Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[Kaboom]

You're probably thinking of the entry for his high-school era Super Saiyan 2 self from Daizenshuu #2's "growing up" guide. It reads as such:

HIGH SCHOOL ERA SUPER SAIYAN 2
First Appears: Vol. 37
During the Tenkaichi Budoukai he transforms at Kibito's request. Because he couldn't gain power from anger and because he hadn't been training, he doesn't have the same battle power as when he defeated Cell.

It's talking about Super Saiyan 2, as said, and it actually says he's weaker than before. I'd like to note that it gives two reasons for him not being as strong. Because he couldn't get angry AND because he didn't train. You could interpret this a few different ways.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

Only things that come to my mind are these:

HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT
First Appears: Vol. 36-42
Many years after the battle with Cell, Gohan had become a high school student. Due to either Chi Chi's influence or him neglecting to train, his strength hadn't changed since he was a boy.

HIGH SCHOOL ERA
SUPER SAIYAN 2
First Appears: Vol. 37
During the Tenkaichi Budoukai he transforms at Kibito's request. Because he couldn't gain power from anger and because he hadn't been training, he doesn't have the same battle power as when he defeated Cell.

It seems to suggest that Gohan is as strong as he was, but he can't use the rage boost to come to the same level as he was against Cell.

EDIT: Kaboom was faster.

[RandomGuy96]

You're probably thinking of the entry for his high-school era Super Saiyan 2 self from Daizenshuu #2's "growing up" guide. It reads as such:

HIGH SCHOOL ERA SUPER SAIYAN 2
First Appears: Vol. 37
During the Tenkaichi Budoukai he transforms at Kibito's request. Because he couldn't gain power from anger and because he hadn't been training, he doesn't have the same battle power as when he defeated Cell.

I'd like to note that it gives two reasons for him not being as strong. Because he couldn't get angry AND because he didn't train. You could interpret this a few different ways.

Oh, that's the one? I'd been aware of that, I thought it was another entry. Yeah, this gives not training as a reason for him being weaker. Which usually isn't what I hear when this entry is brought up... and kind of violates certain theories that I had. How do you interpret it? I'm updating my old list and am unsure of whether or not to go with "Gohan got weaker" or "Gohan just lost his rage boost". It determines how much room I really have to make the beatdowns work in the Cell Saga, before Gohan turns SS2.

HIGH SCHOOL STUDENT
First Appears: Vol. 36-42
Many years after the battle with Cell, Gohan had become a high school student. Due to either Chi Chi's influence or him neglecting to train, his strength hadn't changed since he was a boy.

Okay, this one is much clearer. This must be what people commonly refer to, outright stating that kid Gohan and adult Gohan have the same strength. But then again, wouldn't that contradict the other entry which says that he got weaker due to not training?

Though his power being specifically stated to not change at all is news to me either way; I originally had him getting a bit stronger due to getting older and training for the tournament.

[Saiga]

Combining the two, you could say that a lack of training means he didn't gain any strength, which means that the lack of rage boost leaves him weaker.

[ZombieVito]

I been having this issue for a while now, if Gohan truly did not get weaker at all then it will destroys my numbers from the Cell Games.

[Kakashi]

What's even the point of asking other people if you're just going to give sparse content-less replies where you just state your own opinions of fact?

I asked for his power level which can be anything at the low millions but you are overrating it

[Kamiccolo9]

What's even the point of asking other people if you're just going to give sparse content-less replies where you just state your own opinions of fact?

I asked for his power level which can be anything at the low millions but you are overrating it

So, it's his power level can be anything, as long as it fits inside the parameters you set for it? Seems legit.

[Kakashi]

Pure Boo is only stated to be the strongest Boo in the anime, but since Goku couldn't stand a chance against Gohan Boo, Gotenks Boo, S. Kaioshin Boo, Piccolo Boo, and Evil Boo, while he could stand a chance against Pure Boo, it's obvious that Pure Boo isn't literally the strongest Boo. But even if he was stronger than Gohan Boo (he isn't), that doesn't make him stronger than Super Vegetto, since Super Vegetto was faaa~aaar stronger than Gohan Boo.

Pure Boo is stronger than Gohan-Boo is stated. Goku was just haxed, he was able to fight Ultimate Gohan as a SSjin. Goku implies Pure Boo > SSjin Vegetto when they fight

[Kakashi]

What's even the point of asking other people if you're just going to give sparse content-less replies where you just state your own opinions of fact?

I asked for his power level which can be anything at the low millions but you are overrating it

So, it's his power level can be anything, as long as it fits inside the parameters the movie sets for it? Seems legit.

Fixed for you

[Kamiccolo9]

Fixed for you

The movie says that he's stronger than Freeza. Not really sure how that means he must to be in the low millions.

[Kakashi]

Fixed for you

The movie says that he's stronger than Freeza. Not really sure how that means he must to be in the low millions.

The movie was revealed after Frieza transformed into his 3rd form so Giant Slug > 3rd form Frieza

3rd form Frieza is 2 million range, no? That's the low millions

[Kamiccolo9]

Fixed for you

The movie says that he's stronger than Freeza. Not really sure how that means he must to be in the low millions.

The movie was revealed after Freeza transformed into his 3rd form so Giant Slug > 3rd form Freeza

3rd form Freeza is 2 million range, no? That's the low millions

Show me in the movie where it says that Slug is stronger, specifically, than 3rd form Freeza.

And then, show me where it says that movie powers have to be based off the corresponding anime arc.

I want direct quotes by the way. I'm in no rush; take your time.

[Kakashi]

Show me in the movie where it says that Slug is stronger, specifically, than 3rd form Freeza.

And then, show me where it says that movie powers have to be based off the corresponding anime arc.

I want direct quotes by the way. I'm in no rush; take your time.

It says "Freeza" but since the movie was revealed before Freeza was known to have his final form soSlug is stronger than 3rd form Freeza. Movies follow Anime. No need to explain. Rakasie said if they eat the fruit, they would beat Freez so he men Frieza at his max? That's like me asking you to show me where in the Manga does Goku say he doesn't love Chi Chi.

[Kamiccolo9]

Show me in the movie where it says that Slug is stronger, specifically, than 3rd form Freeza.

And then, show me where it says that movie powers have to be based off the corresponding anime arc.

I want direct quotes by the way. I'm in no rush; take your time.

It says "Freeza" but since the movie was revealed before Freeza was known to have his final form soSlug is stronger than 3rd form Freeza. Movies follow Anime. No need to explain. Rakasie said if they eat the fruit, they would beat Freez so he men Freeza at his max? That's like me asking you to show me where in the Manga does Goku say he doesn't love Chi Chi.

So....nothing then? Okay.

Being serious now, stop stating your opinions as fact. It's getting old.

No need to explain.

If you expect to be taken seriously, then back up your opinions with evidence. Absolutely nothing states that characters in movies have to be equal to the anime characters. If you won't (or can't) back that up, then don't expect anyone to agree with you. As it stands now, you, in this and in practically every other thread, are just screaming into the wind, and shaking your head with your hands covering your ears every time someone disagrees with you. You start topics just so that you can put down other people's views without even acknowledging them. Stop it. It's not funny, it doesn't make you look clever, and all you've succeeded in doing is irritating some of the members here.

If you've come up with some system that works for you in coming up with power levels, great. Good for you. Just get it through your head that it does not have to apply to everyone else.

[Kakashi]

Show me in the movie where it says that Slug is stronger, specifically, than 3rd form Freeza.

And then, show me where it says that movie powers have to be based off the corresponding anime arc.

I want direct quotes by the way. I'm in no rush; take your time.

It says "Freeza" but since the movie was revealed before Freeza was known to have his final form soSlug is stronger than 3rd form Freeza. Movies follow Anime. No need to explain. Rakasie said if they eat the fruit, they would beat Freez so he men Freeza at his max? That's like me asking you to show me where in the Manga does Goku say he doesn't love Chi Chi.

So....nothing then? Okay.

Being serious now, stop stating your opinions as fact. It's getting old.

No need to explain.

If you expect to be taken seriously, then back up your opinions with evidence. Absolutely nothing states that characters in movies have to be equal to the anime characters. If you won't (or can't) back that up, then don't expect anyone to agree with you. As it stands now, you, in this and in practically every other thread, are just screaming into the wind, and shaking your head with your hands covering your ears every time someone disagrees with you. You start topics just so that you can put down other people's views without even acknowledging them. Stop it. It's not funny, it doesn't make you look clever, and all you've succeeded in doing is irritating some of the members here.

If you've come up with some system that works for you in coming up with power levels, great. Good for you. Just get it through your head that it does not have to apply to everyone else.

But it is a fact. Movies are made for Anime fans and the movie takes place before Goku was healed from his battle with Ginyu. M4 Goku is 90,000. Is that not a fact? Not even the Manga showed Frueza at his max. An opinion is how strong someone is and his exact level. You are being ignorant on this, dude. Even Kaboom says movies and Anime follow each other and Kanoom is the man

Anyway, if you watched the movie when it was first released, what would you think? There is a reason why TOEI releases the movies wen they do. Your logic also implies Tullece is stronger than Freeza's max. Coola is the first one o surpass Freeza.

Coola > 100% final form Freeza

Slug > 3rd form Freeza

Tullece ~ first form Freeza

Those are what the movies imply going by time line. You are the one going by baseless assumptions

[Kamiccolo9]

But it is a fact. Movies are made for Anime fans and the movie takes place before Goku was healed from his battle with Ginyu. M4 Goku is 90,000. Is that not a fact? Not even the Manga showed Frueza at his max. An opinion is how strong someone is and his exact level. You are being ignorant on this, dude. Even Kaboom says movies and Anime follow each other and Kanoom is the man

Anyway, if you watched the movie when it was first released, what would you think? There is a reason why TOEI releases the movies wen they do. Your logic also implies Tullece is stronger than Freeza's max. Coola is the first one o surpass Freeza.

Coola > 100% final form Freeza

Slug > 3rd form Freeza

Tullece ~ first form Freeza

Those are what the movies imply going by time line. You are the one going by baseless assumptions

The funny thing is, for the most part, I agree with you. It's your attitude about it that's the problem. No, it is not a fact. And just because Kaboom agrees with it does not make it a fact (nothing against Kaboom, of course. But his opinion is no more official than yours or mine.)

Kaio says that Slug is stronger than Freeza. That can mean anything from Slug being stronger than First Form Freeza (the form he's usually in), 2nd Form Freeza (the one that broke the "One Million Wall"), 3rd Form Freeza (the one that had appeared at the time), or Final Form Freeza (the true power of Freeza). It's not any more specific than "stronger than Freeza."

M4 Goku being at 90 thousand is not a fact unless the movie says he is at 90 thousand. Sure, he can be at 90 thousand, but unless it says so, then he doesn't have to be.

And calling me ignorant? I could just as easily accuse you of being narrow minded. There is no rule saying that movie power levels correspond with their anime levels. If anything, the movie levels that we do have, those for Cooler's Armored Squadron, seem to ignore the manga and anime levels when taken at face value. Sure, you can make them work if you twist things enough. But it's easier, and makes just as much sense to assume that the movies do what they want.

Again, if there is some written rule stated by Toei, Toriyama, or Shueisha concerning this, then, by all means, show me. If not, then your "facts" have no bearing in anything but your own opinion, and therefore has no bearing on whether or not others are "right" or "wrong."

[Kaboom]

But it is a fact. Movies are made for Anime fans and the movie takes place before Goku was healed from his battle with Ginyu. M4 Goku is 90,000. Is that not a fact? Not even the Manga showed Freeza at his max. An opinion is how strong someone is and his exact level. You are being ignorant on this, dude. Even Kaboom says movies and Anime follow each other and Kanoom is the man

As much "the man" as I and my evil twin Kanoom may collectively be, we hold no such authority. The "movie characters line up with series ones" is an easy way of doing things, but it's not a fact unless the movie says it is. There's nothing wrong with seeing things that way and it may very well be the optimal option, but people don't HAVE to see it that way if they don't want to.

[DBZGTKOSDH]

It says "Freeza" but since the movie was revealed before Freeza was known to have his final form soSlug is stronger than 3rd form Freeza. Movies follow Anime.

If that was the case, Goku, Piccolo, and Gohan wouldn't wouldn't be at 30.000, 18.000, and 10.000 respectively and Kaio-ken x10 in M3, we wouldn't have seen "Super Saiyan" Goku against Slug in M4, we wouldn't be informed that Goku "killed" Freeza in M5, we wouldn't have seen Dende as the Kami of Earth in M6, and we wouldn't have seen SS2 Goku in M10 (though this is debatable).

[Kakashi]

It says "Freeza" but since the movie was revealed before Freeza was known to have his final form soSlug is stronger than 3rd form Freeza. Movies follow Anime.

If that was the case, Goku, Piccolo, and Gohan wouldn't wouldn't be at 30.000, 18.000, and 10.000 respectively and Kaio-ken x10 in M3, we wouldn't have seen "Super Saiyan" Goku against Slug in M4, we wouldn't be informed that Goku "killed" Freeza in M5, we wouldn't have seen Dende as the Kami of Earth in M6, and we wouldn't have seen SS2 Goku in M10 (though this is debatable).

Everyone in M3 is based on what Goku was. Goku was over 30,000 and it makes sense because it was in his middle of his training. Goku is SSjin in M4 because the movie is based on the Ginyu Arc where Goku is said to be the SSjin

M5 is Frieza Arc so obviously Goku beat Frieza. Dende was the gurdian because the movie happened on Namek IMO. Movies follow Anime time line.

Regardless, M4 Goku is the one who fought Ginyu. His Kaioken x100 beat Giant Slug easily

Goku was not SSjin 2 in M10

But it is a fact. Movies are made for Anime fans and the movie takes place before Goku was healed from his battle with Ginyu. M4 Goku is 90,000. Is that not a fact? Not even the Manga showed Freeza at his max. An opinion is how strong someone is and his exact level. You are being ignorant on this, dude. Even Kaboom says movies and Anime follow each other and Kanoom is the man

As much "the man" as I and my evil twin Kanoom may collectively be, we hold no such authority. The "movie characters line up with series ones" is an easy way of doing things, but it's not a fact unless the movie says it is. There's nothing wrong with seeing things that way and it may very well be the optimal option, but people don't HAVE to see it that way if they don't want to.

Not everything has to be spelt out so it can be a fact. M2 Goku being the same one who bet Vegeta is not a fact?

[Kaboom]

Not everything has to be spelt out so it can be a fact. M2 Goku being the same one who (fought) Vegeta is not a fact?

He might be, he might not. I personally have him a little stronger than that. Up to whoever's making up numbers for their own list.

Also, PLEASE quit double-posting.