Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 93 - Official Discussion Thread

[TheWayofPie]

Hopefully when Vegeta explains Jiren’s tactic Goku says “Oh yeah! Like when I was fighting those Ginyu guys!

Because thats exactly what Goku was doing against Jiece and Burter

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Hopefully when Vegeta explains Jiren’s tactic Goku says “Oh yeah! Like when I was fighting those Ginyu guys!

Because thats exactly what Goku was doing against Jiece and Burter

Nah it’s better not. It will just make them look dumb for not noticing earlier.

And Jiren’s technique does seem very different from that. Goku was just saving energy, the movie makes it the secret of Jiren’s power.

[Magnificent Ponta]

Moving off discussion of that line for just a moment, it's nice to see Toyotarou get the opportunity to put his own spin on telling the events of Broly in a little more detail (though this thereby becomes, curiously, a movie recap inside a movie recap). But it's also interesting to see, within that, that Toyotarou doubles down on a couple of differences that were implied by his previous opportunities to briefly recap events, and introduces a few more by collapsing the plot beats:

• Goku and Vegeta seem to fight Broly together as their basic approach. They're never shown not doing it in any Manga retelling, and this particular recap doubles down by implying that they even do it together from the earliest stages in Base form, rather than in taking turns throughout as occurs in the movie (with the exception of the tiny sequence where they fight together in SSjB, before they escape and leave Broly with Freeza);
• All characters somehow seem to escalate their forms more quickly than in the movie - Goku and Vegeta are regularly shown fighting Broly together in SSjB as standard (in Vegeta's case, before his armour gets trashed - actually, this doesn't happen at all in the manga, unlike in the movie. There's a small inconsistency for Goku, though, whose clothes already seem to be trashed while fighting Base Broly as in the movie, though they're intact in the previous manga recaps even against SSj Broly); here, Broly also sheds his armour and seems to go further into what looks like his Full-powered SSj form already while fighting SSjB Goku and Vegeta, rather than in the movie, where he only does it while fighting Gogeta;
• As an interesting extra note, Paragus's dialogue with Freeza seems to be collapsed into a single exchange - rather than saying Broly has hit his limit against SSjB Goku, as in the movie, he worries instead that he'll snap and go berserk (this is the drift of his dialogue much earlier, during the fight with SSjG Vegeta, in the movie - and of course Broly does it a bunch in the movie before he gets anywhere near SSj), which points to a briefer and more intensive exchange with a single major rage event that also sends Broly into SSj.

No doubt a lot of the difference is just for efficiency in running the most important beats of the story for re-introducing Broly's background, but it's still interesting to see.

Also interesting to see that the manga adopts the very specific number of 41 years for Broly and Paragus being stranded on Vampa, but doesn't necessarily hook it to the exact same timescale as the movie (what with the "5 years later" bit, and all). Opens the way for the 'past' events of Broly to all take place in AGE 739, with the 'present day' events in AGE 780, maybe (though then again, maybe not, since Vegeta seems to be in an incubator in the recap, as in the movie, which would move those events back again). Still, I think it's the most specific dating detail the manga has used of any event thus far (i.e., not a round number susceptible of generalised interpretation, like the "More than 10 years" since Cell, or the "40 years" of the Granolah arc).

[Hellspawn28]

The DBS manga is still . I feel like it’s 2015 all over again.

[FortuneSSJ]

Good move from Toyo in introducing DBS Broly to manga readers. It's a recap like that DBS anime should haven done with the movies. Not retelling everything.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

That line about Broly and Paragus being on Vampa for exactly 41 years is so weird. Kind of embarassing that they tried using a specific number that’s way off the mark.

[Yuji]

That line about Broly and Paragus being on Vampa for exactly 41 years is so weird. Kind of embarassing that they tried using a specific number that’s way off the mark.

I'm sure that's the timeframe used in the movie as well.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

That line about Broly and Paragus being on Vampa for exactly 41 years is so weird. Kind of embarassing that they tried using a specific number that’s way off the mark.

I'm sure that's the timeframe used in the movie as well.

I think the movie only says it’s 5 years between the exile and Planet Vegeta’s destruction. Going by the manga, it’s only 1 year difference.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Just saw the 41 years statement on the official website, though I don’t remember it in the movie. Alway thought it was 41 years between Planet Vegeta’s destruction and the movie, it makes way more sense.

780 - 41 = 739, the year most people agree on for the events of Jaco’s manga.

Unless the exile and the planet’s destruction are being lumped together now, but it’s weird Broly was still in incubation when Vegeta was already out fighting.

[Omori]

This 41 year line is still a weird mistake, which I also would have expected to be fixed by Toyotarou.
Or at least keeping it ambiguous with something like "more than 40 years".

780 - 41 = 739, the year most people agree on for the events of Jaco’s manga.

That's why it probably should have been "46 years ago" and then "5 years later".

Future guidebooks will have some fun with that

[GreatSaiyaman123]

A couple pages have leaked here and there.

Spoiler:

The rest of Goku and Vegeta’s conversation. Vegeta mentions they’ve hit their limits and have to train their minds now. I like they haven’t abandoned this point, but it feels weird that Goku has to be told that. Goku always knows when he hit his limits.

The translation seems to be faulty, but Vegeta seems to imply Jiren, Broly Moro, and Gas all had the perfect Ki control? Maybe Moro and Gas, but Broly definitely doesn’t. The syntax is weird so I think the translation is off.

The chapter ends with Piccolo leaving to kidnap Pan, as I predicted.

[Yuji]

A couple pages have leaked here and there.

Spoiler:

The rest of Goku and Vegeta’s conversation. Vegeta mentions they’ve hit their limits and have to train their minds now. I like they haven’t abandoned this point, but it feels weird that Goku has to be told that. Goku always knows when he hit his limits.

The translation seems to be faulty, but Vegeta seems to imply Jiren, Broly Moro, and Gas all had the perfect Ki control? Maybe Moro and Gas, but Broly definitely doesn’t. The syntax is weird so I think the translation is off.

The chapter ends with Piccolo leaving to kidnap Pan, as I predicted.

Even Moro and Gas don't make much sense either. It was a plot point that both Gas and Moro didn't train as hard and didn't have a good grasp on their abilities as well as Goku and Vegeta. I'll wait for Viz but it seems like Toyotaro just tried to shoehorn all the previous antagonists into the movie's dialogue for the sake of continuity. In the movie, they just mention Jiren, which makes sense since he's portrayed as an extremely skilled martial artist consistently.

I think there's only so much Toyotarou can do to work around this scene which was obviously written before Goku and Vegeta achieved their new forms. It seems Vegeta is trying to attain UI as he basically describes the same principles, even though Goku already mastered it, and Vegeta is doing the exact opposite with UE.

[FortuneSSJ]

This retelling may actually be more than 5 chapters. I was expecting this chapter to end with Gohan vs Gamma 1 but they didn't even kidnap Pan...

I wonder how Toyotaro truly feels. Granolah arc introduced Ultra Ego Vegeta and Black Freeza and now instead of telling a new story, he's stuck with this for the next months. BOG retelling was 4 chapters and none of them had more than 20 pages... These ones have almost 50...

[PrinceVegetto]

This retelling may actually be more than 5 chapters. I was expecting this chapter to end with Gohan vs Gamma 1 but they didn't even kidnap Pan...

I wonder how Toyotaro truly feels. Granolah arc introduced Ultra Ego Vegeta and Black Freeza and now instead of telling a new story, he's stuck with this for the next months. BOG retelling was 4 chapters and none of them had more than 20 pages... These ones have almost 50...

I think they're trying to give Toriyama as much time as they can for the next arc which I believe will be big. I predict it will either tie up everything from Super to EoZ or we will go into a Black Freeza arc.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Chapters out. Not sure if spoiler tags are needed, but I’ll use then since it’s only been a few hours.

Spoiler:

Yup. Goku has officially regressed. He forgot the very stuff he would talk about every saga. And turns out every villain since Jiren had better control over their powers than the gang. What the fuck man. How and why do you take a bad scene and make it even worse. And Viz even butchers the line by having Vegeta say he and Goku were on pair with those guys. The fanslations I saw had Vegeta say Freeza and co. were just a step above.

But hey, at least we got Goku vs Vegeta, and it rocks. And come to think of it, I don’t remember Piccolo and Bulma ever interacting before… so that’s nice.

[Jack Bz]

It doesn't make sense that any characters besides Jiren had better control over their power than Goku and Vegeta. Why would Broly (who doesn't know how to fight and gets his power from fits of rage), Moro (who got strong very quickly and suddenly by stealing powers to the point where his body started to fall apart) and Gas (same deal as Moro) have better control? ESPECIALLY when Goku knows ultra instinct and they don't?

Goku got a specific and spelled out lesson that the answer isn't more power during his fight against Jiren during the tournament of power.

I understand Toyo was dealt a difficult hand to write around with this scene, but the problem wasn't that Vegeta didn't mention all the recent antagonists. The movie had enough sense to specifically mention Jiren and not Broly for that scene.

[Yuji]

Looks like there are no colour tones used for ultimate Piccolo. I wonder how Toyotaro will make the distinction in the future for when he activates the form? Just the aura?

[JulieYBM]

God, I did not like how weird, creepy and stalkerish Beers was in this chapter.

Oh hey, we might be getting Goten and Trunks fighting in costume this time...

[ATA]

I'm going to make a thread about this later but Goku being written from the audience's point of view is killing his character. Got Goku acting like a turkey ass nigga.

God, I did not like how weird, creepy and stalkerish Beers was in this chapter.

It was never acceptable but Dragon Ball still uses dated comedy. Now I'm understand Japanese social norms are different than USA's social norm(Hell USA's social norms changes depending on what CITY/State/Region you're in) but the "Male character has a crush so he can be weirdo to Female character because dummy got a crush on a lemon". He can be a weird ass nigga because "Awee Beerus got a crush".

I did think shielding her was cute in the movie and in the manga.

[nineko]

Yay, manga Gogeta.

This was a nice chapter, and I totally support Beerus + Cheelai.