Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U.S.?

Discussion regarding the entirety of the franchise in a general (meta) sense, including such aspects as: production, trends, merchandise, fan culture, and more.
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KaiserNeko
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by KaiserNeko » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:04 pm

ImmaDeker wrote:
KaiserNeko wrote: Seriously, if you keep using Episode of Bardock as an example of bad writing, I have absolutely nothing for you. Episode of Bardock was one of the biggest piss takes we've ever taken and that ending with, yes, Goku literally pointing out plot holes was not AMAZING WRITING. It was never SUPPOSED TO BE. IT WAS GOHAN HAVING A DREAM ABOUT SOMETHING THAT NEVER SHOULD HAVE BEEN MADE. Also, it was Gohan asking about the plotholes, in which case Goku had no response, because the entire thing was a dream, explaining why none of it made ANY SENSE.
And my point is your thing you admit was bad was bad and it turned me off your work.

So, y'know.

And again, it's not like you just dovetail to shit after. There're isolated moments in the recent stuff that I've seen that I don't dislike. Little bits I thought were funny. I like 17 and 18 quite a bit.

But you can't possibly be flustered by someone who chooses to not actively follow a team that willingly admits it pushes out bad product. I mean, really, knowing that some of your content CAN just be willingly half assed (by your own admission!) should be a reasonable enough reason for me to not like what your teams does.
I'm not flustered that you don't actively follow us. Hell, I don't even particularly care if you're a fan of our work.

But some of the things we put out are more for fun. Episode of Bardock? Purely for fun. Most of the movies? For fun. If you don't enjoy the more cavalier style, then I get that. But they're not representative of our quality as a whole because, ultimately, they're not the main project.

And I'm not admitting to purposely putting out a "bad" product... although we have, on several occasions, made work that is below our average. Episode 12 is still a huge... thing for me, and Episode 20 is nothing but a huge metajoke about Wrestling that I, to this day, still don't know whether or not worked on any level. I can acknowledge when we put out bad content, but sometimes? We put out content that is meant for a cheap chuckle, or to play to something more low brow. Or sometimes, the writing is SIMPLE, because that's what the scene CALLS for. Again: Our shit doesn't smell like roses, but sometimes, you just make a cheap joke for fun.

If you don't like that, I certainly don't blame you. But calling us "word murderers" and making it seem like we're lazy or poor writers because of it just seems unfair. Sometimes, fluff is enjoyable, easily consumable, and the irreverence entertaining in it's own right. Meanwhile, we're always trying 100% to make sure the series is the best it can be. ... which isn't amazing, no, but that's what people come to see. Also, just because it's fluff, doesn't mean it's poorly written or that it's not enjoyable.
Last edited by KaiserNeko on Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:26 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:09 pm

ImmaDeker wrote:
Gyt Kaiba wrote:Not to mention that that is again just an opinion, not a fact.
Right, but I assume the basic concept of discourse and conversation (i.e. the sharing of ones' opinions) is enough that people can just assume it's my personal opinion that this is the death of comedy and I do not have to spoonfeed this detail.
Perhaps not, but when you make absolutely no attempt to clarify that it's just your opinion, then it can make it look like you are trying to claim your opinion is fact. Which I'm sure was never your intention, so you'd surely not want it to come off that way.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by SingleFringe&Sparks » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:22 pm

KaiserNeko wrote:
ImmaDeker wrote:
KaiserNeko wrote: Seriously, if you keep using Episode of Bardock as an example of bad writing, I have absolutely nothing for you. Episode of Bardock was one of the biggest piss takes we've ever taken and that ending with, yes, Goku literally pointing out plot holes was not AMAZING WRITING. It was never SUPPOSED TO BE. IT WAS GOHAN HAVING A DREAM ABOUT SOMETHING THAT NEVER SHOULD HAVE BEEN MADE. Also, it was Gohan asking about the plotholes, in which case Goku had no response, because the entire thing was a dream, explaining why none of it made ANY SENSE.
And my point is your thing you admit was bad was bad and it turned me off your work.

So, y'know.

And again, it's not like you just dovetail to shit after. There're isolated moments in the recent stuff that I've seen that I don't dislike. Little bits I thought were funny. I like 17 and 18 quite a bit.
Actually I think the humour in pointing out plotholes or odd character reactions is legitamete humour for a parody, when it can be used as a tounge-cheek joke. Thats what most directors commentaries do when they reflect on their own work. Admittingly there are some odd inconsistencies that characters have with their reaction times under different pressures that make it funny to talk about, but not at the expense of attacking things that were already explained within the series. Making fun of the Supreme Kai's constant panic attacks, or why the characters get stronger by stripping down, is funny. Its funny because of how it was delivered in the dub. Mocking the characters for making mistakes entirely is a step further I dont find funny, though I hold that against most parodies in general. For my preference in what a DBZ parody does well comes from the obscure: Alternate relatity DBZ. Similar to TAS, but more consistent with concentrating on humour from inside jokes in the show rather than comparing it to our world laws.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by Kid Buu » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:30 pm

Yeah I don't mind plotholes being talked about either.

Anyway, since we were talking about it, I have a ton of Yamcha (also Ten/Chaozu) jokes that aren't exactly derailing the character either. Maybe I send KaiserNeko a PM on them to see if he likes them and not and can add them to Abridged at one point, if he is down.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by KaiserNeko » Wed Aug 27, 2014 5:36 pm

I'd also like to point out: I'm not really interested in arguing the QUALITY of our work. I'm more interested in discussing the aspect of comedy such as referential humor, how parody is used effectively, etc. and how our series uses them. Our work is not amazing, though we're always trying harder to improve, and even if it were I'm always understanding if someone does not enjoy our work.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by ImmaDeker » Wed Aug 27, 2014 6:06 pm

KaiserNeko wrote: If you don't like that, I certainly don't blame you. But calling us "word murderers" and making it seem like we're lazy or poor writers because of it just seems unfair. Sometimes, fluff is enjoyable, easily consumable, and the irreverence entertaining in it's own right. Meanwhile, we're always trying 100% to make sure the series is the best it can be. ... which isn't amazing, no, but that's what people come to see. Also, just because it's fluff, doesn't mean it's poorly written or that it's not enjoyable.
I'm no comedy Nazi (the comedy I like ranges the full spectrum from stuff like Monty Python and Stella to Drawn Together and Filthy Frank and, man, little makes me laugh harder than somebody getting konked on the head), but it's just...y'know, I kinda miss when parodies, and comedy in general, were smarter, is all. I get there're exceptions to any statement, but there was a point where parody really did mean more than "meta acknowledge a thing about this thing and call it stupid." There're genuinely clever parody bits here and there, making actual jokes out of implication rather than spoonfeeding implication. Certainly your writing quality, even at your lowest, tends to surpass other Abridged stuff. It's not nearly as painful as watching, say, YGO:TAS. You're a big fish in a small pond, but it's still a small pond.

Maybe it's because I have a weird attachment to comedy as a concept for various reasons, but I really, sincerely hate most internet comedy. There's a difference between stupid comedy and LAZY comedy. I love stupid. I can DO stupid until the end of the day and am stupid frequently in my real life. But internet comedy save for a few diamonds in the rough really are lazy. And I mean, I don't think your team IS lazy per se, but a lot of written content generated could very well as been generated by a lazy person (I'm not sure if that's better or worse). I even tried watching the most recent one and then Cell going all SUDDEN WACKY LET'S TALK ABOUT STABBING THE GUY LOUDLY BECAUSE SCREAMING OUT OF NOWHERE IS ALWAYS FUNNY made me go "Ugh, come on." and I just kinda stopped. I think there was yet another Yamcha joke in there too and, man, that's...hard to keep funny. It's fake wit. It's wit that beats at hivemind concepts and exists only to REMIND a brain of concepts, and thus pay off on the brief euphoria of remembering rather than actual wit or humorous observation.

I think DBZA is smartly written when you compare it to its peers, but your peers are also not even remotely intelligent by any stretch of the imagination. It's the most technically competent in terms of editing and vocal performance and I can actually say that CAN stand on its own perfectly fine. But in terms of writing? It's just...not really that funny. Occasional bits, sure! But even your main series has a lot of shit I just plum do not remember and I have a friend who loves MARATHONING your show to the point where I've seen the bulk of your content a few times. It wasn't upsetting to rewatch, I wasn't angered, but little bits here and there and the general structure and composition of the thing as a script and story isn't far removed from everything I dislike about amateur, internet comedy. I love smart. But I also love stupid. I love finesse, but I also love clusterfucks. I love comedy for adults and also comedy for children I don't like the idea of being an elitist over something as simple as what makes us laugh, and laughing is one of the things I love doing the most.

But you don't make me laugh as much as you maybe would because, ultimately, I just think the bulk of your writing, even when excluding its nadir and even at its zenith, is just an incredibly dull, tired take on the most basic, uninspired type of parody imaginable and one incredibly indicative of what the larger internet assumes is the standard for wit. It's not really amusing and not really impressive. I'd actually make the argument some of your show's scripts, including recent mainline episodes, actively waste the potential of your voice talent pool.

It doesn't actively enrage me. I think it bothers me when it's held on a high pedestal, but as it exists on its own it's just something I can casually indulge (and enjoy well enough, even if I forget basically everything afterwards like immediately. You have very few genuinely memorable jokes). And I've actually enjoyed talking with you about it , generally enjoy you as a person from the small interaction we've had, and am actually very happy you succeed doing what you enjoy. Creativity is subjective and if people grok what you do, I think that's great and I hope it continues to pay off with it. You've created a product that people enjoy and you should reap those benefits, whatever those benefits may be. And I think, in a different context, I'd actually love to discuss comedy with you as an overall art form at some point.

Your product isn't obligated to appeal to me, nor do I expect it to. It doesn't and that's part of the beauty of creativity. But while I hold you no ill will for it, yes, I do fully believe you, your team, and your peers in the poor excuse for parody the abridged genre is are all word murderers.

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by BlazingFiddlesticks » Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:07 am

ImmaDeker wrote:I'm no comedy Nazi (the comedy I like ranges the full spectrum from stuff like Monty Python and Stella to Drawn Together and Filthy Frank and, man, little makes me laugh harder than somebody getting konked on the head), but it's just...y'know, I kinda miss when parodies, and comedy in general, were smarter, is all. I get there're exceptions to any statement, but there was a point where parody really did mean more than "meta acknowledge a thing about this thing and call it stupid." There're genuinely clever parody bits here and there, making actual jokes out of implication rather than spoonfeeding implication. Certainly your writing quality, even at your lowest, tends to surpass other Abridged stuff. It's not nearly as painful as watching, say, YGO:TAS. You're a big fish in a small pond, but it's still a small pond.
In Kaiser's defense, isn't this an issue of form? If you want to shake Dragon Ball Z to its foundation, a series of formulaic fight stories grounded on contrivances and routine power-ups written by a man who rarely thought ahead when drawing his manga chapters in two days and was losing his patience writing the later half of it and whose long-lived international popularity is something of joke considering all that... how do you effectively communicate that with the TV adaptation of that story? You don't. No more than you could write Dr. Light as the villain of the entire Mega Man series (for creating robots to start with) solely by using footage from Mega Man games.

It does not excuse some of their choices, I can certainly agree they go the easy route in places, but I kind of see the options for recycling footage as a bit limited.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by ImmaDeker » Sat Aug 30, 2014 6:48 pm

BlazingFiddlesticks wrote:? If you want to shake Dragon Ball Z to its foundation, a series of formulaic fight stories grounded on contrivances and routine power-ups written by a man who rarely thought ahead when drawing his manga chapters in two days and was losing his patience writing the later half of it and whose long-lived international popularity is something of joke considering all that... how do you effectively communicate that with the TV adaptation of that story? You don't. No more than you could write Dr. Light as the villain of the entire Mega Man series (for creating robots to start with) solely by using footage from Mega Man games.
Which I don't see as a very valid argument, because
It does not excuse some of their choices, I can certainly agree they go the easy route in places, but I kind of see the options for recycling footage as a bit limited.
If the method isn't effective, then maybe you just don't do it. Except they have every reason to do it (the important reason being that they want to).

But you act like footage parodies can't be original. Duel Masters (at least season one and three, as two had US original footage) and Angel Grove High vastly disagree with you. The problem with Abridged parodies (rather than just a normal, distinct fan footage parody) is that they are crushed by linear thinking and a lack of ingenuity except when they joke about Gohan becoming strong but then not that one time because hey pointing out what fans don't like is what parody means now and we are Michael Myers's kitchen knife to the construction of comedic art via the English language.

But comparisons to Angel Grove High, frankly, just aren't fair because EVERY fan footage parody looks fucking embarrassing compared to Angel Grove High's level of craft. You might as well ask someone to compare my fighting skills to Muhammed Ali's.

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by ParkerAL » Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:09 pm

Angel Grove High? The place where the Power Rangers go to school?

I mean, Bulk and Skull are comedic geniuses, so I guess I kind of see where you're possibly coming from. :D
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by ImmaDeker » Sat Aug 30, 2014 9:52 pm

ParkerAL wrote:Angel Grove High? The place where the Power Rangers go to school?

I mean, Bulk and Skull are comedic geniuses, so I guess I kind of see where you're possibly coming from. :D
https://www.youtube.com/user/BramcoEntertainment/videos

The series that makes every Abridged series just look sad(der). It's a really great spoof of 90's sitcoms using Power Ranger's non-Sentai footage (and a host of other surprising sources).

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by TheBalishChannel » Sun Aug 31, 2014 1:52 am

Honestly, when it comes to this series, there's nothing more annoying than seeing/hearing people quote the "funniest lines" from various TeamFourStar Dragon Ball productions, be it on the internet or in real life. I went to see Battle of Gods three times, and all three times I went there was at least one person who insisted that they constantly recite certain lines. In fact, the second time I went, as I was walking into the auditorium I could instantly hear someone repeating, "And the brain damage, and the brain damage, and the brain damage, and th-." Aside from that, I don't think the casual viewer knows that it's not an official production, despite the message that's placed at the beginning of every episode.

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by ABED » Sun Aug 31, 2014 9:11 am

I don't think the casual viewer knows that it's not an official production
I suspect either they don't know the show exists or don't watch it.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by BlazingFiddlesticks » Sun Aug 31, 2014 11:13 pm

ImmaDeker wrote:But you act like footage parodies can't be original. Duel Masters (at least season one and three, as two had US original footage) and Angel Grove High vastly disagree with you.
My first exposure to anime was the bad-communication-induced gag-dub that was Samurai Pizza Cats, and I (vaguely) knew something was up (not that it was bad thing) with that when I four. Duel Masters indeed being another great example. Dragon Ball even has such an injector/interpretor with Remix, whatever the actual quality of his nonsense. I did not mean to say footage parodies could not be original.
ImmaDeker wrote:The problem with Abridged parodies (rather than just a normal, distinct fan footage parody) is that they are crushed by linear thinking and a lack of ingenuity except when they joke about Gohan becoming strong but then not that one time because hey pointing out what fans don't like is what parody means now and we are Michael Myers's kitchen knife to the construction of comedic art via the English language.
So it comes down to a limitation of form, even if the form is not ideal, yeah. No need to repeat that TeamFourStar can come off as safe at times. DBZ Abridged is still trying to tell the Dragon Ball story, so its comedic potential is greatly limited by being bound to and having to provide the basic exposition, though that is the manner TFS chose to work with it. Yes. All true.

But another question. What is really the difference, in form, between something like the Duel Master dub and YGO TAS? Neither of them have much respect for their storylines, but they advance them anyway. Both of them are self-aware, pointing out their own contrivances and making fun of flashbacks or internal monologues whenever they get the chance, and drop pop-culture references without warning. I don't see much of a difference between Bandit Keith's "In America" and Duel Master's deliberately-out-of-the-blue Batman jokes other than that the former is a one-trick pony; but even that only says that Bandit Keith could have been better scripted, not that the joke was inherently bad. I'm not meaning to put Duel Masters on a pedestal, but at first glance the only answer to that question is "Duel Masters just did it consistently better.", which in of itself says something however minute to YGO TAS's credit.
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Pannaliciour wrote:Reading all the comments and interviews, my conclusion is: nobody knows what the hell is going on.
Just like Dragon Ball since Chapter #4.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by ImmaDeker » Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:39 am

Incorrect, because Little Kuriboh is a word murderer and the Duel Masters team can actually fucking write.

Let's take this point for point, and I'm gonna intentionally split your post up just to build up to my ultimate point. Feel free to not continue my format if you choose to reply, as it will become gross. Just using this as an easy device to structure my argument because, really, this requires going point for point.
What is really the difference, in form, between something like the Duel Master dub and YGO TAS?
LITERALLY EVERYTHING.
Neither of them have much respect for their storylines, but they advance them anyway
.

Incorrect.

On a basic level, and I'll only use season one here because that's the fairest example and the only one I remember clearly, there were pretty clear places where the storyline was respected in BOTH facet. Because first, we need to define what respect is. I assume you mean a combination of intensely liberal interpretation of how to progress the plot plus a lack of gravity toward its machinations, which would be false on both counts. Off the top of my head? Shobu's entrance into the Temple and the need to finally move past his father's deck and rebuild it to keep with the times is treated with actual gravity. Not to mention, in a brilliant twist (given that Plastic Cow had early inklings to make the show a parody, even before seeing the footage, so as to not be Yu-Gi-Oh!), the entire first episode was played completely straight only for parts two and three to revel in the comedy. The show knew where to apply gravity when needed, in order to contrast the comedy AND, more importantly, to ground the characters in actual personality.

By contrast, YGO: TAS doesn't do that at all and uses the YGO cast as bullshit Family Guyesque ciphers for recycled Adult Swim jokes and meta I CAN DO THIS BECAUSE I'M A MAIN CHARACTER GAH-FUCKIN'-HUR ISN'T POINTING THIS OUT WITTY word sodomy that does not bother with the slightest bit of lubricant. The icing on the cake, and the very episode that finally made me stop, was making the Big Five 4Kids and doing an entire episode shitting on 4Kids because weeaboos are stupid people who hold grudges so THIS IS STILL FUNNY HUH? even if 4Kids had stopped being relevant at that point...but also when it was like "YEAH WE SHIT ALL OVER YOUR JOB AND CHARACTER BUT RIP MADDIE BLAUSTEIN", which suggests a complete inability to understand two core things: what's contextually acceptable when constructing a joke and what's tastefully acceptable in terms of affectionate parody (you can't do "HEY WEEBS, I STILL HATE 4KIDS TOO!" jokes and try to call that a tribute. YOU FUCKING CAN'T. WHY DOES THIS STILL MAKE ME ANGRY? HOW DOES NOBODY NOTICE HE IS GENUINELY A TERRIBLE PERSON? It is brutally tasteless and hollow in its execution.)

Thing is, Duel Masters builds a context. Not even with drama necessarily, but it builds a cast and a world with personalities and characteristics that are the source for jokes. YGO:TAS has hollow ciphers enacting whatever LK finds convenient to joke about at a given time, usually directly stolen from Adult Swim.

Duel Masters is something you have to actually sit down and write, and respects the story it tells with the footage it has by using it for a variety of jokes ranging from character to pop culture (sometimes to great effect, see below). YGO:TAS is if you took a single Family Guy cutaway and aggressively serialized it over 30+ installments.

Not the same.
Both of them are self-aware, pointing out their own contrivances and making fun of flashbacks or internal monologues whenever they get the chance, and drop pop-culture references without warning.
The problem with that comparison is that it refuses to note the one core, critical difference between the two, besides the fact that one was made by actual writers and editors and the other was made by an idiot on the internet who honors dead actresses by shitting in the mouth of their corpses: Duel Masters, as a brand, is not a known quantity.

YGO:TAS knows you're at least peripherally familiar with YGO as a brand. It doesn't have to, or THINKS it doesn't have to, actually build a character and context because by default it assumes you know the story. DBZA does too, which is why you get really stupid jokes like foreshadowing Gohan "becoming the strongest in the universe but he doesn't do crap" or Vegeta going "EWWWW" with GT, because these (and many of YGO:TAS's "jokes") are structured less like punchlines and more like building toward reminding you of an opinion you (statistically!) probably have. And when you REMEMBER THAT THING, you laugh because hey, I remember that thing! Not that KaiserNeko is obligated to defend his and his staff's work, because he's not, but it's why I can't take his defense of "Well, GT Joke, it's a Dragonball parody" seriously. Because it's NOT A JOKE. It's acknowledging a thing you know most people in your audience will agree with and is the lowest form of reference comedy as it only really exists, structurally, to be a thing you endear your audience with. All comedy is emotional manipulation, but that sort of reference comedy is the skeevy kind in that all it does is express an opinion, just express an opinion, that you can share with someone to make them like you. It's much like politics in that regard: you accomplish your goal if you know your supporters agree with you, so you make shallow references because if you like or hate something, someone's more likely to be loosened up and find the rest of your jokes funny. In theory. It's ultimately cheap and lazy, especially in the context of an Abridged because Abridged shows are written by amateurs who think that's the minimum of how to structure a joke.
When I briefly spoke with Andrew Robinson, principle writer and co-story editor of Kaijudo: Rise of the Duel Masters who had also worked on the Duel Masters dub even before that, perhaps making him the closest the American Duel Masters brand has to an auteur (though he credits a lot of Duel Masters's quality to the late Dwayne McDuffie and his wife Charlotte Fullerton, WHICH EXPLAINS A LOT), I was quick to point out how much I ADORED the Greg the Bunny cameo in season 1 of Duel Masters. Because, y'know, that's a pop culture reference done right, where it serves to highlight the absurdity of the context its presented in. Duel Masters was a show that didn't segregate an exposition revelation about the Duel Masters monster realm and the fact that Greg the Bunny is one of the most celebrated Kaijudo masters. He's juxtaposed with this actual exploration of series mythology and both are introduced on their own merits because, again, Duel Masters is not a known quantity, so it has to treat everything in a meaningful, structured context. To Duel Masters, Greg the Bunny being a master of Kaijudo being revealed in tandem with actually going deeper into the mythology of Kaijudo as a concept because it's not mocking your perception of Duel Masters as a brand. It's playing around with the insane lack of boundaries its mythology has.

Abridged mocks mythology. Duel Masters embraces its as it makes it absurd.

Not the same.
I don't see much of a difference between Bandit Keith's "In America" and Duel Master's deliberately-out-of-the-blue Batman jokes other than that the former is a one-trick pony; but even that only says that Bandit Keith could have been better scripted, not that the joke was inherently bad.
BANDIT KEITH IN AMERICA: The same joke, over and over, trying to be a meta take on a character's clashing character design in a largely Japanese setting.
DUEL MASTERS BATMAN JOKES: Circumstantial references to Batman written into the script divorced from the inherent footage and existing as a frame of reference to coalesce the events in place with an audience member's knowledge base.

The fact that you even compare a reference to character design with an "out of the blue Batman" reference, which internal to your own comparison aren't even actually similar because one is intrinsically less random than the other by your own words, when these two things have completely dissimilar structural purposes just on a conceptual basis leaves me to believe my dreams of writing comedy are pointless because nobody actually cares and doing anything beyond dangling keys in front of your audience is frivolous. God is dead and theology is the den of fools and charlatans.

Excuse me while I go drink myself to death.
I'm not meaning to put Duel Masters on a pedestal, but at first glance the only answer to that question is "Duel Masters just did it consistently better.", which in of itself says something however minute to YGO TAS's credit
I may not hate KaiserNeko and his ilk for what they do, but by no means do I, or will I, ever respect it even one iota. Abridged writers regurgitate fandom memes, steal jokes, and make shows that are a sentient meme meant only to, really, create "humor" by throwing recognizable concepts out and calling it parody even when it's done without any meaningful commentary or satirical slant.

By contrast, Duel Masters is a comedy.

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by Akumaito Beam » Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:52 am

ImmaDeker wrote:I even tried watching the most recent one and then Cell going all SUDDEN WACKY LET'S TALK ABOUT STABBING THE GUY LOUDLY BECAUSE SCREAMING OUT OF NOWHERE IS ALWAYS FUNNY made me go "Ugh, come on." and I just kinda stopped.
I'm glad this wasn't just me. Those jokes bug the hell out of me.

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by BlazingFiddlesticks » Mon Sep 01, 2014 12:10 pm

Thank you very much for that.
ImmaDeker wrote:Abridged mocks mythology. Duel Masters embraces its as it makes it absurd.

Not the same.
I think that was the word I was looking for, too.
ImmaDeker wrote: BANDIT KEITH IN AMERICA: The same joke, over and over, trying to be a meta take on a character's clashing character design in a largely Japanese setting.
DUEL MASTERS BATMAN JOKES: Circumstantial references to Batman written into the script divorced from the inherent footage and existing as a frame of reference to coalesce the events in place with an audience member's knowledge base.

The fact that you even compare a reference to character design with an "out of the blue Batman" reference, which internal to your own comparison aren't even actually similar because one is intrinsically less random than the other by your own words, when these two things have completely dissimilar structural purposes just on a conceptual basis leaves me to believe my dreams of writing comedy are pointless because nobody actually cares and doing anything beyond dangling keys in front of your audience is frivolous. God is dead and theology is the den of fools and charlatans.

Excuse me while I go drink myself to death.
And I'll miss the funeral because I doubt the concept of time even exists in my perception.

I admit, a better example would have been Lumis/Umbra as the Mooninites; stealing from Adult Swim, but at least in that comparison both are channeling circumstantial associations (YGO's being to fill in a creative void of a tall and a short villainous duo that are prone to argument but have no given names or personalities in any version, Duel Master's pointing out aesthetics- Hakuo's Helmet, Kokujo's being a caped dark-civilization player dueling at night, etc.), one having to make the "bigger" pull to make the unmemorable memorable in any fashion.
ImmaDeker wrote:The series that makes every Abridged series just look sad(der). It's a really great spoof of 90's sitcoms using Power Ranger's non-Sentai footage (and a host of other surprising sources).
Like making a three minute segway to prolonged joke at Captain Picard's impotence while reminding Crusher Jr. that nobody likes him- in an episode about Kimberly's reacting to getting shot back in time by becoming a bloody outlaw? Certainly not judging a series entirely on a couple episodes (the editing is indeed superb, wow), but its no more funny when seemingly more talented people do it.
JulieYBM wrote:
Pannaliciour wrote:Reading all the comments and interviews, my conclusion is: nobody knows what the hell is going on.
Just like Dragon Ball since Chapter #4.
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BlazingFiddlesticks wrote:Kingdom Piccolo
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Mon Sep 01, 2014 1:16 pm

No offense, but if you (and I use this in general) are the type who are going to sit there and over dissect every little thing to the kind of degree I'm seeing here as of late...then yeah, no wonder Abridged humor in general isn't really going to be for you. Is it so impossible to just enjoy something humorous without trying to sit there and act like you're dissecting it in some college course? Not everything has to be 'trendsetting' or completely original (and let's face it, NOTHING is original) to be enjoyable. Jeebus.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by BlazingFiddlesticks » Mon Sep 01, 2014 1:35 pm

I asked a through question, I was honored with a through answer, half that is on me.

You're right to bring up the 4kids gag in the Virtual World arc; it was spread too thin and did not carry over the entirety of the Abridged version anyway, though I won't say it was entirely meritless- FogHorn LegHorn Lanipator was basically making fun of people who can't get over bad dubs years after the fact just as much as he was the practices. LittleKuriboh himself admitted that the later half the Virtual World arc was awful to write for and forced him to ask himself "What am I doing? Is this comedy?" So whatever follows he's told the world he can look outside of himself that much.
Last edited by BlazingFiddlesticks on Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
JulieYBM wrote:
Pannaliciour wrote:Reading all the comments and interviews, my conclusion is: nobody knows what the hell is going on.
Just like Dragon Ball since Chapter #4.
son veku wrote:
Metalwario64 wrote:
BlazingFiddlesticks wrote:Kingdom Piccolo
Where is that located?
Canada

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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by VegettoEX » Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:05 pm

Gyt Kaliba wrote:No offense, but if you (and I use this in general) are the type who are going to sit there and over dissect every little thing to the kind of degree I'm seeing here as of late...then yeah, no wonder Abridged humor in general isn't really going to be for you. Is it so impossible to just enjoy something humorous without trying to sit there and act like you're dissecting it in some college course? Not everything has to be 'trendsetting' or completely original (and let's face it, NOTHING is original) to be enjoyable. Jeebus.
I don't agree with what you're trying to get at. At all.

I can't turn my brain off and watch season three of dubbed DBZ. There is zero enjoyment I can find there. I can't do it. It's impossible for me to not analyze it, dissect it, and so on and so forth.
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Re: Has TFS damaged the reputation of the franchise in the U

Post by Gyt Kaliba » Mon Sep 01, 2014 3:29 pm

VegettoEX wrote:
Gyt Kaliba wrote:No offense, but if you (and I use this in general) are the type who are going to sit there and over dissect every little thing to the kind of degree I'm seeing here as of late...then yeah, no wonder Abridged humor in general isn't really going to be for you. Is it so impossible to just enjoy something humorous without trying to sit there and act like you're dissecting it in some college course? Not everything has to be 'trendsetting' or completely original (and let's face it, NOTHING is original) to be enjoyable. Jeebus.
I don't agree with what you're trying to get at. At all.

I can't turn my brain off and watch season three of dubbed DBZ. There is zero enjoyment I can find there. I can't do it. It's impossible for me to not analyze it, dissect it, and so on and so forth.
I'm not saying that has to be done, at all. It's perfectly fine to analyze something and be critical of it, but there's a limit to it IMO, and if someone is finding this much displeasure in something - in this case, Abridged - then wouldn't it be better to just not pay any attention to it? And unlike with Season Three of DBZ, which was the only release of the official material at the time in the US and pretty much had to get fan's attentions and vitriol, Abridged is a supplementary fan work. I just don't see what the point is of analyzing something that's just meant to be for fun, and in no way replaces the original, to that degree. Especially not in as condescending a manner as some of it was coming off as. But perhaps that's just me, and I'm overstepping my bounds here.
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