"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[nite_jay]

I feel like the anime has padded a lot of this arc out. I hope In the future Toriyama will be able to
approve arcs fully and not have to just have Toei fill in blanks to extend the arc/episode length. Some things like Black's first match with Goku and their 2nd trip to the future probably could have been cut. They seem like Toei additions that weren't very well thought out in relation to the rest of the story.

[HeroR]

That is kind of loaded, especially since it depends how vague Toriyama's note are, which seems to be pretty vague. As far as we know, the outline says, 'Goku does something awesome, Merged Zamasu defeated'.

Sure, but the end of an arc is something Toriyama will put some thought into so that is practially guaranteed to be more detailed than the rest. And, if he were to use the Kaiouken, he'd need to explain why Goku didn't use it again since, as far as Toriyama is concerned, the last time he used it was on Namek.

We honestly don't know what Toriyama knows, especially he looks at both versions of the anime and manga, so it isn't like he doesn't know the anime used the Kaio-Ken. And, we also don't know how much 'thought' he puts into the end of the arc.

[Ki Breaker]

I feel like the anime has padded a lot of this arc out. I hope In the future Toriyama will be able to
approve arcs fully and not have to just have Toei fill in blanks to extend the arc/episode length. Some things like Black's first match with Goku and their 2nd trip to the future probably could have been cut. They seem like Toei additions that weren't very well thought out in relation to the rest of the story.

You might be right..Kind of..

In near future Toyotaro is going to be ahead of the anime and will give them information, it's the opposite right now,

His manga is much more close to toriyamas work than the anime to me..
And it is pretty much confirmed toriyama sees over his manga once, and even points out mistakes when necessary ( oddly enough it's the gags )

I expect to see both Better fighting and simple story telling in future

[HeroR]

I feel like the anime has padded a lot of this arc out. I hope In the future Toriyama will be able to
approve arcs fully and not have to just have Toei fill in blanks to extend the arc/episode length. Some things like Black's first match with Goku and their 2nd trip to the future probably could have been cut. They seem like Toei additions that weren't very well thought out in relation to the rest of the story.

I doubt they would go through adding the entire paradox plot if it wasn't hinted in the outline, especially since that first match with Black is what started the time loop. And I think some of you guys put too much stock in an outline that Toyotaro confirmed is really barebones. Toriyama already said he wants people to give their own take, so he doesn't care about plot or 'filler' as much as some fans do.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

I feel like the anime has padded a lot of this arc out. I hope In the future Toriyama will be able to
approve arcs fully and not have to just have Toei fill in blanks to extend the arc/episode length. Some things like Black's first match with Goku and their 2nd trip to the future probably could have been cut. They seem like Toei additions that weren't very well thought out in relation to the rest of the story.

I doubt they would go through adding the entire paradox plot if it wasn't hinted in the outline, especially since that first match with Black is what started the time loop. And I think some of you guys put too much stock in an outline that Toyotaro confirmed is really barebones. Toriyama already said he wants people to give their own take, so he doesn't care about plot or 'filler' as much as some fans do.

Also don't see how Goku vs Black R1 is a Toei addition. It's fine nobody was complaining when that episode air. Feel like too many people treat the Manga like a bible here. Just cuz it wasn't in there doesn't mean it was a Toei idea.

[LuckyCat]

Also don't see how Goku vs Black R1 is a Toei addition.

It's weird because Black's ring should only allow him to travel into the future. This was made clear at a later episode when Gowasu was explaining the rings to Zamasu. That Black could suddenly go back in time for a brief period of time in a weakened state goes against what will be the established story.

But hey, from a fan servicey action point of view, it was cool to see a preview of Black's fighting style.

[UpFromTheSkies]

Also don't see how Goku vs Black R1 is a Toei addition.

It's weird because Black's ring should only allow him to travel into the future. This was made clear at a later episode when Gowasu was explaining the rings to Zamasu. That Black could suddenly go back in time for a brief period of time in a weakened state goes against what will be the established story.

But hey, from a fan servicey action point of view, it was cool to see a preview of Black's fighting style.

Black didn't use the ring to travel to the past, he used it to detect a rip in space and time made by Trunks' time machine and he simply followed him through that rip. Once the rip began to close, he was pulled back into the future because it wasn't his ring that was allowing him to be there.

[nite_jay]

I feel like the anime has padded a lot of this arc out. I hope In the future Toriyama will be able to
approve arcs fully and not have to just have Toei fill in blanks to extend the arc/episode length. Some things like Black's first match with Goku and their 2nd trip to the future probably could have been cut. They seem like Toei additions that weren't very well thought out in relation to the rest of the story.

I doubt they would go through adding the entire paradox plot if it wasn't hinted in the outline, especially since that first match with Black is what started the time loop. And I think some of you guys put too much stock in an outline that Toyotaro confirmed is really barebones. Toriyama already said he wants people to give their own take, so he doesn't care about plot or 'filler' as much as some fans do.

Also don't see how Goku vs Black R1 is a Toei addition. It's fine nobody was complaining when that episode air. Feel like too many people treat the Manga like a bible here. Just cuz it wasn't in there doesn't mean it was a Toei idea.

I don't really think that the manga should be a bible for the series but I'm just saying that some parts in this arc in the anime could be cut and the story would probably be more coherent. I still usually enjoy the anime more, though.

[LuckyCat]

Black didn't use the ring to travel to the past, he used it to detect a rip in space and time made by Trunks' time machine and he simply followed him through that rip. Once the rip began to close, he was pulled back into the future because it wasn't his ring that was allowing him to be there.

Tomāto, Tomäto. It's still odd that he can do this with the ring, and only does it once for whatever reason. In either case, it's obviously a Toei idea. (Not necessarily a bad one, mind you).

[HeroR]

But the first meeting with Black isn't one of them since Black coming to the past and Beerus and Whis seeing him started the loop. If Goku vs. Black round 1 didn't happen, you would have what the manga has or going by the anime, Black would have never been created since it was Zamasu losing to Goku that triggered him.

The only real place that could have been cut was round 2, but that happened because they chose to trust Beerus about Zamasu being taking care of. That and the episode of Trunks meeting Gohan.

Black didn't use the ring to travel to the past, he used it to detect a rip in space and time made by Trunks' time machine and he simply followed him through that rip. Once the rip began to close, he was pulled back into the future because it wasn't his ring that was allowing him to be there.

Tomāto, Tomäto. It's still odd that he can do this with the ring, and only does it once for whatever reason. In either case, it's obviously a Toei idea. (Not necessarily a bad one, mind you).

And you're basing that on what? Did you see Toriyama's outline?

[LuckyCat]

And you're basing that on what? Did you see Toriyama's outline?

Yes, it's in my broom closet, next to the Spic-n-Span.

[UpFromTheSkies]

It's still odd that he can do this with the ring, and only does it once for whatever reason.

Black followed Trunks the first time because he didn't really know what was going on, but the second time he knew they would be back and wasn't worried.

[LuckyCat]

It's still odd that he can do this with the ring, and only does it once for whatever reason.

Black followed Trunks the first time because he didn't really know what was going on, but the second time he knew they would be back and wasn't worried.

He at least knew it would make him travel in time. I don't see how that furthers the Zero Mortals plan which was set for Trunks' future. It's a little random and confusing, which explains why the manga wouldn't try to fit it in.

[Pannaliciour]

Wasn't the whole forbidden to go to the past more like: it isn't allowed, but that doesn"t mean you can't
So it is forbidden but that doesn't mean you can"t.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Wasn't the whole forbidden to go to the past more like: it isn't allowed, but that doesn"t mean you can't
So it is forbidden but that doesn't mean you can"t.

Gowasu said that it was impossible, but even if it could be done, it's forbidden.

[HeroR]

He at least knew it would make him travel in time. I don't see how that furthers the Zero Mortals plan which was set for Trunks' future. It's a little random and confusing, which explains why the manga wouldn't try to fit it in.

He had no clue what happened the first time and accidentally followed Trunks to the past. Once he realized what happened, he didn't care to return. He could only stay for a few minutes regardless.

The manga didn't fit it in to save time most likely. Not because it's confusing.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Also don't see how Goku vs Black R1 is a Toei addition. It's fine nobody was complaining when that episode air. Feel like too many people treat the Manga like a bible here. Just cuz it wasn't in there doesn't mean it was a Toei idea.

Toyotaro said that he doesn't cut anything from Toriyama's outline, so if something isn't in the manga, it's a Toei idea (but that doesn't mean that everything from the manga is from Toriyama of course).

[HeroR]

Also don't see how Goku vs Black R1 is a Toei addition. It's fine nobody was complaining when that episode air. Feel like too many people treat the Manga like a bible here. Just cuz it wasn't in there doesn't mean it was a Toei idea.

Toyotaro said that he doesn't cut anything from Toriyama's outline, so if something isn't in the manga, it's a Toei idea (but that doesn't mean that everything from the manga is from Toriyama of course).

You can't say that with certainty since you haven't seen the outline. Not to mention, when has Toei added an entire subplot that connects or is key to the main story? Especially when Toriyama himself said that there will be some confusion with time when the manga doesn't have the paradox.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

You can't say that with certainty since you haven't seen the outline.

Eh? It is stated that while both Toei & Toyotaro make their own additions & expansions to Toriyama's outline, each presenting their own interpretation to the not-that-much-detailed story he provides them, Toyotaro doesn't change anything from the outline, while Toei does make changes to the story. We don't need to see the outline to know that.

[HeroR]

You can't say that with certainty since you haven't seen the outline.

Eh? It is stated that while both Toei & Toyotaro make their own additions & expansions to Toriyama's outline, each presenting their own interpretation to the not-that-much-detailed story he provides them, Toyotaro doesn't change anything from the outline, while Toei does make changes to the story. We don't need to see the outline to know that.

You keep saying the anime make changes to the outline. What are these changes?