FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Fulicer » Thu Jul 04, 2013 11:30 am

Kendamu wrote: You're not going to convince me that what I was having trouble with when switching to a crappy cable (after my first one broke) and then that problem being fixed after I switched to a better cable simply didn't happen. I experienced that for myself. Don't confuse my ideas as, "Go spend $150 on a cable." I'm just saying not to buy end cheapest piece of crap out there.
You might have had certain problems with your bad cable for signal-related reasons, but I should point out that stuff related to rendering assets (loading, drawing distances, LOD, etc) in a game are entirely dependent on the console or PC hardware (basically what Captain Awesome said about the game stuff). Otherwise, I could convince people to buy a "high-speed" HDMI cable to improve their frame rate and basically allow more features to be turned on in Crysis, when in fact they should be buying a better graphics card and perhaps some other components. The resolution that you use with any screen, PC combo could have influence too (on the framerate).

So once the (2D) frames are rendered using the console or PC hardware independent of the cable, they have to be transmitted to the screen. I suppose something could go wrong with transmitting pure image data (and that debate is probably applicable to you and Captain Awesome), but like I said the cable has nothing to do with what happens when those frames are rendered. I've been writing OpenGL programs for a while now and I don't really care about the DVI cable used as far as rendering goes.
Last edited by Fulicer on Thu Jul 04, 2013 11:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Ajay » Thu Jul 04, 2013 11:35 am

What everyone has said is true, the cable has absolute nothing to do with any kind of graphical processing or any real processing whatsoever. It's purely a way of sending the image data to your monitor.

As for the quality of cables - THIS article pretty much explains it all in depth.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Dalesy » Fri Jul 05, 2013 6:32 pm

Kendamu wrote:Not exactly. While HDMI cables in general are overpriced, they aren't "all the same." Insulation and quality of wiring used determines how well a cable deals with electrical interference and how fast the data transfer is. Quality materials also ensure that the cable is less likely to break during normal plugging and unplugging. Your crappy super thin HDMI cable, while playing a video game, isn't going to load things as quickly and it's going to affect draw distances. This can be a problem when you're looking for guys to drop down on in an Arkham game or you could start tripping over invisible people while running in an Assassin's Creed game.
Uh, no. You may experience interference on some VERY poorly manufactured cables, but those cases are rare. As far as draw distance and response time goes, that's all on your PC/console. You can't trip over an invisible guy in AC or miss someone dropping down on you in Arkham because of a cable's performance. It just doesn't work that way. The cable doesn't process video elements, it just displays the image that is outputted from your GPU. Even with a delay (which pretty much never occurs), you wouldn't see some elements come into the picture later or earlier than others. Draw distance is determined entirely by your hardware's ability to draw on-screen elements. It has nothing to do with the cable you're using.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Metalwario64 » Fri Jul 05, 2013 7:26 pm

Dalesy wrote:It just doesn't work that way. The cable doesn't process video elements, it just displays the image that is outputted from your GPU.
Yeah, I'll also vouch for this, as I know a tiny bit about tech. :wink:

It's not as if unplugging your video cable will suddenly make the game stop functioning, or will suddenly disconnect you from servers or anything.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Kendamu » Fri Jul 05, 2013 11:15 pm

Dalesy wrote:
Kendamu wrote:Not exactly. While HDMI cables in general are overpriced, they aren't "all the same." Insulation and quality of wiring used determines how well a cable deals with electrical interference and how fast the data transfer is. Quality materials also ensure that the cable is less likely to break during normal plugging and unplugging. Your crappy super thin HDMI cable, while playing a video game, isn't going to load things as quickly and it's going to affect draw distances. This can be a problem when you're looking for guys to drop down on in an Arkham game or you could start tripping over invisible people while running in an Assassin's Creed game.
Uh, no. You may experience interference on some VERY poorly manufactured cables, but those cases are rare. As far as draw distance and response time goes, that's all on your PC/console. You can't trip over an invisible guy in AC or miss someone dropping down on you in Arkham because of a cable's performance. It just doesn't work that way. The cable doesn't process video elements, it just displays the image that is outputted from your GPU. Even with a delay (which pretty much never occurs), you wouldn't see some elements come into the picture later or earlier than others. Draw distance is determined entirely by your hardware's ability to draw on-screen elements. It has nothing to do with the cable you're using.
Then I guess my PlayStation 3 is just different than other PlayStation 3 consoles and has different hardware specs, but only when certain cables are plugged in.

In all seriousness, I must've had something running less than 10.2 to have the problems I've had with super cheap cables.

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by MarcFBR » Fri Jul 05, 2013 11:52 pm

Kendamu wrote:In all seriousness, I must've had something running less than 10.2 to have the problems I've had with super cheap cables.
It actually is possible to have problems with super cheap cables, but these generally aren't 'cheap' cables, rather they are the kind built extremely poorly, regardless of price (they are just often super cheap.) There are plenty of places where you can get cheap cables that are built great, and work perfectly.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Kendamu » Sat Jul 06, 2013 3:38 am

Right. My point from the beginning, though, was that it's not that expensive to join the HD Age with the rest of us. A DVD version of the new DBZ Blu-rays doesn't needs to exist. If it does, I wouldn't go out of my way to complain, but FUNimantion would be wasting their time in doing so.

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Kakarot88 » Sat Jul 06, 2013 12:11 pm

Anybody know how to gauge the likelihood that this release is gonna happen?
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Insertclevername » Sat Jul 06, 2013 2:22 pm

I'd say it has a good chance considering they acknowledged the release directly in the beginning of the survey.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Kojiro Sasaki » Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:19 am

Are there some new information about this release? (I have no access to FUNimation forum)

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Gonstead » Sun Jul 14, 2013 6:32 am

If there is, it will be posted for us to see. All you need is patience.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Kendamu » Sun Jul 14, 2013 1:49 pm

Kojiro Sasaki wrote:Are there some new information about this release? (I have no access to FUNimation forum)
I think we're waiting on Otakon hoping that we get more news on US Dragon Ball releases there.

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Sun Jul 14, 2013 3:41 pm

Kojiro Sasaki wrote:I have no access to FUNimation forum
Nobody does at the moment. The forums are down while they work on tinkering the site a little more, and won't be back up until...well, whenever it's all ready to go up again. ^_^;
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Daimo-Rukiri » Tue Jul 16, 2013 11:50 pm

AjayLikesGaming wrote:What everyone has said is true, the cable has absolute nothing to do with any kind of graphical processing or any real processing whatsoever. It's purely a way of sending the image data to your monitor.

As for the quality of cables - THIS article pretty much explains it all in depth.
Quality of cables does matter but for digital? nah. It only matters when you're working with analog than quality of the cables do matter.

Just get a nice braided cable and call it a day, for quality analog expect to pay up the nose...

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Ajay » Wed Jul 17, 2013 6:22 am

Daimo-Rukiri wrote:
AjayLikesGaming wrote:What everyone has said is true, the cable has absolute nothing to do with any kind of graphical processing or any real processing whatsoever. It's purely a way of sending the image data to your monitor.

As for the quality of cables - THIS article pretty much explains it all in depth.
Quality of cables does matter but for digital? nah. It only matters when you're working with analog than quality of the cables do matter.

Just get a nice braided cable and call it a day, for quality analog expect to pay up the nose...
That article explicitly says you don't need to pay extra for digital cables unless you're going over a larger distance and even then they say don't pay over £10. Did you even read that? It's quite literally all in the last paragraph.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by qjz123 » Fri Aug 02, 2013 7:53 am

So since Both Level 1.1 and Level 1.2 are out of stock on amazon can we assume that another Dragon ball Z blu ray release is going to happen soon?
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Ajay » Fri Aug 02, 2013 8:24 am

qjz123 wrote:So since Both Level 1.1 and Level 1.2 are out of stock on amazon can we assume that another Dragon ball Z blu ray release is going to happen soon?
Well...yeah, that's what this entire thread is about. Funimation put out a survey asking fans how they want the Blu-Ray released so that would imply there are certainly plans.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Cold Skin » Fri Aug 02, 2013 9:00 am

Their question about the aspect ratio makes me realize that only a full remake will solve the problem once and for all.

Widescreen will be no good to some fans because it takes out part of the original picture as intended. And in the case of a widescreen display that is not set shot by shot depending on what's being shown, there can be important missing parts that make shots look ugly and unprofessionnal.
4:3 will be no good to some fans because it leaves the screen unfilled, with big black bars on the side, and seeing something "square-like" just won't do when we got awesome widescreen TVs nowadays. And zooming is not a solution since it takes away a good amount of resolution and does not give "clever" widescreen, being always zoomed on the same part of the picture regardless of what happens on screen.

So the only way to go is to have a product where widescreen actually IS the full original picture as intended, and there will be no more problem like "if it's like this we lose some of the picture, but if it's like that we don't enjoy the qualities of our widescreen TV".

As for the actual choice given here, I don't think they ever said if it was going to be "lazy" always-keeping-to-the-center widescreen like they did in some previous boxsets or if it would be "clever" widescreen like Kai.
I would refuse the dead-on-center widescreen without a second thought, the result would look terrible. But I would prefer "clever" widescreen to 4:3 because I want my widescreen TV to be filled, I have trouble diving into that world when the picture is not wide and when you can see black bars on the side, and sacrificing unnecessary elements for that purpose doesn't bother me.

And before all 4:3 fans (at least for the original series) jump at me saying "What?! How dare you?!", do not worry, I haven't answered the poll (don't know if it's available to everyone in the world anyway), because as a French guy, I think it is not my place to answer a poll that will determine a product that is not meant for me, so fans who will actually get that release should be the ones to decide.

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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by ABED » Fri Aug 02, 2013 9:53 am

NO widescreen, the show wasn't intended for widescreen. It was shot and framed for 4:3 television. My suggestion, get over it. Sorry if that comes off as harsh but I don't see why the picture taking up the frame is what's most important, instead of how the art was intended to be presented. There's always going to be black bars, unless everything suddenly became 16:9. Not everything was meant for widescreen and it would be like redirecting the show if they chose that route.
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Re: FUNimation "DBZ on Blu-Ray" Survey

Post by Cold Skin » Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:41 am

^ You don't see the importance of having your screen filled? Good, I don't see the importance of having superfluous elements at the cost of a square window inside my TV.
Which is why a full "redirected" remake will solve it: a full remake will be meant to be seen in widescreen and everyone will be happy.

Think what you want, but we don't have widescreen TVs to see half of the screen not used, sorry but I'm not buying a book to have the last tier filled with blank pages, regardless of the story stopping way before. You don't pretend that fact doesn't exist and put the product as is despite the fact that it's not synchronized with the recepee anymore, you fill those blank pages with something new if need be, which Kai did.
So this IS a problem, and Kai has proven that good widescreen does great, they even ADD new parts of the pictures, which means you actually WIN something and all that is lost is acknowledged as irrelevant by the production company itself.

But if you like it, next time you watch a video on your computer, reduce the video window to half of the screen, see if you're happy. Cause that's always nice watching something in a window smaller than your screen just because "somebody somewhere decided it was meant to be seen that way" (let's say it's to emulate the fact that you're supposed to be far from your TV set, that way you'll see the picture as if you were watching a TV on the other side of the room when you're just in front of your computer screen, that's the way it was meant to be seen!!).

Just like the manga IS now meant to be seen in full color, regardless of "how it WAS meant to be seen" back then. :wink:
See how "WAS" makes the expression "how it WAS meant to be seen" irrelevant to present times?

But to each their own, if you want to let some outdated director decide what's good to see today, suit yourself. It's like asking most grandfathers what's the best streaming website: how can he know what's good when he didn't have the tools to get acquainted with that back then. We have tools today that can go beyond the original vision they had, so why not use it?
Or maybe you want to stop using the microwave oven because it does not respect the vision your ancestors had of "how it's like and how it feels to warm up some food" and you're really losing something compared to them?

Now you want the show as it was meant to be seen otherwise it's redirecting it? Fine. Then don't take a blu-ray. Or a DVD. The show was not meant to be seen on such devices back then, the experience will be modified.
Don't buy it if they did any kind of great remastering: it was not meant to look as good as it is when greatly remaster from today.
See the point? Today we have DVD technology so we want it on DVDs, today we have Blu-Ray technology so we want it on Blu-Ray, today we have widescreen pictures so... guess the end of the sentence?

So I'm terribly sorry if it all sounds snappy, but your post really seemed like "I have the right opinion, you don't", or "this is the right way, period" so it prompted me to show you what it's like when someone rubs tthis to your face when there's no actual, objectively right opinion on a subject.
The truth is, your opinion is valid ("discarding today's features for the original vision") and mine is valid too ("discarding the original vision for today's features"). To you, the original vision is the priority, to me it's something optionnal because it's already gone at the time being, even in the creator's mind who would likely do things a different way today (widescreen, for example? :roll:), and changing the original vision could actually be the way to be closer to the creator's actual vision (as it has likely evolved to adapt to the current context, including current tools).

As I said, the ultimate objective truth is that there are advantages and disadvantages to both 4:3 and widescreen when it comes to the old series that was originally 4:3 but our products are now meant for widescreen.
And the ultimate objective truth is that the only way to have only advantages and getting rid off all disadvantges and making everyone happy about the aspect ratio is to have a new version that is meant to be widescreen from the start, which was the point of my post, my opinion on the subject was just a trivia note (France has already chosen that "Kai smart widescreen" is the way to go, so we're fine here).

And to finish, I will agree with you that for this very specific release, 4:3 is the way to go, because those buying this want the original series, including all its flaws: if they wanted an updated product, they have Kai available.
But from a general point of view, I have a different opinion than yours as to what is to be done with a 4:3 product at the time of widescreen sets.
Last edited by Cold Skin on Fri Aug 02, 2013 11:47 am, edited 2 times in total.

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