dprez wrote: the alien warriors they meet and fight, hearing it all in a language I do not understand does it for me. It gives it a realistic feel. Hearing it spoken by derp de derp white people, talking like I do, just feels...awkward.
MY HOLY GRAIL (110% Serious. Please sell me one)Mayuri Kurotsuchi wrote:"In this world, nothing perfect exists. It may be a cliche after all but it's the way things are. That's precisely why ordinary men pursue the concept of perfection, it's infatuation. But ultimately I have to ask myself "What is the true meaning of being perfect?" and the answer I came up with was nothing. Not one thing. The truth of the matter is I despise perfection! If something is truly perfect, that's IT! The bottom line becomes there is no room for imagination! No space for intelligence or ability or improvement! Do you understand? To men of science like us, perfection is a dead end, a condition of hopelessness. Always strive to be better than anything that came before you but not perfect! Scientist's agonize over the attempt to achieve perfection! That's the kind of creatures we are! We take joy in trying to exceed our grasp, in trying to reach for something that in the end, we have to admit may in fact be unreachable!"
So you're the intended audience for the DB Wikia...! Well, that just about solves everything!Fionordequester wrote:Hmm, thanks for acknowledging that guys. To me, the accuracy of any dub to me isn't anywhere near as big of an issue as it probably is to many. The only thing I really look at when it comes to any change is "is it an improvement, does it make sense, and is it contradicted later"? If those three criteria are met, then I don't mind the change one bit, so I'm probably a lot more lenient about the dub than many.
Pretty sure there were some before it.SaiyamanMS wrote:It was a time before uncut bilingual DVDs (where they were actually one of the early ones to start doing it),
Including Pioneer's DVDs of the Z movies.Pokewhiz7 wrote:Pretty sure there were some before it.SaiyamanMS wrote:It was a time before uncut bilingual DVDs (where they were actually one of the early ones to start doing it),
Blue wrote:I love how Season 2 is so off color even the box managed to be so.
Note that I would like to quantify what I mean by an "improvement". For me to consider it an improvement, it has to both be a good idea, and it has to be executed well.So you're the intended audience for the DB Wikia...! Well, that just about solves everything!
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
Does anyone have the release dates for those movies in the DVD format, now that I think about it? When I recall their pretty early release, it was before the DVD format was even entering the mainstream mindset. I got the DVDs years after the VHSes, they seemed so far apart.Puto wrote:Including Pioneer's DVDs of the Z movies.Pokewhiz7 wrote:Pretty sure there were some before it.SaiyamanMS wrote:It was a time before uncut bilingual DVDs (where they were actually one of the early ones to start doing it),
But it's not their job to make "improvements". When FUNi does that, or any company for that matter, then they are overstepping their bounds.Fionordequester wrote:Note that I would like to quantify what I mean by an "improvement". For me to consider it an improvement, it has to both be a good idea, and it has to be executed well.
For example, changing Goku's reason for sparing Vegeta? Contrary to what I said in the past, I now think that was a bad change, not because it wasn't a good idea in and of itself, but because it was executed horribly, with Goku saying stuff like "don't sink down to his level", and "show him that we're made of better stuff than that", like Krillin was some sort of horrible person for not wanting Vegeta to potentially come back and kill them all. This is the same sort of thing that mars my enjoyment of say, "The Dark Knight", despite how good it otherwise was.
All they should've done was have Goku say something like "I...don't really know how to explain but...I guess I think that I think it would be a waste if Vegeta died, and I guess that he might change if we give him the chance" and left out the stuff about him wanting to fight him again. Heck, for however bad the GT dub might've been, I thought they had the right idea in how they dubbed that scene, with Goku saying "it wasn't hate that changed me...it was love" Something to acknowledge that he knew it was a bad idea, but for some reason he couldn't explain, he wanted to let him live despite that, rather than having the dub talk down to us.
I guess basically, for me, you need to be able to justify the change, and you need to do it well. I won't accept something that sounds like it was written by a hack.
But the original anime also takes liberties to make "improvements". If they can do it, why can't FUNi?AgitoZ wrote:But it's not their job to make "improvements". When FUNi does that, or any company for that matter, then they are overstepping their bounds.Fionordequester wrote:Note that I would like to quantify what I mean by an "improvement". For me to consider it an improvement, it has to both be a good idea, and it has to be executed well.
For example, changing Goku's reason for sparing Vegeta? Contrary to what I said in the past, I now think that was a bad change, not because it wasn't a good idea in and of itself, but because it was executed horribly, with Goku saying stuff like "don't sink down to his level", and "show him that we're made of better stuff than that", like Krillin was some sort of horrible person for not wanting Vegeta to potentially come back and kill them all. This is the same sort of thing that mars my enjoyment of say, "The Dark Knight", despite how good it otherwise was.
All they should've done was have Goku say something like "I...don't really know how to explain but...I guess I think that I think it would be a waste if Vegeta died, and I guess that he might change if we give him the chance" and left out the stuff about him wanting to fight him again. Heck, for however bad the GT dub might've been, I thought they had the right idea in how they dubbed that scene, with Goku saying "it wasn't hate that changed me...it was love" Something to acknowledge that he knew it was a bad idea, but for some reason he couldn't explain, he wanted to let him live despite that, rather than having the dub talk down to us.
I guess basically, for me, you need to be able to justify the change, and you need to do it well. I won't accept something that sounds like it was written by a hack.
I admit, I'll turn a blind eye to maybe a number, word, term, etc that's changed for accuracy or consistency. But to change something like that is just...ugh. I mean, calling that an "improvement" is extremely subjective.
For starters, the original author was involved in SOME capacity from time to time, so it's at least got THAT going for it. Additionally, there is staff assigned for that sole purpose -- to work on adding material to the show.Saiga wrote:But the original anime also takes liberties to make "improvements". If they can do it, why can't FUNi?
What most of us are coming back with is that, IN OUR EYES, we don't see it as a sub-licensee's "job" to do anything other than accurately and faithfully adapt the source material.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
Considering how anime tended to be handled before Dragon Ball Z, I think Toei pretty much had the idea that a lot of the content from their anime would be altered when going to America. Heck, all you need to do is look at Golion's transformation to Voltron to grasp the idea of it.Fionordequester wrote:What most of us are coming back with is that, IN OUR EYES, we don't see it as a sub-licensee's "job" to do anything other than accurately and faithfully adapt the source material.
What if they asked, say, Akira Toriyama or the writers at Toei for permission first, before making the change? Everytime they think of a change they want to make, they consult them first?
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
What a patently absurd question.Saiga wrote: But the original anime also takes liberties to make "improvements". If they can do it, why can't FUNi?
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
...Are we talking just in terms of dialogue, or do scenes that are made way more awesome with FUNI music count to?Plus, I would love to hear what somebody thinks Funimation "improved" by changing. It's not like they were fixing Toei's take on the story by being more faithful to the original work. They were pulverizing it with idiocy.
I think you're making the mistake of thinking that all of the dub is that bad, which it's not. Those moments are, in my opinion, relatively few.What frustrates me is that fans of the dub seem all right that Funimation is insulting the intelligence of the viewer. DBZ is not a smart show, but it never talks down to its audience. Unless it's the English dub, which does. By being a fan of that, it makes dub fans seem like they're agreeing that they're too dumb for what DBZ really is.
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".
I'm going to be kind and focus on the script and not the music.Fionordequester wrote: ...Are we talking just in terms of dialogue, or do scenes that are made way more awesome with FUNI music count to?
Kentai wrote:Son Gokuu is a fascinating character anyway, because he is - at face value, anyway - an idiot savant. The victim of violent head trauma as an infant [...] he's a simple bumpkin with a fair share of brain damage who's natural talents to work out what's wrong compensate for his broad lack of common sense. But he's also a fighter, through and through [...] he fight until he has, in no uncertain terms, beaten his enemy on terms they can both acknowledge. He doesn't want to kill anyone, or even prove that he can win... he just wants to know he can. He's an ineffably charming bastard who's manly leanings were really incendental, and yes, the fact that he was voiced by a squeaky woman made the combination perhaps all the more charming.
