The gamma's are said to be the strongest androids meaning above a SSJB level 17. Gamma 1 shows as much going toe to toe with Ultimate Gohan. They also improve as the fight progresses meaning they're most likely above SSJB level by the time they're going against Gohan and Piccolo in their Ultimate forms. The latter is why I place Orange Piccolo well above SSJB. The fact he's capable of both tanking Gamma 2's attacks and taking him out with one shot is purposeful to show the power gap is significant. DB uses sequences like this when one character is shown on par or weaker than another until they access a new transformation and decimate the same opponent. Frieza's actions in the manga are the latest example.Goku9001 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 22, 2022 2:01 amWhat statements were provided in regards to how the Gammas compare to Goku and Vegeta? I watched it dubbed and didn't catch any and that's likely because the dubbed may have omitted/translated these statements differently.Hugo Boss wrote: ↑Sun Aug 21, 2022 11:22 amYes, precisely. Of course, their intel about Cell Max played a big factor, but their power was also accounted. The Gammas are also capable of improving as the fight prolongs, and at the end they were implied to be above Goku and Vegeta. So, they don’t lose on either scenario.
By the way, despite how their fight played out, Beast Gohan is also implied to be weaker than Cell Max at full power. Cell Max’s attack power significantly dropped after Gamma #2’s attack. I should say, before watching the movie in its entirety, I was skeptical about it, but Gamma #2’s big scene is a huge moment in the movie (definitely dwarfs what came later). I left the movie thinking the only one who could single-handily defeat Cell Max was Broly, as long as Cell Max wasn’t perfected.
Gamma 2's performance definitely places him way up there and I definitely don't think there's anything that suggests that Orange Piccolo could do the same thing. In fact, he gambles on Gohan to do the same thing because he has the potential to be the "mightiest warrior" i.e one that surpasses both Goku and Vegeta. That should put things in perspective as to how powerful the Gammas could be. However, I'm not so sure if Cell Max's battle power had dropped. My understanding was that attacking his weakspot made him more susceptible to damage at the expense of overloading his system and making him stronger. Cell Max became progressively stronger as the fight continued.
Looking back on things, I think Beast Gohan may be weaker than Broly considering what you said including how the emphasis on Gohan's transformation into the "mightiest warrior" seems to be placed strictly on surpassing Goku and Vegeta. When looking at this in the context of the manga (whenever or if Super Hero gets readapted to reconcile with the manga), I can't imagine Beast Gohan being treated as a significant benchmark for Goku and Vegeta to overcome. It's difficult to tell how Beast Gohan compares to UI Goku and Jiren. At least in terms of power, he should be way ahead of Jiren but that doesn't tell us how he'd fare against Jiren considering Jiren's explosive fighting style.
Gamma 2 injuring Cell Max isn't an indication of his power compared to Orange Piccolo at that point and Beast Gohan. His attack is similar to Vegeta's attack against Buu, meant as a last ditch sacrifice where you release all of your power in a single burst. The point is realized he didn't stand a chance against such a powerful enemy and his only option to become the hero he's meant to be was his sacrifice. Even if he could somehow match Cell Max in size to facilitate a one on one a little better he would have been crushed. Orange Piccolo on the other hand at least put up a fight despite being on the third fight of the day without using the Senzu.
Beast Gohan was the second instance of showing how significant his power increase was when he transformed. He went from not standing a chance in Ultimate to Cell Max's attacks being almost nothing to him while his single attack rocked him. As a smart fighter, he went to the Makankosappo right away because he knew the best bet was a highly concentrated attack with more than enough power to break through Cell Max's weak spot and cause him to destruct.
We really have no way of knowing what he could have done in a straight up fight against Cell Max, if the logistics were a little easier given his size difference and they weren't given an exploit. I don't think Broly would have faired any better given we don't know what he's capable of when he's in the more controlled form Kale showed in the ToP. In his beserk form, he would have been pretty useless in trying to direct a focused attack at a single spot. If Toriyama, Toyotaro, and the gang want to clearly show where Gohan falls in the order, they need to show him fighting a maxed out Broly along with somehow referencing or even showing how he fared against UE Vegeta or TUI Goku.
I'd love to see the same with Orange Piccolo. Somehow setting up a situation where we see someone known to be on their level liek Granohla coming to take up Vegeta on the offer, and Piccolo steps up telling Vegeta he'd like to fight first. Perfect for some dialogue from Vegeta laughing about Piccolo not standing a chance and if he wants to get himself killed it's fine with him. Only to show Piccolo transform, first shocking Vegeta just through his ability to sense ki and going on to show him he's able to compete on that level.
So perfect to use Vegeta in this capacity given the history he has doubting Piccolo's capabilities, which caused him to eat his words in DBZ and sadly be proven right in DBS. Finally time for Piccolo to shock the Ultra Ego out his hair like he did during the Cell saga.
