"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Black Hawk]

Interesting prognostication, but Roshi can only seal with the mafuba and he needs a jar. Unless he mafuba her out of the stage but does Roshi have that type of power. And dyspo and kahsersal are still in this thing, too. Unless if 17 can...we have Frieza still in here. I always seen to forget about him. Gohan and Roshi vs kefla would be cool.

Now that's an idea that never occurred to me. Given the setup of the arena, someone who uses the Evil Containment Wave wouldn't necessarily have to have the precision to seal the opponent in any sort of container. Given the downward thrusting motion of the technique, one could just force opponents down off the stage like Smash Bros. without any concerns of precision as long as a ledge is near.

[Jesus-is Lord]

Interesting prognostication, but Roshi can only seal with the mafuba and he needs a jar. Unless he mafuba her out of the stage but does Roshi have that type of power. And dyspo and kahsersal are still in this thing, too. Unless if 17 can...we have Frieza still in here. I always seen to forget about him. Gohan and Roshi vs kefla would be cool.

Now that's an idea that never occurred to me. Given the setup of the arena, someone who uses the Evil Containment Wave wouldn't necessarily have to have the precision to seal the opponent in any sort of container. Given the downward thrusting motion of the technique, one could just force opponents down off the stage like Smash Bros. without any concerns of precision as long as a ledge is near.

Exactly, Black Hawk.

[prince212]

How do you guys think this Kefla vs Gohan fight will go? I feel like gohan is going to use a technquie and teamwork to best kefla. What type of technique is Toyo going showcase, mafuba? Is gohan going to exploit a weakness of kefla? What is toyotaro going to do? Or unless he's going to make ultimate Gohan as strong as kefla in which I wouldn't have to much of an problem with it, though it's be head scratching. It makes more sense then gohan in the anime being blue level with casual training and like 10 hours of intense gaining from piccolo in the woods. Lol

There’s lots of possibilities like you said .. yes Roshi has to do something.. gohan trust in teamwork for sure .. I think mafuba will appear but it won’t eliminate kafla .. part of gohans teamwork is prevent goku to waste stamina ..
defusion is another possibility and the one with more sense if neither goku or Jiren eliminate kafla ....but I will like Jiren to lay the cards on the table at he end of the chapter and the best thing to do it is a one punch out method against kafla

[alakazam^]

Yeah. I totally hate how people refuse to acknowledge the triumphs of the DBS manga, because they feel like they have some sort of arbitrary loyalty to the DBS anime.

What triumphs? Migatte no Gokui doesn't need foreshadowing here.

[Bergamo]

Yeah. I totally hate how people refuse to acknowledge the triumphs of the DBS manga, because they feel like they have some sort of arbitrary loyalty to the DBS anime.

What triumphs? Migatte no Gokui doesn't need foreshadowing here.

So you think a new power coming out of completely nowhere is fine?

[Lord Beerus]

Yeah. I totally hate how people refuse to acknowledge the triumphs of the DBS manga, because they feel like they have some sort of arbitrary loyalty to the DBS anime.

What triumphs? Migatte no Gokui doesn't need foreshadowing here.

So you think a new power coming out of completely nowhere is fine?

Well, people really like SSJ3...

[SSJgogeto]

How do you guys think this Kefla vs Gohan fight will go? I feel like gohan is going to use a technquie and teamwork to best kefla. What type of technique is Toyo going showcase, mafuba? Is gohan going to exploit a weakness of kefla? What is toyotaro going to do? Or unless he's going to make ultimate Gohan as strong as kefla in which I wouldn't have to much of an problem with it, though it's be head scratching. It makes more sense then gohan in the anime being blue level with casual training and like 10 hours of intense gaining from piccolo in the woods. Lol

Kale is said to be a demonic saiyan. Master Roshi has a demon seal. I think it will happen.

Didn't Roshi said something about trying to seal a strong being when he taught Goku the Mafuba?

[alakazam^]

So you think a new power coming out of completely nowhere is fine?

It's not out of nowhere, it was talked about in F. Also, SS3, as mentioned.

[Bergamo]

So you think a new power coming out of completely nowhere is fine?

It's not out of nowhere, it was talked about in F. Also, SS3, as mentioned.

Mentioning something 3 arcs in advance isn't proper foreshadowing.

[Jesus-is Lord]

So you think a new power coming out of completely nowhere is fine?

It's not out of nowhere, it was talked about in F. Also, SS3, as mentioned.

Mentioning something 3 arcs in advance isn't proper foreshadowing.

The entire premise of the form makes little sense. So it's a technique that somehow gives you the power-up beyond ssj blue kaioken x 20? What!? And you achieve it by "surviving a near death expirence" or "breaking your limits to survive a near death expirence" - how does that translate to achieving a transformation that's multiplayer is greater ssj blue kaioken - while not be a sayain form - while also giving you the super power of instinctively dodge. That's UI - a huge transformation that just gives you the power to dodge. And does UI use god ki or regular ki? Never estbalished and what is that aura around it? It looks so pretty but the value of it decreases because it has no implicative meaning for its existence because Jiren can somehow produce the same aura.

This is why I don't think UI is that good of a form, hopefully the manga can explain things better though I doubt.

[alakazam^]

Mentioning something 3 arcs in advance isn't proper foreshadowing.

That's moving the goalposts. It was mentioned, it didn't pop out of nowhere.

[Bergamo]

Mentioning something 3 arcs in advance isn't proper foreshadowing.

That's moving the goalposts. It was mentioned, it didn't pop out of nowhere.

You said that ultra instinct doesn't need foreshadowing. I'm not saying it came out of nowhere, but you said that it would be okay if it did.

[alakazam^]

You said that ultra instinct doesn't need foreshadowing. I'm not saying it came out of nowhere, but you said that it would be okay if it did.

I did say that because it was being argued that one of the triumphs of the manga over the anime was that it had more foreshadowing of Migatte no Gokui, when that doesn't make it better nor worse.

It could pop out of nowhere and Whis explaining all about it.

[Bergamo]

You said that ultra instinct doesn't need foreshadowing. I'm not saying it came out of nowhere, but you said that it would be okay if it did.

I did say that because it was being argued that one of the triumphs of the manga over the anime was that it had more foreshadowing of Migatte no Gokui, when that doesn't make it better nor worse.

It could pop out of nowhere and Whis explaining all about it.

So, you think that showcasing the power that is going to be used in Goku's new transformation and then having Whis explain that UI is the next step in Goku and Vegeta's training doesn't make the story more cohesive? You think that mentioning UI once and then bringing it back randomly 70 episodes later is exactly the same?

[Miracles]

UI was scratched upon in RoF but it wasn't brought up again till the TOP. Vegeta didn't even remember UI until Goku achieved it a second time against Kefla. No particular training was being done for it and all of a sudden Goku gets it cause he pushes passed his limit by trying to resist huge energy. This is not proper foreshadowing from TOEI but I didn't really care cause it was COOL, period.

The manga on the other hand actually had Beerus showcase UI in the exhibition god match with Goku watching and getting info on it, Vegeta and Whis discuss UI while training and now Goku talks about it in the TOP.
It's obvious the manga did a better job at build up here.

[Cetra]

You said that ultra instinct doesn't need foreshadowing. I'm not saying it came out of nowhere, but you said that it would be okay if it did.

I did say that because it was being argued that one of the triumphs of the manga over the anime was that it had more foreshadowing of Migatte no Gokui, when that doesn't make it better nor worse.

It could pop out of nowhere and Whis explaining all about it.

So, you think that showcasing the power that is going to be used in Goku's new transformation and then having Whis explain that UI is the next step in Goku and Vegeta's training doesn't make the story more cohesive? You think that mentioning UI once and then bringing it back randomly 70 episodes later is exactly the same?

They actually did hint Migatte no Goku'i at the start of the Survival arc when Goku dodged Bulma like he was in trance.

[Bergamo]

I did say that because it was being argued that one of the triumphs of the manga over the anime was that it had more foreshadowing of Migatte no Gokui, when that doesn't make it better nor worse.

It could pop out of nowhere and Whis explaining all about it.

So, you think that showcasing the power that is going to be used in Goku's new transformation and then having Whis explain that UI is the next step in Goku and Vegeta's training doesn't make the story more cohesive? You think that mentioning UI once and then bringing it back randomly 70 episodes later is exactly the same?

They actually did hint Migatte no Goku'i at the start of the Survival arc when Goku dodged Bulma like he was in trance.

That doesn't make a lot of sense. Nothing else hints that Goku had UI before he was hit with the spirit bomb. Besides, dodging Bulma isn't really that impressive. Foreshadowing also isn't usually done in one-off episodes.

Even if you want to count that, it's obviously not as effective as the foreshadowing in the manga.

[PFM18]

Yeah. I totally hate how people refuse to acknowledge the triumphs of the DBS manga, because they feel like they have some sort of arbitrary loyalty to the DBS anime.

What triumphs? Migatte no Gokui doesn't need foreshadowing here.

So you think a new power coming out of completely nowhere is fine?

Well no it isn't. Which is exactly why it will be awful when it suddenly arises at the end of the tournament with the only build up being Goku saying "yeah so I totally want to unlock this power Hit. I don't have a choice I have to attain it!" and then boom he suddenly knows exactly how to use it to it's full extent. No struggle, no learning process, he is just going to have it. Using Omen as a way of giving Goku a struggle to finally learn to complete the abilities of Ultra Instinct over the course of a series of fights that push him to his limits is infinitely better than it being mentioned a couple times then it is used during the climactic moments just because. This is not a "triumph" of the manga in any capacity. It's entirely inorganic and not cohesive whatsoever.

[TKA]

Well, people really like SSJ3...

I'm tired of this false equivalency.

Super Saiyan 3 cannot be compared to the likes of Super anime's ultra instinct, or "beyond blue", or Trunk's "rage form". Super Saiyan 3 was meant to be a red herring. The form never won a single fight and was introduced to make distract the reader/viewer: the real powerup mechanic of the Buu arc was fusion. It was a nice spin on things, where every previous arc was about getting new forms and techniques, Super Saiyan 3 was objectively a bad form and stated as such within the story.

If Goku turned Super Saiyan 3 out of nowhere, and proceeded to kill Buu, THEN it would be comparable to what the Super anime does.

[Cetra]

So, you think that showcasing the power that is going to be used in Goku's new transformation and then having Whis explain that UI is the next step in Goku and Vegeta's training doesn't make the story more cohesive? You think that mentioning UI once and then bringing it back randomly 70 episodes later is exactly the same?

They actually did hint Migatte no Goku'i at the start of the Survival arc when Goku dodged Bulma like he was in trance.

That doesn't make a lot of sense. Nothing else hints that Goku had UI before he was hit with the spirit bomb. Besides, dodging Bulma isn't really that impressive. Foreshadowing also isn't usually done in one-off episodes.

Even if you want to count that, it's obviously not as effective as the foreshadowing in the manga.

I don't know what exactly you mean of the manga but it was a hint in the anime. There is no point in showing a random dodging for no reason. And it was not "shown as random dodging" either. It is all about how it is done. Also it is very well normal foreshadowing, not actually saying he has Migatte. It only shows "okay, guys, he is on his way". That is all that is necessary.