Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[Gogeta8001]

I guess so.

I go with the DBZF general conscious that Base Saiyans > Frieza but I guess theirs some things we all can't agree on.

[TheMightyOzaru]

This is very interesting....:

Will Goku be able to transform into [Super Saiyan] God in the future?
I think you’ll understand if you watch [the movie], but Goku has already absorbed [Super Saiyan] God’s power and made it his own, so there is no need for him to transform into [Super Saiyan] God. Goku basically only thinks of fighting as a sporting match, so borrowing the power of five people isn’t fair, and he resisted doing that; however, it seems his curiosity towards the realm that lay even further beyond him won out.

This is all sorts of confusing. Uub would in no way be a challenge to Goku at this point.... I guess he can choose to use it's power or something...?

[RandomGuy96]

Not really the place to get into these kinds of debates, is it?

The power level thread isn't the place to get into power level debates?

[Gogeta8001]

This is very interesting....:

Will Goku be able to transform into [Super Saiyan] God in the future?
I think you’ll understand if you watch [the movie], but Goku has already absorbed [Super Saiyan] God’s power and made it his own, so there is no need for him to transform into [Super Saiyan] God. Goku basically only thinks of fighting as a sporting match, so borrowing the power of five people isn’t fair, and he resisted doing that; however, it seems his curiosity towards the realm that lay even further beyond him won out.

This is all sorts of confusing. Uub would in no way be a challenge to Goku at this point.... I guess he can choose to use it's power or something...?

So SSJ Goku = SSJG Goku after he absorbed the SSJG powers?

Wouldn't that make him the strongest unfused character at EoZ? It was established already that Gohan was the strongest unfused character.

[dbzfan7]

So SSJ Goku = SSJG Goku after he absorbed the SSJG powers?

Wouldn't that make him the strongest unfused character at EoZ? It was established already that Gohan was the strongest unfused character.

It's not really established Gohan was the strongest unfused character at the end, but a lot of people including myself believe that. Toriyama never made a statement on it as some fans like to claim he did. If you incorporate BOG's then even still Whis is the strongest unfused character.

[RandomGuy96]

If you're counting non-manga stuff anyway, then Syn Shenron is most likely the strongest unfused character, given how he tanked that x10 Kamehameha and all. Either him or Omega; if you're counting SSG as "not a fusion", I don't see why you can't count him.

[Gogeta8001]

So SSJ Goku = SSJG Goku after he absorbed the SSJG powers?

Wouldn't that make him the strongest unfused character at EoZ? It was established already that Gohan was the strongest unfused character.

It's not really established Gohan was the strongest unfused character at the end, but a lot of people including myself believe that. Toriyama never made a statement on it as some fans like to claim he did. If you incorporate BOG's then even still Whis is the strongest unfused character.

Wel if he has that kind of power, then how can Uub compare to him? From what I remember, Uub was only able to be on par with Base Goku while enraged.

[Kaboom]

Not really the place to get into these kinds of debates, is it?

The power level thread isn't the place to get into power level debates?

I've said this before, but do you see what subforum this thread is in? The fan-created works section. That means this thread is here for the presentation of fan-made numbers as an "art" form, not as some sort of scientific research into what is or isn't correct. Debate and feedback should be primarily about form and consistency, not this "you're wrong and I'm right and this chain of character names with lots of >'s proves it" bologna. If someone wants to base their numbers on their own way of thinking and interpreting things, then fine. Let 'em. It doesn't affect your own made-up numbers.


Anyway, about this new Battle of Gods stuff... Nice to know roughly where Whis, Beerus, and God-Goku all stand compared to each other. What I admit I don't like though is Goku keeping the god-power to access whenever he wants. Like I've said before, it just seems to cheapen everything. I guess the fact that SSJ God's power depends on the power of the person using it, meaning it's essentially a "multiplier" of some sort after all like the other Super Saiyan transformations, helps make that a little better though. It means that even though Goku's been carried ahead into a new realm of power, he'll still need to actually work to progress within that realm.

It does really take something away from the ending of the manga, though. Hard to believe Goku's excited about someone on Pure Boo's level of power if he can drop someone that strong with a finger-flick if he wanted to. As "close to canon" as Battle of Gods is, I suppose in some ways still counting it as an alternate universe might be a good idea.

[TheMightyOzaru]

We could just assume Goku can choose whether or not to use his God powers. Much like how Gohan can seemingly choose to be SSJ or Ultimate.

[dbzfan7]

Anyway, about this new Battle of Gods stuff... Nice to know roughly where Whis, Beerus, and God-Goku all stand compared to each other. What I admit I don't like though is Goku keeping the god-power to access whenever he wants. Like I've said before, it just seems to cheapen everything. I guess the fact that SSJ God's power depends on the power of the person using it, meaning it's essentially a "multiplier" of some sort after all like the other Super Saiyan transformations, helps make that a little better though. It means that even though Goku's been carried ahead into a new realm of power, he'll still need to actually work to progress within that realm.

It does really take something away from the ending of the manga, though. Hard to believe Goku's excited about someone on Pure Boo's level of power if he can drop someone that strong with a finger-flick if he wanted to. As "close to canon" as Battle of Gods is, I suppose in some ways still counting it as an alternate universe might be a good idea.

This is my whole problem with him keeping that power. It greatly conflicts with the ending. It also makes Oob extremely pointless and gives everyone access to an easy power boost. I can see everyone get it now, because why not have several SSJ Gods.

[RandomGuy96]

Not to mention the idea of it being a multiplier makes the whole movie essentially PIS, since they could've murderstomped Beers and Whis if they had given this to Gohan or Gotenks.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Gohan's base power likely isn't higher than Goku's in this movie and the idea that SSJ God would stack on top of his ultimate form is PIS in and of itself. Gotenks' fusion would run dry really quickly seeing what SSJ4 does to fusion.

[Gogeta8001]

Well besides all of the Buu Saga/BoG stuff, what did you guys think of my GT power levels?

[dbzfan7]

Not to mention the idea of it being a multiplier makes the whole movie essentially PIS, since they could've murderstomped Beers and Whis if they had given this to Gohan or Gotenks.

Pretty much. Though giving it to Gotenks is kind of impossible as they need 6 Saiyans.

[Victorious]

There is no freaking canon . I get so tired of this whole canon argument. Where is it stated that something is canon and something isn't when it comes to Dragon Ball? I'll tell you. Nowhere! Whether you like it or not, GT and Battle of Gods exist. There are statements that are made and there is power scaling to follow. How you decipher that is entirely up to you, but claiming what Battle of Gods states is bull shit because it's "non canon" is bull shit in and of itself because there's no canon to begin with. The SEG is a guide book like the Daizenshuu, and many people here have made the 2 times multiplier work. Gohan also doesn't have to be exactly 2 times. It's stated that his power increased through anger. It can be a 4 times boost for him if you really think that's necessary.

The manga should be the only 'canon'....if it's not then everything just gets too subjective on where to draw the line. The Line should be drawn at the manga and end there.

[TheMightyOzaru]

There is no freaking canon . I get so tired of this whole canon argument. Where is it stated that something is canon and something isn't when it comes to Dragon Ball? I'll tell you. Nowhere! Whether you like it or not, GT and Battle of Gods exist. There are statements that are made and there is power scaling to follow. How you decipher that is entirely up to you, but claiming what Battle of Gods states is bull shit because it's "non canon" is bull shit in and of itself because there's no canon to begin with. The SEG is a guide book like the Daizenshuu, and many people here have made the 2 times multiplier work. Gohan also doesn't have to be exactly 2 times. It's stated that his power increased through anger. It can be a 4 times boost for him if you really think that's necessary.

The manga should be the only 'canon'....if it's not then everything just gets too subjective on where to draw the line. The Line should be drawn at the manga and end there.

The line shouldn't be drawn anywhere. Nothing is accepted as canon therefore there is no canon. Stuff like GT, the movies, and Battle of Gods all exist whether you want them to or not. Not everything has to take place in the same universe though. Toriyama himself suggested multiple universes in the Daizenshuu 6.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

I can see everyone get it now, because why not have several SSJ Gods.

Everyone can get Super Saiyan God for 7 minutes, but not everyone can absorb its power to make it permanent like Goku did. I can see Vegeta succeeding doing so, but what about Gohan, Goten, Pan, Trunks, and Bra?

[DBZGTKOSDH]

If you're counting non-manga stuff anyway, then Syn Shenron is most likely the strongest unfused character, given how he tanked that x10 Kamehameha and all. Either him or Omega; if you're counting SSG as "not a fusion", I don't see why you can't count him.

All we know is that Beers is stronger than Super Vegetto, who is equal or stronger than SS4 Goku, who is close in power with Oozaru Baby, Super #17, SS4 Vegeta, and Si Xing Long, but weaker than Yi Xing Long, Super Yi Xing Long, and SS4 Gogeta. There isn't any way to tell if God Goku is stronger or weaker than Yi Xing Long or even SS4 Gogeta.

[dbzfan7]

I can see everyone get it now, because why not have several SSJ Gods.

Everyone can get Super Saiyan God for 7 minutes, but not everyone can absorb its power to make it permanent like Goku did. I can see Vegeta succeeding doing so, but what about Gohan, Goten, Pan, Trunks, and Bra?

Exuding Bra and maybe Pan, the kids have shown themselves to be super prodigies. When they put their minds to something they can easily accomplish what the adults do. So I can easily see it happening for everyone else. Goku did it by accident, I can see that easily happen for everyone else.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Goten & Trunks are very talented, but Gohan hasn't shown any talent. His dormant power was the only special thing for him.