"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[ryou766]

Are we looking at the same image? He looks the same in physique.

To me he looks wider across the chest compared to the anime. Although, this confirm to me that the reason Black Goku is skinner than Goku in the anime is because they're trying to mimic Toriyama's current style more, much like Future Trunks.

I've never been a fan of Toriyama's recent scrawny approach for the characters, honestly.

[Bullza]

I don't particularly mind that Zeno has a "childish" design, the problem I have is that it's just an horrific character design in general.

Toriyama does some fantastic character designs, he's one of the best when it comes to that but his Zeno design is beyond horrid. It's quite possibly the worst one or one of the worst ones he's done for this series.

[HeroR]

I've never been a fan of Toriyama's recent scrawny approach for the characters, honestly.

For me, it depends on the character. Goku and Vegeta for example look fine to me when they're skinny, which is why I think Super Saiyan God Goku and Black Goku looks fine. Others like Mr. Satan and Gohan, not so much. Mr. Satan looked like a cancer patient in Toriyama recent art style. I also think he went too far with Cabba.

[ryou766]

Cabba's appearance and over all character could have been much better than what it was.

[MaGyunia]

See? Personal tastes also play their part and bear on how much a fan likes or dislikes a particular aspect of a character's design. But we're just talking about the design, a proper analysis on a(ny) character must go far deeper than that and beyond, and in that regard I've already stated the main reason why I don't like Zen-ou-sama's introduction (the combo I specified, which has so numerous and significant ramifications in light of the distant and recent past in the franchise).

Cabba's appearance and over all character could have been much better than what it was.

They added a "roman legionnaire" look to him to add to the Saiya-jin casual wear, in order to make him look more like a "warrior for good", or rather, a "warrior", than our strongly steeped concept of Saiya-jin. Cabba's design is a mixture between Saiya-jin wear before they were annexed into Freeza's galactic army, Freeza's army wear and that slight Roman touch. His physical appearance as far as his body goes can be subject to debate in terms of taste, but I personally like it, and I have to be honest, when I first looked at him he stroke me as evil. Totally wrong on that one, and unexpected. But he was indeed another character whose potential was sorely misused, like so much stuff in DBSuper and especially in the 6th Universe arc, which was the first set of events which really was new in the series, and about which we discussed so much in here and outside, and about which so much hype and strong expectations were built.

[Lujin_16]

I don't particularly mind that Zeno has a "childish" design, the problem I have is that it's just an horrific character design in general.

Toriyama does some fantastic character designs, he's one of the best when it comes to that but his Zeno design is beyond horrid. It's quite possibly the worst one or one of the worst ones he's done for this series.

The worst??? Pilaw?Carlic??Popo??Frieza 2 form,Janemba fat baby??Boo?? you exaggerating to much What is when Zeno transforms in someone who looks badass when he gets angry???

[Grimlock]

I wouldn't mind Omni-King's design if it wasn't Akira Toriyama trying to be "the simplest" all the time. I couldn't even express my reaction when I saw Monaka, who was supposed to be the strongest opponent Beerus ever fought (remember that we didn't know he was a regular being at that time). After Monaka at least the King of Multiverse had to be someone imposing fear and such. Yeah, we got some new designs through Universe 6 characters but honestly, they all look normal to me; they aren't bad but there's nothing awesome as well.

[VegettoEX]

I wouldn't mind Omni-King's design if it wasn't Akira Toriyama trying to be "the simplest" all the time. I couldn't even express my reaction when I saw Monaka, who was supposed to be the strongest opponent Beerus ever fought (remember that we didn't know he was a regular being at that time).

Well, haven't you just given it a proper analysis and chance right there? As Lujin_16 just mentioned, what if Zen'o has a transformation?

This is one of those examples of kneejerk, hyperbolic criticisms I feel like I've been talking about so much lately. Zen'o has literally been on screen for a few minutes of time in total. It was an introduction. Is it really fair to judge him yet beyond that kneejerk reaction?

[ryou766]

His physical appearance as far as his body goes can be subject to debate in terms of taste, but I personally like it, and I have to be honest, when I first looked at him he stroke me as evil. Totally wrong on that one, and unexpected. But he was indeed another character whose potential was sorely misused, like so much stuff in DBSuper and especially in the 6th Universe arc, which was the first set of events which really was new in the series, and about which we discussed so much in here and outside, and about which so much hype and strong expectations were built.

Quite the opposite with me. I took a took a glance at Cabba's design from when the raw scans were released and assumed that he was a kindhearted character as opposed to the stereotypical way that we all view Saiyans who aren't Goku, Vegeta or any of their children. I assumed that he would be similar to Tarble. In a way, I was right. The two have distinct similarities aside from the hairstyle. But yes, his character was improperly used outside of design. He could have been much more interesting. In fact, the same could go for every other contestant in U6, for the exception of Hit (who i felt as though was the only one done right). But, I also did like that we later learned through Cabba that the Saiyans in Cabba's universes are the complete opposite to the ones in U7. We also learned that they outgrew their tails... Which is.. interesting? I guess?

[Grimlock]

Eh, but I'm judging something that won't change; his design, it is what we see, what it is. With an amount of time on-screen we judge personality, and that's not what I did here. If Omni-King possesses a transformation, it probably won't affect his normal form, and I'll judge his transformation alone, separating from his base one. Unless his transformation is a "creepy" version of his base form (you know, when the colors keep and all that change is his appearance but not too much, just imposing fear), then maybe it can make his base form a little bit cooler, I don't know.

[Nekis13]

Man i hate those Dragonball Z fans who has never seen Dragonball and expecting that super must have all the time DbZ feeling and no comedy like Dragonball..In my opinion for me they are fake fans
who don't undesrtand Akira's history designs,Comedy etc

I have to agree here, you don't see us Dragon Ball fans complaining because DBZ was (way more) action packed.

With the whole Zen'o thing, I'm eh with him, not because of his design but rather because he just appeared for 5 minutes and hasn't been seen again. Just design doesn't make a good character, it's personality and interactions also play the role (which we still don't have that much).

Look at Beerus and the outrage he made when he was first revealed, tons of people jumping in and saying that DBZ was dead because Goku was going to fight some anorexic Cat. Now look at us now, 3 years later and for some of us Beerus is our favorite character!

[MaGyunia]

His physical appearance as far as his body goes can be subject to debate in terms of taste, but I personally like it, and I have to be honest, when I first looked at him he stroke me as evil. Totally wrong on that one, and unexpected. But he was indeed another character whose potential was sorely misused, like so much stuff in DBSuper and especially in the 6th Universe arc, which was the first set of events which really was new in the series, and about which we discussed so much in here and outside, and about which so much hype and strong expectations were built.

Quite the opposite with me. I took a took a glance at Cabba's design from when the raw scans were released and assumed that he was a kindhearted character as opposed to the stereotypical way that we all view Saiyans who aren't Goku, Vegeta or any of their children. I assumed that he would be similar to Tarble. In a way, I was right. The two have distinct similarities aside from the hairstyle. But yes, his character was improperly used outside of design. He could have been much more interesting. In fact, the same could go for every other contestant in U6, for the exception of Hit (who i felt as though was the only one done right). But, I also did like that we later learned through Cabba that the Saiyans in Cabba's universes are the complete opposite to the ones in U7. We also learned that they outgrew their tails... Which is.. interesting? I guess?

Lots of things are interesting about Cabba. That's what you get when you start exploring mirror universes. Their original planet is still there, there are slight changes in all races and fighters who bare a comparison with existing races and characters in the 7th Universe, but there are many similarities as well. The Saiya-jin "had" to be a race of warriors, regardless of their history, planet, size, facial features, behavior, psychological or behavioral characteristics or actual fighting power, and Frost had to be evil, as, regardless of the Universe where they come from, "there's no way there would be a good and kind Freeza; regardless of the Universe where he comes from, Freeza will always be Freeza" (Vegeta dixit).

I like Cabba's eyebrows, though, that was an unexpected part of his design. But you were totally right on the similarities with Tarble, both physically and especially in terms of behavior. Congratulations on that one.

[MaGyunia]

Eh, but I'm judging something that won't change; his design, it is what we see, what it is. With an amount of time on-screen we judge personality, and that's not what I did here. If Omni-King possesses a transformation, it probably won't affect his normal form, and I'll judge his transformation alone, separating from his base one. Unless his transformation is a "creepy" version of his base form (you know, when the colors keep and all that change is his appearance but not too much, just imposing fear), then maybe it can make his base form a little bit cooler, I don't know.

It will probably take the usual gradual process of letting time pass and have him interact and play a role in the events to welcome him and see him in another light to accept him. Either that or they'll skip it like they did with #19, #17, #18 or fat Majin Buu and instead throw a Janenba and have him go from a goofy huge stupid yet powerful yellow ball to something whose physique is perhaps one of the most appropriate depictions of a devil in the whole of Dragonball (which is good).

Look at Beerus and the outrage he made when he was first revealed, tons of people jumping in and saying that DBZ was dead because Goku was going to fight some anorexic Cat. Now look at us now, 3 years later and for some of us Beerus is our favorite character!

Disagreed. Don't know about the outrage Beerus' appearance caused when we all first saw him, but personally I liked it, as I have a thing for cats. I didn't think it was stupid or silly. I took Beerus seriously given and based on his previous description, and nothing changed after I actually saw him.

[ryou766]

Wait. There was "outrage" centered around Beerus' appearance? How could someone dislike that godly bratty kitty?

[Nekis13]

Look at Beerus and the outrage he made when he was first revealed, tons of people jumping in and saying that DBZ was dead because Goku was going to fight some anorexic Cat. Now look at us now, 3 years later and for some of us Beerus is our favorite character!

Disagreed. Don't know about the outrage Beerus' appearance caused when we all first saw him, but personally I liked it, as I have a thing for cats. I didn't think it was stupid or silly. I took Beerus seriously given and based on his previous description, and nothing changed after I actually saw him.

Ahh, well it probably wasn't as big of a reaction as I remember it to be, at least not in this side of the fanbase.

[sintzu]

Man i hate those Dragonball Z fans who has never seen Dragonball and expecting that super must have all the time DbZ feeling and no comedy like Dragonball.

We don't mind if it has comedy but unlike DB it's used in the wrong places and to make things worse it's not even funny, all we've been getting are childish gags that are forced into serious moments to make them look less serious then they are.

When Goku found Krilin's body they didn't cut to someone making an unfunny joke that ruined the scene like what Super does.

The Buu arc is another great example of how to balance comedy with serious situations.

In my opinion for me they are fake fans.

There's no such thing as a fake fan, if they enjoy a part of the franchise then they're fans.

[sintzu]

Naruto,Saitama or One Piece they have skinny/weak looking designs and no one talks about why???

I think this is a huge dragonball fanbase problem what we have

Because that's how they've always been, they didn't completely change from one type to another like DB has.

The problem is from the people in charge of the franchise, The fans just want consistent art and writing which is very understandable.

[pacz360]

Man i hate those Dragonball Z fans who has never seen Dragonball and expecting that super must have all the time DbZ feeling and no comedy like Dragonball..In my opinion for me they are fake fans
who don't undesrtand Akira's history designs,Comedy etc

This doesnt makes sense how the hell there fake fans if they didnt watch the first part of db that like me saying your not a real fan of db if you didnt watch gt or something.

[JulieYBM]

The "outrage" comes mainly from the fact that we would expect something other than

I think that's your (general, plural "your") problem, then: Toriyama's entire modus operandi has been to defy expectations and do the total opposite of what people want. This is something that (again, 30 years later) you've either come to accept, or still enjoy the franchise in spite of.

I do wonder if a lot of it (and I hate to play the "age" card so often) is folks still in their teens and perhaps early 20s struggling with the fact that they're watching a children's cartoon and not being able to come to terms with that. Could you comment on that from your perspective?

In this context I think it has more to do with people being unable to come to terms with liking someone else's fiction. It continues to defy their expectations and demands, but they're not yet mature enough to either understand what they are consuming or simply go off and do their own thing in response. They want possession over Dragon Ball, but they refuse to take it and assume the responsibility that comes with it.

[Bullza]

The worst??? Pilaw?Carlic??Popo??Frieza 2 form,Janemba fat baby??Boo?? you exaggerating to much What is when Zeno transforms in someone who looks badass when he gets angry???

Are Garlic Jr and Janemba Toriyama 's designs? Regardless yeah all those have better designs. Frieza in his second form and Buu have very good designs actually.

Mr Popo doesn't look amazing but he has a decent outfit.

If Zeno transforms and looks entirely different then that'd be great but as he is now, he has a poor character design with an equally bad colour scheme. It's true he really does look like he belongs in Pokémon.

If you look outside of Toriyama's designs then there are probably worse character designs to be found in GT. That show had some awful looking characters.