Why Was Gohan Handled So Poorly In The Cell Arc?

[DBZ Mick]

Its not that Gohan doesn't like fighting, he's pretty much refusing to fight seriously. Cell has to beat up every single one of his friends and family almost till they died (plus kill an android) so that Gohan actually is willing to fight seriously.

Gohan has never been like that. Sure, he doesn't like to fight, but he has always fought for his family and friends the best that he could.

It's exactly this. Remember what happened when Freeza transformed to his third form and started blasting Piccolo to near death? Gohan goes crazy and launches into an attack on Freeza. But with Cell...nothing.

[Duo]

Gohan in movie 9 made far more sense to me than he did in the Artificial Human arc. He's fighting to be like his dad, responds to conflict by fighting as hard as he can (as a Super Saiyan), gets pushed down really far (like Goku right before he turned Super Saiyan) and then gets just a touch of advice and help from his father, unleashes his full power, and ends it. I find that far more consistent with the Gohan I knew than the one Cell fought.

[RandomGuy96]

Huh, I hadn't noticed that. Good observation. That's just weird: Toei made more sense than Toriyama?

[Duo]

Huh, I hadn't noticed that. Good observation. That's just weird: Toei made more sense than Toriyama?

Beats me. Some of the movies just totally nailed it with the characters and plot idea's, then others completely blew it. Don't ask me how GT and Fusion Reborn were apparently done by the same writing team (as far as we can assume based on almost no information whatsoever).

[SingleFringe&Sparks]

The issue isn't whether he likes to fight, the issue is why he thinks that his plea will do anything. He seemed gung ho about helping his friends from the beginning, but now he has cold feet and tries to solve it with words. He may not know Cell, but he knows the kind of being Cell is, so his reticence to fight feels like it comes out of nowhere.

My biggest problem is when Cell returns and Goku still has to hold his hand. Gohan is ready to give up even without a fight.

and he fears that he might hurt his friends if he lost control of himself again

I don't recall him saying he fears hurting his friends.

I found that to be the biggest 180 contradiction in the entire series, it just didn't make any sense that Gohan was so eager to fight Cell and train; then the moment he's called in he tells cell multiple times he doesnt want to fight with no reason why he rejected it even after telling Goku how badly he needed to... and why he told Cell he didnt want to kill him wasn't clear either....Gohan kept contradicting himself the entire fight. I can understand if Gohan lost his confidence because his his SSJ2 mindset changed him and blinded him through its power up, as it caused Goku to kill himself but the whole rant he gave about him being just a useless kid and etc.. came out of no where, unless he was just parroting what Piccolo said about him before he transformed.

[Vice]

Anyone has a right to bitch about anything in the story, within reason. And I don't really see any unreasonable posts in this thread.

Agreed. Vice is more than capable to simply not participate in these threads if his whole mentality is "stop talking about this guys".

Or Gohan fans can stop pretending he didn't flop during his short run when the story was focused on him and that he is more important to the plot or deserves more of the spotlight than Goku does. It's Goku's story, not Gohan's.

Despite the fact that he got more than any other character not named Goku, they still aren't satisfied. So no, I do not agree that there is a right to bitch about this as he is not meant to be more important than Goku is.

[Saiga]

Gohan in movie 9 made far more sense to me than he did in the Artificial Human arc. He's fighting to be like his dad, responds to conflict by fighting as hard as he can (as a Super Saiyan), gets pushed down really far (like Goku right before he turned Super Saiyan) and then gets just a touch of advice and help from his father, unleashes his full power, and ends it. I find that far more consistent with the Gohan I knew than the one Cell fought.

Very well put, I agree with this a lot. I finished movie 9 thinking that it could have done without Goku's cameo, but I guess it still handles Gohan much better than the Cell Games.

Huh, I hadn't noticed that. Good observation. That's just weird: Toei made more sense than Toriyama?

Indeed, though movie 9 is some of Toei's best and the Cell Games is some of Toriyama's worst, which mitigates the surprise somewhat. I also think Toei made more sense with Vegeta's reaction to Super Saiyan Goku - in filler, Vegeta is actually happy that Goku became a Super Saiyan, compared to the serious aggression he develops after the Freeza arc in the manga. It just seems to fit the personality of Namek arc Vegeta better.

On topic, while I agree that Gohan was handled very poorly during the Cell Games, I'm not sure he should have been built up more before the RoSaT. At least, not in terms or power or anything. The RoSaT training is what separates Gohan from his future counterpart - Goku notes that it's only during then that he began to see Gohan's potential. I don't think the training Gohan did with Goku and Piccolo should have made him drastically different from his future counterpart, especially when present Gohan was much younger.

[Kid Buu]

Another thing I like about Movie 9 is that Vegeta actually sticks to the whole I'LL NEVER FIGHT AGAIN motto at the end of the Cell Games.

[Michsi]

I'm probably one of the few that doesn't really think Gohan's reluctance to fight Cell at that moment was completely out of left field and that he didn't suddenly turn into a pacifist for that one fight . My only complaint regarding his character during the Cell Games s that he was flung into the spot light so suddenly when he had been basically ignored in the first half of the arc. I know that his potential had been brought up and demonstrated ever since he was introduced, but I think a little more foreshadowing that this was going to be his big arc wouldn't have hurt.

[penguintruth]

I seriously don't know what you people are talking about.

Go and read the manga. He's fighting Cell. He's not refusing to fight Cell. He's saying he doesn't want to, but it's not like he's refusing to. He's right there, fighting him. It's not like he starts to refuse to fight, so much as at one point he's trying to figure out how to tap into the power he can only get to with his anger and struggling.

[rereboy]

I seriously don't know what you people are talking about.

Go and read the manga. He's fighting Cell. He's not refusing to fight Cell. He's saying he doesn't want to, but it's not like he's refusing to. He's right there, fighting him. It's not like he starts to refuse to fight, so much as at one point he's trying to figure out how to tap into the power he can only get to with his anger and struggling.

Half-ass attempts. He's clearly capable of doing much better even without SSJ2, as the the one hit he laid on Cell demonstrated. During the whole time the Cell Jrs are born and beat up the gang, he's just watching.

[Metalwario64]

Yeah, after he declares he doesn't want to fight, he only tries to attack him a couple of times, otherwise he just sits there and then he and Cell start hugging.

[RandomGuy96]

Which is especially dumb because he SHOULD be able to take all 7 Juniors in just Super Saiyan. He was already a lot stronger than the suppressed Cell that was beating Goku.

[thatdbzguy]

I seriously don't know what you people are talking about.

Go and read the manga. He's fighting Cell. He's not refusing to fight Cell. He's saying he doesn't want to, but it's not like he's refusing to. He's right there, fighting him. It's not like he starts to refuse to fight, so much as at one point he's trying to figure out how to tap into the power he can only get to with his anger and struggling.

Half-ass attempts. He's clearly capable of doing much better even without SSJ2, as the the one hit he laid on Cell demonstrated. During the whole time the Cell Jrs are born and beat up the gang, he's just watching.

Landing one little hit on Cell, compared to the numerous times Goku hit him, automatically means he can do significantly better without SSJ2?

And of course he didn't attack the Cell Jrs. Cell would've stopped him, and he was trying to unleash all of his hidden power because he knew he wouldn't be able to do anything.

"Bu-bu-but he always charged in without thinking beforez!!1!" It's called maturing. Gohan wasn't the exact same kid mentally during the Cell Games as he was previously.

Gohan was written like shit, but not for those reasons.

[rereboy]

Landing one little hit on Cell, compared to the numerous times Goku hit him, automatically means he can do significantly better without SSJ2?

Yes. Watch the fight again. That hit is the only time it actually looks like he is trying and put some real spirit behind the blow.

And of course he didn't attack the Cell Jrs. Cell would've stopped him, and he was trying to unleash all of his hidden power because he knew he wouldn't be able to do anything.

That didn't ever stop him before. Against Freeza, for example, he acted to protect Piccolo and, because he acted with real spirit, he was able to reach his anger boost. With Cell is unwilling to fight with spirit, with anger, he is unable to fight like he actually wants to protect his friends even if it kills him like he has always done. Why?

"Bu-bu-but he always charged in without thinking beforez!!1!" It's called maturing. Gohan wasn't the exact same kid mentally during the Cell Games as he was previously.

Its called maturing to just watch your friends be killed without actually doing anything because he thought that the person hurting them would also stop him... When that never bothered him before, even if it killed him. Yeah. Very mature.

Gohan was written like shit, but not for those reasons.

If you say so... This is probably the worst example of actual worse writing in Dragon Ball. Plotholes are just overlooked details that don't really matter at the end of the day. But this is so much more than that.

[thatdbzguy]

Gohan tried up until Cell hit him through that mountain. That's when he tried to convince Cell to stop fighting.

And you just ignored what I said. Gohan didn't attack because he knew he wouldn't be able to do anything. Cell would've stopped him, and even if he "had the spirit", he still wouldn't be a match against either Cell or the Cell Jr.s without going SSJ2. This shows Gohan's maturity because he actually thought before just charging in like a lunatic. He knew damn well he wouldn't be able to do anything, which is why you saw him trying to awaken his hidden power while his friends. were getting attacked.

I honestly don't see how thinking before acting shows a lack of maturity.

[rereboy]

Gohan tried up until Cell hit him through that mountain. That's when he tried to convince Cell to stop fighting.

And you just ignored what I said. Gohan didn't attack because he knew he wouldn't be able to do anything. Cell would've stopped him, and even if he "had the spirit", he still wouldn't be a match against either Cell or the Cell Jr.s without going SSJ2. This shows Gohan's maturity because he actually thought before just charging in like a lunatic. He knew damn well he wouldn't be able to do anything, which is why you saw him trying to awaken his hidden power while his friends. were getting attacked.

I honestly don't see how thinking before acting shows a lack of maturity.

Like I said, half-assed attempts. He wasn't fighting with spirit, like he had always fought before.

And no, I didn't ignore you. Your argument just doesn't make sense. You think that Gohan has ever cared that he probably doesn't stand a chance when his friends' life is on the line? What do you think would have happened to Piccolo agaisnt Freeza if Gohan had thought "Piccolo is going to die, but Freeza probably won't allow me to save him since he is so powerful, so instead of actually trying to save him and attack with all my spirit, I will just stand here and hope that my power rises"? Yeah, Piccolo would have died.

And maturity has nothing to do with being able to think. Maturity is about being wiser and more experienced. You think that Gohan was being wise and experienced in the Cell games? There's nothing wrong with him actually trying to convince Cell to not fight, but after Cell flat out refuses to step down, what the hell is Gohan doing? He should know better than anyone how dangerous Cell is for Earth and for his friends. He fought Radditz, Nappa, Vegeta, the Ginyu force, Freeza,... He knows how ruthless the enemy can be. And that is what he does? Half-assed attempts? Just standing there watching? Old Gohan would be screaming his heart out and attacking with all he had, until Cell was forced to really hurt him or kill him or until Gohan won the fight. Gohan's attitude and actions were twisted for the sake of tension and drama.

[thatdbzguy]

Gohan tried up until Cell hit him through that mountain. That's when he tried to convince Cell to stop fighting.

And you just ignored what I said. Gohan didn't attack because he knew he wouldn't be able to do anything. Cell would've stopped him, and even if he "had the spirit", he still wouldn't be a match against either Cell or the Cell Jr.s without going SSJ2. This shows Gohan's maturity because he actually thought before just charging in like a lunatic. He knew damn well he wouldn't be able to do anything, which is why you saw him trying to awaken his hidden power while his friends. were getting attacked.

I honestly don't see how thinking before acting shows a lack of maturity.

Like I said, half-assed attempts. He wasn't fighting with spirit, like he had always fought before.

And no, I didn't ignore you. Your argument just doesn't make sense. You think that Gohan has ever cared that he probably doesn't stand a chance when his friends' life is on the line? What do you think would have happened to Piccolo agaisnt Freeza if Gohan had thought "Piccolo is going to die, but Freeza probably won't allow me to save him since he is so powerful, so instead of actually trying to save him and attack with all my spirit, I will just stand here and hope that my power rises"? Yeah, Piccolo would have died.

And maturity has nothing to do with being able to think. Maturity is about being wiser and more experienced. You think that Gohan was being wise and experienced in the Cell games? There's nothing wrong with him actually trying to convince Cell to not fight, but after Cell flat out refuses to step down, what the hell is Gohan doing? He should know better than anyone how dangerous Cell is for Earth and for his friends. He fought Radditz, Nappa, Vegeta, the Ginyu force, Freeza,... He knows how ruthless the enemy can be. And that is what he does? Half-assed attempts? Just standing there watching? Old Gohan would be screaming his heart out and attacking with all he had, until Cell was forced to really hurt him or kill him or until Gohan won the fight. Gohan's attitude and actions were twisted for the sake of tension and drama.

Yeah, you're ignoring a vital part of my argument. Gohan didn't just stand there watching, he was very obviously trying to unlock his hidden power, not just waiting for it to randomly pop-up. With Piccolo, it was different, because he wasn't the last hope anyone had of beating Freeza like he was against Cell, so if Gohan happened to get killed in the process, it wouldn't have mattered as much.

With Cell, Gohan knew that the only chance they had against beating Cell was his hidden power, and that just charging in without unlocking all of it could just get him killed and end up screwing everyone over.

[rereboy]

]
Yeah, you're ignoring a vital part of my argument. Gohan didn't just stand there watching, he was very obviously trying to unlock his hidden power, not just waiting for it to randomly pop-up. With Piccolo, it was different, because he wasn't the last hope anyone had of beating Freeza like he was against Cell, so if Gohan happened to get killed in the process, it wouldn't have mattered as much.

With Cell, Gohan knew that the only chance they had against beating Cell was his hidden power, and that just charging in without unlocking all of it could just get him killed and end up screwing everyone over.

And you are ignoring that he was trying to achieve a boost while just standing there. In the past, he always, ALWAYS, achieved a boost, WHILE attacking. He attacked to defend his friends and family and, WHILE attacking, he would achieve his boost, which allowed for his attacks to be somewhat effective. In fact, we can say that he achieved a boost BECAUSE he was attacking with all his spirit.

Enter the Cell games, and that goes out of the window. Suddenly he needs to get the boost before he tries to attack. And when he did try to attack before then, there's no visible spirit behind his effort, just a consistent half-assed performance with the exception of that one hit that he could have followed up with more attacks and hits but didn't (really, he just stood there and watched Cell get up and recuperate instead of following up his attack...).

And no, Gohan was the only one that could save Piccolo from Freeza. And he did. Being the only one capable of doing something at the time never bothered Gohan before the Cell games. Even against Nappa he froze up not because he was the only one but simply because he was terrified of Nappa.

[TheAldella]

Huh, I hadn't noticed that. Good observation. That's just weird: Toei made more sense than Toriyama?

Beats me. Some of the movies just totally nailed it with the characters and plot idea's, then others completely blew it. Don't ask me how GT and Fusion Reborn were apparently done by the same writing team (as far as we can assume based on almost no information whatsoever).

I could see that, considering GT's amount of good concepts.