Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by kei17 » Sat Dec 10, 2011 1:47 am

TheBlackPaladin wrote:I wouldn't call it "bad." It's just not...memorable. To me, anyway. It's a little too subdued to add any kind of emotional power to the scenes. Not that subtle music is a bad thing in and of itself, I just don't think it meshes particularly well with DBZ.
Agreed. It would go well with live-action movies, but not anime, particularly DBZ. DBZ needs more catchy and powerful melodies with trumpets and strings.

Pokewhiz7 wrote: Here's a good one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eX4Gk5imn8
I like that one as a general piece of music, not as DBZ music.

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Codarik » Sat Dec 10, 2011 2:42 am

@xzero

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Frj259bl0wY (Skip to 3:01) Emotion. Made that piece sad and depressing, which is exactly what this scene is about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS3tuW1Ugho Of the few action themes he made, this is the best. The heavy beat totally went well with what was going on. Made it seem like Vegeta was fighting for his life, again which was what this scene was about. Kikuchi's music for this scene was very unfitting, personally.

I emailed Johnson a couple times a few years back. He said he put everything into his music and loved scoring DBZ. I know you said it sounded like he wasn't trying but he was.

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by penguintruth » Sat Dec 10, 2011 4:03 pm

I like Johnson's stuff more than Faulconer's, anyway. The music doesn't overstep its boundaries.
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.


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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by dbboxkaifan » Sat Dec 10, 2011 4:28 pm

penguintruth wrote:I like Johnson's stuff more than Faulconer's, anyway. The music doesn't overstep its boundaries.
Agreed, plus it doesn't sound repetitive (from what I've seen on YouTube / elsewhere) as Faulconer's music is to me.
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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Fionordequester » Sat Dec 10, 2011 9:51 pm

What exactly HAVE you seen on Youtube and these other places though?
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by DragonBoxZTheMovies » Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:18 pm

His work for the first three DBZ movies as well as the Ultimate Uncut' stuff was pretty forgettable and bland. There were a few good pieces here and there but for the most part it sounded like constant droning that was there to hide the forced voice acting.
His work for DBZ movies 12 and 13 was a completely different story however. Both were very memorable scores that had good range and fit the scenes they were composed for well. Big Kikuchi fans may not enjoy the overly loud rock style of movie 12 but the orchestral approach he had with movie 13 maybe a bit more to their liking.

Something I find really interesting about Nathan Johnson's work is that each of his scores have very distinctive styles to them and that he can change his style beyond recognition.

Quick question, did Nathan do DBZ movie 11 as well?

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by dbboxkaifan » Sun Dec 11, 2011 8:29 pm

Fionordequester wrote:What exactly HAVE you seen on Youtube and these other places though?

1) *YouTube

2) That's my opinion and from where I heard it, I don't really need to tell you (although, I said that much already, stick with that if you want).
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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by VegettoEX » Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:05 pm

If you're not going to properly use semicolons in place of commas where you should be doing so, you might not want to start correcting other folks' capitalization of proper nouns.
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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Codarik » Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:39 pm

DragonBoxZTheMovies wrote:Quick question, did Nathan do DBZ movie 11 as well?
No, Mark Menza composed for that one. Just a small correction, Johnson didn't compose for movie 1, that too was Menza.

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Fionordequester » Sun Dec 11, 2011 10:57 pm

1) *YouTube

2) That's my opinion and from where I heard it, I don't really need to tell you (although, I said that much already, stick with that if you want).
Well, to me, I find it important to know, because if you say, watched only Season 3 and were immediately turned off of it, or only watched the Immavideos, then I can see how you would have a bad impression of it. However, those clips and that season aren't a good representation of the dub as a whole, and in fact, there were moments where it really shined, to the point where I like that season better.

Honestly, the dub really varies in quality from time to time (although there is a point where you can usually expect something that is, in my opinion, just as good as the Japanese version), so you can't really watch a small segment of it and conclude that the rest is of the same quality. So, that's why I wanted to know. I'm not trying to start an argument that's at all negative in tone.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by DragonBoxZTheMovies » Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:39 pm

Codarik wrote:
DragonBoxZTheMovies wrote:Quick question, did Nathan do DBZ movie 11 as well?
No, Mark Menza composed for that one. Just a small correction, Johnson didn't compose for movie 1, that too was Menza.
Really? That's kinda bizarre since this was released around the time of the 'Ultimate Uncut' stuff and everything else Funimation was dubbing at the time featured Nathan's score (DBZ Movie 12 and 13). Perhaps they had finished dubbing the movie a while ago as was the case with DBZ Movie 12.

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Pokewhiz7 » Mon Dec 12, 2011 6:46 pm


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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Lord Exor » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:14 am

Codarik wrote:@xzero

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Frj259bl0wY (Skip to 3:01) Emotion. Made that piece sad and depressing, which is exactly what this scene is about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS3tuW1Ugho Of the few action themes he made, this is the best. The heavy beat totally went well with what was going on. Made it seem like Vegeta was fighting for his life, again which was what this scene was about. Kikuchi's music for this scene was very unfitting, personally.

I emailed Johnson a couple times a few years back. He said he put everything into his music and loved scoring DBZ. I know you said it sounded like he wasn't trying but he was.
You have Johnson's e-mail address? Did he ever mention releasing the score on some outlet?


As for the topic at hand; I think many of you have yet to listen to Johnson's score on a comprehensive level. Not to belittle the ears of anyone here, but I could discern several themes and leitmotifs. Even a nonentity such as Princess Snake was endowed with a macabre waltz.
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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Codarik » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:53 am

Lord Exor wrote:
Codarik wrote:@xzero

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Frj259bl0wY (Skip to 3:01) Emotion. Made that piece sad and depressing, which is exactly what this scene is about.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS3tuW1Ugho Of the few action themes he made, this is the best. The heavy beat totally went well with what was going on. Made it seem like Vegeta was fighting for his life, again which was what this scene was about. Kikuchi's music for this scene was very unfitting, personally.

I emailed Johnson a couple times a few years back. He said he put everything into his music and loved scoring DBZ. I know you said it sounded like he wasn't trying but he was.
You have Johnson's e-mail address? Did he ever mention releasing the score on some outlet?
I remember asking him if he was able to release his music in some way, he replied "Due to contract problems with FUNimation, I'm not allowed to release my music, I'm only allowed to put a few samples on my website".
Last edited by Codarik on Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:55 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Lord Exor » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:54 am

What is his website?
"My dear friend, how can I make this even more painful for you? I could crush your hands, rip off both of your ears, or maybe I'll just smash in your tiny little cranium. Ehehehehehehehe."
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—Frieza

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Codarik » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:55 am

Lord Exor wrote:What is his website?
http://homepage.mac.com/nathanmj/musicf ... isten.html

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Lord Exor » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:07 am

Thanks! It even has the full Vegeta vs. Zarbon track!
"My dear friend, how can I make this even more painful for you? I could crush your hands, rip off both of your ears, or maybe I'll just smash in your tiny little cranium. Ehehehehehehehe."
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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Codarik » Tue Dec 13, 2011 2:18 am

Lord Exor wrote:Thanks! It even has the full Vegeta vs. Zarbon track!
Hey you're welcome! "Get What's Coming" was a perfect title for the Vegeta vs Zarbon theme. I listen to it on a daily basis. :D

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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by Gonstead » Tue Dec 13, 2011 3:44 am

Pokewhiz7 wrote:This is alright also: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FN-NUkbHRk
Here's the full theme - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_4JJ3DWjtk

We should see if Johnson can release a full soundtrack for the music he did for Dragon Ball Z. I'd gladly pay for an official release.
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Re: Why was Nathan Johnson's score so underrated?

Post by penguintruth » Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:24 pm

Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.


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