The Merits of Dragonball GT

[Rocketman]

GT has really neat ideas (well, not the Super 17 arc, that was pretty dumb), I absolutely love the Evil Dragons concept, and I like everybody's new designs.

If it would just stop sucking Goku's dick for five goddamn minutes I'd have a better attitude about it.


It's not that Toriyama didn't write it, it's that it's poorly written, period.

It's not that GT has plotholes at all, it's that it's absolutely riddled with them to a degree never seen in DB or Z. The entire series is based on a plothole, you can't get worse than that.

It's not that Goku's the hero, it's that nobody else ever gets to do anything but get fucked up with no effort by the villain OR stand around cheering on Goku. Hey, there's seven evil dragons and seven heroes...nah, let's just have Godku do it all!

It's not that strengths get mixed up sometimes, it's that there doesn't seem to be any consistency whatsoever. One episode Rildo is stronger than Buu and is basically invincible because he IS the planet and overpowers Super Saiyan Goku, then a bit later he's killed by offhand shots from the heroes in base.

[SonEric84]

It's not that Goku's the hero, it's that nobody else ever gets to do anything but get fucked up with no effort by the villain OR stand around cheering on Goku. Hey, there's seven evil dragons and seven heroes...nah, let's just have Godku do it all!

I also hated their excuse for that. "Well, you're the only one who can handle this!" Overall though, I enjoyed GT...but I just think of it as a side story. I do have to say that the last episode sure beats the crap out of Z's ending though.

[NeoKING]

It's not that strengths get mixed up sometimes, it's that there doesn't seem to be any consistency whatsoever. One episode Rildo is stronger than Buu and is basically invincible because he IS the planet and overpowers Super Saiyan Goku, then a bit later he's killed by offhand shots from the heroes in base.

This is just stupid. I always felt that people who used this excuse never really watched the series but skimmed through it. It's as if no one realized that it was explicitly shown that that Rildo who attempted to stop the heroes spaceship from leaving M2 was nothing but a shell possessed by an immature Baby. That's why he did nothing but grab the ship instead of actually turning it into metal. Is that really so hard to see? Really? It was not the real General Rildo. Also, I dunno if this counts, but it is shown repeatedly throughout the Goku vs. Rildo fight that Rildo is extremely weak to Ki-based attacks and much better in hand-to-hand combat - he even lampshades this in the Blue Water dub. The beginning of episode 20 is proof of this.

[The Time Traveller]

People still use Rildo? Even if it looks and sounds like Dildo?

[NeoKING]

People still use Rildo? Even if it looks and sounds like Dildo?

Well, I don't really think about that when I spell it that way, so whatever rows your boat, lol.

[Vegeta Jr]

The only redeemable aspect of GT is that it is now 100% none canon and those who say Akira gave character designs (which he did) to say it has some sort of backing can go play Dragonball Online, the real continuation of Z.

On a more technical level I did thoroughly enjoy the music and the colour pallete of the series, but that's about it. Completely reused characters and plot points and the absolute ridiculous amounts of plot holes and inconsistencies just makes it out as a really bad fanfic.

The villains were terrible. Bebi had a damn cool design as his normal self but then he goes invading people like Garlic jr, totally unoriginal and again people hate the Saiyans, we got that impression after the entire Namek/Freeza saga.
Super 17 makes no sense, 17 wasn't evil anymore and he's a cyborg not an android so how could a machine control him and why did he keep calling 18 his best friend and they belonged together yet not his sister.
The Dragons were either fat and stupid or looked nothing like Dragons. Props to the Idea that the use of Dragon Balls has detrimental effects though as the Elder Kai foreshadowed in Z but was completely ignored.

[Rocketman]

The only redeemable aspect of GT is that it is now 100% none canon and those who say Akira gave character designs (which he did) to say it has some sort of backing can go play Dragonball Online, the real continuation of Z.

DBGT has some redeeming qualities. DBO is complete shit.

[Rory]

The only redeemable aspect of GT is that it is now 100% none canon and those who say Akira gave character designs (which he did) to say it has some sort of backing can go play Dragonball Online, the real continuation of Z.

DBGT has some redeeming qualities. DBO is complete shit.

You'd know after playing the final version, right?

[Rocketman]

The only redeemable aspect of GT is that it is now 100% none canon and those who say Akira gave character designs (which he did) to say it has some sort of backing can go play Dragonball Online, the real continuation of Z.

DBGT has some redeeming qualities. DBO is complete shit.

You'd know after playing the final version, right? :roll:

Unless they completely redesign everything, my opinion shall not change. I have liked nothing about DBO I have heard.

[Jon Jon]

One of my friends was in the beta and I watched him play. Overall I'd say it looks like a lot of fun. The fact that Toriyama is helpign with it I find to be really awesome. I'll definitely be playing when the international english version is released.

[Cipher]

The GT vs DBO thing shouldn't even be part of this conversation. It doesn't affect GT as a series at all.

And I've said it before, but GT is anime-canon (which is why, hey, it depends on anime-only elements like the Tsufur-jin and the purifying water). DBO is manga canon, at the moment, until Toriyama has to sign off on something else or just forgets.

Also, to everyone bashing GT for being bizarre or inconsistent, and then defending DBO:

What the hell? The only thing I can possibly attribute this to is blind support of whatever Toriyama's latest backing is. You know what kind of complaints we'd get if DBO had the same status as GT? "I don't like it because the Nameks look funny." I swear, honest. That would be a community-wide justification for why DBO sucked and wasn't canon or something.

The fact that Toriyama is helpign with it I find to be really awesome.

In, like, the exact same capacity he helped with the movies and GT.

[Kid Buu]

It's not that Goku's the hero, it's that nobody else ever gets to do anything but get fucked up with no effort by the villain OR stand around cheering on Goku. Hey, there's seven evil dragons and seven heroes...nah, let's just have Godku do it all!

Yeah I wish it was more like that as well.

Pan vs Dragon #1
Uub vs Dragon #2
Gohan vs Dragon #3
#18 vs Dragon #4
Gotenks vs Dragon #5
Vegeta vs Dragon #6
Goku vs Dragon #7

That would have been my ideal list.

Edit: This is just the fight order, not which dragon they would fight.

[NeoKING]

I don't get something though. It was established in the very first episode that Goku was going to be the most important character. How? All the other fighters have settled down, like Cipher said in his post reviewing GT. Goku has been the only one fighting in all the time they've been relaxing and calming down their lives. How could you expect everyone else to get the same amount of treatment they did in Z, when in Z everyone actually was into fighting? They weren't in the same groove came GT, but Goku was, and he became so strong that the others simply couldn't catch up. That's why he was the trump card of the Goku-Pan-Trunks group, with the other two playing supporting roles.

I honestly didn't think that Goku being the one to get the most fights in all that surprising.

Yeah I wish it was more like that as well.

Pan vs Dragon #1
Uub vs Dragon #2
Gohan vs Dragon #3
#18 vs Dragon #4
Gotenks vs Dragon #5
Vegeta vs Dragon #6
Goku vs Dragon #7

That would have been my ideal list.

You'd have Pan fight Yi Xing Long? The same Yi Xing Long who was able to do a 10X Kamehameha? This list is crazy, lol.

[Kaboom]

You'd have Pan fight Yi Xing Long? The same Yi Xing Long who was able to do a 10X Kamehameha? This list is crazy, lol.

I think he was giving a fight order, not referencing the actual dragons.

[Kid Buu]

You'd have Pan fight Yi Xing Long? The same Yi Xing Long who was able to do a 10X Kamehameha? This list is crazy, lol.

I think he was giving a fight order, not referencing the actual dragons.

Yeah that was what I meant, I will edit it to make it look less confusing. Sorry about that.

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

The only redeemable aspect of GT is that it is now 100% none canon and those who say Akira gave character designs (which he did) to say it has some sort of backing can go play Dragonball Online, the real continuation of Z.

DBGT has some redeeming qualities. DBO is complete shit.

Comparing an MMORPG to an Anime series is unfair.


But story wise, I'd pick GT over DBO any day of the week.

[Rocketman]

I don't get something though. It was established in the very first episode that Goku was going to be the most important character. How? All the other fighters have settled down, like Cipher said in his post reviewing GT. Goku has been the only one fighting in all the time they've been relaxing and calming down their lives.

Vegeta settled down and stopped fighting? Bullshit.

As for the kids, Gohan still had his Mystic upgrade ten years after the Buu saga, so he doesn't need to train, and the fusion technique makes Gotenks viable even with Goten and Trunks being slackers.


And again, it's not that Goku is the most important or the main character. It's that nobody else gets to do anything. Z at its worst was never that unbalanced - Vegeta does more damage to Recoome than he does to everybody he fights in GT put together.

[NeoKING]

Vegeta settled down and stopped fighting? Bullshit.

You must'a missed the number of scenes where Vegeta is seen doing casual activities in GT that has little to no relation to fighting whatsoever. Not to mention the episode where he's shown taking Bra shopping and only fights the Son Brothers when he had to.

Face it, by the time GT kicked in, Vegeta had settled down and gotten used to the family life. Don't you think he'd also be on the ship with Goku if he hadn't?

As for the kids, Gohan still had his Mystic upgrade ten years after the Buu saga, so he doesn't need to train,

Gohan had a family and he also settled down. He wanted to be a scholar, and he went and did it... even though all his studying didn't really make him as rich as Trunks, his junior who didn't give a damn about studying as much as he did. Gohan wasn't that much of a fighter in GT either, and only fought when the situation called for it.

and the fusion technique makes Gotenks viable even with Goten and Trunks being slackers.

You know, even with fusion, it would be utterly worthless, seeing how Gotenks couldn't take out Boo - and the boys actually trained for that fight. Now imagine how a ten-year slacker Gotenks would fair against GT's "over-powered" heels; it'd be the exact same as the boys being separate.

And again, it's not that Goku is the most important or the main character. It's that nobody else gets to do anything. Z at its worst was never that unbalanced - Vegeta does more damage to Recoome than he does to everybody he fights in GT put together.

I dunno, but maybe you're exaggerating this. I mean, it's not like the other characters didn't get to fight the main bad guys. They did, it's just that they got canned because they weren't strong enough(See: Gohan/Goten/Vegeta/Trunks/Oob VS. Super #17). Even Pan got time to fight. They just didn't stretch out their fights like Z did.

In Z, it was all "Let the good guys sans Goku fight the bad guys, and make them do some crazy stuff for episodes on end, so it looks like they can ALMOST WIN, but have them lose. You know, like how we had the guys fight Nappa even though we all saw their efforts weren't worth a damn and got 'em killed? Yeah, like that."

GT just goes "Have the good guys sans Goku make an effort - because they're the good guys, they have to. But, have 'em get their shit handed to 'em at the speed of light. No foolin' around, if they can't take it, they can't take it. Time is money, and we don't have money to waste on fights where we know the good guys other than Goku are gonna lose."

But I guess I can see your point. Most people who watch GT think that everything in Z should apply to it.

But to the TC, I honestly believe that Dragon Ball GT is a very entertaining series. Just don't have your nitpicking tools at the ready and you should be fine. Remember, the key to GT is to think that the whole thing is a dream where Pilaf is still alive, Goku is a kid again, Shenron is red, the Dragon Ball stars are black, and the Japanese BGM is beautiful.

[Rocketman]

Face it, by the time GT kicked in, Vegeta had settled down and gotten used to the family life. Don't you think he'd also be on the ship with Goku if he hadn't?

Do I think Vegeta would want to spend a whole year in a confined space with Goku, especially kid Goku?


No.

GT just goes "Have the good guys sans Goku make an effort - because they're the good guys, they have to. But, have 'em get their shit handed to 'em at the speed of light. No foolin' around, if they can't take it, they can't take it. Time is money, and we don't have money to waste on fights where we know the good guys other than Goku are gonna lose.

They only know everybody but Goku is useless because they FORCE everybody but Goku to be useless! It's the same shit the movies did! "Oh, Vegeta is Goku's superior at this point? FUCK THAT! *has Vegeta be useless while Goku kicks all the ass*"

[Silver Sinspawn]

I agree with everything Cipher has said to this point.