"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Yamcha upset fan]

ginyu frog is still alive in this time line,,,,



just saying,,,

We don't know that for sure.

...that being said, he isn't totally unwelcome.

It would be a really interesting tourn of events

[Luso Saiyan]

unlike trunks power up that Vegeta and Goku couldn't achieve. but toei fanboyism did, impossible to explain inuniverse.

Says who? You know nothing about this power/transformation, therefore you can't make any of those claims.

[Anime Kitten]

Says who? You know nothing about this power/transformation, therefore you can't make any of those claims.

Agreed on this, but adjust the tone a little.

No one potentially knows any more than anyone else, unless you somehow have the script for the show or manga. Like I said before, it's best to just wait before calling "PLOTHOLE! The arc is ruined because this can't work!" Let me give an example. Say after Episode 47 aired, someone leaked that Black was Zamasu. Right then, it'd make absolutely zero sense because there hadn't been an explanation, yet. Do you see what I mean now?

[dbs fanboy]

I don't understand why multiple people are taking story plots completely out of context.

I'm sure lots of Charles dickens works, especially Christmas carol would look like nonsensical @$$pulls if you want to remove the context and he story they occur in. In not sure how doing that acts as a defense for Super.

People, are just stating that inside the fictional universe created. The current works has inconsistencies versus the previous. Rather than saying yeah I guys a few decades of time could result in that we have people sticking their fingers in their ears and saying no, no, no if this sucks, the other stuff you love sucks too. It's like the argument 6 year olds use, it's so bizarre.

Super is different then it's predecessors and that's ok. Not everyone is going to like those changes and yes the storytelling is not at fluid or streamlined. Super feels like a disjointedly constructed story written by a lot of different people because well, it is.

I agree with what you say, but i don't think that the argument is that simple, these responses were created due to the fact that he said that Trunk's power up was "anti Z", when the same thing happened on the series and he's judging the power up too soon (event thought it will probably end up being just a stupid rage boost such as Vegeta's in BoG, cool, necessary, but stupid)

[Luso Saiyan]

Agreed on this, but adjust the tone a little.

What tone?

[Anime Kitten]

What tone?

Your post seemed a bit rude toned, that's all.

[Luso Saiyan]

Your post seemed a bit rude toned, that's all.

Wasn't rude at all. Don't blame me for how you decided to read it.

[Anime Kitten]

Wasn't rude at all. Don't blame me for how you decided to read it.

Again, I find this very rude toned. But I'm not going to drag this on, so I won't respond any more.

When does everyone think the arc will end? I'm guessing 66 or 67.

[Boo Machine]

If there are no more surprises then, I'd say the arc would end around episode 67, 68, maybe a little more depending on how long the "final fight" and ending is.

I just want to know if this arc will connect to anything in a future arc. I mean, you have guys messing around in different timelines and universes. That has to cause something. Especially with the main culprit being "Son Goku". Despite all the back and forth between Universe 10 and 7 we haven't seen much of 10. I'd like a little more on that.

[FortuneSSJ]

Despite all the back and forth between Universe 10 and 7 we haven't seen much of 10. I'd like a little more on that.

What bugs me is the absence of the God of Destruction from Uni10. HIs name should already have been mentioned by someone, at least.

Beerus killed a person from his Universe. In this case Beerus saved his/her life by protecting the Kaioshin, but I would like to see his/her approach to that.

[Alruneia]

When does everyone think the arc will end? I'm guessing 66 or 67.

I stand by my earlier November estimate (so 65-68). At the moment, 67 seems pretty likely to me. It depends on the success of the Evil Containment Wave and on the upcoming Zamack's (I'll use this name for simplicity) level of strength and possible weaknesses. I expect the technique to fail, and I also think that the fact that Black avoided getting erased because he was wearing the Time Ring might come into play. Maybe without the ring he'll either die or be severely weakened. Still hoping for that Sauron-esque moment where Trunks' sword cuts the finger with the Time Ring on it off

[Noah]

Explain the scenario with Dr Gero building androids much stronger than Super Saiyans. Because as far as Dr Gero was concerned, he had only collected data from Saiyans while they were on Earth and he had no idea about what happened on Namek with Goku becoming a SSJ, and on top of that, was very surprised with Goku's SSJ abilities and power as whole he transformed in front of him. So how come Android 16, 17 and 18 turned to be as strong as they were? It's quite a plot hole now that you think about it.

No, it's not. Since there's nothing that indicates that no one could ever have surpassed Goku and Freeza after Namek Arc. Dr. Gero is a genius, this is a fact, he was just being cautious, knowing how Goku was getting stronger through the time (RR to Saiyan Arc), making androids that would outclass him no matter what was a great strategy. Also he was not that all impressed with Super Saiyan, he even states that 19 could still defeat him

[TheMikado]

I don't understand why multiple people are taking story plots completely out of context.

I'm sure lots of Charles dickens works, especially Christmas carol would look like nonsensical @$$pulls if you want to remove the context and he story they occur in. In not sure how doing that acts as a defense for Super.

People, are just stating that inside the fictional universe created. The current works has inconsistencies versus the previous. Rather than saying yeah I guys a few decades of time could result in that we have people sticking their fingers in their ears and saying no, no, no if this sucks, the other stuff you love sucks too. It's like the argument 6 year olds use, it's so bizarre.

Super is different then it's predecessors and that's ok. Not everyone is going to like those changes and yes the storytelling is not at fluid or streamlined. Super feels like a disjointedly constructed story written by a lot of different people because well, it is.

I agree with what you say, but i don't think that the argument is that simple, these responses were created due to the fact that he said that Trunk's power up was "anti Z", when the same thing happened on the series and he's judging the power up too soon (event thought it will probably end up being just a stupid rage boost such as Vegeta's in BoG, cool, necessary, but stupid)

Ok I didn't understand what was happening in the thread. Yes it's too early to judge yet, but it certainly lacks the same level of foreshadowing that we have become accustomed to since Z. In Z we were constantly foreshadowing Gohans potential since Raditz and finally delivered in Cell Arc and expanded in the Buu arc. Meanwhile Gokus boosts in terms of the anime were foreshadowed weeks in advance as we never see the "results" of his training for several weeks. The only thing close to this is the SSJ3 transformation which ending up not doing much in the end. I suppose you could count fusion too but even that was foreshadowed with the pairing of those two in the tournament.

[TheMikado]

Explain the scenario with Dr Gero building androids much stronger than Super Saiyans. Because as far as Dr Gero was concerned, he had only collected data from Saiyans while they were on Earth and he had no idea about what happened on Namek with Goku becoming a SSJ, and on top of that, was very surprised with Goku's SSJ abilities and power as whole he transformed in front of him. So how come Android 16, 17 and 18 turned to be as strong as they were? It's quite a plot hole now that you think about it.

No, it's not. Since there's nothing that indicates that no one could ever have surpassed Goku and Freeza after Namek Arc. Dr. Gero is a genius, this is a fact, he was just being cautious, knowing how Goku was getting stronger through the time (RR to Saiyan Arc), making androids that would outclass him no matter what was a great strategy. Also he was not that all impressed with Super Saiyan, he even states that 19 could still defeat him

This is a little different in that your argument is that they made the enemy too strong, that's like staying Darkseid is only strong because of Superman. Or Flashs enemies are only fast because he is and calling it a plot hole.

[Noah]

This is a little different in that your argument is that they made the enemy too strong, that's like staying Darkseid is only strong because of Superman. Or Flashs enemies are only fast because he is and calling it a plot hole.

Which argument? If you're talking about I'm being relutant to believe that Base Trunks is above Super Vegetto, then no... I have no problem in characters surpassing others power related, provided it is explained in a rational way, not simply played to audience

[TheMikado]

This is a little different in that your argument is that they made the enemy too strong, that's like staying Darkseid is only strong because of Superman. Or Flashs enemies are only fast because he is and calling it a plot hole.

Which argument? If you're talking about I'm being relutant to believe that Base Trunks is above Super Vegetto, then no... I have no problem in characters surpassing others power related, provided it is explained in a rational way, not simply played to audience

No I meant about Gero making the androids so strong. One is talking about arbitrarily inflating an antagonist to be a challenge for the protagonist vs protagonist inflation to match the antagonist. As with everything, the reasoning is just as important as the execution, in universe there are plausible reasons for the androids strength which have nothing to do with Goku, same with Darkseid and Superman. The difference is a plausible reason for both Blacks strength and Trunks strength are not the explained in universe.

[Bullza]

Are we sure there's really three Zamasu's?

I'm watching it again now with subs and when Goku brings up that he saw Beerus kill him, Black mentions it has something to do with the time ring somehow.

But if he's a Zamasu from another timeline altogether then the time ring shouldn't play any part in it at all. He shouldn't even know that a Zamasu had died anyway.

That combined with them showing a flashback of the Zamasu who died...it makes me wonder if Black could just be that Zamasu.

[Sandubadear]

Are we sure there's really three Zamasu's?

I'm watching it again now with subs and when Goku brings up that he saw Beerus kill him, Black mentions it has something to do with the time ring somehow.

But if he's a Zamasu from another timeline altogether then the time ring shouldn't play any part in it at all. He shouldn't even know that a Zamasu had died anyway.

That combined with them showing a flashback of the Zamasu who died...it makes me wonder if Black could just be that Zamasu.

In my opinion, Black is from the regular Super timeline, but when Beerus killed Zamasu, the timeline was rewritten (that's what Beerus meant) and Black was never created. However, Black wasn't erased despite his past self being killed, because the Time Ring protected him.

[fadeddreams5]

Anti DBZ? The same DBZ that gave SSJ to 7 years old Goten and 8 years old Trunks?!

And had an old man in cave capable of building robots much stronger than Super Saiyan with very limited data on what Saiyans were capable with.

Or had a 4 year old Gohan surpass the power that his father spent his entire life building up with just a few months of training under Piccolo.

Goten, Trunks, and Gohan are prodigies. It was a dumb idea to give the former two SSJ forms, as that cheapened the transformation greatly, but there's simple reasoning behind it. Gohan had a mysterious potential; this was always a unique trait of his. There isn't meant to be an explanation to his hidden powers, though it could be explored if they gave a flip about the character.

Dr. Gero created androids with infinite energy he himself could not control. We're never told what resources he used to achieve this. Clearly he did make miscalculations because he never intended on releasing the androids to begin with--they were too dangerous. He thought him and 20 could get the job done, and he was wrong.

Trunks in Super just got angry and, presumably, attained a form as strong as SSJB, despite never achieving SSJ3, SSJG, or SSJB, and never having hidden powers. It's an asspull to end all asspulls. As bad as Ichigo transforming against Ulquiorra.

[Alee9977]

I think the arc can end in 70, most likely Merged Zamasu will have a transformation (or more) and that is going to take more episodes, so I don't think the arc is ending until 70 or so.