Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[SayianBeyondGod]

Curious. What is everyone's opinions on Seththeprogrammer and his DBZ power scaling?

He's alright and he makes some legit arguments, but I don't always agree with him claims and there's a fair amount of question ones as well. I prefer Chuck when it comes to scaling to be honest.

[DBZ Macky]

Can someone explain me what's with the cards that have correlation to strength?

They have numbers on them, which could be a representation of their power.

[SayianBeyondGod]

Can someone explain me what's with the cards that have correlation to strength?

They have numbers on them, which could be a representation of their power.

I figured that out soon after but now I'm questioning the credibility myself. I don't know if we're suppose to take the images of the cards literal since without direct translation, it's seems like Trunks with the Spirit Sword is too low and Fused Zamasu isn't in his mutated state which was the peak of his power but should be lower without it.

[SayianBeyondGod]

Assuming these cards are credible and Trunk's card is not referring to his Spirit Sword form and just his rage which I can see since his sword isn't enlarged, I think we can scale how many times stronger is x than x. We can use the fact SSB which is 8300 is a 50x mulitper than SSG which is 7800. With a napkin calculation SSBE transformation would be just barely over 50 in a multiple from blue, UI being around 55x higher than blue, Kefla would be just 50x stronger than blue.

Now I see trying scaling the gap of power with the displayed numbers being too iffy. The best credibility these cards should have may just be the order rather than gap of power I guess.

[Kenneth La Torre]

Can someone explain me what's with the cards that have correlation to strength?

Nothing much. The cards have power ratings that people here agree with and they actually are sensible enough to make sense.
Tho they are just stickers

[Kenneth La Torre]

I shouldn’t be what? I’m aware that in older collections the gods were ????, but since Ultra Instinct Goku (mastered) had ???? previously and they gave him a number now I personally find interesting that they are still being secretive about Beerus’ strength (can we still expect something about him?).

No, like i said, it isnt only beerus. Dont take thiese stickers seriously. If we go by whats been stated in the show, then SSB vegito is so strong that he is stated in two sources (manga and interview) to be pretty much as strong as beerus, and SSB vegito in the stickers has a power of 9300. And the stickers also have the non-shirtless jiren equal to MUI Goku (9500), when we saw MUI goku play around with jiren.

This shouldnt be taken seriously in the first place. Even ssj4 Gogeta (9200) has a higher power than UIO goku (9000), and we know that is dumb.

I’m not getting why you think you are in the position to tell me what I should take seriously or not. Regardless, I don’t care about it. I just brought it here because it’s related to the thread, it’s the closest to official content we have in this regard, and more importantly to have fun with it. By the way, I don’t see any inconsistency between the stickers and the anime (any SS4 Gogeta’s strength assessment is pure speculation). And Ultra Instinct Goku’s number is 9600.

UI gokus is 9500, not 9600.

[Kenneth La Torre]

Actually, it could be 9600, its just so freaking blurry that its hard to notice (BTW i cant seem to edit so posting again is the only way)

[Marlowe89]

Spirit Sword Trunks is probably the most questionable. Without the sword I agree with the placement 100%. With the sword...he killed Merged Zamasu so...but whatever.

That's probably just SS Rage Trunks, despite the presence of the "spirit sword" in the artwork. He's in another set (without the spirit sword) and has the same number.

Kinda goes to show that the sword probably shouldn't be considered a part of Trunks' own power.

So I think might go by this because it does make sense. Keep an eye out for that in the future because I'd want to see where they'd put Android 17 and Hit.

There are already cards for Android 17 and Hit, although again, I'm not sure if you're supposed to compare different sets. Hit has a level of "8200" (so just below SSB Goku) and 17 has a max level of "6500" which exceeds SS2/SS3's numbers but is below the god forms and Ultimate Gohan.

[Hugo Boss]

Actually, it could be 9600, its just so freaking blurry that its hard to notice (BTW i cant seem to edit so posting again is the only way)

I have a bad eye for long distances, but I can see clear enough in my smartphone that it is 9600.

[Bullza]

Oh yeah now that I look at it again, Goku is 9,600 and Jiren 9,500 which again makes sense.

There are already cards for Android 17 and Hit, although again, I'm not sure if you're supposed to compare different sets. Hit has a level of "8200" (so just below SSB Goku) and 17 has a max level of "6500" which exceeds SS2/SS3's numbers but is below the god forms and Ultimate Gohan.

There's more of these images out there? You got a link to it?

So Hit has the same as Golden Frieza and Android 17 is above Super Saiyan 3 Goku but significantly below Ultimate Gohan.

Hit's an awkward one anyway, physically he's way below Golden Frieza but with his abilities I would have said he should be higher....though the number would fit with how he did kinda lose just about against Goku in the filler so I can see where they would get that from.

Surprised Android 17 is so low though. I'd have though he'd be closer to Gohan but in the manga he did seem to be about or a bit above Super Saiyan 3 and you'd think that for the anime too.

[Hugo Boss]

There's more of these images out there? You got a link to it?

There are several links. You can find most on MsDBZBabe’s tumblr.

By the way, comparing those sets is something to be done carefully. SSB Vegeta’s number for example varies from 7500 to 8800.

[Kenneth La Torre]

Here’s something about power levels, but not to be taken too seriously, it’s meant to be cute.

https://ibb.co/bxwTtH
https://ibb.co/hy38tH
https://ibb.co/iEfA7c
https://ibb.co/bXfotH
https://ibb.co/i4Qcnc
https://ibb.co/mtKsLx
https://ibb.co/eAXCLx
https://ibb.co/gadV7c
https://ibb.co/bSxOSc
https://ibb.co/ePeEYH
https://ibb.co/dqHOSc
https://ibb.co/fFaotH
https://ibb.co/eg8K0x




Zeno: Infinite
Jiren: 9500
SSB Vegito: 9300
SS4 Gogeta: 9200
UI Omen Goku: 9000
SSB Goku and Vegeta: 9000
Merged Zamasu: 9000
Spirit Bomb GT Goku: 8900
SSB Kaioken Goku: 8800
Omega Shenron: 8700
SSB Goku: 8500
SS4 Goku: 8300
SS4 Vegeta: 8300
Hit: 8200
Nova Shenron: 8000
SSB Vegeta: 8000
SS Rose Goku Black: 8000
SS Rage Future Trunks: 8000
Frost and Freeza: 7800
Berserker Kale: 7000
LSS Broly: 7000
Ultimate Gohan: 6800
SS2 Caulifla: 6500
Freeza: 6400
Android 17: 6200
Majuub: 6100
Trio De Danger: 6000
SS2 Goku: 5800
Majin Buu: 5500
Piccolo: 5000
Roshi and Tien: 4000
Rebrianne: 3800
Caulifla: 3500
Chichi and Goku: 3000
Kale: 2800
Goten, Trunks, and Bra: 2500
Bulma: 800 or 300 (too blurry)

Hakaishins And Angels: ????
Smoke Shenron: ????
Great Priest: ????
Mastered UI Goku: ????

I did this a long time ago. I dont know why people are obsessed over it now lol

[Kenneth La Torre]

You can tell its not to be taken serious, at least when it comes to unimportant characters

[Bullza]

So it might be awkward to cross reference the numbers between sets? Going by some of the numbers in the above pictures, Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken has a 8,800 which is more than Kefla which shouldn't be the case.

Final Form Frieza is above Android 17? Wouldn't have said that. He's above Super Saiyan 2 Goku... probably wouldn't have said that either.

Ribrianne above Base Caulifla....depends on what form of Ribrianne but that could maybe work.

Super Saiyan Berserk Kale is above Android 17 but below Ultimate Gohan....maybe?

In the one image we have Gohan, that doesn't look like his Ultimate form, it's clearly different from the other image with the bang and he has a higher number than Super Saiyan 2 Caulifla and Piccolo so I don't know what that's meant to be.

Piccolo is above Base Caulifla so above the Base Saiyans which is possibly right.

Ultra Instinct Omen Goku is above God of Destruction Toppo which would be correct if it was from the second and especially third time he used it but the first time he would likely be below Kefla.

[Kenneth La Torre]

So it might be awkward to cross reference the numbers between sets? Going by some of the numbers in the above pictures, Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken has a 8,800 which is more than Kefla which shouldn't be the case.

Final Form Frieza is above Android 17? Wouldn't have said that. He's above Super Saiyan 2 Goku... probably wouldn't have said that either.

Ribrianne above Base Caulifla....depends on what form of Ribrianne but that could maybe work.

Super Saiyan Berserk Kale is above Android 17 but below Ultimate Gohan....maybe?

In the one image we have Gohan, that doesn't look like his Ultimate form, it's clearly different from the other image with the bang and he has a higher number than Super Saiyan 2 Caulifla and Piccolo so I don't know what that's meant to be.

Piccolo is above Base Caulifla so above the Base Saiyans which is possibly right.

Ultra Instinct Omen Goku is above God of Destruction Toppo which would be correct if it was from the second and especially third time he used it but the first time he would likely be below Kefla.

Just treat it for what it is, a collection of stickers with power levels as official as the power levels that came from Vjump for broly and gogeta

[TheDipDap1234]

Goten, Trunks, and Bra: 2500

Just a minor correction. The girl on that sticker is Marron not Bra.

But yeah I agree that we shouldn't take these seriously.

[Marlowe89]

Final Form Frieza is above Android 17? Wouldn't have said that. He's above Super Saiyan 2 Goku... probably wouldn't have said that either.

Super Saiyan Berserk Kale is above Android 17 but below Ultimate Gohan....maybe?

Piccolo is above Base Caulifla so above the Base Saiyans which is possibly right.

Ultra Instinct Omen Goku is above God of Destruction Toppo which would be correct if it was from the second and especially third time he used it but the first time he would likely be below Kefla.

These four comparisons in particular are nearly consistent with my own list, so I'm personally fine with them. SSBE also looks like it's indeed Vegeta's equivalent for UI Omen strength-wise, so that matches up nicely as well.

There are certainly a few anomalies -- Anilaza's "7500" is especially strange -- but overall these seem way too structured and thoughtful to simply be disregarded as random numbers. Whether they're meant to be taken as word of god or not, I think it's nice to have something a little specific considering how vague the anime itself tends to be. It might be as close as we'll ever get to an "official" power scale for Super.

[Kenneth La Torre]

Goten, Trunks, and Bra: 2500

Just a minor correction. The girl on that sticker is Marron not Bra.

But yeah I agree that we shouldn't take these seriously.

My mistake, i dont even know how i confused them lol. But yes, these are not to be taken seriously. It scares me that some people are.

[PerhapsTheOtherOne]

I think the better idea was that Jiren's full-power and Jiren's shirtless power are being counted as separate things in the cards, rather than part of the same continuous spectrum.

The numbers don't mean much; the existence of differing cards does.

[Bullza]

I don't even see Aniraza's sticker, where's that?

I'm not really sure where Final Form Frieza is supposed to stand. Some things imply roughly Base Tier. Then there's him easily beating Jimeze who Goku was Super Saiyan for. So I could see him being above Super Saiyan, at a real push maybe just about Super Saiyan 2 but not higher than Super Saiyan 3 or Android 17. Especially comparing how each stood up to Super Saiyan Blue Goku.

Kale being below Ultimate Gohan is fine as Gohan put up a better fight against Super Saiyan Blue than Kale did against Super Saiyan God. That's true for Android 17 too so I don't know if I'd have said she was stronger than him.

Piccolo being above the Base Saiyans I suppose is fine if you go by his fight with Gohan. He was on par with Super Saiyan 2 Gohan but his sticker isn't as high as Super Saiyan 2 Goku so maybe Gohan and Goku really weren't quite equal.

But what Gohan is this?

[spoiler][/spoiler]

It's a different from this one with a different number and a bang.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

The former is even higher than Final Form Frieza and Super Saiyan 2 Caulifla.