How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

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Rocketman
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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by Rocketman » Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:35 am

If Freezer did a couple squats and lunges during the week of waiting, Super Saiyan Goku could've never equaled him. The Namek arc no longer hinges on the heroes being clever or skilled, but on the villain being stupid.

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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by fadeddreams5 » Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:46 am

The most prominent aspect of Resurrection F is the revelation that Frieza is a moron.
"Dragon Ball once became a thing of the past to me, but after that, I got angry about the live action movie, re-wrote an entire movie script, and now I'm complaining about the quality of the new TV anime. It seems Dragon Ball has grown on me so much that I can't leave it alone." - Akira Toriyama on Dragon Ball Super

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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:57 am

Rocketman wrote:If Freezer did a couple squats and lunges during the week of waiting, Super Saiyan Goku could've never equaled him. The Namek arc no longer hinges on the heroes being clever or skilled, but on the villain being stupid.
When you've maintained your position as the strongest warrior in the universe without having to do much, while leading an army of super strong soldiers, you are bound to get complacent.

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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by rereboy » Tue Apr 07, 2015 11:08 am

Lord Beerus wrote: When you've maintained your position as the strongest warrior in the universe without having to do much, while leading an army of super strong soldiers, you are bound to get complacent.
He wasn't complacent. He was very alert to every threat that might challenge him. He destroyed planet Vegeta immediately when he thought they were becoming too strong and he even had the hindsight to recognize that things were going to become tougher on Namek and summoned the Ginyu force when even Zarbon thought that it was too much.

Which means that this movie doesn't portray him as complacent. It portrays him as just lazy. He is very alert and he takes various steps to remain on top, but never the most obvious of all: training a bit. Which makes him lazy. And kind of stupid.

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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Tue Apr 07, 2015 11:59 am

Lord Beerus wrote: He really wasn't. Golden Freeza ultimately proved no match for Blue Super Saiyan God Goku in the movie.
But Freeza is stronger then both Cell and Buu in ROF. So Goku's statement at the end of the manga with Buu being their strongest opponent is no longer relevant now.
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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by Lord Beerus » Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:01 pm

rereboy wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote: When you've maintained your position as the strongest warrior in the universe without having to do much, while leading an army of super strong soldiers, you are bound to get complacent.
He wasn't complacent. He was very alert to every threat that might challenge him. He destroyed planet Vegeta immediately when he thought they were becoming too strong and he even had the hindsight to recognize that things were going to become tougher on Namek and summoned the Ginyu force when even Zarbon thought that it was too much.

Which means that this movie doesn't portray him as complacent. It portrays him as just lazy. He is very alert and he takes various steps to remain on top, but never the most obvious of all: training a bit. Which makes him lazy. And kind of stupid.
Being "complacent" and "lazy" is pretty much the same thing. It all revolves around a lack of effort and being arrogant.
Hellspawn28 wrote:
Lord Beerus wrote: He really wasn't. Golden Freeza ultimately proved no match for Blue Super Saiyan God Goku in the movie.
But Freeza is stronger then both Cell and Buu in ROF. So Goku's statement at the end of the manga with Buu being their strongest opponent is no longer relevant now.
Well... maybe he just wanted Oob to feel special. I mean, he comes from a poverty stricken background, you gotta raise his status somehow. :P

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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by rereboy » Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:18 pm

Lord Beerus wrote: Being "complacent" and "lazy" is pretty much the same thing. It all revolves around a lack of effort and being arrogant.
They are similar and are used together many times but actually complacent means "to be pleased, especially with oneself or one's merits, advantages, situation, etc., often without awareness of some potential danger or defect", while lazy means "not liking to work hard or to be active".

Like I said, Freeza didn't like the situation he was in, he wasn't pleased by it, he was fully aware of the danger and he actually did something about it. Therefore he wasn't complacent.

However, those efforts didn't include him working hard even though he knew he could improve immensely in a very short time. And that can only be justified by him being exceptionally lazy.

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Re: How do all these new movies affect the end of the manga?

Post by Skar » Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:46 pm

rereboy wrote:It's even worse when we realize that he knew about this and still went to Earth without training for a few months after Namek.
I always assumed Freeza was at his max potential in the manga. Maybe the average member of his race had a power level of a few thousands or so. Freeza and King Cold were born with a mutation and I thought that pushed them to the heights of their race's potential. At least this makes Freeza's loss beyond his control because the hero was just too strong for him not that Freeza was just lazy.
Lord Beerus wrote:
Rocketman wrote:If Freezer did a couple squats and lunges during the week of waiting, Super Saiyan Goku could've never equaled him. The Namek arc no longer hinges on the heroes being clever or skilled, but on the villain being stupid.
When you've maintained your position as the strongest warrior in the universe without having to do much, while leading an army of super strong soldiers, you are bound to get complacent.
That's what we originally assumed but that idea was contradicted when we found out Freeza knew about Buu and Beerus this entire time and is fully aware that they are both stronger than him. On top of that Freeza is positive he can surpass Goku who defeated Buu in four months which means he could've surpassed Buu in less time. This movie gives Freeza the most potential in the entire series but also makes him the laziest and stupidest character in the entire series. Compared to other emperors Freeza has it easy. Most of the time they have to find some ancient artifact, build a super weapon, or other complicated task in order to remain in power. All Freeza had to do was train every now and then. If Freeza is at least 100 years old then four months would've been less than 0.5% of his lifespan. He could even spread those four months worth of training over time and train a week or two every decade.

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