Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[dbzfan7]

The logic of this place: If you like everything about this movie without seeing it and basing your opinion solely on pre-release material, you're a good and reasonable fan of DB.

If you dislike ANYTHING about this movie based on the same information as the guys who like it, you're arrogant, an embarrassment and your opinion doesn't matter because you haven't seen the movie at all.

Anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?

I'm not even saying I dislike it.

I'm just questioning some hyperbole about a certain event's ranking in franchise history and people are getting mad.

Ah well.

But that is the point you can't really question them at all until you have actually seen said scene. It may very well be the best scene in the franchise it may not, we will find out when we actually see the film.

Best scene in the franchise is debatable. There is no best scene in the franchise. That perspective is different between people. Personally if the concept let's me down, then scene wise it doesn't do it for me even if it's animated superbly. You could have the best animation ever, but if it's just a guy kicking someone while they're down, then the concept has lost me. It's much better argued that it's the best animated fight in the franchise. That can be more objective and believable. However there is no arguing one of the best scene's in the franchise for that person. That's an opinion that can't be argued since it's a preference.

[ShadowWolf87]

The logic of this place: If you like everything about this movie without seeing it and basing your opinion solely on pre-release material, you're a good and reasonable fan of DB.

If you dislike ANYTHING about this movie based on the same information as the guys who like it, you're arrogant, an embarrassment and your opinion doesn't matter because you haven't seen the movie at all.

Anyone else see the hypocrisy in this?

I'm not even saying I dislike it.

I'm just questioning some hyperbole about a certain event's ranking in franchise history and people are getting mad.

Ah well.

But that is the point you can't really question them at all until you have actually seen said scene. It may very well be the best scene in the franchise it may not, we will find out when we actually see the film.

I'm going off context here. I mean, for the sake of a parallel example: if you were watching a superhero film with two heroes. One of them fights the villain who's actually a bit stronger, finds a weakness, exploits it so that he has him worn down, but then an outside force intervenes and stops him from ending it. Then the other hero who has yet to even fight steps in to finish off this enemy so weak now he can't be really even touched by it...

Contextually speaking, it seems underwhelming. And then when you stack it up against moments like Gohan doing the same to a fresh Cell, or Goku's fights with Freeza, Piccolo, Vegeta, Vegeta sacrificing himself to stop Buu, Goku meeting his grandpa again, and tout it as greater than even those... If I didn't have that context, I wouldn't think twice about it, but it seems a bit hyperbolic to me. Which is all I'm trying to say.

[SansrivaaL]

What I find amusing is people claiming that Goku stole Vegeta's kill, if my memory serves me right the summary says Freeza was the one that did the killing not the other way around.... so why do some people claim that? I'm not going into debates here cuz I may be in the wrong and Goku did steal Vegeta's kill

[dbzfan7]

What I find amusing is people claiming that Goku stole Vegeta's kill, if my memory serves me right the summary says Freeza was the one that did the killing not the other way around.... so why do some people claim that? I'm not going into debates here cuz I may be in the wrong and Goku did steal Vegeta's kill

You have chosen wisely. You could have an opinion, and someone will take it radically out of context and insult you. I agree with your statement though.

[Marlowe89]

Who cares if the Vegeta vs. Freeza match was one-sided because Freeza was weakened? Do we have any way of measuring exactly how weakened Freeza was specifically? Why are we even questioning his strength at this point when he flat-out transformed into the same variation of Super Saiyan as Goku?

This all seems like a really pointless argument.

According to people who saw the movie, and the movie's description, Goku wears Freeza out to the point he hits his knees in exhaustion and a full-on punch to the face from Freeza doesn't even hurt him. I'm going off that.

Fair enough, but I'm still not sure what this is supposed to undermine exactly. If we're going by context, Vegeta transforms into SSGSS before the "beatdown" even occurs, which at least implies that Freeza couldn't simply be taken out by any character not yet on a SSG-esque level of power even in his current state. I can see why people would find this match-up impressive despite the villain not being at his best.

[ShadowWolf87]

Who cares if the Vegeta vs. Freeza match was one-sided because Freeza was weakened? Do we have any way of measuring exactly how weakened Freeza was specifically? Why are we even questioning his strength at this point when he flat-out transformed into the same variation of Super Saiyan as Goku?

This all seems like a really pointless argument.

According to people who saw the movie, and the movie's description, Goku wears Freeza out to the point he hits his knees in exhaustion and a full-on punch to the face from Freeza doesn't even hurt him. I'm going off that.

Fair enough, but I'm still not sure what this is supposed to undermine exactly. If we're going by context, Vegeta transforms into SSGSS before the "beatdown" even occurs, which at least implies that Freeza couldn't simply be taken out by any character not yet on a SSG-esque level of power even in his current state. I can see why people would find this match-up impressive despite the villain not being at his best.

Yes and no. Yes in that he's still extremely powerful, but no in that Vegeta takes on a form that Freeza is now incapable of even hurting before he attacks him and it's completely one-sided as a result.

[sintzu]

Honestly I'd feel kinda sour if I was the big fan. I'd want a worthy final battle.

I've been watching One Piece lately and the way Oda writes Luffy's crew taught me to appreciate what Vegeta and the rest of the characters not named Goku have gotten throughout the story.

Sure a 5 minute beat down might not sound much to you but to me it's a lot cause my favorite character is getting treated right however me liking it doesn't mean I don't want an epic 20 minute battle down the line.

If it doesn't happen ? no harm done,Vegeta has gotten so much attention throughout the story and will probably continue to do so which is more then enough to keep me happy.

What I find amusing is people claiming that Goku stole Vegeta's kill.

If it means seeing Vegeta go on a funny rant then so be it.

To anyone who's upset about that,can you tell me why ? the battle ended with Freeza on his hands and knees defeated while Vegeta was standing over him victorious,shouldn't you be happy about that ?

[Dbzfan94]

While the child in me is so happy that Goku is the one to kill Freeza, I really feel Vegeta got jipped.
I mean he got killed for gods sake and then just reversed like nothing happened then Goku stole the kill.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

but it seems a bit hyperbolic to me. Which is all I'm trying to say.

Which is fair enough but you could have just said that in your initial post instead of questioning the persons opinion of the franchise on a whole.

[ekrolo2]

Honestly I'd feel kinda sour if I was the big fan. I'd want a worthy final battle.

I've been watching One Piece lately and the way Oda writes Luffy's crew taught me to appreciate what Vegeta and the rest of the characters not named Goku have gotten throughout the story.

Sure a 5 minute beat down might not sound much to you but to me it's a lot cause my favorite character is getting treated right however me liking it doesn't mean I don't want an epic 20 minute battle down the line.

If it doesn't happen ? no harm done,Vegeta has gotten so much attention throughout the story and will probably continue to do so which is more then enough to keep me happy.

What I find amusing is people claiming that Goku stole Vegeta's kill.

If it means seeing Vegeta go on a funny rant then so be it.

To anyone who's upset about that,can you tell me why ? the battle ended with Freeza on his hands and knees defeated while Vegeta was standing over him victorious,shouldn't you be happy about that ?

Because it's not really a victory, it's basically him beating up a guy who can't do jack to him anymore for a few minutes who Goku softened up for him. I loathe all the curb stomp battles in the entire series and would much prefer Vegeta & Freeza having a roughly even fight then concluding with Vegeta winning not because of Freeza being a dumbass or because Goku softened him up, but due to his own strength.

[ShadowWolf87]

Honestly I'd feel kinda sour if I was the big fan. I'd want a worthy final battle.

I've been watching One Piece lately and the way Oda writes Luffy's crew taught me to appreciate what Vegeta and the rest of the characters not named Goku have gotten throughout the story.

Sure a 5 minute beat down might not sound much to you but to me it's a lot cause my favorite character is getting treated right however me liking it doesn't mean I don't want an epic 20 minute battle down the line.

If it doesn't happen ? no harm done,Vegeta has gotten so much attention throughout the story and will probably continue to do so which is more then enough to keep me happy.

See, the fan perspective I get and I can identify with and appreciate. (Even if I do feel Vegeta is comparatively treated far better by the fandom and other media than most of the rest.) I'm not trying to detract from personal enjoyment.

[dbzfan7]

Honestly I'd feel kinda sour if I was the big fan. I'd want a worthy final battle.

I've been watching One Piece lately and the way Oda writes Luffy's crew taught me to appreciate what Vegeta and the rest of the characters not named Goku have gotten throughout the story.

Sure a 5 minute beat down might not sound much to you but to me it's a lot cause my favorite character is getting treated right however me liking it doesn't mean I don't want an epic 20 minute battle down the line.

If it doesn't happen ? no harm done,Vegeta has gotten so much attention throughout the story and will probably continue to do so which is more then enough to keep me happy.

Well we all look at things differently. There's a lot to like about Vegeta's 5 minutes of pure pwnage. I'm saying I'd be a bit sour. Still Vegeta has a great moment overall. I think it coulda been better and a little more dignified, but depending on where his character went, maybe it was. Perhaps he just wanted to not screw up and succeed where Goku ended up coming short. That's another way to look at the scene. I kinda look at it from a similar angle of how Goku would rather die than take a senzu fighting Cell. So to me I feel it's a bit embarrassing. That doesn't mean you have to see it that way though.

[sintzu]

It's basically him beating up a guy who can't do jack to him anymore.

That's what Freeza did to him on Namek so it's his turn to be on the receiving end.

[Kamiccolo9]

It's basically him beating up a guy who can't do jack to him anymore.

That's what Freeza did to him on Namek so it's his turn to be on the receiving end.

Was it badass when Freeza did it?

[ShadowWolf87]

It's basically him beating up a guy who can't do jack to him anymore.

That's what Freeza did to him on Namek so it's his turn to be on the receiving end.

Was it badass when Freeza did it?

Freeza doing it was done to create a sense of dread, and was a villain being a villain.

Vegeta's bit here... idk. I get wanting payback and all, but it just feels a tad overplayed. Like Toei REALLY wanted that fanservice moment so much they poured a disproportionate amount of budget into it.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Is it mentioned at all in the movie how Jaco was once trying to kill Goku? Does he admit this and Goku forgives him?

[Birusu16]

Honestly I'd feel kinda sour if I was the big fan. I'd want a worthy final battle.

I've been watching One Piece lately and the way Oda writes Luffy's crew taught me to appreciate what Vegeta and the rest of the characters not named Goku have gotten throughout the story.

Sure a 5 minute beat down might not sound much to you but to me it's a lot cause my favorite character is getting treated right however me liking it doesn't mean I don't want an epic 20 minute battle down the line.

If it doesn't happen ? no harm done,Vegeta has gotten so much attention throughout the story and will probably continue to do so which is more then enough to keep me happy.

Well we all look at things differently. There's a lot to like about Vegeta's 5 minutes of pure pwnage. I'm saying I'd be a bit sour. Still Vegeta has a great moment overall. I think it coulda been better and a little more dignified, but depending on where his character went, maybe it was. Perhaps he just wanted to not screw up and succeed where Goku ended up coming short. That's another way to look at the scene. I kinda look at it from a similar angle of how Goku would rather die than take a senzu fighting Cell. So to me I feel it's a bit embarrassing. That doesn't mean you have to see it that way though.

Why or how is it embarrassing? Goku accepted all the help he could get to beat Kid Buu. He took a freebie power-up in order to stop Beerus from destroying the Earth. So why is Vegeta not refusing to beat down a weakened Freeza embarrassing? One instance of Goku refusing help or not taking advantage of a weakness doesn't make him better than Vegeta in that regard. What Vegeta did was smart just like what he did in BoGs (throwing away his pride in order to keep Beerus' temper in check in order to save the planet) was smart . He decided to pounce on Freeza before he could recover seeing as he just saw Goku on the losing end of his battle with Freeza.

[Gyt Kaliba]

Is it mentioned at all in the movie how Jaco was once trying to kill Goku? Does he admit this and Goku forgives him?

From what I've gathered, Goku and Jaco don't get to interact really (though Jaco does interact with a fair few of the others apparently), sadly. Knowing Goku, he'd probably just laugh it off anyway.

[dbzfan7]

Why or how is it embarrassing? Goku accepted all the help he could get to beat Kid Buu. He took a freebie power-up in order to stop Beerus from destroying the Earth. So why is Vegeta not refusing to beat down a weakened Freeza embarrassing? One instance of Goku refusing help or not taking advantage of a weakness doesn't make him better than Vegeta in that regard. What Vegeta did was smart just like what he did in BoGs (throwing away his pride in order to keep Beerus' temper in check in order to save the planet) was smart . He decided to pounce on Freeza before he could recover seeing as he just saw Goku on the losing end of his battle with Freeza.

Look I'm not getting into another back and forth cat fight. I've had enough of those. Even if I did, I doubt I'd even change your mind or even get you to look at a different perspective anyways.

[ekrolo2]

It's basically him beating up a guy who can't do jack to him anymore.

That's what Freeza did to him on Namek so it's his turn to be on the receiving end.

Freeza is a sadist who gets off on doing that and Vegeta has murdered his two elite men on top of the entire Ginyu Force AND robbed him off his chance of immortality. Makes sense that Freeza would make his death as slow and painful as possible as Vegeta was a consistent pain in his ass.

Here, we've got a Vegeta who previously defended Goku's (moronic) decision to not eat a Senzu so he can fight Cell fairly, yet here he's perfectly okay with just beating Freeza down because.... because shut up, Toriyama-sensei overrides your logic! Now I'm not totally against Vegeta doing this because he and Goku are complete fucking idiots who should have no say whatsoever in how an enemy should be dealt with so him being pragmatic is a plus. But to call him beating down a pretty defenseless enemy who got softened up by Goku a "big moment" doesn't really ring true to me.

As I said above, I'd have much preferred him to beat down Freeza in an actual battle as I find curb stomps to just be generic DBZ fight rule numero uno and it really diminishes what could've been a great showing for both characters.