Are There Any Updates On The Harmony Gold Dub Of Dragon Ball?

[10gigtriforce]

Whatever Funi inherited from Harmony Gold also might have been unusable.

Ya know thats fair. I know it had only been 6 years since the HG dub when funi started dubbing but improperly stored video stuff can rot in that time, plus they didnt go full on DB until what 01? That'd been 12 years. Even more time for film to rot. Heck we've seen what ~8 years did to the buu saga original masters...

[MasenkoHA]

The weird thing with Zero is isn't it actually a somewhat acceptable if strange English adaptation of "Goku"?

How do you figure?

I seriously think they named him Zero so they could rhyme it with Hero.

I kind of like some of the name changes: Lena, Mao Mao, and Zendaki even if they’re unnecessary. But Zero is a pretty ehhh name.

[Robo4900]

The weird thing with Zero is isn't it actually a somewhat acceptable if strange English adaptation of "Goku"?

How do you figure?

I seriously think they named him Zero so they could rhyme it with Hero.

I kind of like some of the name changes: Lena, Mao Mao, and Zendaki even if they’re unnecessary. But Zero is a pretty ehhh name.

"Zero" and other name changes were apparently suggested by Toei, not Harmony Gold. I think that's one reason a lot of these stuck around with Funi initially (some even stick around to this day, like "Master Roshi", which arguably is a mis-adaptation; should be Master Muten, really); Toei expected name changes, so they gave Funi that list of names, and Funi tried it out with those before deciding to do their own interpretations of the original names.

As for how Zero kinda-sorta adapts Goku accurately... It strips out the Sun Wukong reference, which never came across in English anyway unless you happen to look it up (which... Whatever you call him, that'll come up as trivia), but one meaning of the name Son Goku is essentially "He who is the master of understanding nothingness".
Sean Schemmel has occasionally brought this little nugget out at cons, and said it more specifically as "He who is the master of understanding nothing", but that's a mischaracterisation of the meaning of it; it ties into taoist and buddhist beliefs, and perhaps another way to adapt it that some would argue is more accurate is "He who is the master of understanding emptiness" or something like that.
And so, if we're specifically leaning into that aspect of his name, that he is the master of taoist/buddhist ideas of nothingness/emptiness, then arguably Zero is a solid adaptation.

But I'm given to understand there are other meanings to the names Son Goku/Sun Wukong, but Zero only really adapts the one meaning, so YMMV on whether they actually did a good job at adapting his name there.

As for the talk of whether it would've been good if HG did more...
I'd love HG to have done more, because then we'd have more of this rather charming dub. But I wouldn't have wanted it to succeed, because then they'd sit on the rights as they've done with Macross.
Really though, the ideal thing for me isn't that HG do well here, but that the next company that picked it up wasn't Funimation. Or that Funimation didn't bail on DB after the initial 13 episodes, or their initial Vancouver cast and Pioneer's distribution... So many incompetent, bad corner-cutting choices made in the name of penny-pinching, and each one made the end product significantly worse. And of course, the only reason Funi got the license in the first place was nepotism (since Gen Fukunaga has relatives at Toei)...
I don't particularly think HG would've been a good option, but it's easy to think that basically anyone would be better than Funi, 'cause Funi were really shit in the '90s, and even though they've got better, they still refuse to let go of any of their old baggage. Again, I think with the rights hoarding stuff, I really don't think HG would be a better option, but it is nice to fantasise about the idea that a different, more suited company could have got the license at one time.

[Cure Dragon 255]

Boy I sure would LOVE a Kunzait mega post about that. HINT HINT HINT!

[Planetnamek]

Boy I sure would LOVE a Kunzait mega post about that. HINT HINT HINT!

Same here.

I don't think Funimation were inherently terrible, like it or not they played a major role in making anime more mainstream and less niche(and yes I know people like Kunzie would've much rather that DB had never gotten dubbed period, but I don't agree with that mentality at all as even if you don't like the dub you can't argue that it did bring the original Japanese version to a much wider audience then it would've otherwise).

As for why some other company never snapped up the rights to DB before Funi did, I heard that the main reason for that is the license for the DB franchise was very expensive and none of the companies that wanted to dub it could afford to do so(that's likely why HG only did 5 episodes and only aired them in a few test markets, because that's all they could afford to do) Funi had the edge because of Gen having an uncle at Toei, so he was able to get the license to dub DB without having to pay through the nose to do so.

Articles like this made me appreciate the risk Funi was taking:https://www.dmagazine.com/publications/ ... wer-mound/

[10gigtriforce]

well dang I didnt know toei suggested the name changes to HG and re-suggested them to funi(who thankfully changed em). Kinda makes ya wonder what other weird dub names in other series came from japan.


When did HG have the license taken away? Maybe no one after them but before funi had an interest in it in the US. At least that toei trusted

[Robo4900]

I don't think Funimation were inherently terrible, like it or not they played a major role in making anime more mainstream and less niche(and yes I know people like Kunzie would've much rather that DB had never gotten dubbed period, but I don't agree with that mentality at all as even if you don't like the dub you can't argue that it did bring the original Japanese version to a much wider audience then it would've otherwise).

This is a false dichotomy; you're looking at this as if it's either "DB got done by Funimation, or it didn't get done at all." There were countless other companies active when Funi were doing it, all of whom would've loved to get a slice of Dragon Ball in America (early '90s, it was the biggest thing ever in Japan, and was sweeping through Europe; in fact, Toei didn't want this no-name startup that Funimation was in 1994 to have Dragon Ball at first, for that reason).

As for why some other company never snapped up the rights to DB before Funi did, I heard that the main reason for that is the license for the DB franchise was very expensive and none of the companies that wanted to dub it could afford to do so(that's likely why HG only did 5 episodes and only aired them in a few test markets, because that's all they could afford to do) Funi had the edge because of Gen having an uncle at Toei, so he was able to get the license to dub DB without having to pay through the nose to do so.

Articles like this made me appreciate the risk Funi was taking:https://www.dmagazine.com/publications/ ... wer-mound/

Again, I think this just plays into your false dichotomy; if Gen Fukunaga hadn't used nepotism to get the license when he did, someone would've picked it up. A franchise like that doesn't tend to get overlooked. And I think there are several companies who would've done it infinitely better than Funi. Funi fundamentally mismanaged the franchise at every turn. They fucking skipped 140 episodes of the show, including some of the ones that drew the highest ratings of the run in Japan!

I don't know how expensive Dragon Ball was to pick up, but I'll say this: I don't see much suggestion that price was an issue there, and I'm pretty sure what he's saying about "Dragon Ball was a risk because Hollywood was against it" is... Either a lie, or a deceptive phrasing. I think what he really means is that the move of going into "Re-versioning" foreign media for a western audience was seen as an unusual move given his prior work in... What, small-time radio and TV? I think what he's getting at there is most were saying it'd be better for him to try and move up in TV, radio, and eventually movie production instead of pivoting into "Re-versioning" anime.

Apparently though, Funi had a hard time getting Dragon Ball: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atTdTl3UOzI&t=4m33s
For those unable to access USA YouTube, he says here that basically because Funi was a startup in 1994, Toei didn't want to give such a big franchise to them, but his uncle -- who worked on the live action side -- intervened.
The way he goes on to talk about it, it sounds like basically he saw DBZ, and liked it, and thought it'd be a great fit for the USA. (Which also somewhat explains the later accounts of them desperately trying to get Toei to let them skip DB...)

When did HG have the license taken away? Maybe no one after them but before funi had an interest in it in the US. At least that toei trusted

We've never seen any suggestion that there was ever any lack of interest in the property, to my knowledge.

[eledoremassis02]

Spoiler:

I don't think Funimation were inherently terrible, like it or not they played a major role in making anime more mainstream and less niche(and yes I know people like Kunzie would've much rather that DB had never gotten dubbed period, but I don't agree with that mentality at all as even if you don't like the dub you can't argue that it did bring the original Japanese version to a much wider audience then it would've otherwise).

This is a false dichotomy; you're looking at this as if it's either "DB got done by Funimation, or it didn't get done at all." There were countless other companies active when Funi were doing it, all of whom would've loved to get a slice of Dragon Ball in America (early '90s, it was the biggest thing ever in Japan, and was sweeping through Europe; in fact, Toei didn't want this no-name startup that Funimation was in 1994 to have Dragon Ball at first, for that reason).

As for why some other company never snapped up the rights to DB before Funi did, I heard that the main reason for that is the license for the DB franchise was very expensive and none of the companies that wanted to dub it could afford to do so(that's likely why HG only did 5 episodes and only aired them in a few test markets, because that's all they could afford to do) Funi had the edge because of Gen having an uncle at Toei, so he was able to get the license to dub DB without having to pay through the nose to do so.

Articles like this made me appreciate the risk Funi was taking:https://www.dmagazine.com/publications/ ... wer-mound/

Again, I think this just plays into your false dichotomy; if Gen Fukunaga hadn't used nepotism to get the license when he did, someone would've picked it up. A franchise like that doesn't tend to get overlooked. And I think there are several companies who would've done it infinitely better than Funi. Funi fundamentally mismanaged the franchise at every turn. They fucking skipped 140 episodes of the show, including some of the ones that drew the highest ratings of the run in Japan!

I don't know how expensive Dragon Ball was to pick up, but I'll say this: I don't see much suggestion that price was an issue there, and I'm pretty sure what he's saying about "Dragon Ball was a risk because Hollywood was against it" is... Either a lie, or a deceptive phrasing. I think what he really means is that the move of going into "Re-versioning" foreign media for a western audience was seen as an unusual move given his prior work in... What, small-time radio and TV? I think what he's getting at there is most were saying it'd be better for him to try and move up in TV, radio, and eventually movie production instead of pivoting into "Re-versioning" anime.

Apparently though, Funi had a hard time getting Dragon Ball: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atTdTl3UOzI&t=4m33s
For those unable to access USA YouTube, he says here that basically because Funi was a startup in 1994, Toei didn't want to give such a big franchise to them, but his uncle -- who worked on the live action side -- intervened.
The way he goes on to talk about it, it sounds like basically he saw DBZ, and liked it, and thought it'd be a great fit for the USA. (Which also somewhat explains the later accounts of them desperately trying to get Toei to let them skip DB...)

When did HG have the license taken away? Maybe no one after them but before funi had an interest in it in the US. At least that toei trusted

We've never seen any suggestion that there was ever any lack of interest in the property, to my knowledge.

Id also like to add from a fan/story persective that skipping 95% of dragonball made every turn in the first episode of Z confusing, esheshally when non-cannon films filled that gap a little).

I for the love of god could never understand why people feared piccolo in both Z and Dead Zone. I feel a series recap ala dragon ball kai was very much needed

[Cure Dragon 255]

I have no love for Funimation but you can rest assured that if someone like 4kids or Harmony Gold got the show we would have never gotten uncut subs by Steven Simmons at all. Which is the closest translation anyone can possibly want without just giving up on subs and learning Japanese.

[MasenkoHA]

I have no love for Funimation but you can rest assured that if someone like 4kids or Harmony Gold got the show we would have never gotten uncut subs by Steven Simmons at all. Which is the closest translation anyone can possibly want without just giving up on subs and learning Japanese.

There are other companies besides those 3.

Honestly Pioneer should have gotten the license seeing what solid work they did with the 3 Z movies and in general.

Funimation isn’t as bad as some other companies that would have never released a subtitles release but they were still pretty shit.

[MasenkoHA]

I don't think Funimation were inherently terrible, like it or not they played a major role in making anime more mainstream and less niche

It was becoming more mainstream with the success of movies like Akira and Studio Ghibli films. Funimation played next to no role in making anime more mainstream. You’re giving them far too much credit.

As for why some other company never snapped up the rights to DB before Funi did, I heard that the main reason for that is the license for the DB franchise was very expensive and none of the companies that wanted to dub it could afford to do so(that's likely why HG only did 5 episodes and only aired them in a few test markets, because that's all they could afford to do) Funi had the edge because of Gen having an uncle at Toei, so he was able to get the license to dub DB without having to pay through the nose to do so.

The license was probably on hold. Since Harmony Gold grabbed it in 1989, 1994 was probably the time it expired and became available again and then Fukunaga played neopotism.

[eledoremassis02]

I think FUNimation did play some role, HG had issues getting it to stick and FUNimation somehow got it on syndication. Did it go national before Cartoon Network? I used to watch it on Channel 11 (here in the NY area) but now that I hear HG aired in little areas and NY is a pretty big market, I'm not sure about FUNimation and broadcast history.

Also, while Dragon Ball became huge in 98-00's I do have this feeling Pokemon played a much larger role into acceptance of anime, between the cards and more "kid-friendly" aspects of the show.

But I think it was the big 3: Sailor Moon, Dragon Ball Z and Pokemon.

Edit: I'm still bummed we never for a Ocean cast pioneer level of the series *or even later films*

[MasenkoHA]

I think FUNimation did play some role, HG had issues getting it to stick and FUNimation somehow got it on syndication

Funimation had to partner with Saban to get it decent timeslots in syndication.

It’s not like Funimation, a newly formed company that had to use nepotism to grab the license, and only Funimation could have made Dragon Ball work in America. Harmony Gold running a few episodes as test pilot in very select markets hardly means anything.

[eledoremassis02]

I think FUNimation did play some role, HG had issues getting it to stick and FUNimation somehow got it on syndication

Funimation had to partner with Saban to get it decent timeslots in syndication.

It’s not like Funimation, a newly formed company that had to use nepotism to grab the license, and only Funimation could have made Dragon Ball work in America. Harmony Gold running a few episodes as test pilot in very select markets hardly means anything.

It means they couldn't make it work for one reason or another. Not saying FUNimation had to be the only one, but they were the one at the right place at the right time regardless how they got it. Id love to see another company tackle the properly better. I was excited for the Bang Zoom dub and for the Ocean Kai dub. There are definitely things I don't like about FUNimation (outside the products they make) but FUNimation did make Dragon Ball (Z) popular and after watching the HG dub I do wish we were able to see more of that as I think the dubs slightly got worse in terms of quality with each redub.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

It was becoming more mainstream with the success of movies like Akira and Studio Ghibli films. Funimation played next to no role in making anime more mainstream. You’re giving them far too much credit.

Akira and Ghibli are certainly popular, but they are not as big as Dragon Ball. You wouldn't see merchandise for either in mainstream stores other than the odd DVD, even then Ghibli movies haven't sold more copies than the orange bricks.

Dragon Ball has paved the way for an entire genre (i.e shonen) to have reasonable levels of success with series like Naruto, Bleach and now My Hero Academia. Nothing inspired by Akira or Ghibli has seen that degree of success.

Funimation have their faults as a company, but they undoubtedly played a huge part in making anime more popular in the west, although it would have happened with or without their efforts to "Americanize" DBZ.

[Planetnamek]

I don't think Funimation were inherently terrible, like it or not they played a major role in making anime more mainstream and less niche

It was becoming more mainstream with the success of movies like Akira and Studio Ghibli films. Funimation played next to no role in making anime more mainstream. You’re giving them far too much credit.

As for why some other company never snapped up the rights to DB before Funi did, I heard that the main reason for that is the license for the DB franchise was very expensive and none of the companies that wanted to dub it could afford to do so(that's likely why HG only did 5 episodes and only aired them in a few test markets, because that's all they could afford to do) Funi had the edge because of Gen having an uncle at Toei, so he was able to get the license to dub DB without having to pay through the nose to do so.

The license was probably on hold. Since Harmony Gold grabbed it in 1989, 1994 was probably the time it expired and became available again and then Fukunaga played neopotism.

I strongly disagree that i'm "giving them too much credit" , sure there were a few somewhat succesful films, but anime was still overall seen as pretty niche, especially in the realm of TV, so by all means hate them and hold a grudge against them for their dubs all you want(even though it seems pretty pointless nowadays and there are far more productive things you could be doing with your time instead but I digress ), does not make them any less influential, and it's not just me saying that, it's people FAR smarter and more well-versed then you and I:https://www.forbes.com/sites/bruceroger ... b24c0966c1

It was becoming more mainstream with the success of movies like Akira and Studio Ghibli films. Funimation played next to no role in making anime more mainstream. You’re giving them far too much credit.

Akira and Ghibli are certainly popular, but they are not as big as Dragon Ball. You wouldn't see merchandise for either in mainstream stores other than the odd DVD, even then Ghibli movies haven't sold more copies than the orange bricks.

Dragon Ball has paved the way for an entire genre (i.e shonen) to have reasonable levels of success with series like Naruto, Bleach and now My Hero Academia. Nothing inspired by Akira or Ghibli has seen that degree of success.

Funimation have their faults as a company, but they undoubtedly played a huge part in making anime more popular in the west, although it would have happened with or without their efforts to "Americanize" DBZ.

Exactly, it never fails to amuse me when people try to rewrite history and act like anime would've still been super succesful even without DBZ becoming big. I'll grant you it wasn't just Funimation that kickstarted the anime boom(Sailor Moon was getting big ratings on Toonami months before CN picked up DBZ so DiC certainly deserves some credit too) but they undoubtedly played a huge role.

I don't think Funimation were inherently terrible, like it or not they played a major role in making anime more mainstream and less niche(and yes I know people like Kunzie would've much rather that DB had never gotten dubbed period, but I don't agree with that mentality at all as even if you don't like the dub you can't argue that it did bring the original Japanese version to a much wider audience then it would've otherwise).

This is a false dichotomy; you're looking at this as if it's either "DB got done by Funimation, or it didn't get done at all." There were countless other companies active when Funi were doing it, all of whom would've loved to get a slice of Dragon Ball in America (early '90s, it was the biggest thing ever in Japan, and was sweeping through Europe; in fact, Toei didn't want this no-name startup that Funimation was in 1994 to have Dragon Ball at first, for that reason).

As for why some other company never snapped up the rights to DB before Funi did, I heard that the main reason for that is the license for the DB franchise was very expensive and none of the companies that wanted to dub it could afford to do so(that's likely why HG only did 5 episodes and only aired them in a few test markets, because that's all they could afford to do) Funi had the edge because of Gen having an uncle at Toei, so he was able to get the license to dub DB without having to pay through the nose to do so.

Articles like this made me appreciate the risk Funi was taking:https://www.dmagazine.com/publications/ ... wer-mound/

Again, I think this just plays into your false dichotomy; if Gen Fukunaga hadn't used nepotism to get the license when he did, someone would've picked it up. A franchise like that doesn't tend to get overlooked. And I think there are several companies who would've done it infinitely better than Funi. Funi fundamentally mismanaged the franchise at every turn. They fucking skipped 140 episodes of the show, including some of the ones that drew the highest ratings of the run in Japan!

I don't know how expensive Dragon Ball was to pick up, but I'll say this: I don't see much suggestion that price was an issue there, and I'm pretty sure what he's saying about "Dragon Ball was a risk because Hollywood was against it" is... Either a lie, or a deceptive phrasing. I think what he really means is that the move of going into "Re-versioning" foreign media for a western audience was seen as an unusual move given his prior work in... What, small-time radio and TV? I think what he's getting at there is most were saying it'd be better for him to try and move up in TV, radio, and eventually movie production instead of pivoting into "Re-versioning" anime.

Apparently though, Funi had a hard time getting Dragon Ball: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atTdTl3UOzI&t=4m33s
For those unable to access USA YouTube, he says here that basically because Funi was a startup in 1994, Toei didn't want to give such a big franchise to them, but his uncle -- who worked on the live action side -- intervened.
The way he goes on to talk about it, it sounds like basically he saw DBZ, and liked it, and thought it'd be a great fit for the USA. (Which also somewhat explains the later accounts of them desperately trying to get Toei to let them skip DB...)

When did HG have the license taken away? Maybe no one after them but before funi had an interest in it in the US. At least that toei trusted

We've never seen any suggestion that there was ever any lack of interest in the property, to my knowledge.

I never claimed it wouldn't have gotten dubbed at all, but if Funimation didn't exist it likely would've taken a hell of a lot longer for it to have been dubbed in the U.S.. In that case the most likely scenario would've been 4Kids getting their hands on it(which as CureDragon pointed out means the very likely scenario where we either don't get subbed episodes at all or they only get a few token DVD releases before ending like 4Kids short-lived uncut DVDs of Shaman King and Yu-Gi-Oh)

Honestly I don't blame them for skipping DB(and I was never confused by any of the stuff with Piccolo), 4Kids did something similar with Yu-Gi-Oh by skipping the first 27 episodes(mainly because Toei wasn't eager to license them as the lack of card games probably made them a more difficult sell) and that paid off for them.

Look I like DB as much as the next person on here, but it does kind of take some time to really get going and even if it did have better promotion and timeslots in syndication, i'm not too sure it would've been nearly as big as DBZ was. Hell even when DB was airing in prime-time slots on Toonami it's ratings were still nowhere near what DBZ was pulling. Then there's GT which actually was a bigger success here then it was in Japan ironically(where it's ratings while not bad were nowhere near what the series was pulling in it's peak), matter of fact America was one of the only places where GT didn't fail and part of that came down to Funi skipping the first 16 episodes to get right to the episodes that most emulated Z(and then making more money by selling them as "lost episodes" on DVD)

Some shows that are big in Japan and other overseas countries just don't catch on here for whatever reason and that's just the sad truth and no amount of angry words for Funi are going to change that. Just look at Saint Seiya, its been dubbed no less then three times now in the U.S. and it's still nowhere near as big as it is elsewhere, sometimes you just have to accept that certain things just aren't going to catch on here.

So nope, not seeing any "false dichotomy" here at all

[Valerius Dover]

^Slight nitpick, but the Yu-Gi-Oh! situation isn't quite the same. The first 27 episodes are a completely separate series compared to the more well known anime, by Toei rather than Gallop. It just so happens that it only adapts the arcs that the later anime skipped over.

[MasenkoHA]

Exactly, it never fails to amuse me when people try to rewrite history and act like anime would've still been super succesful even without DBZ becoming big.

Because it would have without Dragon Ball Z. Also again another more competent company could have licensed Dragon Ball. You are giving Funimation way too much credit for playing neopotism and failing their way to the top.

I'll grant you it wasn't just Funimation that kickstarted the anime boom(Sailor Moon was getting big ratings on Toonami months before CN picked up DBZ so DiC certainly deserves some credit too) but they undoubtedly played a huge role.

Here’s Roger Ebert, who was about as mainstream as it gets for a movie critic talking about anime in 1999:

https://www.rogerebert.com/rogers-journ ... s-the-mind

Do you honestly think the people he was talking to were little rugrats watching DBZ while eating pizza rolls with their surge?

I never claimed it wouldn't have gotten dubbed at all, but if Funimation didn't exist it likely would've taken a hell of a lot longer for it to have been dubbed in the U.S..

No reason to believe Pioneer or US Renditions or Manga UK wouldn’t have licensed it. The fact that Pionner oversaw the dubbing of the first three Z movies and handled home video distribution of the show during the Saban days would indicate they had some interest it.

There is no basis in the idea that only Funimation would have grabbed it in the mid-90s.

4Kids did something similar with Yu-Gi-Oh by skipping the first 27 episodes(mainly because Toei wasn't eager to license them as the lack of card games probably made them a more difficult sell) and that paid off for them.

False equivalency the two Yu-Gi-Oh shows were different adaptations Toei was only involved with the first 27 episode series. 4kids didn’t skip anything they just licensed the card game series.

Hell even when DB was airing in prime-time slots on Toonami it's ratings were still nowhere near what DBZ was pulling.

Which probably had more to do with it being marketed as a goofy unimportant prequel series. Since Funimation started with DBZ (more or less) there was a perception of what something with Dragon Ball’s name in it should be like. Funimation themselves screwed over the first series.

Not saying Z wouldn’t have done better but Funimation ensured through incompetence that Dragon Ball would do worse than it could have.

[KBABZ]

Boy I sure would LOVE a Kunzait mega post about that. HINT HINT HINT!

Just don't quote the entire thing, mmmkay?

[Planetnamek]

Exactly, it never fails to amuse me when people try to rewrite history and act like anime would've still been super succesful even without DBZ becoming big.

Because it would have without Dragon Ball Z. Also again another more competent company could have licensed Dragon Ball. You are giving Funimation way too much credit for playing neopotism and failing their way to the top.

I'll grant you it wasn't just Funimation that kickstarted the anime boom(Sailor Moon was getting big ratings on Toonami months before CN picked up DBZ so DiC certainly deserves some credit too) but they undoubtedly played a huge role.

Here’s Roger Ebert, who was about as mainstream as it gets for a movie critic talking about anime in 1999:

https://www.rogerebert.com/rogers-journ ... s-the-mind

Do you honestly think the people he was talking to were little rugrats watching DBZ while eating pizza rolls with their surge?

I never claimed it wouldn't have gotten dubbed at all, but if Funimation didn't exist it likely would've taken a hell of a lot longer for it to have been dubbed in the U.S..

No reason to believe Pioneer or US Renditions or Manga UK wouldn’t have licensed it. The fact that Pionner oversaw the dubbing of the first three Z movies and handled home video distribution of the show during the Saban days would indicate they had some interest it.

There is no basis in the idea that only Funimation would have grabbed it in the mid-90s.

4Kids did something similar with Yu-Gi-Oh by skipping the first 27 episodes(mainly because Toei wasn't eager to license them as the lack of card games probably made them a more difficult sell) and that paid off for them.

False equivalency the two Yu-Gi-Oh shows were different adaptations Toei was only involved with the first 27 episode series. 4kids didn’t skip anything they just licensed the card game series.

Hell even when DB was airing in prime-time slots on Toonami it's ratings were still nowhere near what DBZ was pulling.

Which probably had more to do with it being marketed as a goofy unimportant prequel series. Since Funimation started with DBZ (more or less) there was a perception of what something with Dragon Ball’s name in it should be like. Funimation themselves screwed over the first series.

Not saying Z wouldn’t have done better but Funimation ensured through incompetence that Dragon Ball would do worse than it could have.

Not really sure what you're getting at with Ebert, I don't really see how that contradicts anything I said

I don't recall DB being marketed that way at all, besides plenty of things that are poorly marketed still do well anyways. So i'm not convinced that was the sole reason DB didn't do nearly as well.

Again I never claimed only Funi would've grabbed it, just that it likely would've taken much longer to have been dubbed.