Saiyan Pride

[Vegeta Jr]

...

True, I absolutely hated Vegeta during the Androids arc. After he emerges from rosat though, he didn't feel as much as a nuisance to me.

Yea but wasn't Vegeta in like 10 episodes max for the Android saga before going in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber?

[Snail]

It doesn't matter if he had a total of 5, 10, 15 episodes in total during the Android arc before rosat. The matter of the fact is that he was a jackass. His ego was at an all time high. It was annoying.

[Victator Supreme]

Yeah.... agree 100%

Vegeta in the Cell Saga, especially after RoSaT, is an entirely different (and far more nauseating) character. It's like he subsisted for a year on a diet of his own ego.

In the Freeza Saga he's using stealth, deception, and basically any tactic to win. He assaults warriors when they are weakened, from behind, or while out cold. He has himself healed to benefit from a power increase. He works with his enemies. He even threw dirt in Zarbon's eyes.

The key difference being he knew he was outmatched on Namek. Anytime he thought he had the advantage he acted like an arrogant ass. Hell he even dared Frieza to transform.

[Onikage725]

Yeah.... agree 100%

Vegeta in the Cell Saga, especially after RoSaT, is an entirely different (and far more nauseating) character. It's like he subsisted for a year on a diet of his own ego.

Well, he did become a Super Saiyan. I can buy his personality changed with becoming what he had always been told was effectively a god.

I buy it just fine. I don't think it was a poorly written change. I just think the jackass levels went a bit too high for my taste.

[Brakus]

Could this whole discussion about Saiyan pride be a metaphor for something a little more down-to-earth? It's almost like a real-life parallel to any human issue close to some people's heart: black pride, gay pride, Asian pride....

It almost seems to hit close to home for me; a friend of mine was very embarrassed that he was gay, and wanted nothing to do with it, until one of his friends explained that it's nothing to be ashamed about, and it should be something that he should embrace. I just find it intriguing that this issue raised in DBZ Season 3 could be somewhat similar to what people like my friend went through.

[Saiyavenger2941]

Could this whole discussion about Saiyan pride be a metaphor for something a little more down-to-earth? It's almost like a real-life parallel to any human issue close to some people's heart: black pride, gay pride, Asian pride....

It almost seems to hit close to home for me; a friend of mine was very embarrassed that he was gay, and wanted nothing to do with it, until one of his friends explained that it's nothing to be ashamed about, and it should be something that he should embrace. I just find it intriguing that this issue raised in DBZ Season 3 could be somewhat similar to what people like my friend went through.

That would make sense, yes, but I doubt thats the case. Toriyama isn't one to make a social commentary like that, to my knowledge.

[saiyanprincess]

Vegeta was probably putting on a front to Dodoria because he did not want to look weak or show his emotions; after Freeza is supposedly destroyed (or so they think) he has lost the one thing that fueled him all his life... to become the first Super Saiyan in (I cant remember how long; sorry) and to kill Freeza with his own hands.

He believed that Goku had achieved both and was a mere third class, so this could have gave him a slight personality change.... he just goes from being a space pirate who would do anything to win, to being someone who wants to show off and test his ever-growing strength with the next big challenge.

Hence why he did not lose his cruel sense of humor, and that he still proved he didn't care about kicking peoples' butts. (i.e. - after getting zapped from Namek he proceeded to bully Gohan and tell him he can clean his boots, and then challenged him and beat him to a pulp).

He did have a personality transformation further on, and although he was born mean, he was only really really evil because of Freeza.

[caejones]

I believe there's an editorial somewhere on Daizex that argues that the Saiyan pride thing couldreflect Japanese racism (and the author mentioned that there might have been racial tension between Toriyama and one of his overlings?).
Although I'd still question if Toriyama had such a commentary in mind (though he did say he made Vegeta the embodiment of all the people he didn't like...), there are all kinds of interesting parallels (Raditz is Goku's brother and has this glorious saiyan heritage thing... but he dies quickly and is forgotten; Raditz flips out when Goku doesn't have a tail, and yet all of the saiyans lose their tails and still become stronger than ever before; and of course, let's not forget Goku and his apathy toward the whole subject.).

... And GT went and did things that seem completely opposite to that idea (forcing the tail and saiyan pride and all of that back into the picture and religating everyone that isn't pure-blood to nobodies, although one might argue that Toriyama kinda set up for the shafting with his handling of many classic characters along with some of the major characters in the final chapters...).