The most satisfying way for YOUR favorite character to perform in the upcoming tournament

[kinisking]

Since I'm over the age of five, I can't say I have a favorite character who I require to have a level of success if the story doesn't call for it.

Well, the great thing about fiction is that it can basically call for anything. This arc could be written in a multitude of ways, so at this moment anything is possible. So, what's wrong with saying our hopes?

[SsjCookie]

I agree that Gohan had the resolve to fight, but I feel like he is missing something. When he first went ss2 he become overly sadistic for a few moments, and when he first use the elder kai ritual he become idk more vegatish. I feel like every time he gets a major upgrade he changes in an unexpected way. The way super has him portrayed now makes him look like a wishy washy mess.

I see nothing wrong with Gohan acting like himself instead of him going OOC to be a badass. That is honestly the biggest problem I have with Gohan when he become powerful. He never acts like himself.

This!!
I always have the feeling he gets to easily overwhelmed by his own power and starts acting all Vegeta like in the fight (remember Cell and Buu saga)
He gets all arrogant and overly confident and eventually loses the fight even despite his superior power.
That's why Future Trunks is my favourite character, he always stays himself and doesn't mess around with his enemy's.
Sadly I don't think he'll appear in the Zeno tournament.

[kinisking]

I agree that Gohan had the resolve to fight, but I feel like he is missing something. When he first went ss2 he become overly sadistic for a few moments, and when he first use the elder kai ritual he become idk more vegatish. I feel like every time he gets a major upgrade he changes in an unexpected way. The way super has him portrayed now makes him look like a wishy washy mess.

I see nothing wrong with Gohan acting like himself instead of him going OOC to be a badass. That is honestly the biggest problem I have with Gohan when he become powerful. He never acts like himself.

This!!
I always have the feeling he gets to easily overwhelmed by his own power and starts acting all Vegeta like in the fight (remember Cell and Buu saga)
He gets all arrogant and overly confident and eventually loses the fight even despite his superior power.
That's why Future Trunks is my favourite character, he always stays himself and doesn't mess around with his enemy's.
Sadly I don't think he'll appear in the Zeno tournament.

At this point it's completely in character. Gohan can get cocky when he fights and that's a fact. Just because he has no reason to be cocky outside of battle doesn't mean it's out of character. I like that he's nice to his allies and rude to his enemies unlike vegeta whos usually an asshole to everyone.

[HeroR]

At this point it's completely in character. Gohan can get cocky when he fights and that's a fact. Just because he has no reason to be cocky outside of battle doesn't mean it's out of character. I like that he's nice to his allies and rude to his enemies unlike vegeta whos usually an asshole to everyone.

It is OOC since Gohan shouldn't become a arrogant, jerkass every time he get a giant power boost. It was okay when he became a Super Saiyan 2 since the same thing happened to Goku when he first went Super Saiyan. Plus he was 9 to 11 years old. There is no excuse for Ultimate Gohan making the same mistake and it would be really, really stupid for Gohan's ego to get in his way again.

[kinisking]

At this point it's completely in character. Gohan can get cocky when he fights and that's a fact. Just because he has no reason to be cocky outside of battle doesn't mean it's out of character. I like that he's nice to his allies and rude to his enemies unlike vegeta whos usually an asshole to everyone.

It is OOC since Gohan shouldn't become a arrogant, jerkass every time he get a giant power boost. It was okay when he became a Super Saiyan 2 since the same thing happened to Goku when he first went Super Saiyan. Plus he was 9 to 11 years old. There is no excuse for Ultimate Gohan making the same mistake and it would be really, really stupid for Gohan's ego to get in his way again.

To me it sounds like you're saying it's out of character just because you don't like it. He's dominating the opponent, why shouldn't he be cocky? Before ssj2 Gohan he was a kid and we didn't really get to see him dominate much opponents so it made sense for him to not have that side of him.

Gohan talking trash doesn't mean he's making a mistake either. You can still talk trash and take the situation seriously like Vegetto and ultimate Gohan himself. It wasn't a case of wanting him to suffer and going against all advice like with ssj2 Gohan. Gohan lost because he lets the kids fight against his better judgment. He was still being cautious.

[HeroR]

To me it sounds like you're saying it's out of character just because you don't like it. He's dominating the opponent, why shouldn't he be cocky? Before ssj2 Gohan he was a kid and we didn't really get to see him dominate much opponents so it made sense for him to not have that side of him.

Gohan talking trash doesn't mean he's making a mistake either. You can still talk trash and take the situation seriously like Vegetto and ultimate Gohan himself. It wasn't a case of wanting him to suffer and going against all advice like with ssj2 Gohan. Gohan lost because he lets the kids fight against his better judgment. He was still being cautious.

It is OOC because Gohan is by default a humble, meek character, who actually has self-esteemed issues even as a teenager. He isn't like Goku who is confident in his power and needs guidance to act, even as late as the Cell Games when he didn't realized that he surpassed his father. He also needed a prep talk from Goku because he felt responsible for letting himself become rusty, while Goku tells him he would be unstoppable if he gets mad. However, the moment he gets a power boost that dominates his enemies, he turns into Vegeta for some reason. Forgivable the first time since the same thing happened to Goku, inexcusable the second since his ultimate form isn't an emotional transformation. He was in his right mind when he clearly wasn't the first time he went Super Saiyan 2.

Gohan has proven that he can't trash talk and get away with it since he let Buu escaped instead of just murdering him. Vegetto is a poor example since he trash talk Buu for a reason, while Gohan just did it to because he felt like it. And Gohan wasn't cautious against Buu since if he was, he would have killed Buu the moment he showed his face again, no ifs or ands about it. Not even Vegeta would make such a mistake, mostly because he would want to kill his opponent himself.

[kinisking]

To me it sounds like you're saying it's out of character just because you don't like it. He's dominating the opponent, why shouldn't he be cocky? Before ssj2 Gohan he was a kid and we didn't really get to see him dominate much opponents so it made sense for him to not have that side of him.

Gohan talking trash doesn't mean he's making a mistake either. You can still talk trash and take the situation seriously like Vegetto and ultimate Gohan himself. It wasn't a case of wanting him to suffer and going against all advice like with ssj2 Gohan. Gohan lost because he lets the kids fight against his better judgment. He was still being cautious.

It is OOC because Gohan is by default a humble, meek character, who actually has self-esteemed issues even as a teenager. He isn't like Goku who is confident in his power and needs guidance to act, even as late as the Cell Games when he didn't realized that he surpassed his father. He also needed a prep talk from Goku because he felt responsible for letting himself become rusty, while Goku tells him he would be unstoppable if he gets mad. However, the moment he gets a power boost that dominates his enemies, he turns into Vegeta for some reason. Forgivable the first time since the same thing happened to Goku, inexcusable the second since his ultimate form isn't an emotional transformation. He was in his right mind when he clearly wasn't the first time he went Super Saiyan 2.

Gohan has proven that he can't trash talk and get away with it since he let Buu escaped instead of just murdering him. Vegetto is a poor example since he trash talk Buu for a reason, while Gohan just did it to because he felt like it. And Gohan wasn't cautious against Buu since if he was, he would have killed Buu the moment he showed his face again, no ifs or ands about it. Not even Vegeta would make such a mistake, mostly because he would want to kill his opponent himself.

Gohan had a right to have self esteem issues at the time. He HAD gotten weaker and he had an asshole like Vegeta to remind him a not so nice way. Who wouldn't feel guilty then? He didn't need any pep talk from Goku but it did help. Unlike Goku and vegeta who are always confident, Gohan's a mix of both. He has times where he's insecure, and times where he's confident. Why would he be in-secure against a guy like boo where he can clearly sense he's stronger than? You can already see that in Gohan before he's in his ultimate form. When training against goten you could see that he prides himself in his own strength and proud that be became a super saiyan so early. You can't just take one aspect of his character and say that's his only characteristic. Gohan's not one dimensional. Tell me, have you ever felt insecure? Have you ever felt confident? Are you only an insecure person and confident person or is it possible to be both depending on the situation.

Also, it isn't strange for Gohan to think he hadn't surpassed his father. It's fucking Goku. The man who was saving the day ever since gohan was a kid and gohan's very own father. Him assuming that has more to do with respect than not being confident. Once gohan started fighting he knew why Goku chose him because he was aware of his own power.

We also don't know if killing Boo would have been so easy. We know Gohan's stronger, but we don't know if he was strong enough to just blast him without softening him up first. Even beerus, that wanted to kill boo wasn't able to with a ki blast.

Gohan hasn't truly needed emotional guidance from Goku during the cell saga. Even then, it was a unique situation where even Vegeta had given up. Gohan took the initiative a lot of times in the saiyan saga, boo saga, ROF, and BOG.


Vegeta wouldn't make a mistake like that? So what happened against Freeza was out of character?

[sintzu]

I want each of the non Goku and Vegeta fighters to get 1 main win and for Goku and Vegeta to get 3 each at least.

[HeroR]

Gohan had a right to have self esteem issues at the time. He HAD gotten weaker and he had an asshole like Vegeta to remind him a not so nice way. Who wouldn't feel guilty then? He didn't need any pep talk from Goku but it did help. Unlike Goku and vegeta who are always confident, Gohan's a mix of both. He has times where he's insecure, and times where he's confident. Why would he be in-secure against a guy like boo where he can clearly sense he's stronger than? You can already see that in Gohan before he's in his ultimate form. When training against goten you could see that he prides himself in his own strength and proud that be became a super saiyan so early. You can't just take one aspect of his character and say that's his only characteristic. Gohan's not one dimensional. Tell me, have you ever felt insecure? Have you ever felt confident? Are you only an insecure person and confident person or is it possible to be both depending on the situation.

Also, it isn't strange for Gohan to think he hadn't surpassed his father. It's fucking Goku. The man who was saving the day ever since gohan was a kid and gohan's very own father. Him assuming that has more to do with respect than not being confident. Once gohan started fighting he knew why Goku chose him because he was aware of his own power.

We also don't know if killing Boo would have been so easy. We know Gohan's stronger, but we don't know if he was strong enough to just blast him without softening him up first. Even beerus, that wanted to kill boo wasn't able to with a ki blast.

Gohan hasn't truly needed emotional guidance from Goku during the cell saga. Even then, it was a unique situation where even Vegeta had given up. Gohan took the initiative a lot of times in the saiyan saga, boo saga, ROF, and BOG.


Vegeta wouldn't make a mistake like that? So what happened against Freeza was out of character?

Gohan always had self-esteem issues. It wasn't just in the Buu Saga where Vegeta tore him a new one. The only times Gohan has shown 'self-confidence' is when he became a berserker as a Super Saiyan 2, where he clearly wasn't in his right mind, and Ultimate Gohan, where he should feel confidence, but then he went straight Vegeta for no real reason. What he did to Ginyu in Super is closer to how Gohan should act. He was confidence, but he wasn't arrogance that made him want to spare Ginyu. With Goten, he felt confidence because he was about to spar with a seven years old boy who he didn't think could become a Super Saiyan. There is simply no excuse for what he did against Buu. Piccolo warned him that something wasn't right, but instead of heeding his mentors warnings, he let Goten and Trunks do what they want because, 'Hey, I'm powerful. Buu can't hurt me'. You would think after his arrogance got his father killed that he would be more careful about playing with his food.

Dude, I have suffered with self-esteem issues all my life and if I do act self-confidence, it's mostly to hide that I have low self-esteem. I don't go from being having low self-esteem to arrogant. Most people don't. If Gohan's sudden self-confidence was a shield to hide how insecure he felt, like Vegeta who definitely had an inferiority-superiority complex, or even Krillin when he was a child whose bouts of arrogance was to hide how weak he felt, then it becomes believable for Gohan to swing between talking low about himself and thinking he's hot shit.

Thing is, even when Gohan became aware of his power he didn't know how to access it even when his family was being beating to a pulp by Cell Jrs. And he still needed guidance in the sense that Goku had to pat him on the back and tell him he could defeat Dabura if he got mad enough.

[kinisking]

Gohan had a right to have self esteem issues at the time. He HAD gotten weaker and he had an asshole like Vegeta to remind him a not so nice way. Who wouldn't feel guilty then? He didn't need any pep talk from Goku but it did help. Unlike Goku and vegeta who are always confident, Gohan's a mix of both. He has times where he's insecure, and times where he's confident. Why would he be in-secure against a guy like boo where he can clearly sense he's stronger than? You can already see that in Gohan before he's in his ultimate form. When training against goten you could see that he prides himself in his own strength and proud that be became a super saiyan so early. You can't just take one aspect of his character and say that's his only characteristic. Gohan's not one dimensional. Tell me, have you ever felt insecure? Have you ever felt confident? Are you only an insecure person and confident person or is it possible to be both depending on the situation.

Also, it isn't strange for Gohan to think he hadn't surpassed his father. It's fucking Goku. The man who was saving the day ever since gohan was a kid and gohan's very own father. Him assuming that has more to do with respect than not being confident. Once gohan started fighting he knew why Goku chose him because he was aware of his own power.

We also don't know if killing Boo would have been so easy. We know Gohan's stronger, but we don't know if he was strong enough to just blast him without softening him up first. Even beerus, that wanted to kill boo wasn't able to with a ki blast.

Gohan hasn't truly needed emotional guidance from Goku during the cell saga. Even then, it was a unique situation where even Vegeta had given up. Gohan took the initiative a lot of times in the saiyan saga, boo saga, ROF, and BOG.


Vegeta wouldn't make a mistake like that? So what happened against Freeza was out of character?

Gohan always had self-esteem issues. It wasn't just in the Buu Saga where Vegeta tore him a new one. The only times Gohan has shown 'self-confidence' is when he became a berserker as a Super Saiyan 2, where he clearly wasn't in his right mind, and Ultimate Gohan, where he should feel confidence, but then he went straight Vegeta for no real reason. What he did to Ginyu in Super is closer to how Gohan should act. He was confidence, but he wasn't arrogance that made him want to spare Ginyu. With Goten, he felt confidence because he was about to spar with a seven years old boy who he didn't think could become a Super Saiyan. There is simply no excuse for what he did against Buu. Piccolo warned him that something wasn't right, but instead of heeding his mentors warnings, he let Goten and Trunks do what they want because, 'Hey, I'm powerful. Buu can't hurt me'. You would think after his arrogance got his father killed that he would be more careful about playing with his food.

Dude, I have suffered with self-esteem issues all my life and if I do act self-confidence, it's mostly to hide that I have low self-esteem. I don't go from being having low self-esteem to arrogant. Most people don't. If Gohan's sudden self-confidence was a shield to hide how insecure he felt, like Vegeta who definitely had an inferiority-superiority complex, then it becomes believable for Gohan to swing between talking low about himself and thinking he's hot shit.

Thing is, even when Gohan became aware of his power he didn't know how to access it even when his family was being beating to a pulp by Cell Jrs. And he still needed guidance in the sense that Goku had to pat him on the back and tell him he could defeat Dabura if he got mad enough.

That's the thing though, gohans a realistic character. He isn't a generally insecure person, just when the situation calls for it. Every time he feels insecure it's because he has a reason to feel insecure. Every time he feels confident he has a right to feel confident. He isn't just one or the other. Gohan was confident in BoG and RoF too as you point out. I'm not denying that he's had insecure moments but it's not like that's his default personality. Also,as he ages he gets more confident just like a regular person. Also that seems like a huge jump to assume that Gohan was cocky by letting Gotenks fight. I'm pretty sure he even told them to be careful. Gohan was letting the younger generation fight just like Goku had done for him. Saying it's his fault is like blaming Goku for what happened against cell.

Well that answer want the same that I was expecting, my bad man. I'm sorry you feel that way.

Gohan knew how to access it, he knew he needed to get angry. Emotions aren't an on and off button. Again, Gohan didn't need that at all. Gohan was almost definitely aware of it himself. Gohan himself almost definitely was aware of that himself. He thought Dabura was running away and he didn't object to what Goku said. He also said he'll be back before Goku said which implied that he was confident in winning. Goku was just being a good father for once.

[SsjCookie]

Thing is, even when Gohan became aware of his power he didn't know how to access it

That's Because he's not a naturally talented fighter like Goku.
He has perhaps the most inherited potential of all the (half)Saiyans around, but he's definitely not the best fighter.
He's better off doing his own thing (whatever that may be)

[HeroR]

That's the thing though, gohans a realistic character. He isn't a generally insecure person, just when the situation calls for it. Every time he feels insecure it's because he has a reason to feel insecure. Every time he feels confident he has a right to feel confident. He isn't just one or the other. Gohan was confident in BoG and RoF too as you point out. I'm not denying that he's had insecure moments but it's not like that's his default personality. Also,as he ages he gets more confident just like a regular person. Also that seems like a huge jump to assume that Gohan was cocky by letting Gotenks fight. I'm pretty sure he even told them to be careful. Gohan was letting the younger generation fight just like Goku had done for him. Saying it's his fault is like blaming Goku for what happened against cell.

Well that answer want the same that I was expecting, my bad man. I'm sorry you feel that way.

Gohan knew how to access it, he knew he needed to get angry. Emotions aren't an on and off button. Again, Gohan didn't need that at all. Gohan was almost definitely aware of it himself. Gohan himself almost definitely was aware of that himself. He thought Dabura was running away and he didn't object to what Goku said. He also said he'll be back before Goku said which implied that he was confident in winning. Goku was just being a good father for once.

Gohan really isn't a realistic person for the reasons I named. Most people don't go from meek and having confident issues, to thinking they are the best thing ever, especially after having the humbling experience Super Saiyan 2 Gohan had. This isn't about Gohan gaining self-confident when he becomes powerful. The problem is he goes from one extreme to the next. He goes from having self-doubt to having an ego that can rival Vegeta. It comes off as off-balance at best and OOC at worst.

Gohan didn't really show confident in BOG. He saw him try to attack Beerus after he took down several of his friends and get wrack. He was determine, but not self-confident. In Resurrection 'F', both the movie and series, he wasn't really self-confident since he knew he was out of shape and he knew good and well he couldn't take Freeza. If you used the dub, he actually says to Bulma after she asked if he could take down Freeza, 'I can take care of his men, maybe'. That isn't self-confidence. He only acted assured in Super with dealing with Ginyu, and that wasn't from a place of arrogant.

He was being arrogant for letting Gotenks fight, because he only allowed it to happened because he was sure that even if Gotenks messed up, he could just step in and waste Buu. This is despite Piccolo saying that something was wrong. Gohan didn't let Gotenks fight to let the next generation get a shot. He did it because he was arrogant in his power and thought he could afford to humor Buu. The Goku comparison doesn't work because Goku couldn't beat Cell no matter what he did, so he had no choice but to rely on Gohan.

Gohan wasn't confident in his ability to deal with Dabura after the tongue-lashing Vegeta gave him. He even mourns to himself that he probably should have let Goku or Vegeta handle Dabura.

[TekTheNinja]

Dude... You're obsessed. Zamasu's gone. His arc's over and he's dead. Completely. For good. Gone. Sorry to say, bro.

We say this to all the Gohan fans (including me) and yet we're still going .

Gohan is a different case entirely. Gohan was basically Z's main character and has been relegated to a tertiary character at best. Zamasu was a villain an arc ago who was defeated and had his plot wrapped up. It would be like Frieza coming back for no reason. ...Oh wait. Super did that. -_-

[namekiansaiyan]

I want each of the non Goku and Vegeta fighters to get 1 main win and for Goku and Vegeta to get 3 each at least.

They will all probably get more than that.

My prediction is that Goku will not win the most simply becuase I believe not everyone will have the same amount of matches and that Beerus will hold Goku back for the most important fights which he will win.

I expect Vegeta and Piccolo to have the most battles and wins as I think Toriyama will most likely be able to use them in more situations.

I then expect Gohan, Krillin and Tien to be about the same
With Roshi,17, 18 and Buu to have the least but still quite a few.

Thing is, even when Gohan became aware of his power he didn't know how to access it

That's Because he's not a naturally talented fighter like Goku.
He has perhaps the most inherited potential of all the (half)Saiyans around, but he's definitely not the best fighter.
He's better off doing his own thing (whatever that may be)

He is the least skillful fight on team Universe 7.

[Ki Breaker]

He is the least skillful fight on team Universe 7.

That's absolutely false, you are trying to say 17 & 18 who are regular teenage punks and possess jackshit martial arts knowledge and majin buu who literally flies face first in and shows no skill not related to his body other than replicate techniques are all more skilled than gohan who has been trained by goku and was taught everything he had learned up to that point..

Gohan gets too much crap for his screw ups when Vegeta consistently screws up far more..

[kinisking]

He is the least skillful fight on team Universe 7.

That's absolutely false, you are trying to say 17 & 18 who are regular teenage punks and possess jackshit martial arts knowledge and majin buu who literally flies face first in and shows no skill not related to his body other than replicate techniques are all more skilled than gohan who has been trained by goku and was taught everything he had learned up to that point..

Gohan gets too much crap for his screw ups when Vegeta consistently screws up far more..

Exactly. They'res no way that 18 or 17 who haven't trained a day in their life are more skilled.

[SsjCookie]

He is the least skillful fight on team Universe 7.

That's absolutely false, you are trying to say 17 & 18 who are regular teenage punks and possess jackshit martial arts knowledge and majin buu who literally flies face first in and shows no skill not related to his body other than replicate techniques are all more skilled than gohan who has been trained by goku and was taught everything he had learned up to that point..

Gohan gets too much crap for his screw ups when Vegeta consistently screws up far more..

Exactly. They'res no way that 18 or 17 who haven't trained a day in their life are more skilled.

Don't forget that 17 and 18 are androids and that they are programmed to fight.
Where they are now on their power scale still remains to be seen.
Gohan is still stronger than 18 though, but he's very VERY rusty.

[kinisking]

That's absolutely false, you are trying to say 17 & 18 who are regular teenage punks and possess jackshit martial arts knowledge and majin buu who literally flies face first in and shows no skill not related to his body other than replicate techniques are all more skilled than gohan who has been trained by goku and was taught everything he had learned up to that point..

Gohan gets too much crap for his screw ups when Vegeta consistently screws up far more..

Exactly. They'res no way that 18 or 17 who haven't trained a day in their life are more skilled.

Don't forget that 17 and 18 are androids and that they are programmed to fight.
Where they are now on their power scale still remains to be seen.
Gohan is still stronger than 18 though, but he's very VERY rusty.

Was their fighting style programmed? I doubt it. Also, we don't know if gohan's been training with Piccolo or not.

[Ki Breaker]

That's absolutely false, you are trying to say 17 & 18 who are regular teenage punks and possess jackshit martial arts knowledge and majin buu who literally flies face first in and shows no skill not related to his body other than replicate techniques are all more skilled than gohan who has been trained by goku and was taught everything he had learned up to that point..

Gohan gets too much crap for his screw ups when Vegeta consistently screws up far more..

Exactly. They'res no way that 18 or 17 who haven't trained a day in their life are more skilled.

Don't forget that 17 and 18 are androids and that they are programmed to fight.
Where they are now on their power scale still remains to be seen.
Gohan is still stronger than 18 though, but he's very VERY rusty.

Nowhere is it stated they are programmed to fight..
All we know us they are enhanced humans who have infinite energy..

[Alee9977]

For this arc, I expect Gohan to win at least one fight, but after this arc I hope to see him fighting against future villains and training and getting stronger and all of that, the same I feel with Piccolo.