List of plotholes in GT

Deep Thought · Post by **Deep Thought** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:25 am

What about the Dragon Balls being able to revive Kurrin for the fourth time? That was actually pretty important, too, because that's how the Dragons came to be as well.

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 2:53 am

sailorspazz · Post by **sailorspazz** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 3:53 am

The biggest plothole, from a drooling fangirl's perspective: After de-transforming from the Oozaru form, Vegeta still had clothes! He should have been naked, dammit! I saw enough of Gokuu and Gohan's little boy parts after they de-transformed, so can't they at least throw in some nice fan service for the ladies?

(OK, so I guess the Vegeta shower scenes were kind of fan servicey....but still!)

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 5:10 am

Kunzait_83 wrote:Unless I'm just not remembering it right, didn't Dende's upgrading of the Earth Dragon Balls make them like the Namekian set so that they no longer have the "one time only" limit? That makes Kuririn' 4th revival with the Earth set not all that much of a "plothole".

No, since they couldn't bring back Goku....unless you mean the upgrade between the Cell and Buu Sagas, in which case, I dunno. I don't recall it ever being mentioned.

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 6:05 am

Did you forget that Shenlong could grant three wishes instead of two in the Boo arc?

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 7:49 am

sailorspazz wrote:The biggest plothole, from a drooling fangirl's perspective: After de-transforming from the Oozaru form, Vegeta still had clothes! He should have been naked, dammit! I saw enough of Gokuu and Gohan's little boy parts after they de-transformed, so can't they at least throw in some nice fan service for the ladies?

(OK, so I guess the Vegeta shower scenes were kind of fan servicey....but still!)

Yes, the Golden Oozaru and Super Saiyan 4 transformations and back are mysterious clothes generating things.

It's not that absurd, though, considering Piccolo had magical clothes growing powers (or materialization is you want a less hilarious name). But the weird thing is how it seemed to be like a reflex for the higher Saiyan levels.

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote:Did you forget that Shenlong could grant three wishes instead of two in the Boo arc?

I thought Dende's Shen Long could always grant three wishes as long as one of them wasn't to bring multiple people back to life. It seems like that was always unclear, the way it was stated.

Kunzait_83 · Post by **Kunzait_83** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 10:57 am

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:27 am

I thought that Dende said that the Dragon Balls would only be able to grant two wishes if he applied that effect to them... In any case, they wished everyone killed at the Tenkaichi Budôkai back to life in the Boo arc, yet they still had two wishes left, so...

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 11:58 am

Chibi Mystic Gohan wrote:I thought that Dende said that the Dragon Balls would only be able to grant two wishes if he applied that effect to them... In any case, they wished everyone killed at the Tenkaichi Budôkai back to life in the Boo arc, yet they still had two wishes left, so...

If I remember correctly, didn't they wish the people from the Tenkaichi Tournament back to life with the Earth's Dragon Balls and then later did everything else with Namek's (ie, restoring the Earth and all it's inhabitants back to life)?

Then they used Polunga's third wish to restore Son Goku's power. Shen Long never actually granted a second wish at that time.

Chibi Mystic Gohan · Post by **Chibi Mystic Gohan** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 12:01 pm

That's true, but it's still stated that they had two wishes left, to use at a later time.

sailorspazz · Post by **sailorspazz** » Sun Nov 02, 2008 2:44 pm

Kunzait_83 wrote:No, I'm almost possitive that when Dende became Earth's Kami just before the Cell Game, when he recreated Earth's Dragon Balls, he made them more like the Namekian set in that they can do infinite ressurections for individuals who were brought back before, and could also grant three wishes.

No, at the time of the Cell Games, they were still only able to revive those who had not previously been resurrected. Remember that they were unable to revive Gokuu after the end of the Cell Games when they brought back everyone who had been killed by Cell. Once everyone realized this, they were trying to come up with some other way to bring him back, but then Gokuu interjected and said not to bother. So, in the manga canon, Shenlong is never able to restore life to those who have already been revived once before. Krillin being revived in GT means they either forgot this fact, or the Dragonballs were upgraded by Dende offscreen at some point.

Nikkolas · Post by **Nikkolas** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 3:45 am

Just to comment here on the building thing...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oT0w8h3fMlc

This is Goku easily righting a falling skyscraper in SSJ4. If people are referring to when he and Vegeta are trapped under a building during the fight with Shenron, that was only because if they tried to move the stuff would collapse on them. I believe Vegeta says it but maybe it was Goku.

GT has plenty of real inconsistencies but this is not one of them.

Li'l Lemmy · Post by **Li'l Lemmy** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:25 am

Nikkolas wrote:This is Goku easily righting a falling skyscraper in SSJ4. If people are referring to when he and Vegeta are trapped under a building during the fight with Shenron, that was only because if they tried to move the stuff would collapse on them. I believe Vegeta says it but maybe it was Goku.

No, you were right; it was Vegeta. Goku wanted to use the opportunity to perform Fusion, and Vegeta interjects with his wee li'l complaint that the entire building will collapse on them if he moves to do so.

~Da Lemmy

Maphisto86 · Post by **Maphisto86** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:32 pm

onlyonelegend wrote:Not really plot holes, just things i found annoying.

How Vegeta magically loses his tail when knocked out of SSJ4.

How Goku's tail turned gold the first time he goes SSJ, but never again.

These are two things that bugged the hell out of me when I first saw GT. Like the clothes, Vegeta magically gains his tail but when he reverts back to normal it is gone and his old clothes return. Lazy, lazy, script writing.

Although on the second inconsistency, Goku's tail does become golden furred while fighting Bebi as SSJ3 but not before when he was SSJ, it was just brown furred. In fact I did not see much of GT other than the Bebi saga. I didn't know we ever saw SSJ Goku with a golden furred tail other than on the cover of the first 'GT Perfect File'. I also never saw Goku fighting Super 17 or the Dragons as anything other than his normal and SSJ4 forms. The color of a Saiyan's tail while SSJ seems to be different depending on the artist's mood. In fact, since we never saw half-breeds like Trunks or Bura with a tail, many fan artists sometimes show them with a tail colored like their hair or brown like full Saiyans.

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:40 pm

Well, Son did fight Super #17 initially as a SSj1.

Conan the SSJ · Post by **Conan the SSJ** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:42 pm

Tsukento wrote:[The point is that he's able to turn into a Super Saiyan yet can't use Instantaneous Movement.

The difference for Instantaneous Movement and Super Saiyan 3 is that we've never seen a child or young adult perform these abilities, they could only be accessible for fully prepared adult bodies. Gotenks was only able to go level 3 because he was the combination of two Super Saiyan kids/bodies, so he was a unique case in that regard. It isn't a plothole to say Goku can't use Instantaneous Movement or Super Saiyan 3 in his child form, at best consider it a retcon.

Saiyan-Professor · Post by **Saiyan-Professor** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 4:45 pm

Maphisto86 wrote:
onlyonelegend wrote:Not really plot holes, just things i found annoying.

How Vegeta magically loses his tail when knocked out of SSJ4.

How Goku's tail turned gold the first time he goes SSJ, but never again.
These are two things that bugged the hell out of me when I first saw GT. Like the clothes, Vegeta magically gains his tail but when he reverts back to normal it is gone and his old clothes return. Lazy, lazy, script writing.

Although on the second inconsistency, Goku's tail does become golden furred while fighting Bebi as SSJ3 but not before when he was SSJ, it was just brown furred. In fact I did not see much of GT other than the Bebi saga. I didn't know we ever saw SSJ Goku with a golden furred tail other than on the cover of the first 'GT Perfect File'. I also never saw Goku fighting Super 17 or the Dragons as anything other than his normal and SSJ4 forms. The color of a Saiyan's tail while SSJ seems to be different depending on the artist's mood. In fact, since we never saw half-breeds like Trunks or Bura with a tail, many fan artists sometimes show them with a tail colored like their hair or brown like full Saiyans.

I believe that the use of many animation studios created this inconsistency, because sometimes it would be gold and then it would not. When Kakarrot first regained his tail, he went straight to Super Saiyan 3 to fight Baby. I am sure that particular studio if given the chance would have shown his lower levels with a golden tail and thus the others would have followed suite. As far as the clothes thing is concerned, we have Piccolo doing this all throughout Z. I think that idea was far better than having a naked guy with an 8-year-old body running around all the time. Moreover, much as I like Vegeta I do not like him enough to sit there and watch him fight in the nude. I had issues with the flashback scene in the Freeza Saga when he pulled an Andy Sipowicz.

BlueSky · Post by **Kaboom** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 6:35 pm

I don't see any reason whatsoever why Goku's teleportation would be restricted the way GT made it out to be. It's just a trick centered around sensing and tracking Ki. There was never any indication it had anything to do with size or age or power.

Saiyan-Professor · Post by **Saiyan-Professor** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:06 pm

SSj Kaboom wrote:I don't see any reason whatsoever why Goku's teleportation would be restricted the way GT made it out to be. It's just a trick centered around sensing and tracking Ki. There was never any indication it had anything to do with size or age or power.

In an online-translated version of one of the GT Perfect Files, I read years ago stated that the writers had to come up with an idea of how to demonstrate some drawbacks for Kakarrot in his chibi form. They thought that limiting his Shunkan Idou and his use of Super Saiyan 3 was a good way of doing it without handicapping him too much.

Since Toriyama was involved in the early stages of GT, does anyone know if he had anything to do with the whole Shunkan Idou question?

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:13 pm

Saiyan-Professor wrote:
SSj Kaboom wrote:I don't see any reason whatsoever why Goku's teleportation would be restricted the way GT made it out to be. It's just a trick centered around sensing and tracking Ki. There was never any indication it had anything to do with size or age or power.
In an online-translated version of one of the GT Perfect Files, I read years ago stated that the writers had to come up with an idea of how to demonstrate some drawbacks for Kakarrot in his chibi form. They thought that limiting his Shunkan Idou and his use of Super Saiyan 3 was a good way of doing it without handicapping him too much.

Since Toriyama was involved in the early stages of GT, does anyone know if he had anything to do with the whole Shunkan Idou question?

IIRC, all he had to do with GT was the character designs of Giru, Pan, Goku, and Trunks, as well the giant planet (Monmars) and the desert planet (Khara) and their funky Space Ship.