Who is the strongest human?

[mrkaizoku]

Would Android 18 count after all the wires had been ripped out?

I assume the wires you're talking about are the bomb that Shenlong removes. Number 18 is still a part human part machine. So I don't think she counts in a strongest human argument.


I believe that Tenshinhan is most likely the strongest by the end of the series (if you don't count Uub). Kuririn would probably be the strongest if he'd kept up his training, but that's a moot point. All of the humans power levels seesaw back and forth for the duration of the comic. It's one of the things that make "Dragonball" really enjoyable. You never know when someone is going to whip out a new technique and shock everyone.

[djkalteraphine]

Ignoring Uub, I was going to say Kuririn, but when really thought about it, my answer came different. Assuming Tenshinhan kept up his training by the Buu saga, I would say him.

I think he got a raw deal, getting taken out in one hit. That would've been an infinitely awesome time to give Ten some time to shine before killing him off again (which would've had to happen, y'know, so Goku didn't fuse with him). I chalk it up to Toriyama wanting to end it soon, not a mark of Tenshinhan's ability.

[SSj_Rambo]

Would Android 18 count after all the wires had been ripped out?

I assume the wires you're talking about are the bomb that Shenlong removes. Number 18 is still a part human part machine. So I don't think she counts in a strongest human argument.

Yes 18 is still a human, I remember reading that that is the reason she never seems to age as well as the reason her power never changes (if she had become human she would have lost all of the strength she derives from her mechanical parts).

[Tyro]

Tenshinhan and the others arrived on King Kai's 6 days before Goku got to Namek.

Five days, actually.

Goku: "Aw, I've been there and done that! The G's I'll be putting myself through during the five days 'till I get to planet Namek make that look like nothing!"

Tenshinhan did not get revived until 280 days later.

260.

Narrator: "The Namekian dragon balls reenergize quickly, and in 130 days they summon Shenlong, the dragon lord." + "Since Chaozu and Tenshinhan want to return together, Yamcha is elected for this round of resurrection. 130 more days pass...and this time Chaozu is restored to life with the first wish and Tenshinhan with the second."

Krillin's power boost on Namek put him somewhere in the mid to upper 20,000s.

Or higher. Vegeta implies that Kuririn and Gohan are continuously getting naturally stronger.

[SSJmole]

Would Android 18 count after all the wires had been ripped out?

I assume the wires you're talking about are the bomb that Shenlong removes. Number 18 is still a part human part machine. So I don't think she counts in a strongest human argument.

One problem though , She ages , She gives birth , I think she powers up later. So anything that is robotic left can't be that much.

[Rocketman]

I think he got a raw deal, getting taken out in one hit. That would've been an infinitely awesome time to give Ten some time to shine before killing him off again (which would've had to happen, y'know, so Goku didn't fuse with him). I chalk it up to Toriyama wanting to end it soon, not a mark of Tenshinhan's ability.

One hit by Gotenks-Buu. An atomic explosion would vaporize a Spartan phalanx too.

[djkalteraphine]

I think he got a raw deal, getting taken out in one hit. That would've been an infinitely awesome time to give Ten some time to shine before killing him off again (which would've had to happen, y'know, so Goku didn't fuse with him). I chalk it up to Toriyama wanting to end it soon, not a mark of Tenshinhan's ability.

One hit by Gotenks-Buu. An atomic explosion would vaporize a Spartan phalanx too.

Because Tenshinhan's a completely normal human, right? I suppose he just sat around for seven years, did he?

[Kaboom]

Because Tenshinhan's a completely normal human, right? I suppose he just sat around for seven years, did he?

Certainly not. But matching him or any human, heck, most non-fused Saiyans, even... up against Gotenks-Buu is still like an ant versus a steamroller.

[mrkaizoku]

Would Android 18 count after all the wires had been ripped out?

I assume the wires you're talking about are the bomb that Shenlong removes. Number 18 is still a part human part machine. So I don't think she counts in a strongest human argument.

One problem though , She ages , She gives birth , I think she powers up later. So anything that is robotic left can't be that much.

You gotta remember that the only thing that Shenlong changes in her is the bomb and NOTHING ELSE. Kuririn asks Shenlong if he can turn them back into humans, and Shenlong says that it can't be done. Shenlong says that he can't change them because there power is beyond his. So Kuririn asks him to remove the bombs from them instead. So Number 18 is just as human in volume 42 as she was in volume 30.

[Super Saiyan Turlast x4]

Krillin is the strongest human in my opinion.

Krillin's power was stated to be "constantly increasing" by Vegeta, and likely could've been around 30,000 by the end of the Freeza saga. Everyone believes Tien's power is around 20,000 just becasue he was there longer, and that means absolutely nothin. He didn't learn any new skills, and after being on 10x gravity for a while, I'm pretty sure the effects for power gaining was decreased to an extent.

Tien used the Shin Ki-Ko-Ho, which is literally 300x more powerful then himself, and doesn't matter what his power level is. He also deflected Gotenks Buu's attack that was for Dende, so that doesn't matter, either. All he says when they're on the lookout after the Cell Games, is that he's going to go home to be with Chaitzu. There's no guarantee he trained for seven years, since he knew his power was useless, as stated by himself when he didn't want to train in the rosat after Piccolo.

Tien was only stronger during the early tourney battles, and the Saiyan saga of course. That's about it; Krillin surpasses him in every following saga in my opinion.

[Xyex]

One problem though , She ages , She gives birth , I think she powers up later. So anything that is robotic left can't be that much.

She doesn't age. She looks the same at the end of Z as she did when she first appeared. And giving birth has no bearing one way or the other, she was always more human than machine. The only thing the Dragon changed was to remove her bomb.

As for powering up, that's also a non-factor in this because the Androids in Trunks future could do it. They'd only fought at half power up until they killed Gohan.

Because Tenshinhan's a completely normal human, right? I suppose he just sat around for seven years, did he?

Are you implying that 7 years of training is enough for someone likely somewhere between Recoome and Ginyu in power to match the likes of Buu? By the end of the series he'd easily be the strongest human but that doesn't mean he could go toe-to-toe with the likes of even first form Freeza.

He didn't learn any new skills, and after being on 10x gravity for a while, I'm pretty sure the effects for power gaining was decreased to an extent.

1) Who says he learned nothing new? He even comments that he's going to take what he learned and apply them in his own way (advent of the Shin Kikoho I'd bet right there).

2) Sure, he's not going to gain as much strength on day 225 as he did on day 34 but that doesn't mean it's going to be completely pointless. Goku still managed to get to 8,000, after all.

Tenshinhan used the Shin Ki-Ko-Ho, which is literally 300x more powerful then himself, and doesn't matter what his power level is.

If it's literally 300x more powerful than himself then it obviously does matter what his power is. But there's no "literally" about it because it's never said how much stronger than him it is or, for that matter, if it actually has anything that could be considered a 'power level'. It may simply have the same effective 'impact force' against everyone, no matter their power.

There's no guarantee he trained for seven years,

1) Tien not training is like Goku not eating.

2) He's shown to have been training.

Tenshinhan was only stronger during the early tourney battles, and the Saiyan saga of course. That's about it; Krillin surpasses him in every following saga in my opinion.

I can buy that Krillin is stronger up to some point after the Cell Games and before Buu but during the Buu saga there's no way that Krillin's still the strongest when he's been sitting around doing nothing for the last 4-5 years while Tien's been training.

[SSJmole]

One problem though , She ages , She gives birth , I think she powers up later. So anything that is robotic left can't be that much.

She doesn't age. She looks the same at the end of Z as she did when she first appeared. And giving birth has no bearing one way or the other, she was always more human than machine. The only thing the Dragon changed was to remove her bomb.

As for powering up, that's also a non-factor in this because the Androids in Trunks future could do it. They'd only fought at half power up until they killed Gohan.

She looked older to me when she fought Goten and trunks and the tournament.

Giving birth is a factor because it means all her reproduction organs are human , The fact she eats later means digestive system is they. So if all her internal organs are human the only robotic part could be limbs ie arms and legs.

That makes her Human as would you say a man with an artificial leg was not human? No because he is. 18 in my opinion is human.

Also powering up counts. Yes in Trunk's time they could but things are diffrent in that time as for example there is no 19 , 20 or even 16. If the Androids in the main universe could power up wouldn't they have done against cell to not be absorbed? Or 17 done it to Piccolo since they were even in strength?

So I actually do count her as strongest human.

[Tyro]

2) He's shown to have been training.

Where was this shown, then?

[Victator Supreme]

Tenshinhan used the Shin Ki-Ko-Ho, which is literally 300x more powerful then himself, and doesn't matter what his power level is. He also deflected Gotenks Buu's attack that was for Dende, so that doesn't matter, either. All he says when they're on the lookout after the Cell Games, is that he's going to go home to be with Chaitzu. There's no guarantee he trained for seven years, since he knew his power was useless, as stated by himself when he didn't want to train in the rosat after Piccolo.

That makes no sense. The Kikoho is not some big gun. Its energy he generated himself. So yes it does show he is stronger. Krillan was unable to generate that type oof power at anytime.

[djkalteraphine]

Because Tenshinhan's a completely normal human, right? I suppose he just sat around for seven years, did he?

Are you implying that 7 years of training is enough for someone likely somewhere between Recoome and Ginyu in power to match the likes of Buu? By the end of the series he'd easily be the strongest human but that doesn't mean he could go toe-to-toe with the likes of even first form Freeza.

I'm not implying it, I'm saying it. Tenshinhan would've been closer to Ginyu's power when he was training with Kaio. Then he trained for the Androids and gained more power still -- being able to hold his own against a Cell Jr. as effectively as beaten Goku. And with Ten's personality, I doubt he would've eased his training regiment at all, even with peace. It wasn't his nature to stop. So yes, I do think he should've fought Buu a bit longer, surprising him and angering him, causing Buu to obliterate him. It would've worked just as well as what happened, and the only reason it didn't, as I said, Toriyama was so close to the end and he was ready to be done.

[Xyex]

Giving birth is a factor because it means all her reproduction organs are human , The fact she eats later means digestive system is they. So if all her internal organs are human the only robotic part could be limbs ie arms and legs.

Her limbs are flesh and blood too. As Bulma points out she's only got "a few mechnical parts". It's likely just this and that inserted into various areas of her body. And 18 isn't fully human, she's a Cyborg. If her implants count than so does Gohan's Saiya-jin DNA so he's the strongest human.

She looked older to me when she fought Goten and trunks and the tournament.

Nah, she looks exactly the same through to the end of Z. It's not until GT screws with everyone's designs that she changes. The simpliest way to see this by looking at Trunks future. When Trunks kills her and 17 that's at around the same time that the series ends.

Also powering up counts. Yes in Trunk's time they could but things are diffrent in that time as for example there is no 19 , 20 or even 16. If the Androids in the main universe could power up wouldn't they have done against cell to not be absorbed? Or 17 done it to Piccolo since they were even in strength?

Uh, no. Flawed logic here. You can't power up if you don't have reserve energy. The future 17 and 18 did because they were only running at half power. The ones in the series didn't because they stayed at full power. That's like saying that Freeza can't power up because he didn't power up after reaching 100% so that he could overpower Goku. So no, powering up doesn't count because all it means is that she wasn't at her full power before.

Where was this shown, then?

I believe in the manga he's simply shown to be in weighted clothing (the outfit he's wearing when he appears) though the anime gives a quick scene earlier with him and Chaotzu doing some training.

Tenshinhan would've been closer to Ginyu's power when he was training with Kaio.

Tien would have been lucky to even match Ginyu's power by the Cell Games.

It would've worked just as well as what happened, and the only reason it didn't, as I said, Toriyama was so close to the end and he was ready to be done.

Except that even first form Freeza could kill him with a finger flick. Yeah, the humans are incredibly powerful compared to everyone else in the universe with the exception of the Saiya-jins but they're not cappable of making leaps in power that exceed even what the Saiya-jins can do. But let's not forget that Ginyu was the second most power person in the entire universe until Goku, Gohan, and Vegeta started abusing Zenkais. Hell, Zenkai abuse is the only reason the Saiya-jins ever broke the 500k mark. Without that little factor the humans just aren't going to get that high.

[Velasa]

Giving birth is a factor because it means all her reproduction organs are human , The fact she eats later means digestive system is they. So if all her internal organs are human the only robotic part could be limbs ie arms and legs.

That makes her Human as would you say a man with an artificial leg was not human? No because he is. 18 in my opinion is human.

Aah, not quite. Those parts could have been well intact but all throughout her torso, her brain there could be wiring that interacts with everything and changes and enhances it. I don't remember seeing her eat- in fact I mainly remember a shot where the sayiajin are devouring food and she and Pic are leaning against the far wall looking thoroughly disinterested. With their energy limitless, it seems that her and 17 don't need to eat, but could do it on occasion for pleasure or to pass time while others are eating around them.

[Captain Awesome]

I think the reason a lot of people seem to think Tenshinhan is the strongest human, is that everyone assumes he has the same drive to become stronger that he had during Dragonball, whereas in Z, we only see a few instances of this.

The nail in the coffin for Tenshinhan, in my opinion, is the moment he wusses out on the Room of Spirit and Time, that kinda says to me he isn't the same guy we remember from Dragonball.

[Rocketman]

I'm not implying it, I'm saying it.

Then you are wrong.

Tenshinhan would've been closer to Ginyu's power when he was training with Kaio.

No. Goku trained on King Kai's for a year, trained in 100x gravity, got four or five Zenkais...and still could only top Ginyu by using the Kaioken. And Goku's a Saiyan. Tien can't get anywhere near that kind of power growth.

Then he trained for the Androids and gained more power still -- being able to hold his own against a Cell Jr. as effectively as beaten Goku.

Filler. Doesn't count. Piccolo and the humans get buttraped by the Cell Jrs.

And with Ten's personality, I doubt he would've eased his training regiment at all, even with peace. It wasn't his nature to stop. So yes, I do think he should've fought Buu a bit longer, surprising him and angering him, causing Buu to obliterate him.

Wait...you think Tien should be surprising a Buu that's been smacking Mystic Fucking Gohan around for the last half hour?

We're through the looking glass now, gentlemen.

[djkalteraphine]

Wait...you think Tenshinhan should be surprising a Buu that's been smacking Mystic Fucking Gohan around for the last half hour?

Yes.