Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
SSJ2FutureGohan wrote:Super Buu (SSGSS Goku + SSGSS Vegeta absorbed) vs. Whiss
Well I like to place the SSJGSS's at 7.5, so if Boo absorbs them both I guess it's an equal fight power wise (Boo's power really does absolutely nothing at this stage). Whis should win with his mastery of fighting. Boo's regeneration should keep him in the game, and maybe wear Whis down, but I just think Whis is too good of a fighter after what he said to Goku and Vegeta in F whilst training them.
So Whis wins.
supercat wrote:
First Form (FnF)
Final Form (FnF)
Golden (FnF)
I have First Form Freeza at SSJ3 Goku/Kid Boo level.
I place True Form Freeza ahead of SSJ Vegetto by a bit, probably equal to Vegetto as a SSJ2.
Golden Freeza in my head is 10x his True Form.
The fusion wins if Yamcha and Chaozu are also from the Android saga.
DBZAOTA482 wrote:Base Goku (Android Saga) + Tenshinhan (Boo Saga) Potara Fusion vs. Base Gohan (Boo Saga)
Most likely the fusion. The potara boost is rather gargantuan, and I don't have more than a 2x gap between Goku and Tien so them being somewhat close in power would overall help the fusion.
DBZAOTA482 wrote:Idasa + Ikosa Potara Fusion vs. Majin Spopovich
Same as above.
DBZAOTA482 wrote:Chi-Chi vs. Videl (25th Budokai) + Blonde Lunch Potara Fusion
The fusion might be too much.
DBZAOTA482 wrote:Ultimate Gohan +Tenshinhan (Boo Saga) Potara Fusion vs. Bootenks
Fusing with Tenshinhan would make Gohan weaker. To me, the gap between Gohan and Tien is bigger than the gap between Goku and Mark.
DBZAOTA482 wrote:Chi-Chi (23rd Budokai) vs. Majin Spopovich + Yamu Potara Fusion ; Kamehameha is optional for her
Chichi could one-shot either of them individually... but a fusion of them should definitely win.
TheGmGoken wrote:SSGSS Goku (Movie 6) vs Golden Cooler (Movie 5)
If Golden Frieza was stronger than SSGSS Goku, then Cooler would also likely be on the fortunate end of having such an advantage. With that said, this is all going to be heavily dependent on how much Goku has actually improved since Movie 5. I always saw Movie 5 Goku more or less within the same realm of power as his Yardrat self and Movie 6 Goku comparable to how powerful he was after he completed his 3 year training for the androids. Barring any issues pertaining to stamina, I'm going to have to say either fighter could end up with a favorable outcome.
New Battle:
Golden Frieza (no stamina issues) vs Super 17 (after absorbing SSJ4 Goku's Kamehameha, SSJ4 Vegeta's Big Bang Attack, and SSJ Vegetto's Big Bang Kamehameha)
I still say Frieza crushes this android with a moderate amount of difficulty. My guess is that Golden Frieza is at the very least a few tiers short of Omega Shenron, if not already there.
supercat wrote:Golden Freeza (no stamina issues) vs Super 17 (after absorbing SSJ4 Goku's Kamehameha, SSJ4 Vegeta's Big Bang Attack, and SSJ Vegetto's Big Bang Kamehameha)
Super #17 wrecks Golden Freeza.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
Golden Frieza vs Omega Shenron (with their actual battle powers, no stamina issues for Frieza)
Goku's Dragon Fist (against Super 17) vs Golden Frieza (worn out)
supercat wrote:Golden Freeza vs Omega Shenron (with their actual battle powers, no stamina issues for Freeza)
Goku's Dragon Fist (against Super 17) vs Golden Freeza (worn out)
I have Super #17 as strong as Whiss, so the Dragon Fist would kill Freeza, and Super Yi Xing Long would just finger flick Freeza.
Zombie wrote:North Kaioshin vs SSJ Goku (CG)
North Kaioshin vs Cell (vs Goku/Gohan)
North Kaioshin vs SSJ Gohan (CG)
North Kaioshin wins all of these matches, with at the most, a mild level of difficulty. East Kaioshin, the weakest among his brethren, was already implied to be slightly above Cell Jr. / Piccolo.
New Battle:
Final Form Frieza (FnF) vs Final Form Rild on M2
AvatarReiko wrote:Vegeta's final explosion vs SSJ3 Goku
Genki Dama(against Kid Buu) vs Buuhan
17 and/or 18 vs Big Bang from SSJ Vegeta(android saga)
The combatants in this scenario have to take the attack head on. They can't dodge.
-SSJ3 Goku casually tanks the blast with minor injuries, but making it out completely unscathed may be out of the question. Fat Buu, who was a decent amount below SSJ3 Goku was able to survive the attack, so this shouldn't be too daunting of a task for the latter. Although one might argue that Buu's survival could be attributed to his regeneration, what's relevant is that he still pulled through the entire ordeal.
-The Spirit Bomb almost failed against Kid Buu, there's no way it's even going to budge Buuhan.
-The androids would suffer some nasty damage, but the end result would likely be in their favor. On the contrary, the damage inflicted from taking such a powerful attack head-on may give Vegeta just the advantage he needs to put those teenage toys in their place.
supercat wrote:Final Form Freeza (FnF) vs Final Form Rild on M2
Freeza wins with moderate effort
AvatarReiko wrote:Vegeta's final explosion vs SSJ3 Goku
Genki Dama(against Kid Buu) vs Buuhan
17 and/or 18 vs Big Bang from SSJ Vegeta(android saga)
The combatants in this scenario have to take the attack head on. They can't dodge.
- Goku gets seriously injured by that explosion but survivies
- Hmm. Does Buuhan really count at totally evil even though he has pure hearted beings within at that time (Gohan, Piccolo, Goten and Trunks)? If so, the Genki Dama decimates him. If not, he's pushing that shit back.
- Either one of them shrugs that attack off.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
Piccolo vs King Piccolo (equal power, unlimited stamina)
Final Form Freeza (FnF) vs Super Baby Vegeta
- Dr Gero wins, easy
- I'd give this to Yamcha
- This match could go either way. But I'd back King Piccolo to win as he is more cunning and tactical in battle.
- SBV crushes Freeza.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
Yamcha (against Jackie Chun) vs Jin Kazama (regular form)
Major Metallitron vs 3 Jack-4's
First Form Freeza (FnF) vs Super Mega Cannon Sigma
- Majuub turns Freeza into candy
- I'm backing Yamcha as he's more superhuman in my books in comparison to Jin
- Major Metallitron crushes the Jack-4s
- Freeza turns Super Mega Cannon Sigma into scrap metal
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
supercat wrote:Final Form Freeza (FnF) vs Majuub (no turning Freeza to candy)
King Piccolo vs Devil Jin and Devil Kazuya
King Piccolo (aged) vs Devil Jin and Devil Kazuya
Mr. Popo vs Devil Jin and Devil Kazuya
First Form Freeza (FnF) vs Base Rild
First Form Freeza (FnF) vs Second Form Rild
- Majoob still wins. He was able to one shot Rild when he was resurrected and Rild and beyond Buuhan and I'd personally see Final Form Freeza (ROF), at his strongest, is Base Vegetto level.
- I'm backing King Piccolo for this fight. But it's a hard fought victory.
- King Piccolo loses
- Popo kicks both their asses
- Rild stomps Freeza
- Rild finger flicks Freeza
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
Final Form Frieza (100%) - before training
SSJ Future Trunks (first appearance)
SSJ Yardrat Goku
Android 18
Android 17
Piccolo (initially merged with Kami)
Android 16
Imperfect Cell
Semi-perfect Cell
Suppressed Perfect Cell
Cell Jr.
Perfect Cell (against Gohan)
Super Perfect Cell
Dabura (no turning to stone)
Paikuhan - rematch, ample space to fight, not restricted to a tournament ring, weighted clothing must stay on, no Burning Shoot for Paikuhan
If Olibu gets owned before reaching Paikuhan, he automatically gets healed and moved up the ladder to his rematch. Who wins?
Final Form Freeza (100%) - before training
SSJ Future Trunks (first appearance)
SSJ Yardrat Goku
Android 18
Android 17
Piccolo (initially merged with Kami)
Android 16
Imperfect Cell
Semi-perfect Cell
Suppressed Perfect Cell
Cell Jr.
Perfect Cell (against Gohan)
Super Perfect Cell
Dabura (no turning to stone)
Paikuhan - rematch, ample space to fight, not restricted to a tournament ring, weighted clothing must stay on, no Burning Shoot for Paikuhan
If Olibu gets owned before reaching Paikuhan, he automatically gets healed and moved up the ladder to his rematch. Who wins?
Hits a brick wall against Cell Jr.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
