ArchedThunder wrote:Could there be any particular reason why they are only just now starting to use 2nd Key Animators more regularly in Super? And why don't they use more like some other shows do? I can't imagine they are too expensive and as I said earlier it seems like it would be very beneficial to the show.
I guess shows like One Piece don't really need them since action scenes aren't as common as most battle shounen, and well, their schedule seems pretty good.
I think their use on Super is all part of Toei's mad patchwork plan to keep things together. It lets good action animators like Higashide pump out lots of work without having to worry about polishing things to his normal standard. I think the start of his cut in the latest episode was finished up by 2nd KAs which is why it's a lot less on-model than the main bulk of it.
As for why now? I think they're really banking on this Future Trunks arc being a big success. I don't think the Universe 6 arc provided the level of enthusiasm they wanted, and so they're pulling out all the stops to try and ensure this arc works out just fine.
I think they're out to eliminate episodes like 33 and 41. Though that's just me being optimistic.
But why aren't they using more though? I mean there are episodes of other shows with tons of 2nd Key Animators, but Super usually has about 3 to 5.
Maybe we'll see more later in the arc.
Anime Kitten wrote:What was in EP33 and 41? Was 33 the episode in which they mentioned Uub?
33 was Goku vs Botamo and Frost, 41 was Super Shenlong's summoning.
Anime Kitten wrote:I see. What would they be eliminating them then?
By eliminating episodes like them he means particularly badly animated stuff. Goku vs Botamo was really stiff and jank (Goku vs Frost wasn't great, but was passable compared to the Botamo fight), while 41 had two laughable shots during the summoning that used digital motion where there should have been actual animation.
Oh, wow. I knew the summoning was bad, but that Botamo fight... Yeah, hopefully they'll help stuff like that. I wonder if the Blu-ray releases will adjust them at all.
Anime Kitten wrote:Oh, wow. I knew the summoning was bad, but that Botamo fight... Yeah, hopefully they'll help stuff like that. I wonder if the Blu-ray releases will adjust them at all.
Botamo fight is already on bluray, no changes. Hopefully they draw some frames for the summoning when that comes out on bluray.
They didn't change the most awful animated fight in the history of Dragon Ball? What an insult to the fans. I was really hoping they do that in the blu-ray.
-BD3 corrections-
Their priorities when correcting are questionable.
They fixed a lot of Bulma shots and all of them were okay, while much worst stuff didn't get any correction.
A world without Dragon Ball is just boring.
Favourite old DB Animators: Masaki Sato and Tadayoshi Yamamuro
Favourite new DB Animators: Yuya Takahashi and Chikashi Kubota
PMD wrote:They didn't change the most awful animated fight in the history of Dragon Ball? What an insult to the fans. I was really hoping they do that in the blu-ray.
R-really?
For me, Grade III Trunks versus Cell is the worst looking fight "in the history of Dragon Ball." Barely any animation, consistently off-model drawings, everyone's randomly bulkier than the bulkiest of bulky they should be, chins are enormous, the shading went to crap, blah blah blah.
I, uh, WOULD encourage folks to perhaps not be so overdramatic and hyperbolic . If you're going to be, you better back that up with more than just a single sentence...!
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PMD wrote:They didn't change the most awful animated fight in the history of Dragon Ball? What an insult to the fans. I was really hoping they do that in the blu-ray.
R-really?
For me, Grade III Trunks versus Cell is the worst looking fight "in the history of Dragon Ball." Barely any animation, consistently off-model drawings, everyone's randomly bulkier than the bulkiest of bulky they should be, chins are enormous, the shading went to crap, blah blah blah.
I, uh, WOULD encourage folks to perhaps not be so overdramatic and hyperbolic . If you're going to be, you better back that up with more than just a single sentence...!
Are you talking about the Uchiyama drawn episode towards the end of that fight?
I thought everything up till then looked pretty great, but I might be forgetting some of it.
EDIT: Oh, you might also be referring to episode 163, the one key animated by Ebisawa?
VegettoEX wrote:For me, Grade III Trunks versus Cell is the worst looking fight "in the history of Dragon Ball." Barely any animation, consistently off-model drawings, everyone's randomly bulkier than the bulkiest of bulky they should be, chins are enormous, the shading went to crap, blah blah blah.
I'll have to look that up. By the way, I thought you were on staff vacation.
PMD wrote:They didn't change the most awful animated fight in the history of Dragon Ball? What an insult to the fans. I was really hoping they do that in the blu-ray.
R-really?
For me, Grade III Trunks versus Cell is the worst looking fight "in the history of Dragon Ball." Barely any animation, consistently off-model drawings, everyone's randomly bulkier than the bulkiest of bulky they should be, chins are enormous, the shading went to crap, blah blah blah.
I, uh, WOULD encourage folks to perhaps not be so overdramatic and hyperbolic . If you're going to be, you better back that up with more than just a single sentence...!
Are you talking about the Uchiyama drawn episode towards the end of that fight?
I thought everything up till then looked pretty great, but I might be forgetting some of it.
EDIT: Oh, you might also be referring to episode 163, the one key animated by Ebisawa?
The Grade III Trunks/Perfect Cell fight was really nothing special. Hell, it even barely a fight to begin with. Now Grade II Vegeta vs Perfect Cell, on the other hand... Woof. That fight was awful. And it ranks among the worst fights in the franchise. Shit fight choreography, off-model animation... just bad in every aspect. The only saving grace about that battle was the cathartic feeling I got of Vegeta getting his ass kicked as a result of being an idiot.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
PMD wrote:They didn't change the most awful animated fight in the history of Dragon Ball? What an insult to the fans. I was really hoping they do that in the blu-ray.
R-really?
For me, Grade III Trunks versus Cell is the worst looking fight "in the history of Dragon Ball." Barely any animation, consistently off-model drawings, everyone's randomly bulkier than the bulkiest of bulky they should be, chins are enormous, the shading went to crap, blah blah blah.
I, uh, WOULD encourage folks to perhaps not be so overdramatic and hyperbolic . If you're going to be, you better back that up with more than just a single sentence...!
I rewatched Trunks vs Perfect Cell and it's not even comparable to Goku vs Botamo as it's much better. Goku vs Botamo is incredibly bad, I don't think there's a single battle in all the Dragon Ball franchise that is as bad as that is. It's quite a shame they didn't want to fix it for the Blu-Ray release. At least Botamo is a very forgettable character, had Goku vs Hit been so badly animated many more people would have stopped watching this show.
As of now though, the animation is getting a lot better but I still dislike how off-model the art is sometimes (except for Black)
And the sequence of Goku and Black punching each others was really bad and they even got Goku's SSJ2 hair wrong on that part. They also got his hair wrong when he was against Trunks and they could have done a better job with SSJ2 Trunks' hair.
悟 “Vincit qui se vincit”
What I consider canonical
Spoiler:
Dragon Ball Manga
Jaco: The Galactic Patrolman
Yo! Son Goku and Friends Return
Additional lore from Toriyama
Dragon Ball Daima
PMD wrote:They didn't change the most awful animated fight in the history of Dragon Ball? What an insult to the fans. I was really hoping they do that in the blu-ray.
Are we too old to enjoy new Dragon Ball movies/series?
Spoiler:
Nickolaidas wrote: Sun Jun 14, 2015 2:10 am
Guys, I'm going to be straight with you. If you feel the show has gotten 'silly' ... it hasn't. You're just 'too old for this shit'. Seriously, 95% of the people in those boards do not fit the target demographic of the show, so don't expect the show to be 'everything you hoped for'. I'm referring to the people here who expect Super to be rich with dark moments, serious storytelling, meaningful characters etc etc. It won't. It's a show for kids. A show for kids being kids. Everyone in those boards has a manchild in him/her, clamoring to get out, and that's fine. But having unrealistic expectations (such as believing the show grew up alongside you) is naïve at best. Honestly, do you take seriously a story where the supposed God of Destruction halts his urges to blow up stuff in order to eat ice cream sundae? That's the show's silliness at full force, take it for what it is. The show hasn't matured one bit, so don't expect it too. Again, I'm not saying that's a bad thing. I'm saying *that* is DB and always will be.
emperior wrote:
As of now though, the animation is getting a lot better but I still dislike how off-model the art is sometimes (except for Black)
And the sequence of Goku and Black punching each others was really bad and they even got Goku's SSJ2 hair wrong on that part. They also got his hair wrong when he was against Trunks and they could have done a better job with SSJ2 Trunks' hair.
When you say the scene of Goku and Black punching eachother do you mean when they clashed fists? I honestly thought that was one of the best parts of that fight.
. If you're going to be, you better back that up with more than just a single sentence...!
