Moments When Science Took The Day Off

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Adrian Malacoda
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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Adrian Malacoda » Fri Aug 26, 2011 1:56 am

Cipher wrote:6. Cell absorbs Android 18, gets punched through the gut and portions of his body blown off, but is later capable of spitting her back out whole. Because, science.

7. Cell has an exoskeleton. We know because we see it crack in several panels. So of course it makes perfect sense that he can bulk up his entire body on a whim.
Cell in general, really. It's bizarre enough that some mad genius is able to combine assorted alien and Earthling genes into some kind of humanoid cockroach monster. However, these genes somehow contain all of the fighters' various signature techniques. Cell's genes also apparently give him insight into all of his opponents' weaknesses, for example Vegeta's pride. His genes also seem to retain memories from their past lives; when Cell was using Freeza's energy disc attack against Goku, he (at least in the American dub) cheerfully told Goku that Freeza's genes warned Cell against being hit by his discs.

The more plausible explanation would be that Cell got all this information from Dr. Gero's spy robot, not from his genes, however, Cell is able to somehow pick up Goku's instant teleportation ability from dead blown-up Goku bits.

Cell's evolution makes no sense, too. What exactly do 17 and 18 have that Cell needs? The explanation I remember involved him needing their infinite energy reactors, but this makes no sense. First of all, Cell is a completely biological creature (despite the American dub referring to him as an android) and he shows no signs of becoming the least bit mechanical after absorbing either cyborg. Even if that were the case, Cell himself doesn't ever seem to have infinite energy in the same way the cyborgs do. Besides, if it were the reactors Cell was after, why didn't Gero just give them to Cell? Were 17 and 18 designed from the very beginning to be absorbed by Cell? Perhaps Cell was created for the express purpose of taking revenge on the cyborgs for their betrayal?

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Bussani
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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Bussani » Fri Aug 26, 2011 2:07 am

Adrian Malacoda wrote:however, Cell is able to somehow pick up Goku's instant teleportation ability from dead blown-up Goku bits.
I don't remember that explanation being in the manga. He just learned it from watching Goku--and perhaps gained some insight from actually being teleported himself.
Cell's evolution makes no sense, too. What exactly do 17 and 18 have that Cell needs? The explanation I remember involved him needing their infinite energy reactors, but this makes no sense. First of all, Cell is a completely biological creature (despite the American dub referring to him as an android) and he shows no signs of becoming the least bit mechanical after absorbing either cyborg. Even if that were the case, Cell himself doesn't ever seem to have infinite energy in the same way the cyborgs do. Besides, if it were the reactors Cell was after, why didn't Gero just give them to Cell? Were 17 and 18 designed from the very beginning to be absorbed by Cell? Perhaps Cell was created for the express purpose of taking revenge on the cyborgs for their betrayal?
I don't think it ever specifically says he needs their reactors, but if he did, I guess it would just be to initiate the evolution itself. He uses ki, after all, not the unnamed energy the two androids throw about. As for not becoming the least bit mechanical, Bulma did say the reason Cell can merge with #17 and #18 is that they're both still mostly human, just with some "bio-organic components"--whatever that means!

I've always wondered whether Gero was the one to come up with the idea of Cell absorbing the two androids. He says he left the project to his computer pretty early on because it would take too long and went on to work on other things; maybe it was his computer that calculated it could make Cell "perfect" by having him absorb Gero's other creations.
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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by ManyFaces » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:02 am

Science is hurled out the window two minutes into Dragon Ball, so the small/obvious disregard to logic doesn't bother me much now, now that I'm so use to it. But it did annoy me in its TV run; I eventually recognized it as Mystical Adventure, a fantasy world where our rules don't apply and now I'm able to appreciate the series more.

What does bother me, though, is when the characters state something yet is ignored later on. A perfect example of that is, as you stated, when characters are able to breathe in space even though it's been said they can't time and time again. Annoying...

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Rocketman » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:30 am

Cipher wrote:3. Goku's spaceship has a gravity machine period, despite being the size of a large room. Furthermore, Vegeta can crank his gravity machine up to 400G in Capsule Corps' backyard without affecting anything outside the ship.
Or inside the ship. Increasing the gravity should pull the air down into a dense blanket hugging the floor.

Blood is affected by gravity too. When Goku activated his machine and went from 10x to 20x, that should have yanked his blood down, at the very least bursting blood vessels in his feet and legs and causing him to faint.

10. Namek's three suns. Maybe someone more adept at astronomy/physics can correct me, but I'm pretty sure there's no way for this to happen. Also, Namek would be hot and dry as fuck.
Triple star systems, yes.

Triple star system with a planet, sure.

Triple star system with a planet that never has night...ehhh. Maybe, if the planet kinda balances between the stars' gravity, or with a certain orbital configuration. It'd be a bitch to figure out, but it could probably happen.

Triple star system with a planet that never has night but is also lush and wet and has large Earth-like oceans, no. A big fat no. A planet that never has night is a planet that never gets a respite from the constant blast of energy from its suns. Hell, Venus and Mars couldn't hold on to their oceans and they have the same Sun we do.



Another one: regular humans are moved to Planet Tuffle/Tsfrui in GT without being crushed by its ten times gravity.

And of course, the utter silliness of a planet having gravity ten times stronger than Earth's in the first place.

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Piccolo Daimao » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:00 am

What about Freeza apparently detonating Namek's core and the planet then exploding on its own? I think I read a post here a while ago explaining how that was pretty much impossible.

Not to mention Cell having his head blown off by Goku's Kamehameha, yet still being able to regenerate from "only his nucleus" later on.

Then there's both Goku and Raditz, after having had a hole blown through their oesophagi by Piccolo's Makankosappo, still being able to talk afterwards.

Furthermore, Roshi and Piccolo destroying Earth's moon and no environmental side-effects ever being shown.
Holden Caulfield in [b][i]The Catcher in the Rye[/i][/b] wrote:I hope to hell when I do die somebody has sense enough to just dump me in the river or something. Anything except sticking me in a goddam cemetery. People coming and putting a bunch of flowers on your stomach on Sunday, and all that crap. Who wants flowers when you're dead? Nobody.

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Fox666 » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:05 am

Piccolo Daimao wrote:Not to mention Cell having his head blown off by Goku's Kamehameha, yet still being able to regenerate from "only his nucleus" later on.
That is a plot-hole, not a scientific impossibility...
Bussani wrote:I've always wondered whether Gero was the one to come up with the idea of Cell absorbing the two androids. He says he left the project to his computer pretty early on because it would take too long and went on to work on other things; maybe it was his computer that calculated it could make Cell "perfect" by having him absorb Gero's other creations.
Not really. No.17 and 18 were created to be absorbed for Cell.
Last edited by Fox666 on Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by dbgtFO » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:07 am

Piccolo Daimao wrote:Not to mention Cell having his head blown off by Goku's Kamehameha, yet still being able to regenerate from "only his nucleus" later on.
Well if you're going to argue that Cell regenerating against Goku is a plothole/inconsistency, you might as well argue that Cell regenerating from his Self Destruction also is, because his head was blown up in both cases.

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Piccolo Daimao » Fri Aug 26, 2011 8:46 am

dbgtFO wrote:
Piccolo Daimao wrote:Not to mention Cell having his head blown off by Goku's Kamehameha, yet still being able to regenerate from "only his nucleus" later on.
Well if you're going to argue that Cell regenerating against Goku is a plothole/inconsistency, you might as well argue that Cell regenerating from his Self Destruction also is, because his head was blown up in both cases.
Either way. Plothole, scientific impossibility, whatever. I just thought I should point it out.
Holden Caulfield in [b][i]The Catcher in the Rye[/i][/b] wrote:I hope to hell when I do die somebody has sense enough to just dump me in the river or something. Anything except sticking me in a goddam cemetery. People coming and putting a bunch of flowers on your stomach on Sunday, and all that crap. Who wants flowers when you're dead? Nobody.

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Bussani » Fri Aug 26, 2011 9:10 am

Piccolo Daimao wrote:What about Freeza apparently detonating Namek's core and the planet then exploding on its own? I think I read a post here a while ago explaining how that was pretty much impossible.
Very much so. What does detonating Namek's core even mean? Where does the core go? You can't just turn a big chunk of molten metal into nothingness--and even if you could, why would that nothingness then blow up? The only explanation is something like...I don't know...Freeza's attack consumed the core and turned into a time bomb for some reason. Which also for some reason kept the planet from imploding.
Fox666 wrote:Not really. No.17 and 18 were created to be absorbed for Cell.
Does it actually say that anywhere? Please let me know if so; then I can stop wondering about it all the time.
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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Michsi » Fri Aug 26, 2011 11:12 am

Bussani wrote:Very much so. What does detonating Namek's core even mean? Where does the core go? You can't just turn a big chunk of molten metal into nothingness--and even if you could, why would that nothingness then blow up? The only explanation is something like...I don't know...Freeza's attack consumed the core and turned into a time bomb for some reason. Which also for some reason kept the planet from imploding.
I don't have enough knowledge regarding this to back it up, but I always assumed he simply destroyed the core and it threw off the plantes internal structure brutally.
Does it actually say that anywhere? Please let me know if so; then I can stop wondering about it all the time.
Aren't 17 and 18 one of his latest models? IIrc Gero first started with Cell but gave up and went back to robots. Or wasn't it like this?

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Rocketman » Fri Aug 26, 2011 3:05 pm

Michsi wrote:I don't have enough knowledge regarding this to back it up, but I always assumed he simply destroyed the core and it threw off the plantes internal structure brutally.
A planet's core is its internal structure.

Basically, one of two things should have happened. Either:

1. Namek's core is somehow completely obliterated, causing the planet to collapse in on itself immediately.

or 2. the core explodes, ripping apart the planet immediately.

There is no way to get the result in DBZ.

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Re: Moments When Science Took The Day Off

Post by Godo » Fri Aug 26, 2011 5:23 pm

Michsi wrote: Aren't 17 and 18 one of his latest models? IIrc Gero first started with Cell but gave up and went back to robots. Or wasn't it like this?
My explanation: The computer slowly took over parts of Dr. Gero's mind and gave him the idea to create #18 and #17. That's why they were uncontrollable, since Dr Gero's goals didn't go hand in hand with the computer's. It was only when Dr. Gero and the computer were destroyed when things really started to go downhill and Cell had to find the cyborgs on his own. Of course, it worked out since the computer had already figured that possibility out.
After Dr. Gero was killed, it transferred itself into his calm and peaceful vessel, Android #16. He made him intentionally peaceful so that his vessel couldn't be harmed. By letting him fight Cell he could easily make Cell's absorption of #17 possible, because he feared the too soon arrival of Tenshinhan into the battle.
This succeeded of course, and after #16 was transferred into Capsule Corps's lab, he became one with their system, sending bits of himself into space, creating Bebi as a backup plan, should Cell come to lose against the Earthlings. And that's also why Raichi looks so darn much like Dr. Gero (Super #17 was also a creation of the computer). The computer doesn't create things anew. It takes things it knows and DNA that has already been created to make them all into something else altogether.
And even now, it is sending it's waves throughout space, creating new villains for Goku and the others to fight against.
In a way, it has become just like the creatures it hated, feeling blood lust and looking forward to more fights and challenges...

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