The Harmony Gold Dub & Broadcast Audio Discussion Thread

[linkdude20002001]

I just watched the films and can confirm everything you mentioned.

And you know what, I really LIKE this dub. With the exception of Launch, Roshi and Krillin, I think the voices are much better than FUNimation's. Primarily because they sound natural and not forced, like FUNi's. Professional voice actors FTW.

I LOVE this dub. It really blows every other company's attempts out of the water. The ONLY bad choices for voices (Bad rhyme! Go away!) were Lunch's and Oolong's. Lunch's voice cracks me up, though... I know it's wrong, but I love it. Lol. I think their voice for the Turtle Sage is VERY fitting and natural; it's what I've wanted from FUNimation all along. Also, I think Kulilin's voice sounds similar to Kohshiroh Izumi's voice in the English dub of Digimon Adventure. Not as intelligent sounding, though, so I think it fits.

[DerekPadula]

I LOVE this dub. It really blows every other company's attempts out of the water. The ONLY bad choices for voices (Bad rhyme! Go away!) were Lunch's and Oolong's. Lunch's voice cracks me up, though... I know it's wrong, but I love it. Lol. I think their voice for the Turtle Sage is VERY fitting and natural; it's what I've wanted from FUNimation all along. Also, I think Kulilin's voice sounds similar to Kohshiroh Izumi's voice in the English dub of Digimon Adventure. Not as intelligent sounding, though, so I think it fits.

Yeah, I can absolutely understand why you would feel that way. The feeling I had after watching it was, "I wish these actors had continued with the dub, instead of the ones from Texas." If they had, then I could genuinely enjoy the English dub. Granted it had some editing and name change flaws, but that was on the production side. The actors were very good, and the original music was there. If they had over 10 years to make incremental improvements like FUNimation did, I mean, wow. Who knows how good it could have been.

I feel like the actors that I mentioned just kind of played the characters a little too goofy. Especially Lunch. Like, what the heck? But the others were great.

[Ashura]

I actually really enjoy the Kai-cast version of Blood Rubies, and wish the anniversary movie was redubbed using this group. All these movies in general have varying cast in their dubs, since it seems like they were the testing ground for Funimation's voice choices.

I will say I really like the HG dub, though, which is why I've worked so extensively to try to preserve it... odd quirks and all. (Goku's 'quiet, I'm counting!' line is hilarious.)

[linkdude20002001]

FUNi's re-dub of that movie STILL wasn't as good as Harmony Gold's. I found there to be more annoying voices than HG's dub had. Let's see... Turtle Sage, Oolong, and actually...I can't remember what I thought about Bulma... But then there's the characters that have bad voices that just happened to not be in that movie (Thank God!)...

Yeah, I can absolutely understand why you would feel that way. The feeling I had after watching it was, "I wish these actors had continued with the dub, instead of the ones from Texas." If they had, then I could genuinely enjoy the English dub. Granted it had some editing and name change flaws, but that was on the production side. The actors were very good, and the original music was there. If they had over 10 years to make incremental improvements like FUNimation did, I mean, wow. Who knows how good it could have been.

I feel like the actors that I mentioned just kind of played the characters a little too goofy. Especially Lunch. Like, what the heck? But the others were great.

Even FUNi's original cast from Vancouver is no where near as good as Harmony Gold's dub. And the name changes can't really be counted against is any more than FUNi's name changes (and mispronunciations of the ones they didn't change). It's just a shame they cut out scenes and censored dialogue. Guess that can't be helped for a show that aired only on TV.

[Ashura]

I actually really like the new Kai Oolong voice, because they didn't try to give him a stereotypical oink-oink pig voice. I don't mind Roshi's voice really, either, but I can understand why a lot of people do. I will say that Roshi's voice in the HG dub is probably one of the highlights though.

[kei17]

I don't mind Roshi's voice really, either, but I can understand why a lot of people do. I will say that Roshi's voice in the HG dub is probably one of the highlights though.

I don't mind his voice, too. Honestly I never liked other English voices of Kamesen'nin since they sound too anile. On the other hand, his voice in the Harmony Gold dub sounds reliable and powerful enough for a martial-arts master.

[superrayman3]

The ending credits exist, but they seem to lose music sync. This would not be hard to fix, though.

Here's an audio Fix I made: http://hotfile.com/dl/142668458/64fac98 ... e.mp3.html

The audio is mono, and is output to only one side.

My audio fix is stereoized and output is on both sides but I can make it mono 1 sided if you want it that way.

The audio itself is very slightly out of sync.

It also cuts off before the songs ends which my patch fixes.

[Ashura]

Hey Rayman... thanks for the help, though I've already done this all myself. My list was created so we have a reference as to what raw materials are currently available to send to Harmony Gold on our end and the state it's in.

[Super Sonic]

With guys talking about how they liked this dub I have to ask, and this is towards the Americans, if this dub had been the series, think you would've watched it the same way guys watch the dub nowadays, or as many anime dubs of the 80s like guys watch US cartoons and with anime senses off?

[Ashura]

Probably more like dubs in the 80s with nostalgia goggles. Which isn't to say they're bad or anything, but there's a certain amount of 'childlike wonderment' which can come with watching something you saw as a kid that can cloud your mind.

I also think if it was popular... we would be stuck with names like Zero and what have you even today. Much like Rockman is now and forever Megaman here, and Akumajou Dracula is Castlevania (much better name).

[Super Sonic]

Know what you mean. Watching through my Voltron dvds now and am still enjoying it, despite now I can tell when some characters who were hurt were likely killed in Go-Lion. I also kind of interpreted that they're more competant as they keep guys from dying more.

[superrayman3]

Hey Rayman... thanks for the help, though I've already done this all myself.

Well I didn't really know that you had already fixed the opening theme during the end credits since it wasnt mentioned in your list, besides I thougt i'd contribute something to help with the project .

My list was created so we have a reference as to what raw materials are currently available to send to Harmony Gold on our end and the state it's in.

And I'm very glad you made the list because it really helps not only HG but also the people here that are interested in this dub and want to keep track of how much progress thats been made easily.

[DerekPadula]

Quick update to say I called the stations today.

Philly57, now CBS3, said there is a 0% chance of having the tapes because they are now a news only station. They are owned by CW but only report the news. They recommended I call the CW headquarters.

Channel62 in Detroit is also owned by CW. I was forwarded to a man named Tony but he wasn't there, so I left a message.

TV20 Detroit, I left a message.

Then I called the CW headquarters in Burbank. They said they don't have anything like that, but after digging further about an archives department or somebody who might know about the archives, she gave the number to their archives department in a separate CW location, in an unknown city. So I called that and left a message. The secretary said it may be necessary to call TOEI in Japan.

That got me thinking, and I decided to call FUNimation directly. I got in touch with Gen Fukunaga's personal assistant and left a message on her voice mail explaining what we're doing and how we're collaborating with Tommy Yune at Harmony Gold, and how we're looking for the tapes. Might as well go right to the current Dragon Ball owners and see if they've got any. Maybe some random fan sent it to them, or maybe HG shipped it to FUNi years ago. We'll see what turns up.

Then I tried to get in touch with Christopher Sabat, but I realized that he no longer works at FUNimation. He works at his own company, Okratron 5000. There was no pickup and no answering machine. I'll try again tomorrow. I have to get in touch with him anyway for an interview request, so this will be a good reason to do so.

Basically, no results no far.

[superrayman3]

Thanks for the update Derek, it's a bit disappointing that philly57, and the station that owns it (CW) don't have the tapes. That leaves Channel62 (posibly if Tony can be reached) TV20 Detroit and Funimation, so far the odds haven't been our favor but there's still a decent chance left, also I think you made a good choice by letting Funimatio know what we're doing we might actually get pretty good results if we can get them involved with this.

[Ashura]

That got me thinking, and I decided to call FUNimation directly. I got in touch with Gen Fukunaga's personal assistant and left a message on her voice mail explaining what we're doing and how we're collaborating with Tommy Yune at Harmony Gold, and how we're looking for the tapes. Might as well go right to the current Dragon Ball owners and see if they've got any. Maybe some random fan sent it to them, or maybe HG shipped it to FUNi years ago. We'll see what turns up.

Thanks for the update. Unfortunate news, but it leads me to an old old old rec.arts.anime post I read a long time ago:

Well guys, after further information gathering, i think i've found out
whats really going on with Funimation and the dubbed Dragon Ball tape
that i've seen.

First off, from what it sounds like, this probably IS the harmony gold
version from years ago... But as far as i can figure it, and from what
i've heard from the vidoe guy at capital, this first tape of the first DB
movie was purchased outright from harmony gold by funimation with
the purpose of being sort of a "sample" tape for them to send to TV
stations... something to show them to get the TV station programmers
interested in picking up the rest of the series... I guess we should thin
kof it as the american Dragon Ball pilot episode...

Supposedly, the video i've seen will either be released like an OAV in
video stores when the series airs, or won't be used at all... I guess
i've been told that most of the other movies might also be released on
video here as a tie in to the series...

I've ALSO been told that the American TV series WILL be made from the
japanese TV series, most likely.

It all boils down to this-- IF funimation is going to release the first
movie to stores, AS IS, that means they will have to keep the cheesy
names that harmony gold stuck them with... and use them in the TV
episodes also... but since Oolong ewas called Chester in this video, and
someone said he was called something else in the HG dub, i thin kwe are
seeing the level of dub quality we're going to get from funimation...

Oh well, aside form the names being changed, I guess the video i saw
wasnt really all that bad. I suppose kids will like it, but they think
MMPR is the pinnacle of tv excellence, so what do THEY know??

When all is said and done, I guess all we can really do is sit and wait
for the premeire episode to air on tv in september...

I'm sure i'll still be watching it every week when it does come out...
even a little mangled, DB is STILL heaps better than anything else on
american tv <new japanese imports excluded of course >. I'm just
praying for some imported DB toys from bandai.. maybe some plushes or
somehting? But with my luck they'll be "americanized" toys.. "yes, even
though they have big eyes and look a certain way in the show, kids wont
like them un;less they look like g.i. joe dolls..."

Oh well.

I've got my subs, at least

-Matt-

The utter bizarreness of it all. The mention of Oolong as Chester leads me to believe this might have been some other dub (or something made up by said dude.) I'm trying to find this guy's first message about it, but Google Groups won't let me bring up all his posts for some reason.

EDIT: He seems to post more here, but it's mostly only historically interesting. Keep reading the thread for some reaction posts by Wuken, someone whom people might recognize from the olden days of the community.

[Ashura]

Found his initial post here:

well, Afriend of mine works at capital city, and managed to get a
preview copy of what i'm assuming is going to be the first two american
TV episodes. I've got a lot to say, and i'm not sure what to make of it
all...

1) Opening theme-- Typical power rangers type music and lyrics... they
tossed out the original japanese music as well as re-dubbing it into
something pretty.... well, bland.

2) THIS IS NOT THE JAPANESE TV SHOW THEY'RE SHOWING

in a surprising move on funimations part, they chose to use the first
Dragon Ball MOVIE instead of working with the TV episodes. This worked
to their advantage in sopme respects, but i think harmed them in others.

o the movie is a lot les etchi, so the prob;lem with the naughty bits
seen in the TV episodes is solved here. I suppose it would have been
near impossible to use the original material without serious hacking.

o BUT, as anyone who's seen the first db movie knows, it isnt the 'real'
story, and is like a condensed version of the first 25 or so episodes
into a 45 minute film... Goku meets bulma, oolong, kame, yamcha and puar
in the first episode! YIKES! all the trade mags I've seen have constatly
hyped how DB has so many episodes, it could be around forever! "this
series has legs!" to quote a cap city article... Unfortunately, i
belivee there are only 3 z-less DB movies, which basically gives them 6
half hour shows to work with. NOW, we know they're going to have 13
episodes, so how is this going to work? Are they going to shoot right
into the DBZ movies after that?? or have i somehow gotten a tape thatwill
be like a video only release? I have no idea. All i know is that they
are going to HAVE to use the TV show sooner or later if they want this to
air more than the 13 weeks they're talking about... After seeing this,
I'm pretty sure that DB will never achieve the success here that it has
in other european countries <this is another point retailer mags like to
hype>. The europeans get to see the REAL tv show. I can see know why
they made this a once a week show.

o NAME CHANGES NAME CHANGES NAME CHANGES!!!

goddammit... i KNEW they were going to do this, but it hurt just as much
anyway when i heard all the character's new improved "american" names i
couldnt help but cringe. Here's a list:

1) Goku becomes Zero

what the hell!? this AGAIN?? ever since harmony gold did their own
version years ago, this has been the name they used. WHY? is Goku harder
to say? do they LIKE having a character with a name that is so stupid?
yes, please name me after a symbol that means nothing, nada, zippo. Hi,
I'm zero.. why yes, you ARE basically worthless, arent you?

a) Kintoun becomes Flying Nimbus- ok, i can understand this one.

b) KAME HAME HA becomes KUH-MEH-HUH-MEH-HUH: yes, for some reason
known only to the goofballs in charge, they keep the same word but
pronounce it like the hawaiian king for crissake!!! WHAT are they
thinking here? deliberate attempt to cause fan spazzing <^_^>

2) Bulma/Bloomer becomes Leena

ok, ok.. i guess i can see this one... but since her name is a joke based
on english anyway, why not keep it? wont kids american kids find it funny
too? or do they figger no one knows what bloomers are anymore? Dont
forget also that her name is CLEARLY on her shirt at the beginning of the
whole movie... guess they figger kids are too dumb to wonder about that.

(here's one of my personal faves)

3) OOlong becomes...... Chester! ROTFLMAO

yes, my favorite shape changing pig is now known as Chester to american
audiences... Ok, the word is weird, but again, it is a word that exists
in the english language, and gives a clue to his chinese influence (other
wise why the whole communist outfit he wears?).. so why not keep it?
Would it kill them to leave a few things alone, or give kids credit to
having an ounce of intelligence? take robotech for example.. ok, they
changed the pure japanese names, but kept them mostly unchanged where
they could... in a fantasy world, poeple expect exotic names dont they?

(another real favorite of mine...)

4) They take the very exotic and strange name Yamcha and change it into:

SADAKI!

NANI!? I can understand wanting to change names into dopey american
ones... but why take a strange name, and change it into another equally
strange name? Just for the sake of change I guess.

a) Puuar becomes Prudence- yamchas buddy switches genders as well as
gains a british accent (?) go figgure. can understand the change
I guess....

5) Mutenroshi/Kame-sennin becomes Master Roshi/Turtle Hermit

ok, finally they get a name as close to the original as possible.

------------------------------

Ok, calming down now... lets see... in non fan mode now, i can admit that
the animation was sharp and was fast paced, and if i was a kid i guess i
would like this show. The dubbing is typically poor, or should i say the
same as most other saturday morning cartoons... lame jokes, some voices
that dont 'fit'... Goku loses all of his naivette, his sense of being
continually baffled by new things.. he becomes almost too old and 'hip'..
he just seems too aware of whats going on <^_^>.. more so than usual.

My friend who wathed it with me, a non fan who'd never seen DB before,
told me that he enjoyed it. I guess that means I'm too sensitive to all
of this stuff, and am nitpicking. sigh.. what else is new...

All in all, I guess non fans will enjoy it. i wonder what they are going
to do after the first movies run out, and for some reason, i just DON'T
think that this show will achieve the same popularity here as in other
countries.... I almost expect to see a Dragon Ball Adventures comic from
arcie or something come out of this show... redrawn by americans of
course... I also dont have much hope for the toy line, but i'll try not
to be too negative before i see whats going to happnen...

Waiting with trepidation,

-Matt-

Interestingly, the names match up with the HG version EXCEPT for Chester and ... Prudence? Ha ha. For some reason this leads me to think that maybe initially Funimation dubbed Blood Rubies using mostly names Toei gave them and then changed their mind a bit later on.

If you look at the initial Blood Rubies dub from Funimation, Bulma has a completely different voice, too, and as such seems like it was dubbed much earlier than the series. I wonder if they had pickups to change the names eventually to match the final version of the series?

[linkdude20002001]

Also, the movie had clips from the TV series added in after the fact. What was released on VHS and DVD probably wasn't the way they originally made it before going on to the TV series.

[Super Sonic]

If you look at the initial Blood Rubies dub from Funimation, Bulma has a completely different voice, too, and as such seems like it was dubbed much earlier than the series. I wonder if they had pickups to change the names eventually to match the final version of the series?

In a way I wouldn't be surprised as Curse of the Blood Rubies premiered on tv about a month or so before the tv series did kinda like a pilot. And it's been awhile since I've seen it, so can't really say for Bulma. (Need to watch again as I have the dvd). But do know the little girl who played Penny on that dub and later Chi-Chi in those initial 13 eps is now playing 2 popular cartoon characters that some friends of mine are fond of.

[linkdude20002001]

With guys talking about how they liked this dub I have to ask, and this is towards the Americans, if this dub had been the series, think you would've watched it the same way guys watch the dub nowadays, or as many anime dubs of the 80s like guys watch US cartoons and with anime senses off?

If this had been the dub, I'd actually enjoy watching the English dub. It still wouldn't be 100% Dragon Ball because of censorship, Lunch's voice, and the name changes, but that's still a fairly small complaint list considering this is an English dub of Dragon Ball we're taking about here. Lol.

[DerekPadula]

Hey everybody. Update time.

Channel 62 Detroit does not have them. All of their tapes were dumped a long time ago, and now they simply stream content over a satellite feed. She suggested I call UPN or Paramount, their parent company. But I don't really feel like doing that.

TV20 Detroit does not have them either. They are now owned by some company in Texas. But she had no idea who.

After multiple calls trying to get through to FUNimation, I left a message on Justin Cook's voicemail. Apparently he's in charge of all this stuff.

Called Okratron 5000, nobody there again, and no answering machine.

Then I just decided to call Gen Fukunaga himself. Unfortunately he wasn't there, so I left a message. But now he knows that we're collaborating with Tommy and what we're trying to do. I assume he's a busy guy, so I'm not sure if I'll receive a call back.

So where does this leave us? Unless we find some more leads about where the tapes aired, it kind of leaves us twiddling our thumbs.

Hopefully we'll get some good info from Tommy's dinner party, or maybe FUNimation will call us back.