"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Bergamo]

The characters? Dynamics? Emotion? You know, the things we have to be invested in to care about the fights?

I like that stuff as much as the next guy, and strongly prefer it to just wanton violence, but it's kind of provable that this series only became popular due to the tournaments. We know Toriyama made the conscious decision to include them in order to boost popularity.

Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

It's not like there was more of an emotional attachment to any of the characters who were eliminated last chapter. If Toyo nails the ideological battle between Goku vs Jirem, then that will easily provide enough substance to make the arc worth it.

[Dbzfan94]

[
Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

Honestly this is how I felt about the TOP as a whole.

[1345521]

[
Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

Honestly this is how I felt about the TOP as a whole.

Especially when everyone gets wished back. It made the whole ToP useless, because goku lost UI. You could argue vegeta "evolution" but the movie dosent seem it'll even have evolution vegeta so that form is as good as noncanon. The ToP in the anime was a big fat waist of time.

[TKA]

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The anime has better action than the manga by far. The manga's action means more though since these characters are actually written consistently, and as such, have clearly defined limits and character traits. That makes it way easier to care about them in these chaotic battles. At least for me.

[Doctor.]

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The two complaints aren't mutually exclusive. The tournament is designed to show cool shit, but that doesn't mean the audience actually finds said shit cool.

[MoscoSama]

All the "saiyan improvement" and constant "limit breaking" in the ToP look like they are anime exclusive with the exception of UI which will be in both versions.

I guess its still possible that Omen and Evolution show up but I seriously doubt that. I actually like the manga way better. Wasn't really a fan of the instantaneous zenkais goku especially kept getting during the tournament in the anime

[1345521]

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The anime has better action than the manga by far. The manga's action means more though since these characters are actually written consistently, and as such, have clearly defined limits and character traits. That makes it way easier to care about them in these chaotic battles. At least for me.

Idk what you're talking about, the anime has MORE action but the manga not only has better written characters like you said, more meaningful action but BETTER ACTION as well. Let's look.
Compare the anime opening of top in episode 96 and 97 vs manga 33
Lol, we get vegeta tossing out fodder and looking like a complete boss. 17 fodder unvierse 10, to the. Frieza just stomps on a guy hand making him look like a boss. 18 kicks some butt, GOKU IS TAKING On the pride troopers by himself.
Can we even Remeber what happened in the anime? Goku getting stopped by a Roshi level fighter, basil doing the same attack like 3 times with the exact same animation, some butterfly looking chick to scared to use her wings. Hit was cool though, or vegeta struggling against some fodder universe 9 ice giant. = trash

Frost and Frieza episode like 107 and 108 I believe vs manga 34
Is this even a question? FROST WAS A BEAST IN THE MANGA. He like straight soloed universe 9 when it took like ssj blue goku and vegeta to best unvierse 9. Lol, Frieza had to fake fight with ultimate gohan ( I was going to call that bad power scailing but based on how strong manga to an night be, let me just hold my breath there) just to please frost or something. Then he buffed up just to point some weak laser beam at frost? Trash
Frieza in the manga WAS A BEAST. He acted like some apex level mafia joint. Took frost by the kneck and KICKED HIM OUT and then looked at him and basically said I used you like my dog, thanks now bye. Now the anime Freeza calling frost an amuture was pretty cool too.

Kale vs kale:
Yeah I don't think I need to say squat:
Cauia in the manga>>>>>>>>>>>>> anime
Cabba in the manga >>>>>>>>> anime
Kale in the manga >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>(times google flex) kale in the anime
Gfrieza vs unvierse 6 sayains >>>>> goku vs universe 6 sayains. Less of the goku show.

Though the anime did a good job of giving fodder some shine, wish Toyo gave us another chapter like 36 you know, would love to see the powers of universe 3, the rest of universe and 4, as well as namekians. One more chapter of fodder shine like chapter 36 would be good. Basically toyotaro should have divide chapter 36 into two parts which encompassed most of the fodder character who have lasted this long. Then have piccolo lose in the 2nd chapter. Would make more sense but it seems Toyo is on a deadline.
Anyway, manga has better action and more meangiful action like you said.

[Omniboy]

[
Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

Honestly this is how I felt about the TOP as a whole.

That's what I'm thinking. The anime is not really all that different to the manga in that regard.

[Kanassa]

I like that stuff as much as the next guy, and strongly prefer it to just wanton violence, but it's kind of provable that this series only became popular due to the tournaments. We know Toriyama made the conscious decision to include them in order to boost popularity.

Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

It's not like there was more of an emotional attachment to any of the characters who were eliminated last chapter. If Toyo nails the ideological battle between Goku vs Jirem, then that will easily provide enough substance to make the arc worth it.

Something as simple as 18 showing Ribrianne how shallow her outlook on love was or Goku partially training Caulifla as they fought or Piccolo having a crisis of self-confidence or the universes having a moment to react to their total annihilation give emotional weight to a fight. They are small things and not very important in the grand schemes of the plot, but they add character and dynamic that are affected by the situation. I should view Goku fighting Jiren as more than 'The protag punches a rather antagonistic wall', there's little dynamic or reason to be invested. If you took off the character's faces and names it would make little difference.

That's why the episode with Roshi managed to make people go 'Oh shit' even though every single one of them knew there was no way in hell Roshi was dying.

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The anime has better action than the manga by far. The manga's action means more though since these characters are actually written consistently, and as such, have clearly defined limits and character traits. That makes it way easier to care about them in these chaotic battles. At least for me.

The Manga's action means nothing because it has very little in it, the enemies are no more than just roadblocks in the story when they should feel like more. The anime, even in it's worse moments, remembered that action is meaningless if it doesn't make efforts to make you give a shit. If the characters aren't given moments to be characters, the line making you care about them in battle becomes thin. The conflict of the Trunks arc becomes hard to give a shit about when the character barely seem to treat it with any seriousness (Other than 'He's strong!') with Trunks's emotional moments taking place off screen.

Yes, the manga is more consistent in it's characters, because it does so little with them that it's pretty damn hard to mess it up.

[Bergamo]

Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

It's not like there was more of an emotional attachment to any of the characters who were eliminated last chapter. If Toyo nails the ideological battle between Goku vs Jirem, then that will easily provide enough substance to make the arc worth it.

Something as simple as 18 showing Ribrianne how shallow her outlook on love was or Goku partially training Caulifla as they fought or Piccolo having a crisis of self-confidence or the universes having a moment to react to their total annihilation give emotional weight to a fight. They are small things and not very important in the grand schemes of the plot, but they add character and dynamic that are affected by the situation. I should view Goku fighting Jiren as more than 'The protag punches a rather antagonistic wall', there's little dynamic or reason to be invested. If you took off the character's faces and names it would make little difference.

That's why the episode with Roshi managed to make people go 'Oh shit' even though every single one of them knew there was no way in hell Roshi was dying.

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The anime has better action than the manga by far. The manga's action means more though since these characters are actually written consistently, and as such, have clearly defined limits and character traits. That makes it way easier to care about them in these chaotic battles. At least for me.

The Manga's action means nothing because it has very little in it, the enemies are no more than just roadblocks in the story when they should feel like more. The anime, even in it's worse moments, remembered that action is meaningless if it doesn't make efforts to make you give a shit. If the characters aren't given moments to be characters, the line making you care about them in battle becomes thin. The conflict of the Trunks arc becomes hard to give a shit about when the character barely seem to treat it with any seriousness (Other than 'He's strong!') with Trunks's emotional moments taking place off screen.

Yes, the manga is more consistent in it's characters, because it does so little with them that it's pretty damn hard to mess it up.

Not everything has to be meaningful. Ribrianne vs 18 was a cute gag fight, but it didn't need to be a character defining moment that showed how Android 18 felt about Krillin. The anime dropped the ball during the one fight that was actually supposed to have weight, because I felt nothing for Jiren. The fight boiled down to Goku is selfish and Jiren is a jerk because of his Sasuke backstory.

[1345521]

Yes, and the tournaments had those stuff, otherwise, they'd be nothing more than flash without substance. "This fight looks cool, but why should I give a shit?"

It's not like there was more of an emotional attachment to any of the characters who were eliminated last chapter. If Toyo nails the ideological battle between Goku vs Jirem, then that will easily provide enough substance to make the arc worth it.

Something as simple as 18 showing Ribrianne how shallow her outlook on love was or Goku partially training Caulifla as they fought or Piccolo having a crisis of self-confidence or the universes having a moment to react to their total annihilation give emotional weight to a fight. They are small things and not very important in the grand schemes of the plot, but they add character and dynamic that are affected by the situation. I should view Goku fighting Jiren as more than 'The protag punches a rather antagonistic wall', there's little dynamic or reason to be invested. If you took off the character's faces and names it would make little difference.

That's why the episode with Roshi managed to make people go 'Oh shit' even though every single one of them knew there was no way in hell Roshi was dying.

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The anime has better action than the manga by far. The manga's action means more though since these characters are actually written consistently, and as such, have clearly defined limits and character traits. That makes it way easier to care about them in these chaotic battles. At least for me.

The Manga's action means nothing because it has very little in it, the enemies are no more than just roadblocks in the story when they should feel like more. The anime, even in it's worse moments, remembered that action is meaningless if it doesn't make efforts to make you give a shit. If the characters aren't given moments to be characters, the line making you care about them in battle becomes thin. The conflict of the Trunks arc becomes hard to give a shit about when the character barely seem to treat it with any seriousness (Other than 'He's strong!') with Trunks's emotional moments taking place off screen.

Yes, the manga is more consistent in it's characters, because it does so little with them that it's pretty damn hard to mess it up.

Lol, bro I'm here to watch dragon ball not some daycare lullaby story of the importance of "friendship, confidence" and bunch of nonsense meant for little kids. No dragon ball fans that grew up with db, z and GT really care about that garbage.

Oh my goodness, 18 gives her own view of "love" which is in contrast to ribirane, OH MY GOODNESS THATS SO AMAZING. 18 loves Kuririn, we get it. Move on, I'm here to watch epic fights with a good taste of some nice relevant take home messages for all people, not just delauient children who don't understand love or have "confidence issues" even though they are grown adults fighting for on a multifersal stGe.

Piccolo having a self identity crisis? REALLY. Hahahahah, thTs like ultra character regression. Something we see from supers anime.

Goku "teaching" then is stupid. Goku just fought them for the lust of fighting when he had a universe at stake. Manga goku actuLly understands when to play around and when not too, like goku In Z. And anime goku didn't teach them sqaut, he just fought then because he found them entertaining. Really it. Which just shows how much character he lacks.

This is dragon ball, a serious fighting show with some universal moral theme to back it. I'm not here to watch a watered down version of it just so I can see my favorite character regress to like high teenagers in persoanility. Which is why give me the manga of super well over the anime version. Manga of super actually keeps the character consistent, and the actions means more. The only problem is toyotaro didn't give many character any shine. But hey, whatever. Better then having bad writing, chRactisrization, art, animation (for the most part), fights (for the most part), and like no gore or serious atmosphere.

[Khandom101]

It's not like there was more of an emotional attachment to any of the characters who were eliminated last chapter. If Toyo nails the ideological battle between Goku vs Jirem, then that will easily provide enough substance to make the arc worth it.

Something as simple as 18 showing Ribrianne how shallow her outlook on love was or Goku partially training Caulifla as they fought or Piccolo having a crisis of self-confidence or the universes having a moment to react to their total annihilation give emotional weight to a fight. They are small things and not very important in the grand schemes of the plot, but they add character and dynamic that are affected by the situation. I should view Goku fighting Jiren as more than 'The protag punches a rather antagonistic wall', there's little dynamic or reason to be invested. If you took off the character's faces and names it would make little difference.

That's why the episode with Roshi managed to make people go 'Oh shit' even though every single one of them knew there was no way in hell Roshi was dying.

You people can't say one minute that this tournament is boring because the choreography is lacking, and then in another moment claim it's because the tournament is all flash and no substance.

The anime has better action than the manga by far. The manga's action means more though since these characters are actually written consistently, and as such, have clearly defined limits and character traits. That makes it way easier to care about them in these chaotic battles. At least for me.

The Manga's action means nothing because it has very little in it, the enemies are no more than just roadblocks in the story when they should feel like more. The anime, even in it's worse moments, remembered that action is meaningless if it doesn't make efforts to make you give a shit. If the characters aren't given moments to be characters, the line making you care about them in battle becomes thin. The conflict of the Trunks arc becomes hard to give a shit about when the character barely seem to treat it with any seriousness (Other than 'He's strong!') with Trunks's emotional moments taking place off screen.

Yes, the manga is more consistent in it's characters, because it does so little with them that it's pretty damn hard to mess it up.

Lol, bro I'm here to watch dragon ball not some daycare lullaby story of the importance of "friendship, confidence" and bunch of nonsense meant for little kids. No dragon ball fans that grew up with db, z and GT really care about that garbage.

Oh my goodness, 18 gives her own view of "love" which is in contrast to ribirane, OH MY GOODNESS THATS SO AMAZING. 18 loves Kuririn, we get it. Move on, I'm here to watch epic fights with a good taste of some nice relevant take home messages for all people, not just delauient children who don't understand love or have "confidence issues" even though they are grown adults fighting for on a multifersal stGe.

Piccolo having a self identity crisis? REALLY. Hahahahah, thTs like ultra character regression. Something we see from supers anime.

Goku "teaching" then is stupid. Goku just fought them for the lust of fighting when he had a universe at stake. Manga goku actuLly understands when to play around and when not too, like goku In Z. And anime goku didn't teach them sqaut, he just fought then because he found them entertaining. Really it. Which just shows how much character he lacks.

This is dragon ball, a serious fighting show with some universal moral theme to back it. I'm not here to watch a watered down version of it just so I can see my favorite character regress to like high teenagers in persoanility. Which is why give me the manga of super well over the anime version. Manga of super actually keeps the character consistent, and the actions means more. The only problem is toyotaro didn't give many character any shine. But hey, whatever. Better then having bad writing, chRactisrization, art, animation (for the most part), fights (for the most part), and like no gore or serious atmosphere.

Can you please tell me, how many eliminations manga Goku has commenced so far, oh I know, absolutely none yet Goku in the anime had the greatest No. of eliminations in the tournament. Yeah, Goku in the anime is playful but at least he eliminated someone Unlike Manga Goku, who is yet to eliminated anyone.
Judging by this who do you think was more serious in the top arc or are you just a plain biased manga sympathizer.

[MoscoSama]

My predictions:

Chapter 39(August) : Freeza takes out Gohan and Kefla, Roshi eliminates Kahseral, Dyspo eliminates Roshi

Chapter 40 (September) : 17 vs Dyspo chapter with Dyspo being eliminated with Goku and Freeza fighting Jiren and Vegeta vs Toppo in background

Chapter 41:(October) : Vegeta beats Toppo, 4 on 1 vs jiren, Jiren eliminates Vegeta, knocks out Freeza and 17 (not eliminated)

Chapter 42 (November) : Goku goes UI, overpowers Jiren, form blows out, 3 on 1 ending with 17 reviving everyone

Chapter 43 (December): First Broly movie chapter

[Omniboy]

Not replying to anyone one in general, just giving my thoughts but I should retract my statement in saying that both mediums are nothing but fighting. They do have aspects that to try lend to themselves to being more than just that. Whether or not they land for me is up for debate. And honestly within the recent chapters of the manga, in regards to Kale and Caulifla, they worked for the most part. I liked Kale's resistance in going Super Saiyan due to the fact that she not only wants to avoid harming Caulifa's ego, but because she also holds Caulifla into high regards for taking her in when no one else would, and that Caulifla should all always look like she is the most powerful because she is the leader.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

Which puts me into another place. Kale and Caulifla seem to belong to a lower class of saiyans. When we see Cabba searching for her in the manga, Cabbe seems to be traveling from a more Utopian high-class society to a more lower class one with broken and cracked building, with people dressed in torn rags as opposed to the saiyans we see with traditional Sadala armor.

[spoiler][/spoiler]

[spoiler][/spoiler]

That may explain them being thieves. Maybe we will see some explanation for this low class society, maybe we will not. But I enjoy setup for Kale and Caulifla's relationship. But Cabbe sacrificing himself to save Kale and put the earring on her was great, and as well as Vegeta saving Cabbe, although that was in the anime as well.

So... yeah I actually enjoyed the last few chapters for their more relation based content.

[Pannaliciour]

I again read chapter 35 of the manga, Goku and Hit vs Jiren. I know the anime made it sort of clear but now also the manga.

Beerus suppressed got hit by mssb Vegeta and then he had to be more serious to one shot Vegeta.

Jiren (supressed) played with mssb Goku and Hit at the same time.

Jiren> Beerus

[Bergamo]

I again read chapter 35 of the manga, Goku and Hit vs Jiren. I know the anime made it sort of clear but now also the manga.

Beerus suppressed got hit by mssb Vegeta and then he had to be more serious to one shot Vegeta.

Jiren (supressed) played with mssb Goku and Hit at the same time.

Jiren> Beerus

Isn't that a bit premature. Comparing suppressed characters is kind of pointless. We know Jiren is stronger than Belmod in terms of combat skill ALONE, so he may be roughly even with Belmod, who is likely below Beerus. We will see though.

[Kanassa]

Lol, bro I'm here to watch dragon ball not some daycare lullaby story of the importance of "friendship, confidence" and bunch of nonsense meant for little kids. No dragon ball fans that grew up with db, z and GT really care about that garbage.

Oh my goodness, 18 gives her own view of "love" which is in contrast to ribirane, OH MY GOODNESS THATS SO AMAZING. 18 loves Kuririn, we get it. Move on, I'm here to watch epic fights with a good taste of some nice relevant take home messages for all people, not just delauient children who don't understand love or have "confidence issues" even though they are grown adults fighting for on a multifersal stGe.

Piccolo having a self identity crisis? REALLY. Hahahahah, thTs like ultra character regression. Something we see from supers anime.

Goku "teaching" then is stupid. Goku just fought them for the lust of fighting when he had a universe at stake. Manga goku actuLly understands when to play around and when not too, like goku In Z. And anime goku didn't teach them sqaut, he just fought then because he found them entertaining. Really it. Which just shows how much character he lacks.

This is dragon ball, a serious fighting show with some universal moral theme to back it. I'm not here to watch a watered down version of it just so I can see my favorite character regress to like high teenagers in persoanility. Which is why give me the manga of super well over the anime version. Manga of super actually keeps the character consistent, and the actions means more. The only problem is toyotaro didn't give many character any shine. But hey, whatever. Better then having bad writing, chRactisrization, art, animation (for the most part), fights (for the most part), and like no gore or serious atmosphere.

Yes, they do? Otherwise, it wouldn't be such a criticised issue? Dragon Ball is more than just fighting, otherwise, it wouldn't have lasted. A nice looking fight is very little without all that goes around it and into it. Yes, the dynamic between 18 and Ribrianne in that episode is simple, but that doesn't make it any less effective and gives the fight substance. Piccolo being afraid that he's dragging his friend down regresses his character how? The tournament of power builds up the Goku who would later decide to teach Uub and him helping Caulifla grow as the battle wears on is perfectly in character, when he see's potential in people he likes to fight them at their best. Manga Goku doesn't understand 'when to play around and when not to', but then that does make him more like Z Goku.

Characters having personality, emotions and dynamics with one another is not regressing them to teenagers, that's making them characters and is storytelling 101. Something which OG Dragon Ball did a good job of.

[1345521]

Something as simple as 18 showing Ribrianne how shallow her outlook on love was or Goku partially training Caulifla as they fought or Piccolo having a crisis of self-confidence or the universes having a moment to react to their total annihilation give emotional weight to a fight. They are small things and not very important in the grand schemes of the plot, but they add character and dynamic that are affected by the situation. I should view Goku fighting Jiren as more than 'The protag punches a rather antagonistic wall', there's little dynamic or reason to be invested. If you took off the character's faces and names it would make little difference.

That's why the episode with Roshi managed to make people go 'Oh shit' even though every single one of them knew there was no way in hell Roshi was dying.


The Manga's action means nothing because it has very little in it, the enemies are no more than just roadblocks in the story when they should feel like more. The anime, even in it's worse moments, remembered that action is meaningless if it doesn't make efforts to make you give a shit. If the characters aren't given moments to be characters, the line making you care about them in battle becomes thin. The conflict of the Trunks arc becomes hard to give a shit about when the character barely seem to treat it with any seriousness (Other than 'He's strong!') with Trunks's emotional moments taking place off screen.

Yes, the manga is more consistent in it's characters, because it does so little with them that it's pretty damn hard to mess it up.

Lol, bro I'm here to watch dragon ball not some daycare lullaby story of the importance of "friendship, confidence" and bunch of nonsense meant for little kids. No dragon ball fans that grew up with db, z and GT really care about that garbage.

Oh my goodness, 18 gives her own view of "love" which is in contrast to ribirane, OH MY GOODNESS THATS SO AMAZING. 18 loves Kuririn, we get it. Move on, I'm here to watch epic fights with a good taste of some nice relevant take home messages for all people, not just delauient children who don't understand love or have "confidence issues" even though they are grown adults fighting for on a multifersal stGe.

Piccolo having a self identity crisis? REALLY. Hahahahah, thTs like ultra character regression. Something we see from supers anime.

Goku "teaching" then is stupid. Goku just fought them for the lust of fighting when he had a universe at stake. Manga goku actuLly understands when to play around and when not too, like goku In Z. And anime goku didn't teach them sqaut, he just fought then because he found them entertaining. Really it. Which just shows how much character he lacks.

This is dragon ball, a serious fighting show with some universal moral theme to back it. I'm not here to watch a watered down version of it just so I can see my favorite character regress to like high teenagers in persoanility. Which is why give me the manga of super well over the anime version. Manga of super actually keeps the character consistent, and the actions means more. The only problem is toyotaro didn't give many character any shine. But hey, whatever. Better then having bad writing, chRactisrization, art, animation (for the most part), fights (for the most part), and like no gore or serious atmosphere.

Can you please tell me, how many eliminations manga Goku has commenced so far, oh I know, absolutely none yet Goku in the anime had the greatest No. of eliminations in the tournament. Yeah, Goku in the anime is playful but at least he eliminated someone Unlike Manga Goku, who is yet to eliminated anyone.
Judging by this who do you think was more serious in the top arc or are you just a plain biased manga sympathizer.

Manga goku would like to apolgize for not having the power of "OMEGA PLOT ARMOR" Which consist of being able to heal at the rate of wolverine, have the stamnia that seems to rival the androids and have strength that grows about as fast as the incrible hulk plus is graced with the abillity to pull new forms out of his behind. if he kept fighting jiren, he'd probably be at ssj 25.

[Bergamo]

Lol, bro I'm here to watch dragon ball not some daycare lullaby story of the importance of "friendship, confidence" and bunch of nonsense meant for little kids. No dragon ball fans that grew up with db, z and GT really care about that garbage.

Oh my goodness, 18 gives her own view of "love" which is in contrast to ribirane, OH MY GOODNESS THATS SO AMAZING. 18 loves Kuririn, we get it. Move on, I'm here to watch epic fights with a good taste of some nice relevant take home messages for all people, not just delauient children who don't understand love or have "confidence issues" even though they are grown adults fighting for on a multifersal stGe.

Piccolo having a self identity crisis? REALLY. Hahahahah, thTs like ultra character regression. Something we see from supers anime.

Goku "teaching" then is stupid. Goku just fought them for the lust of fighting when he had a universe at stake. Manga goku actuLly understands when to play around and when not too, like goku In Z. And anime goku didn't teach them sqaut, he just fought then because he found them entertaining. Really it. Which just shows how much character he lacks.

This is dragon ball, a serious fighting show with some universal moral theme to back it. I'm not here to watch a watered down version of it just so I can see my favorite character regress to like high teenagers in persoanility. Which is why give me the manga of super well over the anime version. Manga of super actually keeps the character consistent, and the actions means more. The only problem is toyotaro didn't give many character any shine. But hey, whatever. Better then having bad writing, chRactisrization, art, animation (for the most part), fights (for the most part), and like no gore or serious atmosphere.

Yes, they do? Otherwise, it wouldn't be such a criticised issue? Dragon Ball is more than just fighting, otherwise, it wouldn't have lasted. A nice looking fight is very little without all that goes around it and into it. Yes, the dynamic between 18 and Ribrianne in that episode is simple, but that doesn't make it any less effective and gives the fight substance. Piccolo being afraid that he's dragging his friend down regresses his character how? The tournament of power builds up the Goku who would later decide to teach Uub and him helping Caulifla grow as the battle wears on is perfectly in character, when he see's potential in people he likes to fight them at their best. Manga Goku doesn't understand 'when to play around and when not to', but then that does make him more like Z Goku.

Characters having personality, emotions and dynamics with one another is not regressing them to teenagers, that's making them characters and is storytelling 101. Something which OG Dragon Ball did a good job of.

These "themes," don't have to be shoved down our throats. Universes having 2 minute erasure scenes where they explain the core traits of their universe is cheap. Zeno is said to erase things in an instant, not give or take a few minutes.

The DBS manga goes much lighter on the moments by having short scenes like Piccolo hesitating to erase universe 9 and Krillin indirectly saving 18. The manga doesn't sacrifice narrative flow for "emotion," and "moments."

[Pokesamus217]

Lol, bro I'm here to watch dragon ball not some daycare lullaby story of the importance of "friendship, confidence" and bunch of nonsense meant for little kids. No dragon ball fans that grew up with db, z and GT really care about that garbage.

Oh my goodness, 18 gives her own view of "love" which is in contrast to ribirane, OH MY GOODNESS THATS SO AMAZING. 18 loves Kuririn, we get it. Move on, I'm here to watch epic fights with a good taste of some nice relevant take home messages for all people, not just delauient children who don't understand love or have "confidence issues" even though they are grown adults fighting for on a multifersal stGe.

Piccolo having a self identity crisis? REALLY. Hahahahah, thTs like ultra character regression. Something we see from supers anime.

Goku "teaching" then is stupid. Goku just fought them for the lust of fighting when he had a universe at stake. Manga goku actuLly understands when to play around and when not too, like goku In Z. And anime goku didn't teach them sqaut, he just fought then because he found them entertaining. Really it. Which just shows how much character he lacks.

This is dragon ball, a serious fighting show with some universal moral theme to back it. I'm not here to watch a watered down version of it just so I can see my favorite character regress to like high teenagers in persoanility. Which is why give me the manga of super well over the anime version. Manga of super actually keeps the character consistent, and the actions means more. The only problem is toyotaro didn't give many character any shine. But hey, whatever. Better then having bad writing, chRactisrization, art, animation (for the most part), fights (for the most part), and like no gore or serious atmosphere.

Yes, they do? Otherwise, it wouldn't be such a criticised issue? Dragon Ball is more than just fighting, otherwise, it wouldn't have lasted. A nice looking fight is very little without all that goes around it and into it. Yes, the dynamic between 18 and Ribrianne in that episode is simple, but that doesn't make it any less effective and gives the fight substance. Piccolo being afraid that he's dragging his friend down regresses his character how? The tournament of power builds up the Goku who would later decide to teach Uub and him helping Caulifla grow as the battle wears on is perfectly in character, when he see's potential in people he likes to fight them at their best. Manga Goku doesn't understand 'when to play around and when not to', but then that does make him more like Z Goku.

Characters having personality, emotions and dynamics with one another is not regressing them to teenagers, that's making them characters and is storytelling 101. Something which OG Dragon Ball did a good job of.

These "themes," don't have to be shoved down our throats. Universes having 2 minute erasure scenes where they explain the core traits of their universe is cheap. Zeno is said to erase things in an instant, not give or take a few minutes.

The DBS manga goes much lighter on the moments by having short scenes like Piccolo hesitating to erase universe 9 and Krillin indirectly saving 18. The manga doesn't sacrifice narrative flow for "emotion," and "moments."

Instead it sacrifices narrative flow for action, that becomes increasingly hard to care about due to most of the characters meaning nothing to the reader.