The lack of respect Dragonball and its fans get.

[samuraigundam]

I have seen all of DBZ and GT twice ( once on TV, and another on the the now defunct International Channel ) , some of DB ( I'm waiting for the domestic DBox release ) , played most of the games, ( even the obscure Famicom ones ) , and would purchase every scrap of DB media and memorabilia if ever I were to become a millionare, and I do not consider myself insane. As a matter of fact, I do not believe in insanity.

Also, as cheesy as DB is, and I just said this on another thread, I consider it to be near Tolkien - esque, in the way it creates unique rules for its world ( and unique inhabitants ) and sticks to them.

Now, if only Toriyama would create a book that teaches the Saiya - Jin language!

On a side note, anime is an incredible genre, with programs that feature concepts and content that rival most current TV shows and movies. Just look at Death Note, and Monster. I've just seen Gankutsuou: the Count of Monte Cristo, and it easily trumps most movie and TV adaptations of that classic novel.

[Adamant]

On a side note, anime is an incredible genre ( or is it considered its own medium )

"Cartoon" is considered a medium. "Anime" are cartoons from Japan.

[samuraigundam]

On a side note, anime is an incredible genre ( or is it considered its own medium )

"Cartoon" is considered a medium. "Anime" are cartoons from Japan.

Well I, of course, know that. But I asked because a few reviewers have recently refered to anime as its own medium, and even though it doesnt make sense, I wanted to know if anyone here thought of anime as that.

Stupid question, I know.

[MCDaveG]

Well I, of course, know that. But I asked because a few reviewers have recently refered to anime as its own medium, and even though it doesnt make sense, I wanted to know if anyone here thought of anime as that.

Stupid question, I know.

Anime is everything cartoon including western series in Japan, we are using japanese word anime to shorten that Japanese cartoon term. It's the same thing as US cartoon

[Bussani]

As much as we love it, we have to acknowledge that DBZ is mass-consumption material that is just one-step above the bottom-of-the-barrel; DBZ is to Mandy Moore as something like Bakugan (which exists solely as a marketing vehicle) is to Britney Spears -- they're both totally just low-brow nonsense intended for wide audiences, but one's got the slightest bit of actual artistic integrity behind it.

I'm certainly not going to disagree with you there, but I do feel that it gets singled out sometimes by anime fans who aren't exactly watching high-brow stuff themselves. It's not exactly breaking news that people can be hypocrites, though. Especially anime fans, for some reason...

[Piccolo Daimao]

At the end of the day, it's just someone's opinion. Some anime fans will look down on Dragon Ball Z because of stereotypes, and, perhaps, that they are simply not knowledgeable enough about DBZ to say otherwise. No-one should be getting mad over some people's opinion, no matter how ridiculous or wrong we may find it.

For the people who badmouth DBZ fans, they're the ones who lack maturity and don't deserve respect. If they're going to insult a whole fan community, they should look at what they're watching/reading for once in a while.

[samuraigundam]

Well I, of course, know that. But I asked because a few reviewers have recently refered to anime as its own medium, and even though it doesnt make sense, I wanted to know if anyone here thought of anime as that.

Stupid question, I know.

Anime is everything cartoon including western series in Japan, we are using japanese word anime to shorten that Japanese cartoon term. It's the same thing as US cartoon

I'm going to have to disagree with you. Western animated series in Japan are not considered Anime. The term " Anime " specifically refers to Japanese produced animation. American shows animated in Japan ( Transformers, G.I. Joe, some animated Batman movies, the Animatrix, ) , are also considered Anime, despite the American influence, because they are drawn in full by Japanese animation teams. The term can be extended to include animation from other Asian countries, as well, but that is debatable.

[Bussani]

I'm going to have to disagree with you. Western animated series in Japan are not considered Anime. The term " Anime " specifically refers to Japanese produced animation. American shows animated in Japan ( Transformers, G.I. Joe, some animated Batman movies, the Animatrix, ) , are also considered Anime, despite the American influence, because they are drawn in full by Japanese animation teams. The term can be extended to include animation from other Asian countries, as well, but that is debatable.

Actually, he was right. Any animated show, in Japan, is referred to as anime. Even Simpsons. Outside of Japan, however, the word usually only refers Japanese animation.

Personally, I don't consider Transformers 'anime'. Except...you know...the Japanese series'. Long story short, the word is used pretty unofficially outside of Japan, so fans don't always agree on what it should mean. Which just gets confusing.

[JulieYBM]

Respect is a two-way street, similarly so is discussion. If a group of nerds on the interwebs are being douche bags to another group of nerds who are trying to provide a solid legitimate argument, than it's obvious somebody is not on the internet to have a discussion, but rather be a douche bag because they can't get away with being the scum of civilization in their real (and likely non-existent) real life.

[MCDaveG]

I don't consider direct to west animation from Japan as anime, since the story and lot fo things is developed from the begining to western audience.

I like for example Afro-Samurai, but for me it's US cartoon, it's mad killing spree with original US voice autors (my favorite S. L. Jackson) and US soundtrack and it's for older western audience.....
Here goes for me that mentioned Batman: Gotham Knight and mentioned Animatrix, because these works are motion pictures or TV series only using graphic or art style and animation used in Japanese shows and movies.

by logic of samuraigundam, we can also consider Thundercats or Silverhawks as anime, because there were involved people from in these days infamous Chibli Studio, when it didn't existed yet.

[Adamant]

Or we could just call it all "cartoons" and ignore the entire labeling problem altogether. It's not like the term ever made sense in the first place.
What do we call US cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call British cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call French cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Russian cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Chinese cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Japanese cartoons? ..."Anime".
Really, how did this practice even start in the first place? All it generally brought with it is heaps of weirdos with superiority complexes declaring that "anime" is better than simple "cartoons", and must absolutely not be referred to as such.

[Bussani]

Or we could just call it all "cartoons" and ignore the entire labeling problem altogether. It's not like the term ever made sense in the first place.
What do we call US cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call British cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call French cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Russian cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Chinese cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Japanese cartoons? ..."Anime".
Really, how did this practice even start in the first place? All it generally brought with it is heaps of weirdos with superiority complexes declaring that "anime" is better than simple "cartoons", and must absolutely not be referred to as such.

If you could get everyone in the world to agree to just call them cartoons, then yeah. But as it stands, if I called an 'anime' a 'cartoon', I can guarantee 500 people would call me out on it and try to correct me. I don't want to have to explain what I mean every single time. That's why I use 'Japanese animation' if I want to be really clear...

[Taku128]

Or we could just call it all "cartoons" and ignore the entire labeling problem altogether. It's not like the term ever made sense in the first place.
What do we call US cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call British cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call French cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Russian cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Chinese cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Japanese cartoons? ..."Anime".
Really, how did this practice even start in the first place? All it generally brought with it is heaps of weirdos with superiority complexes declaring that "anime" is better than simple "cartoons", and must absolutely not be referred to as such.

If you could get everyone in the world to agree to just call them cartoons, then yeah. But as it stands, if I called an 'anime' a 'cartoon', I can guarantee 500 people would call me out on it and try to correct me. I don't want to have to explain what I mean every single time. That's why I use 'Japanese animation' if I want to be really clear...

But you need to spread the knowledge that anime is Japanese for cartoon around! That way eventually you won't have to explain why you say cartoon instead of anime.

[Hellspawn28]

I have watch and finish the series like three or four times before, and same with the Manga. I don't see the big deal with people making a issue about it.

[Velasa]

The reason people don't call them just 'cartoons' is because no one effing respects animation in this country, so fans feel the need to use another term to defend their interest. (For a similar case, see silkscreen vs serigraph). Now, I have no problem with using a country's word for something they made, but it is odd at the same time that very few other countries get that treatment for animation.

[fig404]

Or we could just call it all "cartoons" and ignore the entire labeling problem altogether. It's not like the term ever made sense in the first place.
What do we call US cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call British cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call French cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Russian cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Chinese cartoons? "Cartoons".
What do we call Japanese cartoons? ..."Anime".
Really, how did this practice even start in the first place? All it generally brought with it is heaps of weirdos with superiority complexes declaring that "anime" is better than simple "cartoons", and must absolutely not be referred to as such.

This is now my sig.

[samuraigundam]

I'm going to have to disagree with you. Western animated series in Japan are not considered Anime. The term " Anime " specifically refers to Japanese produced animation. American shows animated in Japan ( Transformers, G.I. Joe, some animated Batman movies, the Animatrix, ) , are also considered Anime, despite the American influence, because they are drawn in full by Japanese animation teams. The term can be extended to include animation from other Asian countries, as well, but that is debatable.

Actually, he was right. Any animated show, in Japan, is referred to as anime. Even Simpsons. Outside of Japan, however, the word usually only refers Japanese animation.

Personally, I don't consider Transformers 'anime'. Except...you know...the Japanese series'. Long story short, the word is used pretty unofficially outside of Japan, so fans don't always agree on what it should mean. Which just gets confusing.

I think I made a mistake in the way I wrote that post. What I meant to say is that the Japanese dont regard foreign animation in the same way they do animation produced in their own country, and I used the term " Anime " to refer to Japans particular style of animation. Sorry about that.

I do consider Anime to be any animation produced in Japan, despite foreign influences on overall plot and character development. Transformers, and G.I. joe were animated by Toei, as their distributor, Sunbow, only began animating in - house in the early ninties.

[Rocketman]

...Why would we call British cartoons anything but cartoons?

[samuraigundam]

I don't consider direct to west animation from Japan as anime, since the story and lot fo things is developed from the begining to western audience.

I like for example Afro-Samurai, but for me it's US cartoon, it's mad killing spree with original US voice autors (my favorite S. L. Jackson) and US soundtrack and it's for older western audience.....
Here goes for me that mentioned Batman: Gotham Knight and mentioned Animatrix, because these works are motion pictures or TV series only using graphic or art style and animation used in Japanese shows and movies.

by logic of samuraigundam, we can also consider Thundercats or Silverhawks as anime, because there were involved people from in these days infamous Chibli Studio, when it didn't existed yet.

Like I said above, I consider Anime to be any animation produced in Japan, despite foreign influences on overall plot and character development. Transformers and G.I. joe were animated by Toei, as their U.S. distributor, Sunbow, only began animating in - house in the early ninties. And since Thundercats and Silverhawks animation was produced completely by a Japanese animation studio, they are technically Japanese animation, as are Afro - Samurai, the Animatrix, and Gotham Knight. Particularly Afro - Samurai, which was first a Manga series. Though, I have always hated Thundercats.

I do not consider animation and art that copies the Anime art style, and originates from non - Japanese animators and artists, to be Anime in any way.

[TripleRach]

Like I said above, I consider Anime to be any animation produced in Japan, despite foreign influences on overall plot and character development. Transformers and G.I. joe were animated by Toei, as their U.S. distributor, Sunbow, only began animating in - house in the early ninties. And since Thundercats and Silverhawks animation was produced completely by a Japanese animation studio, they are technically Japanese animation, as are Afro - Samurai, the Animatrix, and Gotham Knight. Particularly Afro - Samurai, which was first a Manga series. Though, I have always hated Thundercats.

I do not consider animation and art that copies the Anime art style, and originates from non - Japanese animators and artists, to be Anime in any way.

"Foreign influences"? The core production and creative team for a cartoon are far more important than that. Even if the grunt animation for Transformers or ThunderCats or whatever is done in Japan, it doesn't suddenly make them purely Japanese products just because of one part of the production process originated there.

Also, Japan doesn't even do all its own grunt animation. They frequently shop that out to other Asian countries, like Korea and the Philippines. Kai has at least some of its touch up work done in the Philippines, so by your logic, that would make it a Filipino cartoon instead of Japanese.