Official On-Going DBZ 2015 Movie Thread: "Resurrection 'F'"

[Kamiccolo9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTCdpR9Lkb4

Even the game says he has to become a SSJ.

Dear Kami, the only thing that says this kiai stuff (which is done sometimes when they become SSJ too) is the original Japanese manga; I assume even viz wrote something else. People have a reason to think they're one and the same. No matter which way you look at it.

Hell, if I'm not mistaken, it was the Japanese fans that were vocal about SSJ Gohan before the release of BoG. That says a lot. >_>;

One would think that the original manga would take precedence.

Incorrect assumptions taken from flawed sources are still incorrect assumptions. Beliefs built from incorrect evidence are still incorrect beliefs. And a failure to educate yourself is still a failure to educate yourself regardless of what flawed sources say.

Everyone here has access to the actual pertinent quotes from the original manga. If you decide to take flawed, second-hand sources over the original, than you are still at fault.

[fadeddreams5]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTCdpR9Lkb4

Even the game says he has to become a SSJ.

Dear Kami, the only thing that says this kiai stuff (which is done sometimes when they become SSJ too) is the original Japanese manga; I assume even viz wrote something else. People have a reason to think they're one and the same. No matter which way you look at it.

Hell, if I'm not mistaken, it was the Japanese fans that were vocal about SSJ Gohan before the release of BoG. That says a lot. >_>;

One would think that the original manga would take precedence.

Incorrect assumptions taken from flawed sources are still incorrect assumptions. Beliefs built from incorrect evidence are still incorrect beliefs. And a failure to educate yourself is still a failure to educate yourself regardless of what flawed sources say.

Everyone here has access to the actual pertinent quotes from the original manga. If you decide to take flawed, second-hand sources over the original, than you are still at fault.

I understand that. But it works both ways. There's nothing that says he can go SSJ in the manga, right? Yet Old Kai does tell him to go SSJ there too to attain the new form. Reading it, and all other versions can easily lead one to make an assumption like this, even if it's wrong.

Like I mentioned, wasn't it the Japanese fans themselves who were vocal about SSJ Gohan's appearance in BoG? They're the ones with the original source material. And the studio listened, leading me to believe that ritual scene was a careless error, as it wouldn't make sense for Gohan to "power up" to base to fight Beerus, yet "power down" to SSJ to help Goku.

[Kamiccolo9]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTCdpR9Lkb4

Even the game says he has to become a SSJ.

Dear Kami, the only thing that says this kiai stuff (which is done sometimes when they become SSJ too) is the original Japanese manga; I assume even viz wrote something else. People have a reason to think they're one and the same. No matter which way you look at it.

Hell, if I'm not mistaken, it was the Japanese fans that were vocal about SSJ Gohan before the release of BoG. That says a lot. >_>;

One would think that the original manga would take precedence.

Incorrect assumptions taken from flawed sources are still incorrect assumptions. Beliefs built from incorrect evidence are still incorrect beliefs. And a failure to educate yourself is still a failure to educate yourself regardless of what flawed sources say.

Everyone here has access to the actual pertinent quotes from the original manga. If you decide to take flawed, second-hand sources over the original, than you are still at fault.

I understand that. But it works both ways. There's nothing that says he can go SSJ in the manga, right? Yet Old Kai does tell him to go SSJ there too to attain the new form. Reading it, and all other versions can easily lead one to make an assumption like this, even if it's wrong. Like I mentioned, wasn't it the Japanese fans themselves who were vocal about SSJ Gohan's appearance in BoG? They're the ones with the original source material. And the studio listened, leading me to believe that ritual scene was a careless error, as it wouldn't make sense for Gohan to "power up" to base to fight Beerus, yet "power down" to SSJ to help Goku.

That's a logical fallacy. Gohan has already been shown to be able to become a Super Saiyan. One has to prove that he no longer can, not prove that he is still able to. The burden is on the person making the assumption.

As for Battle of Gods, I don't know what this alleged group of fans said, but he does go Super Saiyan in the movie, so it seems their input didn't really matter all that much. You have to prove that it is an error; I don't have to prove that it is correct.

[Doctor.]

That Ultimate Tenkaichi scene adapted from the anime, and you can tell because Goku doesn't hug Gohan. He hugs Gohan in the manga.

[TheGmGoken]

Here's an example on when I said translation messed with everyone heads. Some dubs and manga say something that's differently worded that could confuse some people.

[Kamiccolo9]

Here's an example on when I said translation messed with everyone heads. Some dubs and manga say something that's differently worded that could confuse some people.

And flawed sources are still flawed sources, regardless of how widespread they are. And assumptions based off flawed sources are just as baseless regardless of how many people read the flawed sources.

The point is when people continue to act like those flawed sources have any merit, when everybody has access to a direct transcript of the pertinent scene.

[TheGmGoken]

Here's an example on when I said translation messed with everyone heads. Some dubs and manga say something that's differently worded that could confuse some people.

when everybody has access to a direct transcript of the pertinent scene.

They..do? I'm sure not everyone has it. I don't even have access to it.

[Kamiccolo9]

Here's an example on when I said translation messed with everyone heads. Some dubs and manga say something that's differently worded that could confuse some people.

when everybody has access to a direct transcript of the pertinent scene.

They..do? I'm sure not everyone has it. I don't even have access to it.

It's called the Internet. And if you've used any of Herms' translations, then yes, you do.

[Daisetsu]

In other words, it's in this thread.

[TheGmGoken]

In other words, it's in this thread.

Oh I didn't know Herm's covered this. Didn't know a transformation counted as a strength dialog. That's pretty neat nice job Herms!

It's called the Internet.

Kinda hard to fan accurate translation online these days. Everyone and their mom translates now.

[fadeddreams5]

That's a logical fallacy. Gohan has already been shown to be able to become a Super Saiyan. One has to prove that he no longer can, not prove that he is still able to. The burden is on the person making the assumption.

As for Battle of Gods, I don't know what this alleged group of fans said, but he does go Super Saiyan in the movie, so it seems their input didn't really matter all that much. You have to prove that it is an error; I don't have to prove that it is correct.

True, true. I forgot the Old Kai in the manga doesn't tell him to go SSJ, unlike every English source seems to. Otherwise, the argument would work either way.

I really need to read the original source material. I wish Viz's translations were 100% accurate. Ugh... =(

And as for the other thing, it's impossible to give you definitive proof without contacting a primary source and getting an answer. All I can do is theorize based on the edits they did make. Fans caused them to change a poster which featured SSJ Gohan, as well as the scene in which he fights Beerus.

Spoiler:

But re-watching the scene, it seems they stopped giving two shits, and just confirmed SSJ Gohan a thing alongside the mystic form.

[Rocketman]

So Gohan immediately kiai-powered up into Mystic right after he was brought back to life, then stayed transformed for the next decade?

[Gyt Kaliba]

Not sure if this has already been brought up (I didn't see it after scanning a bit anyway), but apparently FUNimation has seen fit to do some character themed posters for the film's US release.



They're pretty basic, all re-using art from the main poster (except for Goku and Vegeta who, admittedly, I don't quite remember seeing this art of them before), but I'd probably still buy these if they were to go on sale later, though I doubt they will.

[Doctor.]

Goku looks weird, is that fanart?

Still spelling Freeza with an I, huh, I thought they would change it for Kai.

[Gyt Kaliba]

Nope, they've left it with the 'I' and probably always will. I mean, I'm pretty sure they've got the name copyrighted by that spelling, so...it's actually probably more trouble than it's worth to them at this point to try and change the spelling back.

[rereboy]

So Gohan immediately kiai-powered up into Mystic right after he was brought back to life, then stayed transformed for the next decade?

You are putting to much faith in small design differences. Before the mystic business, Toriyama went out of his way to give Gohan a different hairstyle for SSj1 and another for SSJ2, only for later to, apparently, forget all that.

[Rocketman]

You are putting to much faith in small design differences. Before the mystic business, Toriyama went out of his way to give Gohan a different hairstyle for SSj1 and another for SSJ2, only for later to, apparently, forget all that.

Even if you discount the ending for some reason, he's still obviously Mystic after being revived.

[rereboy]

You are putting to much faith in small design differences. Before the mystic business, Toriyama went out of his way to give Gohan a different hairstyle for SSj1 and another for SSJ2, only for later to, apparently, forget all that.

Even if you discount the ending for some reason, he's still obviously Mystic after being revived.

Based on that small design differences...? Even though we have a distinct SSJ1 and SSJ2 hair for Gohan at first, and then he has the same hair all the time? Like I said, too much faith placed in those.

[Rocketman]

Based on that small design differences...? Even though we have a distinct SSJ1 and SSJ2 hair for Gohan at first, and then he has the same hair all the time? Like I said, too much faith placed in those.

How is it a 'small design difference' when it's the only design difference?

[Doctor.]

Gohan's eyes are still fully outlined in Battle of Gods even when he's being all casual and chill in the party, I don't see where we're going with this.