Fan Ideas you Hate

[ABED]

But killing off the main character is usually the time to end the story. I have a hard time thinking of any story where having someone else takeover as the main character worked for the benefit of the story except for Creed. Even in that movie, Rocky is still given a great story, he's not just the teacher who is used for nostalgic name value.

That's another idea I dislike, having the "older" generation move aside so the newer generation can take the spotlight.

[successoroffate]

1. "Take the license away from TOEI and Give it to another company cause TOEI Sucks and this new company is doing X and Y really good."
2. "Redo Dragon Ball with One Piece or Naruto's Animation style."

[Neo-Makaiōshin]

Evil!Goku is the worst thing ever.

[Basaku]

That's another idea I dislike, having the "older" generation move aside so the newer generation can take the spotlight.

Why? Is there some rule why it's inherently wrong for this or other granchise to do so? And really, at this point most don't even wish/hope for that, just so that anyone except Goku/Vegeta can get some spotlight. Goku didn't disappear from Cell arc, he was still core part of it, but other characters got to shine some.

[Lord Beerus]

2. "Redo Dragon Ball with One Piece or Naruto's Animation style."

Um... what? That's an idea fans actually have and want to happen?

Yuck.

[ABED]

That's another idea I dislike, having the "older" generation move aside so the newer generation can take the spotlight.

Why? Is there some rule why it's inherently wrong for this or other granchise to do so? And really, at this point most don't even wish/hope for that, just so that anyone except Goku/Vegeta can get some spotlight. Goku didn't disappear from Cell arc, he was still core part of it, but other characters got to shine some.

There's no rule, but it generally doesn't work out well. In long running series, the connection between the character and the audience is so strong that it's REALLY difficult to make stories where the new main character(s) is as compelling or interesting as the original. Even in the last Star Wars, I enjoyed the new characters, but had more fun watching Han, Chewie, and Leia. I'm not averse to other characters getting chances to shine and I like when authors make great use of all of their characters, but that's not what happened in the Cell arc. Gohan got the spotlight, but I don't think he did very well under it. I think it just showed that Goku is much better suited in the main character role than his son who needed his hand held. Having the main character in the spotlight doesn't preclude other characters from getting their moment to shine. For instance, Goku was undoubtedly the main character during the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai, but Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan had so many great moments in that arc.

[fadeddreams5]

Gohan being cool or successful at fighting. It doesn't make any sense.

This isn't a fan idea. It really happened at more than one point...

That's another idea I dislike, having the "older" generation move aside so the newer generation can take the spotlight.

Why? Is there some rule why it's inherently wrong for this or other granchise to do so? And really, at this point most don't even wish/hope for that, just so that anyone except Goku/Vegeta can get some spotlight. Goku didn't disappear from Cell arc, he was still core part of it, but other characters got to shine some.

There's no rule, but it generally doesn't work out well. In long running series, the connection between the character and the audience is so strong that it's REALLY difficult to make stories where the new main character(s) is as compelling or interesting as the original. Even in the last Star Wars, I enjoyed the new characters, but had more fun watching Han, Chewie, and Leia. I'm not averse to other characters getting chances to shine and I like when authors make great use of all of their characters, but that's not what happened in the Cell arc. Gohan got the spotlight, but I don't think he did very well under it. I think it just showed that Goku is much better suited in the main character role than his son who needed his hand held. Having the main character in the spotlight doesn't preclude other characters from getting their moment to shine. For instance, Goku was undoubtedly the main character during the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai, but Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan had so many great moments in that arc.

Honestly, I feel Goku can be successfully replaced as the main protagonist. The new one just has to be really good. If this ever happened, I'd also want Goku to have a very prominent role. You mentioned Creed. That movie did a fantastic job at utilizing Rocky while passing on the torch.

The DBZ specials did not star Goku, yet are among the most beloved entries to the franchise. =P

[Basaku]

There's no rule, but it generally doesn't work out well. In long running series, the connection between the character and the audience is so strong that it's REALLY difficult to make stories where the new main character(s) is as compelling or interesting as the original. Even in the last Star Wars, I enjoyed the new characters, but had more fun watching Han, Chewie, and Leia. I'm not averse to other characters getting chances to shine and I like when authors make great use of all of their characters, but that's not what happened in the Cell arc. Gohan got the spotlight, but I don't think he did very well under it. I think it just showed that Goku is much better suited in the main character role than his son who needed his hand held. Having the main character in the spotlight doesn't preclude other characters from getting their moment to shine. For instance, Goku was undoubtedly the main character during the 22nd Tenkaichi Budokai, but Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan had so many great moments in that arc.

It definitely is a risk and often doesn't work but it CAN work well. Batman Beyond was great, american comic heroes often switch their leads succesfully, so did Star Trek in multiple TV series and I honestly enjoyed new Star Wars young leads way more than Ford, he was a distraction to me and played way too much on the nostalgia-pandering angle. Leia and Luke were nicely used, they didn't pull away from interesting new cast though.

As for Goku - I get his appeal but how long can the series ride on him? His developement ended in Cell arc, since Buu, GT and now the new era it's the same thing about him. It really isn't very captivating like it used to be in DBZ prime.

[ABED]

I think the biggest reason it successfully passed the torch from Rocky to Adonis is two-fold. 1) Rocky was an integral part of the story, not just as a trainer. He was given a great dramatic story, and 2) the actor ages so either someone has to take his place OR you end the series. With aging comes another story with the characters at another point in their life. In this case, Rocky's at an age where he has more years behind him than in front of him and he's lost pretty much everyone he's ever loved. DB isn't that. Sure the characters age, but they can be kept perpetually in their prime. I should also add that Creed is a phenomenal movie that could've easily been bad fan fiction. I've watched a lot of movies and TV, and this is the first time I can recall ever being done well. Granted, I still was more interested in Rocky, but I did grow to love Adonis almost as much. I don't think Gohan is the Adonis Johnson-Creed of Dragon Ball.

Batman Beyond was great

I think Batman Beyond was overrated. It's enjoyable, but the best part of that show by a mile is still Bruce. The Return of the Joker is the best story in that show, and the best part of the movie is the flashback.

american comic heroes often switch their leads successfully

For a time, then they go back to almost inevitably to the original. Sure there have been other Batmans but there's one true Batman - Bruce Wayne.

honestly enjoyed new Star Wars young leads way more than Ford

I disagree. I think Han was given a lot to chew on and I don't mind the nostalgia. I love Han. SW is loaded with great character and Han is at the top of the pack for me.

I get his appeal but how long can the series ride on him? His developement ended in Cell arc

There's no reason he can't still develop and I find him a much more engaging hero than Gohan in a story about fighters. I also have a preference for proactive heroes over reluctant heroes.

[Basaku]

I think Batman Beyond was overrated. It's enjoyable, but the best part of that show by a mile is still Bruce. The Return of the Joker is the best story in that show, and the best part of the movie is the flashback.

It's a perfectly resonable opinion, the point being that it was a show that was succesful enough in installing the new Batman that he could carry his solo scenes on his own. Bruce was very important to the series but Terry had his own stuff going on and the show didn't need Bruce constantly on screen to work. No one's saying Goku/Vegeta should be gone completly with literally no screentime, but right now they're clogging the attention of the show so badly no one can shine even when they actually do stuff on screen and while they're doing it, the only thing the show focuses on is "when will Goku/Vegeta be back".

For a time, then they go back to almost inevitably to the original. Sure there have been other Batmans but there's one true Batman - Bruce Wayne.

And then there are heroes like Green Lantern whose multiple incarnations seem to be equally popular.

I disagree. I think Han was given a lot to chew on and I don't mind the nostalgia. I love Han. SW is loaded with great character and Han is at the top of the pack for me.

Well for me he's one of the more overrated characters in the saga, written way too much in a way of pleasing the audience's ego and boosted by a factor of Ford's real-life success rather then the actual depth, writing and story in the 3 movies of this character. I enjoyed later parts of Han's story involvement in The Force Aweakens, it actually added some merit to this character, but the movie wastes a LOT of valuable screentime at the beginning to show Han like we've already seen him throughout the entire Original Trilogy (trying to avoid spoilers). It's kind of like never-ending recycling of Goku food jokes and leaving Chi-Chi to train. Particularly detrementing when new characters need as much screentime to get established as possible. Everyone knows what is Han/Goku are about, their tropes and iconic traits don't need long reintroductions.

There's no reason he can't still develop and I find him a much more engaging shonen hero than Gohan. I also have a preference for proactive heroes over reluctant heroes.

He could always develop more, but it's hard to believe he ever will if Toriyama already run out of ideas for him in 1993.

[ABED]

Terry had his own stuff going on

Stuff that I was never all that interested in. He's an okay protagonist, but he can't carry the series without Bruce as his mentor. Not in my opinion, anyway.

they're clogging the attention of the show

Maybe it's just the way you phrased it and didn't intend it this way, but they don't take the attention, the writers give them the spotlight. Sometimes I see commenters treating this issue as though Goku was a diva and complaining until he gets the most screen time.

And then there are heroes like Green Lantern whose multiple incarnations seem to be equally popular.

1 - That's debatable; 2 - They go back to Hal for good reason; 3 - the Green Lantern Corps is like the police, so it's not like someone has to take over someone else's spot. It's not exactly like the Slayer in Buffy.

I get your point about Han, but that isn't so much a problem with him as it is symptomatic of the entire movie. There are constant parallels and call backs to the originals, down to even having essentially a Death Star. Out of all of those things, Han is the one element I never have a problem with because Ford is a great actor and Han's a great character and he's not static either. I don't grow tired of him, and I don't grow tired of Goku. I like the running jokes about food. They're funny and they don't take up a lot of time. It's like the Joey loves food jokes in Friends; I never grew tired of them.

their tropes and iconic traits don't need long reintroductions.

They weren't with Han

Particularly detrementing when new characters need as much screentime to get established as possible.

I don't find that to be true. I felt the screen time was more than enough. I found those characters interesting and didn't need more screen time with them to understand who they were. I found them interesting (by and large) off the bat. The only character who I think could've used more screentime was Poe and that's because he left the story for a long time. I don't think any of the old cast took away valuable time from the new cast, not that I would have a problem with that because I prefer the older cast and want to see further adventures with them. If the older cast has to be short changed because the new cast "needs" more screen time to get established, the new characters probably aren't that interesting. I don't think that's the case here. The film was fairly well balanced. It just could've used more Luke and R2-D2. The new Star Wars movies are difficult to talk about because not only are we trying to avoid spoilers, we haven't seen the full story.

I don't think in DB that it's an issue of screen time, it's an issue of finding the rest of the cast something to do. It's not as much about the minutes as it is making them count. Muten Roshi and Tenshinhan's arc mattered without taking the spotlight off of Goku.

[successoroffate]

2. "Redo Dragon Ball with One Piece or Naruto's Animation style."

Um... what? That's an idea fans actually have and want to happen?

Yuck.

Yeah, Yuck is right. This ideas become popular after Super's Episode 5.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Regarding new protagonists taking over, some anime/manga franchises have been successful with that (Gurren Lagann, JJBA, Yu-Gi-Oh) so it's hardly impossible.

[ABED]

Regarding new protagonists taking over, some anime/manga franchises have been successful with that (Gurren Lagann, JJBA, Yu-Gi-Oh) so it's hardly impossible.

How far into those stories are we talking?

[ekrolo2]

I know people hate the concept of more Saiyan's being out there and this IS the thread where we voice our frustration about such ideas but what if it was done with a twist? Say, a group of Saiyan's from Planet Saiya, after escaping its destruction opted for a Vulcan lifestyle? Becoming very emotionally detached as a way to curb their species violent tendencies after seeing the destructive power of it in the form of the Original Super Saiyan?

[Polyphase Avatron]

Regarding new protagonists taking over, some anime/manga franchises have been successful with that (Gurren Lagann, JJBA, Yu-Gi-Oh) so it's hardly impossible.

How far into those stories are we talking?

A few episodes, an entire story arc, and an entire series with multiple story arcs, respectively.

[Doctor.]

I know people hate the concept of more Saiyan's being out there and this IS the thread where we voice our frustration about such ideas but what if it was done with a twist? Say, a group of Saiyan's from Planet Saiya, after escaping its destruction opted for a Vulcan lifestyle? Becoming very emotionally detached as a way to curb their species violent tendencies after seeing the destructive power of it in the form of the Original Super Saiyan?

As long as it brings something new to the lore of the series, and it's not just a rehash of the "oh no, another evil Saiyan escaped planet Vegeta's destruction" concept, then it'd be acceptable, I suppose.

[ABED]

Regarding new protagonists taking over, some anime/manga franchises have been successful with that (Gurren Lagann, JJBA, Yu-Gi-Oh) so it's hardly impossible.

How far into those stories are we talking?

A few episodes, an entire story arc, and an entire series with multiple story arcs, respectively.

I'm referring to times when series change leads after a few seasons like when when Topher Grace left That 70s Show, or Ron Howard left Happy Days, or when producers tried to replace the Dukes on The Dukes of Hazzard. The audiences grew to love those characters. If the series is only a few episodes int then it's hardly the same thing. There isn't that long term emotional investment.

I'd much rather see the writers make better use of the characters than push someone else into the main role.

[LuckyCat]

1. Make Yamcha relevant again.
2. Evil Goku
3. Brolli comes back once again.

[ABED]

1. Make Yamcha relevant again.
2. Evil Goku
3. Brolli comes back once again.

What's wrong with making Yamcha relevant?