"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[jjgp1112]

ArchedThunder, not that I disagree with you as I share the same thoughts, but when did they officially explain the green Time Rings were for alternate futures? Again, that's the likely explanation and I subscribe to it, but my memory is failing for when the characters referred to its use as such.

When Gowasu first introduces them, he says the green rings are created by somebody creating a new timeline by traveling in time and changing history.

[Nejishiki]

I've slept on it, and my mind is still boggled! But right now, what seems most logical is that Beerus believes he kills Zamasu, thus fixing everything since it would theoretically prevent him from going to the future...but the fact that Zamasu's already there means that he did get the opportunity to go, so he must have survived and managed to regenerate himself. You'd think Gokuu would've mentioned oh, by the way, he's immortal, so you better use some special method to kill him and make goddamn sure it worked, but maybe Zamasu's wish for immortality included some feature that made him truly unkillable, thus he was able to trick them into thinking he died. Because, really, if the Zamasu in the future is the same one from our timeline, none of this makes sense unless he survives: the same circumstances that pushed him closer to the edge of the dark side (Gokuu visiting and disrespectfully insisting they spar) lead to him supposedly being stopped by Beerus just a few days later. If there's no possible situation in which he both turned to the dark side and had an opportunity to travel to the future, then there's no way he could be in the future if he was never able to go. Therefore, he has to survive for this to work! I don't know if I'm making any sense! And now I'm using lot of exclamation points! But yeah, for now I'm gonna assume Beerus fails to kill him.

It's difficult to gather without the context, but I'll assume that they're assuming Future Zamasu is just Zamasu casually traveling with the Time Ring. In other words, it isn't an alternate version of him to them. We, the audience, know that Future Zamasu is a separate character thanks to his dialogue and already being informed of the situations. You're making sense. We just have to remember we're viewing others work this out. It's just like a mystery novel in which the reader may figure out a clue before the characters do.

When Gowasu was explaining what the time rings were he said the top row (green ones) are created when someone makes a split timeline.

Thanks!

[TheMikado]

Do you think Zamasu will kill Gowasu twice? Because killing him once should only mean that he pops straight up with a halo in his head.

Can you even do that?

[Doctor.]

Do you think Zamasu will kill Gowasu twice? Because killing him once should only mean that he pops straight up with a halo in his head.

Can you even do that?

Do what? Kill someone twice? Yeah, Goku warns a dead Vegeta that he'll cease to exist if Kid Boo kills him.

[ekrolo2]

Neither Zamasu or Black are shown wearing a green time ring. They had a silver ring. Again if they were that, it literally falls right into the Future Zamasu and Present Zamasu are the exact same person as he's shown in the present and Future. Then there's the whole magically being ridiculously stronger so without them being different, Present Zamasu somehow improves in barely any time at all. Then there's the whole no point of fucking around with a future alternate time for no reason over his own timeline. The one in the future won't magically fade away as we've already had this discussion with the cyborgs. Killing Zamasu here only prevents this future. It doesn't suddenly make the Future Zamasu not exist. Zamasu exists in Trunks timeline no matter what. He lives in the same world.

Even then, the theory that present and future Zamasu are the same guy gets shaky when you consider the fact present Zamasu isn't immortal yet. Meaning that present Zamasu has to survive Beerus killing him, last an unspecified amount of time into the main timeline's future then travel to Trunks' timeline where he kills Trunks' Zamasu and then threatens Trunks' timeline.

[TheMikado]

I've slept on it, and my mind is still boggled! But right now, what seems most logical is that Beerus believes he kills Zamasu, thus fixing everything since it would theoretically prevent him from going to the future...but the fact that Zamasu's already there means that he did get the opportunity to go, so he must have survived and managed to regenerate himself. You'd think Gokuu would've mentioned oh, by the way, he's immortal, so you better use some special method to kill him and make goddamn sure it worked, but maybe Zamasu's wish for immortality included some feature that made him truly unkillable, thus he was able to trick them into thinking he died. Because, really, if the Zamasu in the future is the same one from our timeline, none of this makes sense unless he survives: the same circumstances that pushed him closer to the edge of the dark side (Gokuu visiting and disrespectfully insisting they spar) lead to him supposedly being stopped by Beerus just a few days later. If there's no possible situation in which he both turned to the dark side and had an opportunity to travel to the future, then there's no way he could be in the future if he was never able to go. Therefore, he has to survive for this to work! I don't know if I'm making any sense! And now I'm using lot of exclamation points! But yeah, for now I'm gonna assume Beerus fails to kill him.

It's difficult to gather without the context, but I'll assume that they're assuming Future Zamasu is just Zamasu casually traveling with the Time Ring. In other words, it isn't an alternate version of him to them. We, the audience, know that Future Zamasu is a separate character thanks to his dialogue and already being informed of the situations. You're making sense. We just have to remember we're viewing others work this out. It's just like a mystery novel in which the reader may figure out a clue before the characters do.

When Gowasu was explaining what the time rings were he said the top row (green ones) are created when someone makes a split timeline.

Thanks!

That's true they technically haven't established that Zamasu and Black are definitely linked until this past episode.

[dbzfan7]

Black is the only one shown wearing a silver time ring, we having seen Zamasu in the future wearing one at all yet.
As for Zamasu's strength in the future we don't know how much time has passed for him, it could have been years.
As for why he's in Trunks's timeline, who knows, just because we don't have an explanation yet doesn't mean it doesn't happen.

We don't even know they're the same Zamasu. You essentially made up your own theory. It could be true, but that doesn't change the fact that Trunks would have his own Zamasu anyways. He has essentially the same universe as Goku. Zamasu wouldn't just not exist in his universe.

I don't know why you're having such a hard time understanding this, the time rings DO NOT function the same as Trunks's time machine. Trunks traveling back to his own past creates a new timeline, but traveling to the future with the time rings does NOT create a new timeline. Killing Zamasu before he time travels would in theory stop everything from happening.

Something that we can't even say is the SAME Zamasu. We see only one time ring, which is the silver one. We do not see any green ring on him. Then he asks to know about Goku, so what does that have anything to do with Trunks? He just picks Trunks future for the lolz instead of practically every other one. That's even if he used any time rings to begin with.

[ArchedThunder]

It's difficult to gather without the context, but I'll assume that they're assuming Future Zamasu is just Zamasu casually traveling with the Time Ring. In other words, it isn't an alternate version of him to them. We, the audience, know that Future Zamasu is a separate character thanks to his dialogue and already being informed of the situations. You're making sense. We just have to remember we're viewing others work this out. It's just like a mystery novel in which the reader may figure out a clue before the characters do.

We don't know if they are different Zamasus, unless by different you mean the same Zamasu, just the one in the future is the same one from an undetermined amount of time in the future and not the Zamasu of Trunks's timeline.

[jjgp1112]

Basically, the way I see it, the Silver ring takes them to the future of their specific timeline while the green ones take them to the alternate timelines. So perhaps Zamasu in the near future of the main timeline takes the ring that just so happens to be linked to Trunks' era and goes there.

The Zamasu that shows up for the fight can't be from Trunks' timeline, because how else would he know Goku? I mean, maybe it's possible that he just so happened to meet Goku in the heavens, but I doubt Toei would spend so much time showing us how the present Zamasu developed into a villain, particularly the fact that his fight with Goku in the main timeline is what accelerated his descent into evil in the first place, if he were a different version.

[SSJ God Gogeta]

Do you think Zamasu will kill Gowasu twice? Because killing him once should only mean that he pops straight up with a halo in his head.

That would be pretty hilarious if it happened.

[Sodhi]

Do you guys see a reason why the bond between kaishin and hakaishin would have been brought up?. Any theories?

[ArchedThunder]

We don't even know they're the same Zamasu. You essentially made up your own theory. It could be true, but that doesn't change the fact that Trunks would have his own Zamasu anyways. He has essentially the same universe as Goku. Zamasu wouldn't just not exist in his universe.

Um, yeah? I said this is what the implication seems to be, not that it is a fact that the Zamasu in the future is from the regular timeline.
The Universes exist in physical space next to each other, all of the split timelines should affect the entire multiverse. If the Zamasu they fought in the future is from this timeline they shouldn't have to worry about the Zamasu from Trunks's timeline.

Something that we can't even say is the SAME Zamasu. We see only one time ring, which is the silver one. We do not see any green ring on him. Then he asks to know about Goku, so what does that have anything to do with Trunks? He just picks Trunks future for the lolz instead of practically every other one. That's even if he used any time rings to begin with.

Why are you acting like I'm stating that it is a fact that Zamasu is from the regular timeline? All I said is that seems to be the implication. If he is from the regular timeline they will probably explain all this, so there is no reason to act like it doesn't make sense when you aren't even looking at the full story.

[Nejishiki]

It's difficult to gather without the context, but I'll assume that they're assuming Future Zamasu is just Zamasu casually traveling with the Time Ring. In other words, it isn't an alternate version of him to them. We, the audience, know that Future Zamasu is a separate character thanks to his dialogue and already being informed of the situations. You're making sense. We just have to remember we're viewing others work this out. It's just like a mystery novel in which the reader may figure out a clue before the characters do.

We don't know if they are different Zamasus, unless by different you mean the same Zamasu, just the one in the future is the same one from an undetermined amount of time in the future and not the Zamasu of Trunks's timeline.

To simplify it, I just mean that they're "different people" in the same sense the original and current Future Trunks are "different people". The Zamasu of the alternate future is immortalized and his prose is harsher from the one we're introduced to (He's developing into that Future Zamasu though). I understand the terminology can get confusing, so hopefully I conveyed the heart of my words!

[dragonballhero]

[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

That is not how the timelines work. Killing Zamasu in the present does absolutely nothing for the future. We've known that since Multi-verse time travel was explained.

Personally, I feel that Present Zamasu's going to pull a Cell/Majin Buu/Baby on Beerus. Also, you're right. I REALLY hope Toriyama didn't forget HIS idea that F. Trunks' world is on a completely different plane of existence from Goku's world. Obviously, this won't do crud against Future Zamasu.

[dbzfan7]

We don't even know they're the same Zamasu. You essentially made up your own theory. It could be true, but that doesn't change the fact that Trunks would have his own Zamasu anyways. He has essentially the same universe as Goku. Zamasu wouldn't just not exist in his universe.

Um, yeah? I said this is what the implication seems to be, not that it is a fact that the Zamasu in the future is from the regular timeline.
The Universes exist in physical space next to them, all of the split timelines should affect the entire multiverse. If the Zamasu they fought in the future is from this timeline they should have to worry about the Zamasu from Trunks's timeline.

The point is Trunks has a Zamasu either way. So he's not going to disappear or prematurely end the threat, as Zamasu exists in the parallel world. My best theory is if this were the case, Zamasu possibly goes to Trunks timeline, as Beerus would be dead. But even then that doesn't make much sense as he has his own universe in universe 10, but for some reason universe 7 is a big deal instead of his own universe.

Why are you acting like I'm stating that it is a fact that Zamasu is from the regular timeline? All I said is that seems to be the implication. If he is from the regular timeline they will probably explain all this, so there is no reason to act like it doesn't make sense when you aren't even looking at the full story.

But that doesn't at all seem to be the implication. They're on completely 2 different levels in the future and past. It's also extremely counter productive that he suddenly goes "Hm...you know this other universe bothers me, so let's forget about my own universe."

[Doctor.]

Do you guys see a reason why the bond between kaishin and hakaishin would have been brought up?. Any theories?

To explain why Beerus isn't doing anything in the future, it's pretty obvious.

[ArchedThunder]

[spoiler]

[/spoiler]

That is not how the timelines work. Killing Zamasu in the present does absolutely nothing for the future. We've known that since Multi-verse time travel was explained.

Personally, I feel that Present Zamasu's going to pull a Cell/Majin Buu/Baby on Beerus. Also, you're right. I REALLY hope Toriyama didn't forget HIS idea that F. Trunks' world is on a completely different plane of existence from Goku's world. Obviously, this won't do crud against Future Zamasu.

Unless the Zamasu in the future isn't from that timeline but from the regular one. They might either think that he's just going back and forth between timeline, thus killing him would stop what he's doing, or they might think that he's the same Zamasu, but at some undetermined point in the future, so killing him before he even has a chance to time travel would stop him from ever meddling with Trunks's future(remember, traveling with the time rings does not create new timelines).

[Xeztin]

I'm late to the party but the death of Gowasu was almost a given with future Zamasu having those ear rings. What peaked my interest the most was Beerus interfering and this "Zero mortal's plan" can't wait!

[ArchedThunder]

The point is Trunks has a Zamasu either way. So he's not going to disappear or prematurely end the threat, as Zamasu exists in the parallel world.

Again, the time travel mechanics are completely different here, If they traveled from the future of the regular timeline to the current time and killed Zamasu, that wouldn't change the future because they just created a split timeline, but traveling to the future with the time ring does not create a new timeline, as such it would make sense that killing Zamasu before he even has a chance to time travel would stop his meddling in Trunks's future from ever happening because we aren't dealing with a new timeline being created. Zamasu would no longer exist in the future because he was never able to travel there in the first place, time would just fix itself, similar to how it sucked Black back to the future timeline.
The only reason Trunks going back during the android saga didn't fix his future was because his time traveling caused a split timeline, we are not dealing with extra splits in this arc.

But that doesn't at all seem to be the implication. They're on completely 2 different levels in the future and past. It's also extremely counter productive that he suddenly goes "Hm...you know this other universe bothers me, so let's forget about my own universe."

How can you say that when we don't know why he would go to a different timeline? Seriously, you are looking at one part of the story and trying to conclude that this doesn't make sense without the full story.
If the Zamasu in the future timeline is from this timeline then just wait for the explanation as to why he went there.
The implication so far has been that Goku helped send Zamasu over the edge, which leads to the events in Trunks's future, we just don't know why he went there yet(if that is what is happening). This arc is being presented as a mystery, you can't jump to the conclusion that something doesn't make sense in a mystery until we have all of the pieces of the puzzle.

[Doctor.]

You guys should just chill and wait for the episodes to see what theories are correct before debating this.