Plot Holes

[Lord Beerus]

Dragon Ball Super produced a huge one: Vegeta becoming a Super Saiyan Blue without having to become a Super Saiyan God, which was stated to be mandatory for any user to achieve the form in the first place. Instead, Vegeta became a Super Saiyan Blue by just training. What bullshit. It's a big, fat fucking plot hole no matter what way you look at it.

[Doctor.]

Dragon Ball Super produced a huge one: Vegeta becoming a Super Saiyan Blue without having to become a Super Saiyan God, which was stated to be mandatory for any user to achieve the form in the first place. Instead, Vegeta became a Super Saiyan Blue by just training. What bullshit. It's a big, fat fucking plot hole no matter what way you look at it.

Nah, he just became a Super Saiyan God without the ritual first

[Lord Beerus]

Dragon Ball Super produced a huge one: Vegeta becoming a Super Saiyan Blue without having to become a Super Saiyan God, which was stated to be mandatory for any user to achieve the form in the first place. Instead, Vegeta became a Super Saiyan Blue by just training. What bullshit. It's a big, fat fucking plot hole no matter what way you look at it.

Nah, he just became a Super Saiyan God without the ritual first

I know Dragon Ball has had a history of breaking its own rules, but the pure lack of explanation as to how Vegeta made the leap from SSJ2 tier to SSJB tier without the use of SSJG reek of fucking laziness. The writers of Super just flat out didn't bother trying to make any sense of the scenario. It's kinda insulting.

[Roronoa-pt]

Dragon Ball Super produced a huge one: Vegeta becoming a Super Saiyan Blue without having to become a Super Saiyan God, which was stated to be mandatory for any user to achieve the form in the first place. Instead, Vegeta became a Super Saiyan Blue by just training. What bullshit. It's a big, fat fucking plot hole no matter what way you look at it.

It may not be the best explanation ever, but good ol' Whis taught Vegeta how to manage/sense KI God. Since Whis is a god being, even stronger than a God of Destruction, it makes sense ( little but better than nothing ).

[Hellspawn28]

^ Or perhaps the Pilaf Gang used the Dragon Balls to become old again and Kibito and Kaioshin fused again in between the gap between DBS and DBGT.

Pilaf and his gang wanted to be old again, they would have done it while they had the chance in ROF. Instead they wish for money and ice cream.

[Speedster]

Regeneration in Dragonball is a major plothole. Even ignoring the major inconsistencies of Piccolo dying and not dying on different occasions of the same event, here is my main gripe about it. One can get blasted away into a million pieces and regenerate as if it is nothing and totally harmless, yet a powerful punch can harm and almost kill you? How is this supposed to work? Why don't the internal organs just regenerate from the punch as fast and effortlessly as normally when you can regenerate your whole self (internally and externally)? Especially if you have infinite Ki like Buu...Why were Gohan's and Vegetto's punches harmful to Buu while when totally blasted, penetrated, cut in half etc it was a harmless child's play. Why Cell's Ki didn't drop from Vegeta's final flash that cut off his arm but dropped a lot by SSJ2 Gohan merely punching him in the stomach? Why does Ki drain more by more powerful attacks that produce far lesser body damage to the opponent who can regenerate?

Another plothole is the line of Goku telling Vegeta that they need fusion even against base Super Buu while kid Buu was implied to be stronger and Goku was on par with him. Of course you can take it that Goku was lying to Vegeta to spare his feelings. Cue to comments telling me how wrong I am in saying kid Buu>Super Buu… I am not wrong but you are entitled to your own opinion...

By the way here is a GT plohole. Piccolo had to sacrifice himself and die to get rid of the black star Dragonballs. But if the Dragon is as strong as his creator couldn't they just summon Utlimate Shenlong and kill him? Wouldn't that convert the Dragonballs into stones like when Piccolo Daimao killed Shenlong? So Piccolo's death in GT was pointless in that regard. And though he did help Goku escaping from Hell in the following saga, couldn't Goku just turn SSJ4 and as adult use instant transmission? - or at least attempt to use it and give us an explanation why it couldn't work?

[Analytic]

^ Or perhaps the Pilaf Gang used the Dragon Balls to become old again and Kibito and Kaioshin fused again in between the gap between DBS and DBGT.

Pilaf and his gang wanted to be old again, they would have done it while they had the chance in ROF. Instead they wish for money and ice cream.

They could've wanted to become older again after RF.

[Hellspawn28]

couldn't Goku just turn SSJ4 and as adult use instant transmission? - or at least attempt to use it and give us an explanation why it couldn't work?

Yeah that never made any sense to me too. Not to mention Kibitoshin could have came by and teleported Goku out of Hell. Instead they have Piccolo be used as a plot device and have him be stuck in Hell forever. Piccolo could have been living with King Kai instead. Heck, we could have got Piccolo and Paikuhan work together.

Super plot holes at the moment:

- Ginyu can use Togma's full power in his body, but yet he was unable to use Goku's full power in Goku's body a while back
- Vegeta can become a SSjG without a ritual
- Ginyu comes back to life after Buu despite being evil deep down inside
- If the Super Dragon Balls are set in space, how come Bluma did not pick them up when they where going to Namek

Some plot holes in GT that I can think of:

- Pilaf found the Black Star Dragon Dragon Balls when no one else found them for years. Bluma would have found them in the Cell or Buu saga
- Pilaf did not recognized Goku as an adult when Pilaf meet Goku as an adult at the end of DB when they try obtain the Fan on the side of a freezing mountain. Shu and Mai recognized Goku, but not him (Pilaf ask Shu on who he was)
- Chi-Chi says that Goku, Trunks and Pan have been out for nine month and they too get the Black Star Dragon Balls back before in one year. The Earth blows up after Bebi made his wish when they return them back to Earth. So won't the time reset back itself when they brought back the Black Star Dragon Balls back to Earth? Unless a whole year past again when Goku became a SSj4 or three months past since Goku return back as a SSj4. The whole thing was always confusing to me .
- Uub hears a hamlet when fighting at the Tenkachi Budokai when outside projection is not allow.
- Cell and Freeza can regen in Hell when Goku told Vegeta that he will be erase forever if he dies again. Goku was even scared that Kid Buu would blow up the Dai Kaio planet in the filler episode. GT follows filler.
- #19 and the other robots created by the RR army escape out of Hell despite being truly robotic. Last time I check, they can't go to the After Life.
- If Piccolo can open up a portal with Dende and knew how to use the whole time, how come he didn't try to do it when Buu escape from the Room of Spirit and Time instead having Gotenks rip a hole through it.
- If Uub has Buu's powers now, how come he didn't use them to help Goku and the others?
- Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr. can turn SSj despite it was mention that someone without enough Saiyan Blood can not go SSj due to the Saiyan blood being too diluted.
- Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr. can go SSj and yet Pan can't despite being much stronger than them.

[Lord Beerus]

Another plothole is the line of Goku telling Vegeta that they need fusion even against base Super Buu while kid Buu was implied to be stronger and Goku was on par with him. Of course you can take it that Goku was lying to Vegeta to spare his feelings. Cue to comments telling me how wrong I am in saying kid Buu>Super Buu… I am not wrong but you are entitled to your own opinion...

Unless you watched the FUNi dub which heavily implied Kid Buu > Super Buu, Kid Buu > Super Buu is never implied anywhere in the manga. I'm sorry, but I just can't let the notion of Kid Buu > Super Buu slide, because it's just flat out false.

[Desassina]

It's inconclusive, to say the least, but Super has handed us a few hints. It's obvious that people can only consider it canon with many layers of adaptation in between, but the series has been organized by someone close to the Daizenshuu as a means to make Kai even more faithful. In the universe made whole by the franchise's products, Kid Buu is stronger than Super Buu, but you could get picky and exclude a major part of what makes Dragon Ball great (which is another way of saying that your enjoyment ended many years ago).

[Hitiro]

Another plothole is the line of Goku telling Vegeta that they need fusion even against base Super Buu while kid Buu was implied to be stronger and Goku was on par with him. Of course you can take it that Goku was lying to Vegeta to spare his feelings. Cue to comments telling me how wrong I am in saying kid Buu>Super Buu… I am not wrong but you are entitled to your own opinion...

Unless you watched the FUNi dub which heavily implied Kid Buu > Super Buu, Kid Buu > Super Buu is never implied anywhere in the manga. I'm sorry, but I just can't let the notion of Kid Buu > Super Buu slide, because it's just flat out false.

I have no idea why people state this as fact when if you take the original source you can only make lazy and really vague conclusions as to Pure Boo > Evil Boo. We outright have a fusion character in their SSJ form being on par with at least a SSJ2 character for him to even have a hope in chance to fight against Boo. That fusion character then receives a hefty enough boost from training in the RoSaT to at least make Piccolo change his opinion of their chances. Whether they actually had a chance in base or not. That fusion also gains SSJ3 which is vastly superior to SSJ. Even without using the multipliers supplied from the databooks we would have something akin to this:

SSJ2 Goku == Majin Vegeta < Fat Boo < SSJ Gotenks < SSJ3 Goku < SSJ3 Gotenks == Evil Boo

If we were to take the databooks multipliers then it would be akin to something like this:

SSJ2 Goku : 1*100 = 100
Majin Vegeta: 1*100 = 100

Fat Boo: 250

SSJ Gotenks: 6*50 = 300

SSJ3 Goku: 1*400 = 400

SSJ3 Gotenks: 7*400 = 2,800

Evil Boo: 2,800

^In the above example SSJ3 Gotenks is 7 times more powerful than Goku!

Then we have several statements by the characters that place Evil Boo above Goku. Frankly I do not see why this is still in contention.

^ Or perhaps the Pilaf Gang used the Dragon Balls to become old again and Kibito and Kaioshin fused again in between the gap between DBS and DBGT.

Not to mention plotholes mean this conclusion of a contradiction automatically cancelling out possibilities is wrong.

Are you saying it is still possible that DBGT can follow DBS? Given everything we know I am very doubtful this is the case. Especially seeing as Goku had already reached a level where he could destroy the universe just from simple blows in DBS. In terms of scale this completely dwarfs anything in DBGT. There is also the fact that there would be no reason for Goku or Vegeta to not use their SSJB forms given how vastly superior they are to the original SSJ forms. Further from this, if for whatever reason they randomly lost their God Ki they could always do a SSJGod ritual to get that ridiculous power again. If anything it should be amplified even further given that Toriyama basically says the strength of the form is based of their original strength.

Super plot holes at the moment:

- Ginyu can use Togma's full power in his body, but yet he was unable to use Goku's full power in Goku's body a while back
- Vegeta can become a SSjG without a ritual
- Ginyu comes back to life after Buu despite being evil deep down inside
- If the Super Dragon Balls are set in space, how come Bluma did not pick them up when they where going to Namek

-Why is it a plothole that Ginyu can use Togma's full power in his body? For starters Togma is one of Freeza's men so he more than likely trained in a similar fashion to Ginyu and other soldiers in the army. Therefore they would all have a similar way to access the power. If you recall back to when Ginyu took over Goku's body he was actually surprised that he couldn't bring out Goku's power. Not even a fraction of power Goku could use without using Kaioken. So Goku, and I assume the other Z Fighters, are all unique in that regard in my opinion. Ginyu would have had the same issue with any other powerful person from Earth.
-Never is it said that it is impossible to get God Ki without the ritual. So why should this be a plothole? A plothole by its very definition is a logical inconsistency within a story. By that definition an inconsistency extends to such things as illogical or impossible events, and statements or events that contradict earlier events in the storyline. But as it was never stated or shown to be impossible to get God Ki without undergoing the ritual. Therefore it does not fall into the category.
-Yes, this is probably a plothole. I guess you could say that Porunga took liberties with the wish "Bring every one back to live except the bad guys" to mean Bobidi's men? But I would say this is a plothole.
-It is possible that Bulma's radar did not have that sort of range so of course she isn't going to pick up the Super Dragonballs. They could be anywhere in the universe. It is even possible that Champa had already collected 6 of the 7 with the one remaining dragon ball being a very difficult place to find. The fact of the matter is these Super Dragonballs are the size of really large planets. In the massive space of a universe which contains millions of planets they are not going to be that easy to find.

[Speedster]

Another plothole is the line of Goku telling Vegeta that they need fusion even against base Super Buu while kid Buu was implied to be stronger and Goku was on par with him. Of course you can take it that Goku was lying to Vegeta to spare his feelings. Cue to comments telling me how wrong I am in saying kid Buu>Super Buu… I am not wrong but you are entitled to your own opinion...

Unless you watched the FUNi dub which heavily implied Kid Buu > Super Buu, Kid Buu > Super Buu is never implied anywhere in the manga. I'm sorry, but I just can't let the notion of Kid Buu > Super Buu slide, because it's just flat out false.

You speak as if this is an English dub thing. It is in the anime, in the *Japanese* version. It is flat out stated by Goku. It is in the Japanese guidebooks of the anime too. On top of that in the anime, we had Goku versus Buutenks. It is fine if you want to believe the manga is different than the anime but don't try to present it as it is only an English dub thing that never appeared in the franchise in Japanese like something similar to the “over 9000” line.

And of course it is implied in the manga itself. If Gohan or Gotenks were stronger than kid Buu they would have been teleported there. Goku actually thought of the idea and he said they (Gohan and Gotenks) would help them (Goku and Vegeta) if they were brought there. Aka a collective effort. If kid Buu was weaker than Super Buu then Gohan alone would be able to one shot him. Besides it is the "Super Buu side" that goes out of their way to interpret the most “troublesome line” as meaning anything else but the most obvious.

In the above example SSJ3 Gotenks is 7 times more powerful than Goku!

Multipliers again? You discount the anime and focus on the manga yet you allow a different third-party material in your argument. This is a fallacy.

[Kuririn Fan]

Oh my God, here we go again...

[Zephyr]

- If the Super Dragon Balls are set in space, how come Bluma did not pick them up when they where going to Namek

I don't think that this one is necessarily a plot hole. Any Super DBs in U7 may have simply been too far away for the Dragon Radar of the Namek arc to pick up on their signals.

[Kuririn Fan]

- If the Super Dragon Balls are set in space, how come Bluma did not pick them up when they where going to Namek

I don't think that this one is necessarily a plot hole. Any Super DBs in U7 may have simply been too far away for the Dragon Radar of the Namek arc to pick up on their signals.

Bulma made new radar for super DBs, so they couldn't pick up on their signals anyway.

[Cetra]

Half of what you say is no plothole, Hellspawn. It is either just not explained or misunderstood by you.

[Hitiro]

Besides it is the "Super Buu side" that goes out of their way to interpret the most “troublesome line” as meaning anything else but the most obvious.

Most troublesome could literally mean anything. You state it as if it is obvious but if a child in a class is the most troublesome out of the bunch that does not mean that child can beat down an adult or that the child is the strongest in the class. Now does it? However. If you want to talk about obvious Goku states to Vegeta that they have no chance fighting Boo unless they fuse. That is the most obvious line in the story. Yet you choose to ignore it? So, right back at you. It is the "Pure Boo side" that goes out of their way to interpret Goku's statement as meaning anything else but the most obvious.

In the above example SSJ3 Gotenks is 7 times more powerful than Goku!

Multipliers again? You discount the anime and focus on the manga yet you allow a different third-party material in your argument. This is a fallacy.

I gave it as an example. If you check what I said before and ignore the multipliers it still comes out the same. Regardless of what you think SSJ Gotenks would have to be semi-comparable to Fat Boo otherwise we would have been told by Piccolo that it is hopeless or that the kids must go into the RoSaT to get stronger. So by attrition this fusion surpasses a SSJ2 adult. From this we can gather that if Gotenks is superior to Goku and Vegeta in their SSJ2 forms as a regular SSJ he must be superior to SSJ3 Goku in his SSJ3 form.

[Desassina]

However. If you want to talk about obvious Goku states to Vegeta that they have no chance fighting Boo unless they fuse. That is the most obvious line in the story. Yet you choose to ignore it?

You're forgetting that Goku had fusion in the back of his mind when he told Piccolo and Krillin that he couldn't beat Fat Buu, despite SSJ3 being on his arsenal. Goku doing the same with Vegeta inside of Super Buu's stomach is no different. The best conclusion is that Goku wanted to get touch-y with Vegeta, on multiple occasions, before he even considered his best transformation. You can only call his statement a fact when you consider the panels as another, when "...like this" couldn't be referring to nothing else (they were two unfused fighters at base). Otherwise, the line could be excluded to make Super Buu's strength much clearer. Let's be honest though: how willing are we to use pedantry in our favour? It's made clear in every other material.

[Hitiro]

However. If you want to talk about obvious Goku states to Vegeta that they have no chance fighting Boo unless they fuse. That is the most obvious line in the story. Yet you choose to ignore it?

You're forgetting that Goku had fusion in the back of his mind when he told Piccolo and Krillin that he couldn't beat Fat Buu, despite SSJ3 being on his arsenal. Goku doing the same with Vegeta inside of Super Buu's stomach is no different. The best conclusion is that Goku wanted to get touch-y with Vegeta, on multiple occasions, before he even considered his best transformation. You can only call his statement a fact when you consider the panels as another, when "...like this" couldn't be referring to nothing else (they were two unfused fighters at base). Otherwise, the line could be excluded to make Super Buu's strength much clearer. Let's be honest though: how willing are we to use pedantry in our favour? It's made clear in every other material.

You're forgetting that Goku was trying to hide his SSJ3 form at the time when he was talking to the other guys. And I highly doubt he had fusion in the back of his mind because his literal statement was "If Gohan or Vegeta were here then together we might be able to manage something." Goku knew the extent of Boo's power by this point so why would he still think that something couldn't have been done without resorting to SSJ3? He has no reason to hide the form now. Everybody and their mother knew of the form. Especially seeing as, as soon as Piccolo shoots him down he says he could have used fusion straight after.

Chapter: 469 (DBZ 275), P5.6-7
Goku: “Damn it! If either Vegeta or Gohan were alive, maybe we could have managed something…”
Piccolo: “…No, it probably wouldn’t matter how many people went at him…He wasn’t at that level…”

Chapter: 469 (DBZ 275), P6.1-7
Context: after Goku laments that Gohan and Vegeta are dead
Goku: “I coulda used Fusion…”
Dende: “Fusion…! Merging together, right? That’s the specialty art of the people of Planet Metamor!”
Goku: “So you know about it, Dende…! That’s right, some people from Metamor who I met in the afterlife taught me that art…It’s a merging technique which can only be performed if two people are fairly close in both power and body size…In other words, by having two people merge into one, they’re able to become a single, new human with amazing power which either of them on their own absolutely wouldn’t be capable of. It really is incredible! Those two from Metamor were completely weak and gentle on their own, but by using Fusion they transformed into a substantial warrior! [ ] …I was just taught the art, but I ain’t never tested it out…There wasn’t anybody on par with me in the afterlife…”

[Desassina]

Having something in the back of his mind means to... No, wait! I'm not going to do a roundabout. Was I not right in using the word pedantry? I'll just stick to the anime, as unfaithful and full of filth as it should be. I'm sorry that I even continued this argument. Move along...