Is it just me or do the fights get worse in the movies?

[Super Sonic]

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Movie 7:
This movie is pretty lame also, but it has one redeeming quality:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4FWQg5KPAY

Someone needs to make a gif of this. I love how he loses his transformation xDDD

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Been done:



Saw that on here a long time ago.

[Velasa]

< < I can forgive anything Movie 5 and 6 could possibly do badly because, well.... Piccolo is a sexy genuis badass and he figures out what to do/whoops everyone's ass and looks so damn good doing it. Except at the end of six, that was lame. But at the beginning against the robots? *melts*

Ok, enough fangirling > > Let me see what kind of actual summary I can give...

In agreement that the first three have the best done and the most varried fighting of any of the movies. Everyone gets a relativly fair shot and they're done in that early-Z style that looks so damn good and close to Toriyama's early art. My only possible complaint about movie one is goddamnit, I wanted to see Pic and Son get to fight! Thankfully movie two made up for that ^^ Three I don't like as much, but it's just as sharp looking and features that awe-inspiring clip where Son's got like five guys on him and he's raging his way through them.

The Sluggu movie gets a lot of flack but I love it like crazy. The exploding neon in Lizard City, Son's head getting shoved through a wall, Pic slipping around the orange guy, dropping through the building and pretending to help only to blow his head into oblivion? Not to mention my personal endless joy that there's a Nameccian kicking Sayiajin ass, and is only beatable with Nameccian help? Always a good thing.

Movie five. Piccolo vs Coola's minions as the previosuly mentioned sexy genuis. Nuff' said.

Movie six is mostly silly and ridiculous, but has that opening fight against the Coola robots which I could watch repeatedly. The fights against Coola himself are mostly bland and confusing though.

Movie seven. Oh Android 13. Terrible? Yes. Hysterical beyond all human logic? Oh god yes. It's a bunch of Sayiajin fighting purple midgets and rednecks and vikings on an iceberg. Every time it's on I can't stop laughing. This one also features the absolute worst art in the entire set of movies.

The first Brolli movie I've always actually found quite interesting because it's one of maybe three that has an actual plot to it that makes independent sense. I've never tried to analyze the battles themselves though, and the way he dies is fairly idiotic. The other two Brolli movies are absolute nonsense failures and I have no desire to mention them again.

Bojak I haven't watched in years and I really need to check it out again to give any kind of summary.

Movie twelve... I don't remember the particulars. It was funny, but often confusing because I get picky about Under/Overworld systems after inventing my own at much loss of time and sanity. I'd probably have to rewatch it to give a better summary.

Last comes that movie for some other anime designed by Toriyama that inexplicably has Dragonball characters in it for about ten minutes. Not a big fan of it in any context.

[Deep Thought]

Whoops, ignore this.

[Deep Thought]

And people wonder why Vegeta doesn't show up in Movie 10.

Movie 6: Alright, my movie debut! And I'm stronger than Kakarot at this point so I should have a good- *gets clocked over the horizon, kicked around and collapses before Goku delivers the killing blow*

Movie 7: Well, OK, I'll try again here! I'm still stronger than Kakarot, so-*gets nearly broken in half, collapses like a bitch while Goku takes a million times more punishment and keeps getting back up, then gets a totally nonsensical killing blow, even for DBZ*

Movie 8: Fine, I'll attack the bad guy BEFORE he reaches his final form! *foot bounces off bad guy's neck* Oh, what the fuck. *gets back in the fight later...for two seconds before getting torn up; also, his power was enough to make the bad guy explode, but only in Goku's body*

Movie 9: Man, I don't wanna go out there... oh, fine. Hey guys, Vegeta's he-*gets his spine shoved out his ears, goes down like the queen of bitches; Mr. Gigantic Pussy himself gets to be the hero instead*

Movie 10: Fuck you, I ain't doing it.

Actually, to be fair, a much as I hate Vegeta, he doesn't get much love in the manga, either.

FREEZA SAGA

Vegeta: Okay, Recoome, time to kick your ass!

*Vegeta fires a bunch of ki blasts and punches and kicks the crap out of him*

Recoome: I so tanked that shit.

*Recoome beats the crap out of Vegeta*

Vegeta: FUCK!

*Goku comes, heals everyone, beats Recoome in one punch, and solos the rest of the Ginyu force besides Jeice*

Vegeta: HA, I CAN STILL KILL JEICE!

*Vegeta kills Jeice in one attack*

Vegeta: HAH, SEE THAT?

Kurrin: Congrats, you just beat an opponent ten times weaker than you. How about fighting an opponent equal to you for a change?

Vegeta: FUCK YOU, KURRIN, YOU'RE DEA- Oh, fuck, it's FREEZA!

Freeza: YOU'RE ALL GOING TO DIE!

*Vegeta and Freeza have an equal match*

Freeza: It's a shame that I have fifteen transformations and power ups.

Vegeta: Oh, ple- *watches Freeza transform* MY GOD!

*Vegeta is too powerless to do anything throughout most of the fight, until.....*

Vegeta: THAT'S IT, I'LL ABUSE THE SYSTEM *gets a zenkai* HAH, I'M THE LEGENDARY SUPER SAYAJIN! DIE, FREEZA!

*Vegeta gets mauled by Freeza*

Vegeta: D-damn it, F-Freeza is un-killable, no one can-.

Goku: Hi.

Vegeta: Looks like it's time for me to die and become useless. Bleh. *dies*

*Goku solos Freeza through the Super Sayajin transformation*

*Vegeta gets revived, time passes*

Vegeta: Oh shit, Freeza' back, there no way in hell anyone can beat hi-

Trunks: Hi.

*Trunks destroys Mecha Freeza, through the Super Sayajin transformation*

Vegeta: FUUUUUUUUCK!

*3 years later*

Vegeta: Hah! I kicked 19's ass, WITH SUPER SAYAJIN!

Piccolo: Please, I could've done that. Or Trunks could've, if we waited.

Piccolo: Speaking of which...

Trunks: Hey, dad, did you finally manage to beat Gohan, the nine year old, in the Super Sayajin race?

Vegeta: DAMN IT, TRU-!

Kurrin: By the way Vegeta, congrats, you just beat an opponent five times weaker than you. How about fighting an opponent equal to you for a change?

Vegeta: FINE, I'LL SHOW YOU ALL, I'LL KILL THOSE OTHER ANDROID FUCKS, 17 AND 18!

*Vegeta gets really, really raped by 18*

Vegeta: FUUUUUUUCK!

*Time passes, Cell becomes Semi-Perfect*

Vegeta: Time o be the hero and beat this son of a bitch!

Tien: Oh, you mean that "son of a bitch" that even I could ward off?

Vegeta: FUCK YOU!

Piccolo: Maybe someone else should go fight the bad guy, because lord knows that this isn't the first time Vegeta fucked up.

Trunks: You know what, dad? I'll go fight the big bad guy, since I'm as strong as you, anyway.

*Vegeta punches both Piccolo and Trunks*

Vegeta: I'M PERFECTLY CAPABLE OF DEFEATING A VILLAIN!

*Vegeta lets Cell turn perfect and gets the crap beaten out of him*

Trunks: See? I told y-

Vegeta: FUCK YOU!

*The Cells Games*

Vegeta: No one can beat this monster, it's a miracle I survi-

Goku and Gohan: Hi.

Vegeta: ......

*Later*

Vegeta: HAH, SEE THIS, GUYS, I'M EQUALLY MATCHED WITH A CELL JR., SERIOUSLY, I'M SO AWESO-

*Gohan lobs the Cell Jr.'s head off with one punch*

Vegeta: DAMN IT!

*Years pass, and it is the Buu Saga*

Vegeta: THAT'S IT KAKARROT, I'M EQUAL TO YOU AND WE ARE GOING TO FIGHT!

*Most of Vegeta and Goku's fight is cut off, because Toriyama thought that the fans would rather see Gohan and the Supreme Kai talk rather than watch a fight that they have been craving for half a decade. Way to go, Toriyama*

Vegeta: Time to nobly sacrifice myself against Buu. *explodes*

Buu: Funny noise did nothing to BUU!

*Vegeta does nothing notable besides be fusion bait for Goku and get his ass kicked by Kid Buu*

[Velasa]

...... Couldn't you make that list for any character except Son Goku though?

[Rocketman]

...... Couldn't you make that list for any character except Son Goku though?

To an extent, yes. What makes Vegeta stand out, though is that he works his goddamn ass off. Even if you don't take filler into account, Vegeta trains the hardest out of everybody, and it never makes a lick of difference.

Becomes a Super Saiyan through sheer bloody-minded determination, unique in all the SSJs - takes out a flunky (the wrong flunky, as it turns out), then gets the piss beat out of him.

Trains for two whole fucking years in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber - is still completely outmatched by Goku, then the blubbering pussy called Gohan gets a bullshit powerup to leave him further in the dust.

And as a bonus: Android 16's "death" meant more to Gohan than Trunks' death meant to Vegeta.

Is the only Z Warrior to continue training after Cell; trains so hard he nearly matches on Earth what Goku does in the afterlife, then he even sells his soul to finally close the gap - but LOLOLOL Goku had a whole 'nother powerup! Oh Vegeta, you silly goose, you thought you would be allowed to be on Goku's level? No, fuck you, we're even gonna make the shitstain kids more powerful than you, by using another technique Goku pulls out of his ass. Also, you know that chap Gohan, who spent the last seven years eating pastries and watching Lifetime while you busted your ass? He's the strongest warrior in the universe now! And you? You're the weakest fighter who's still fighting! OH HO HO


Rather depressing when you think about it: "Don't bother working hard or trying to overcome your limits."

[Yamcha_krillin]

< ridiculously long quote snipped by administrator >

Pure win

[Piccolo Daimao]

I honestly found Broly's uncontrollable love of clotheslining to be entertaining, I'm sorry.

And I can still be entertained by some of the initial Gohan v. SSJ Broly fights; those 15 or so seconds are heavy on technique and one could guess that Broly had picked up a martial art somewhere. Then Gohan backs up a little and SSJs up to even the playing field, whereupon Broly proceeds to go into spaz mode and the rest is fairly forgettable, except for a little gag where Krillin comes in dressed up like Piccolo long enough to get bashed up against a wall or something; then they rip off the ending to the Cell saga(seriously, compare them side by side; not accounting for differences in how long it takes each beam struggle to resolve, they progress and end in much the same manner).

I assumed Kuririn had Piccolo's clothes because he flew up to Kami's Lookout and simply asked Piccolo to make an outfit for him. Seems unlikely, but I doubt Kuririn whipped up a sowing kit and followed Piccolo's design himself. LOL =)

[Forgotten Hero]

The last good movie, for me, was probably movie five. I don't like Brolly all that much. The other movies have some good fight scenes; Gogeta doing crazy flip kicks on Janemba. Otherwise, I find most of the movies forgettable.

[Deep Thought]

...... Couldn't you make that list for any character except Son Goku though?

Not really, Gohan gets some glory moments for sure.

- He damages Raditz, allowing Goku and Piccolo to finish him off.

- He is the only one to damage Nappa significantly beside Goku.

- Finished Vegeta.

- Defeats Cell.

- Becomes the strongest character in the universe.

Piccolo is the most unloved character in DBZ, seriously. In fact,

@Rocketman: Piccolo trained just as hard as Vegeta, but you didn't even count him. Shows how important the Namek became in later DBZ, huh?

[MCDaveG]

Yeah, It's about the improvement of series..... On the begining, there was more kung-fu like action and when the characters started to grew stronger, the fights became about more power and hard single attacks without much choreography and with combination of ki blast variations

[caejones]

Re: Nappa - I dunno, Kuririn destroyed the equivalent of three Raditz, and pissed off someone worth five Raditz.

I think Piccolo and Ten wound up doing better, in a sense, because each of them had their rivalry with Goku holding them back until a new rival showed up.
That's basically how it goes: if you're Goku's rival, you'll do something awesome, then get kicked around. Vegeta basically saved Piccolo's dignity by caring so much about his own. O.O

Which I guess is kinda reflected in the movies. It'd've been easier to tell if there'd been a movie set with Ten as the main rival (DB Movie3 is far from counting). Hmm.

[Super Ghost Kamikaze]

The fights don't just get worse with the progression of the movies...

They get worse with the progression of the SERIES.

Goku VS "Jackie Chun" was easily one of the best fights of the series. More awesome fights fill the period between this and the Goku VS Vegeta fight. From Namek on, fights generally get worse.

[caejones]

The fights don't just get worse with the progression of the movies...

They get worse with the progression of the SERIES.

Goku VS "Jackie Chun" was easily one of the best fights of the series. More awesome fights fill the period between this and the Goku VS Vegeta fight. From Namek on, fights generally get worse.

*nods* *points to podcast episode... 0171 was it?*
Though I was bored by the Ginyu fight, myself. Recoome was a bit more interesting since the MRoA informed me of things I didn't see before, but only just. Ginyu, on the other hand, was less interesting than when I first saw it on Toonamy...
Goku Vs. Freeza... did it really have to take so long?
Oh, and I'll just be frank: Buu saga... Goten and Trunks had most of my interest. I paid more attention to Vegeta Vs Puipui than Majin Vegeta vs Goku. (Granted, I blame the dub for that. "You're going to die; and I guarantee you, it's going to hurt.".)

[Velasa]

Piccolo is the most unloved character in DBZ, seriously. In fact,

@Rocketman: Piccolo trained just as hard as Vegeta, but you didn't even count him. Shows how important the Namek became in later DBZ, huh?

.....................................

But.... I love him << doesn't that count?

Setiously though. I was going to bring up Pic in argument to Rocketman but one of his points was training their ass off since they showed up, and after Cell Pic takes a break to keep an eye on the new Kami.

[Rocketman]

@Rocketman: Piccolo trained just as hard as Vegeta, but you didn't even count him. Shows how important the Namek became in later DBZ, huh?

While I do like Piccolo, there's a couple reasons why I didn't count him.

1. He doesn't train as hard as Vegeta. He never does gravity training past the 10x on King Kai's World and in the Time Chamber, for example.

2. Piccolo is just plain treated better. Note the movies in which they appear together:

Movie 6 - Piccolo gets a lot of time dedicated to him busting robot heads. Vegeta spends his whole time in the movie getting torn apart.

Movie 7 - I don't recall this one much at all, I'll let somebody else fill in.

Movie 8 - Vegeta is first to attack and does nothing to Broly's regular SSJ form. Piccolo (who somehow managed to get to this planet) gets a whole speech calling Vegeta a faggot AND even when Vegeta jumps back into the fight, he (again, strongest fighter at this point) goes down faster even than Piccolo.

Movie 9 - I don't recall all that well. I know they both showed up just to get their faces beat in, but I'm willing to bet that Vegeta was KO'd faster.

Now what about the movies they're in seperately?

Movies 1-5: Piccolo's a fucking badass.

Movies 12-13: Vegeta gets the shit beat out of him. His entire showing in 13 is "Oi!" *one attack* *faints*

In the series, Piccolo also gets a lot of favorable coverage. He kills Goku, his plan would've hurt badly or killed Nappa if Gohan wasn't being a pussy, he apparently gets way more out of King Kai's training than Goku did, he beats up Freeza for a bit.

When the Androids come, (by some interpretations) Piccolo trained enough to be on Super Saiyan levels of power. That's right, Vegeta! All that bullshit you put yourself through? This guy nearly matched it by simple sparring in the woods!

Even after he falls behind in power, Piccolo is still positively viewed, training the idiot kids 'n' such. Even GT likes Piccolo in its own way, as Piccolo helps Goku win twice. Vegeta's only use after he falls behind is as fusion fodder for Goku, so the bad guy can be brought down enough for Goku to defeat him alone.

And Piccolo's heroic sacrifices always work.


But, the major reason I didn't include Piccolo is he's not a Saiyan. As annoying as it can be for fans of other characters, it's a whole thing in the series that Saiyans are just better...except Vegeta.

Actually, upon reflection, the theme should be "everybody gets bullshit powerups except Vegeta". Vegeta's the only major character who earned every scrap of power he's got.

[Tanooki Kuribo]

I don't think the fights get worse. It's probley because we've seen so many fights in the series that when you get to the 6th, 7th movie... you are pretty much desensitized by the awesomeness of the fights.

[KKZ]

It's not really a fight, but I could watch Fifth Form Cooler laying the beatdown on Goku over and over again in Movie 5. Easily my favorite of all the movies.

[Piccolo Daimao]

@Rocketman: Piccolo trained just as hard as Vegeta, but you didn't even count him. Shows how important the Namek became in later DBZ, huh?

While I do like Piccolo, there's a couple reasons why I didn't count him.

1. He doesn't train as hard as Vegeta. He never does gravity training past the 10x on King Kai's World and in the Time Chamber, for example.

2. Piccolo is just plain treated better. Note the movies in which they appear together:

Movie 6 - Piccolo gets a lot of time dedicated to him busting robot heads. Vegeta spends his whole time in the movie getting torn apart.

Movie 7 - I don't recall this one much at all, I'll let somebody else fill in.

Movie 8 - Vegeta is first to attack and does nothing to Broly's regular SSJ form. Piccolo (who somehow managed to get to this planet) gets a whole speech calling Vegeta a faggot AND even when Vegeta jumps back into the fight, he (again, strongest fighter at this point) goes down faster even than Piccolo.

Movie 9 - I don't recall all that well. I know they both showed up just to get their faces beat in, but I'm willing to bet that Vegeta was KO'd faster.

Now what about the movies they're in seperately?

Movies 1-5: Piccolo's a fucking badass.

Movies 12-13: Vegeta gets the shit beat out of him. His entire showing in 13 is "Oi!" *one attack* *faints*

In the series, Piccolo also gets a lot of favorable coverage. He kills Goku, his plan would've hurt badly or killed Nappa if Gohan wasn't being a pussy, he apparently gets way more out of King Kai's training than Goku did, he beats up Freeza for a bit.

When the Androids come, (by some interpretations) Piccolo trained enough to be on Super Saiyan levels of power. That's right, Vegeta! All that bullshit you put yourself through? This guy nearly matched it by simple sparring in the woods!

Even after he falls behind in power, Piccolo is still positively viewed, training the idiot kids 'n' such. Even GT likes Piccolo in its own way, as Piccolo helps Goku win twice. Vegeta's only use after he falls behind is as fusion fodder for Goku, so the bad guy can be brought down enough for Goku to defeat him alone.

And Piccolo's heroic sacrifices always work.


But, the major reason I didn't include Piccolo is he's not a Saiyan. As annoying as it can be for fans of other characters, it's a whole thing in the series that Saiyans are just better...except Vegeta.

Actually, upon reflection, the theme should be "everybody gets bullshit powerups except Vegeta". Vegeta's the only major character who earned every scrap of power he's got.

Movie 7 - Piccolo deflected a blast that Android 13 fired at Gohan, then caught 13 off-guard and managed to swing him around and throw him to the ground like a ragdoll. Vegeta, on the other hand, had his ass handed to him by 14 until he turned into a Super Saiyan, and even then, after that little clash that they had, Vegeta was lying on the ground while 14 exploded. Oh yeah, Vegeta was the first to attack 13 and the first to get butt-whooped while Piccolo managed to lift 13 over and stop him firing a deadly energy blast at Goku. Plus, Vegeta got his spine broke too.

Movie 9 - Yes, you're right. Vegeta did get KO'd after. Their "fight", if you can call it that, consisted of Vegeta and Bojack exchanging some blasts, then Vegeta getting smacked around. Piccolo put up a better fight, actually managed to hit Bojack, which not even Trunks or Vegeta could do, but went down after Bojack went behind him and blasted him.

Conclusion - Vegeta just gets plain screwed over in the movies. Piccolo is just treated better.

[ShinRogafuken]

To be honest, I think this doesn't only apply to just the movies, but the sagas in general.

In Dragon Ball and the Saiyan Saga of Z, we had CRAZY martial arts fighting techniques, like Drunken Fist, 4 Arms, etc. The fighting never got old and was fun, exciting and fresh.

But by the time we get to the Buu Saga, it is basically generic high-speed punches and kicks, with the occasional ki blasts. The only 2 original fights in late DBZ was Goku vs. Pikkon (which is filler by the way) and Gotenks vs. Buu in the Time Chamber.