Onikage725 wrote:Piccolo doesn't really do morality lectures though. Yeah, slightly while against Freeza, but that was heavily influenced by Nail too. It was pretty obvious that the fusion with Namek's greatest warrior is where Piccolo's newfound sense of civic pride came from. I know the Gero thing is probably the most glaring example, but it does best serve my point.
An explanation of how Gero utterly failed to understand how ki works becomes:
"The more you hurt others, the harder your life becomes. Its simple, your desire to kill is killing you. *Cuts off hand* You could have put this hand to good use! What a waste of technology."
I'm sorry, but a world of no.
I agree that there are some unnecisary changes to Piccolo's dailouge. Such as when Chaozu blew himself him against Nappa.
"He blew himself up to take out an enemy. He's won my respect."
became...
"You see Gohan, it doesn't matter how small you are. The most important thing is heart"
So I can understand how certain lines changes can irk you as it even irks me, someone who loves the Dub.
But at the same time, once even the Saiyans arrive, Piccolo seems to have a sense of "I'm gonna defend my planet". He said lines like "The earth won't go down so easy". So I think even before his fusion with Nail he had some "civic pride". But IDK, maybe it's just that it's what I am used to. But the morality speeches once he arrives on Namek just seem well put in there. We know that Piccolo has them much later on atleast. So it's not completely out of character. But one way to look at it is, Piccolo gains his civic pride not because of Nail's influence. Because Nail doesn't actually give any influence. But Piccolo gained Nail's knowledge of Namek's past and this gained his own form of respect for the planet once he knew of everything. So those morality speeches to Freeza really did come from Piccolo and not Nail.
Onikage725 wrote:Again I think it is a measure of degrees. Goku isn't really out of character in the dub, but they do ham up the moral angle to near Captain America levels. Its like the took the "parody of Superman" angle and ran with it the the nth degree. Prime example, when telling Freeza of his dual origins and how his power was awakaned by rage, dub Goku goes on about how he is the "hope of the universe, the answer to all living things that cry out for peace, protector of the innocent, the light in the darkness, truth."
I agree with you 100%. In the Freeza Saga some of Goku's lines were over the top (regardless of how much I may love some of them). But after the Freeza Saga, they tone down the heroic speeches. The Dub still has more than the Original but still less than in the Freeza Saga. In addition, Post-Freeza, the Dub tones them down so they are not too over the top. The Dub Heroic Speeches Post-Freeza do sound like things the Original Goku would say (mostly).
Onikage725 wrote:I just doesnt doesnt help how a lot of these themes really suck. Like I said, roughly any scene involving Bulma on Namek had this ridiculously annoying theme that makes me cringe.
I really don't think the Themes suck. But too each his own. Though I full heartidly agree with you on the Bulma/Namek stuff. Regardless of how much I dislike Bulma's Namek Theme, to me, it's still her theme. Thus for me a scene would not seem the same without it.
Kunzait_83 wrote:I agree with you on all points, save one (and it's a big one); the fact that his insults in the dub are often retarded grade school bullshit that no one over the age of 18 never mind someone who comes from royalty would be caught dead spouting off. "Overgrown Wind-Up Toy" was about as close to this as he came in Japanese. In the dub he was given such non-gems as "Being a good fiend is like being a photographer…you have to search for the right moment!"
But that's my point. Vegeta uses those child'ish insults specifically to mock his opponents. Kind of like "you're not even good enough for me to use a real insult"
kunzait_83 wrote:First off, Vegeta never looses the royalty tinge to his voice because he never let's go of the fact that he was once the prince of a warrior race. He's stuck in the past, stuck in his "glory days" and he never shuts up about being the "prince" of himself, a bunch of half-breeds, and an airheaded full blood who could give two shits less about his alien heritage. So him keeping that grandiose royal voice makes perfect sense and is totally within character. It's one of those subtle character beats that goes completely over FUNimation's heads nine times out of ten.
Well I agree that Vegeta never lets go of this, but FUNi does make sure to make you realize how much he cares about this title. I think the Dub mentions it more than the original. But I feel that as a hardened warrior, the character of Vegeta doesn't need that royal tone. Because he's a warrior first and a prince second. Swallowing his pride for years with Freeza could also have a lack of royal tone and more of a pissy tone.
kunzait_83 wrote:I... agree that Piccolo toned down the arrogance a tad once he reincarnated himself. And I agree once he fuses with Kami he becomes more of a sagelike wiseman character. But pre-Kami fusion... I wouldn't call Piccolo "wise" as in "Yoda-wise", so much as "crafty". "Street smart" even. Wisom implies feelings and knowledge about far more than how to fight real good; it implies a basic understanding of human nature.
You make a good point, but after those 5 extra years before Raditz appeared, I think the character of Piccolo got a better grasp on not only human nature in a sense. But just the ways of the world. You don't actually have to know much about the nature of humans to be wise. But rather my perception of "wise" would be someone who knows how to handle any situation. Be that fighting or not. Someone who can keep his cool under a pressure situation and someone who's persona s basically the rock of the group. If you can look for them to guidance in a situation then they are wise. Which Piccolo does become that by the time Nappa and Vegeta arrive.
kunzait_83 wrote:Again, I disagree. The music even in the action scenes is much more "epic" in tone. It carries the vibe of an old Kung Fu film. DBZ isn't as much about "save the planet"... well I mean yeah that element is there... but the dub, via the voices, script, and music gives the series the misleading feel of a "superhero" show. And it's not. The Z Senshi are not the Justice League. It's a martial arts show about martial artists. It always has been and it always will be.
But the King Piccolo Era and on is kind of both. Think of all of the time that is spent preparing specifically to defend the earth. A year here, 3 years here. Yes, they are martial artists, and live their life as so. But at the same time become the sole hope of the planet and universe. They even acknowlege this, so in a sense they really are super heroes. But not your typical ones. They are not defined "Super Heroes" but rather "Protectors". Regardless of that fact, the musical style can fit both super heroes and what the Z-fighters are, "Protectors"
