't a nobody though. Power levels in the tens of thousands aren't common, and , as far as we know, at the beginning of Z, Zarbon was the 7th or 8th strongest being in the universe.
Anyway, I see no reason to have Pui Pui much higher than that.

[ZombieVito]

Think about it, Babidi recruited the strongest fighters from the whole universe, Freeza didn't make the cut, Pu Pui did.

[RandomGuy96]

I thought that's because he started recruiting after Freeza died? If not, then it seems weird that Pui Pui didn't declare himself emperor of the galaxy at any time... unless he's stronger than Freeza but weaker than Cooler or something.

Plus, are you saying all those generic henchmen on the ship (including the two that Yakon ate) are stronger than Freeza?

[ZombieVito]

We don't know the exact date Babidi started recruiting but considering Majin Buu is thousands of years old, he had to know about Freeza's family. And no, only the 5 (or was it 4?) fighters that Baibidi had to defend his scenarios are stronger.