Marlowe89 wrote:When did I imply otherwise? I just said that the blue aura probably represents God ki and that Goku and Vegeta were learning to tap into more of its power than just the fractions they already possessed. There's little to no evidence that base Goku/Vegeta are as strong as SSG.
Obviously SSB is stronger than SSG because it's a combination of SS and SSG's full power, I'm not denying that at all.
I agree but to be honest Both Vegeta and Goku had power on par wit ssg(but not divine ki so they could be sensed) just after training with whis(Goku post ssg power) and until they tapped into ssb and they looked like in base but it was only to fool us as it may be not official but I believe "Saiyan beyond god" state would be their temporary form after ssg until it reached new transformation ssb.
Marlowe89 wrote:
He just said that Goku is able to access SSG's power, which is true. There was no specification towards power amount or being as strong as SSG in base in that statement.
Correct, that why Saiyan beyond god state was introduced to be later replaced by ssb
RoF shows SSG Goku behind Base Goku as he fights Whis.
Only because Akira wanted to show that Base goku and Base Vegeta being around equal were as strong as ssg while being in temporary state called Saiyan beyond god which latter was replaced by ssb
Whis - 15
Beerus (100%) - 10
SSJB Goku - 7.5
Beerus (70%) - 7
BoG SSJ Goku - 6
SSJG (80%) - 5.6
RoF Goku - 0.15
BoG Goku - 0.12
Mixing a bit of BoG and Super, off course, but the end result is that BoG Goku is allowed to mutliply his power with a range that goes from 1x to before 50x. So, RoF Goku and Vegeta are allowed to match a SSJG (100%) by using a multiplier of 46.666... times their power at base. SSJB is still a multiplier of 50x, and the transformation is blue when they surpass a certain threshold of power. In every other moment, they could transform from a suppressed state, but this is only my opinion.
Whis - 15
Beerus (100%) - 10
SSJB Goku - 7.5
Beerus (70%) - 7
BoG SSJ Goku - 6
SSJG (80%) - 5.6
RoF Goku - 0.15
BoG Goku - 0.12
Mixing a bit of BoG and Super, off course, but the end result is that BoG Goku is allowed to mutliply his power with a range that goes from 1x to before 50x. So, RoF Goku and Vegeta are allowed to match a SSJG (100%) by using a multiplier of 46.666... times their power at base. SSJB is still a multiplier of 50x, and the transformation is blue when they surpass a certain threshold of power. In every other moment, they could transform from a suppressed state, but this is only my opinion.
Too be honest I don't see ssb as more multiplier then 8. Unless ssj is ignored then base->ssb would be x400 multiplier(8x50)
Whis - 15
Beerus (100%) - 10
SSJB Goku - 7.5
Beerus (70%) - 7
BoG SSJ Goku - 6
SSJG (80%) - 5.6
RoF Goku - 0.15
BoG Goku - 0.12
Mixing a bit of BoG and Super, off course, but the end result is that BoG Goku is allowed to mutliply his power with a range that goes from 1x to before 50x. So, RoF Goku and Vegeta are allowed to match a SSJG (100%) by using a multiplier of 46.666... times their power at base. SSJB is still a multiplier of 50x, and the transformation is blue when they surpass a certain threshold of power. In every other moment, they could transform from a suppressed state, but this is only my opinion.
Hmm. Not a bad theory at all.
Spoiler:
Akira Toriyama wrote:My policy is to try and forget things once they’re over. Since if I don’t discard the old and focus on what’s new, I’ll overload my brain capacity. I still haven’t lived down going, “Who the heck is Tao Pai-pai?” that one time I was talking with Ei’ichiro Oda-kun. But the fact that there are still people reading the series after all this time… All I can say is; “thank you.” Really, that’s all.
Akira Toriyama wrote:Drawing Dragon Ball again reminded me of two things--how much I love it, and how much I never want to do it again.
Kunzait_83 wrote:And if you're upset because all this new material completely invalidates the tabletop RPG rulebook-sized statistical system and flowchart for the characters' "canonical Power Levels" that you'd been working on painstakingly for the last bunch of years now... well I don't think there's a kind, non-blunt way of saying this, but that's 100% entirely your own misguided fault for buying so deeply into all this nonsensical garbage in the first place. And that you also have IMMENSELY skewed and comically backwards priorities in what you think is most important and needed to make a good Dragon Ball story.
Zephyr wrote:Goodness, they wrote idiotic drivel in a children's cartoon meant to advertise toys!? Again!? For the ninetieth episode in a row!? Somebody stop the presses! We have to voice our concern over these Super important issues!
Kamiccolo9 wrote:Fair enough, I concede. Sean Schemmel probably has some kind of hidden talent. Maybe he is an expert at Minesweeper. You're right; calling him "talentless" wasn't fair.
Michsi wrote: Mon Jul 04, 2022 11:29 amIn Super Piccolo got yelled off the stage by Vegeta in the U6 Tournament arc and lost to Jiminy Cricket in the ToP , he deserved 15 new transformations with his theme song played by Metallica in the background.
A SS3 cabba will be barely stronger than SS vegeta IMO.
The gap between SS vegeta (not even going allout) vs Cabba was big enough to tank a punch without flinching
A SS3 cabba will be barely stronger than SS vegeta IMO.
The gap between SS vegeta (not even going allout) vs Cabba was big enough to tank a punch without flinching
I agree, i have them on similar levels.
Jk, fuck pl
Last edited by Kuririn Fan on Thu Apr 14, 2016 11:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
OK, Time for my initial numbers list: (No "official" multipliers)
1 unit = 1 cell jr
(Will be improved after next Ep)
BATTLE OF GODS
Piccolo (FP) - 2
Spoiler:
Vegeta - 4 , SS2 - 10, FP SS2 - 20
#18 - 0.28
Fat Buu - 12
GOKU - 0.1 , 4 , 10 , 60
Gohan - 30 (Full power, weakened due to slacking)
Gotenks - base 8 , SS 20 = buu arc goku , SS3 45 = buu arc gohan
Beerus - 150 (suppressed)
Rageta - 150 (lolWUT? Too much of a boost)
Beerus (10%) - 800
Goku (everyone's power) - 250
SSG Goku - 3000 , increasing power - 5000
Beerus (80%) - 6400
Beerus (100%) - 8000
Goku SSG, FP - 7,300
Spoiler:
SS goku - 6800 , base goku - 200
SS goku (Battle worn) - 6000 , beerus energy ball - 6900
Base goku (spiked up to SSG level) - 7200
(Note: It is important to note that beerus was lying about his power % in this battle)
REVIVAL OF FREEZA
Tagoma - 5 (suppressed) , Ginyu - 6
Gohan - 2.4 (base) , 18 (SS)
Piccolo - 2 (weights) 4.5 (Hypothetical unweighted)
Freeza - 35 , Final form - 490
Spoiler:
Second form - 100
Third form - 200
Final form - 490
Goku = Vegeta = 480
(Note: Freeza was stronger of the two, but he wasn't fighting seriously, they both were just playing around. This also fits with Freeza > Base saiyans)
Super Saiyan Blue Goku = Vegeta = 10,000 , battle worn = 9000
Golden Freeza = 11,800 , Tired = 8000
Beerus (likey suppressed) = 15000
TOURNAMENT
Base goku (10%) - 49 , 50% - 245, FP 490
Frost assault form - 460 , Final form - 600 , Worn out - 200
SS goku - 2500 (suppressed) , 6000 (FP) , 12000 (SSB)
Piccolo - 10 , Makankosappo - 1000
Cabba - 475, SS - 2000
HIT - 2000 (Suppressed)
Last edited by apex_pretador on Thu Apr 14, 2016 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Hugo Boss wrote:Beerus was lying about using 100% against Goku, but why you think he was lying about using 10% against Vegeta?
Freeza wasn't fighting seriously due to hiding his golden form. He wasn't hiding strength in his final form.
- Goku didn't seem to have a hard time beileve that he's 10% now, and if he was not lying about 10% , then goku'd have realized that he's at like 40-50% only. He must be 10x of what he was bragging about being 10%.
I agree that he wasn't fighting seriously due to his golden form, but remember that he didn't want to show his golden form till he finds goku worthy for that? And he didn't consider base goku worthy for that. Add in the line of narrator goku surpassing freeza as SSB + Freeza > Base saiyans in BoG (I believe that's an implication of freeza can be beaten by transforming only - see frost)
I recal Beerus only told Whis about using 10% against Vegeta. None besides Whis heard that.
Goku complained Freeza was giving more of the same when his Super Saiyan Blue was tested. They were pretty much even before then, which explains why the narrator said Goku surpassed Freeza after transforming. It's still a valid implication.
Hugo Boss wrote:I recal Beerus only told Whis about using 10% against Vegeta. None besides Whis heard that.
Goku complained Freeza was giving more of the same when his Super Saiyan Blue was tested. They were pretty much even before then, which explains why the narrator said Goku surpassed Freeza after transforming. It's still a valid implication.
I really don't know how to interpret the 10% line, but rageta should be below the goku who absorbed everyone's ki, who is nowhere near initial SSG goku, who's nowhere near SSG goku (FP), who's nowhere near SSB, who's nothing to FP beerus.
Also, the statement is really vague, not clear if beerus was forced or not, to use 10% of his power.
Actually, he didn't say he used exactly 10%, but he implied he didn't use anywhere near 10% for quite a long time. You can argue he used like 9% and that's fine. You still have 91 different percentages to work with.
Zombie wrote:So how much power do you guys think Frost lost after fighting Goku?
20%, 25% tops. Goku wasn't laying on him hard, advising him to concede. I'm leaning on him having difficulty regulating his power consumption in his Final Form. He said, he wasn't used to the form. Leaving him to leak power at a higher rate than usual.
