Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[LightBing]

Just because Goku predicted Vegetto probably wouldn't be enough to defeat Beerus, doesn't mean the latter used that kind of power to subdued him. Goku guessed that was the realm of the God of Destruction; before fighting Cell he did kinda the same. Rage Vegeta, is only guaranteed to be stronger than SSJ 3 Goku not Vegetto. In fact the 10% line gives space to insert a SSJ3 Vegetto, if we assume that's what Goku was thinking.

Beerus - 10
SSJG - 6 (Goku thought he had a chance of winning before Beerus said he was at 70%, meaning SSJG is stronger than hypothetical SSJ3 Vegetto, if that was what Goku was thinking.
SSJ3 Vegetto - 5,75
SSJ1 Vegetto - 1,75
Vegeta - 0,77

[Sora Saiyan]

My power level list for the characters is as follows.

Whis - 15

Beerus - 10

God Goku 6

SSJ3 Vegetto - 5

SSJ2 Vegetto - 1.25

Beerus 10% - 1

SSJ Vegetto. 0.625
Goku realised that Beerus was too much for Vegetto. Considering Beerus was even more surpressed than he was against Vegeta it means Vegetto has to be below 10% Beerus to me.

Enraged Vegeta - 0.2-0.3
Vegeta couldn't draw any blood from Beerus, or cause any real damage. When characters who have held a 2x-3x advantage over their opponent allow themselves to be hit it usually causes noticeable damage. Vegeta was one shotted once Beerus decided to hit him back. Very, very casually at that. I do believe Beerus was allowing himself to be knocked around by Vegeta aswell.

Ultimate Gohan - 0.02
Yep, I give Vegeta a 10-15x boost over Ultimate Gohan. To go a bit deeper I have Gohan 15-20x over SSJ3 Goku Z. So unless Gokus gotten a lot stronger he's not worth putting on this list, and I don't know if he has. Id like to think he's closed the gap between him and Gohan a bit.

Base Vegetto - 0.0125. I used to have base Vegetto equal to Ultimate Gohan, but for that to work Vegeta would need to be like 20x Ultimate Gohan IMO. With Gokus comments about him
not knowing a world like SSJG could exist, and Goku knowing Vegetto couldn't beat Beerus after Beerus had shown him below 10% of his power, and a hell of a lot lower IMO, I just can't put Vegetto any higher when using the SSJ multipliers.

The powers are getting stupid, I'm just glad I don't follow base Gotenks being above SSJ3 Goku. The SSJ multipliers are a bastard to fit in this list. It makes everything worlds apart.
This list might seem stupid to some, but I'm trying to stick with what I believe from the manga. Infect the list would be much easier if I put everybody besides Vegeta, Godku, Beerus and Whis lower, but I didn't want to put Vegeta to far above Ultimate Gohan. Putting Vegeta above Vegetto didn't seem logical to me either, even though it would've been the easier thing to do.

[Doctor.]

How is SS3 Vegetto a 5,75? If you go by the official multipliers, he's a 14 by your numbers. Vegeta has to be stronger than SS Vegetto at the very least.

Spoiler:

Vegeta: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- Enraged SS2: 80,000

Goku: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- SS3: 2,000

Fat Boo: 1,700
Grey Boo: 1,020
Mr. Boo: 680

Kid Boo: 2,050

Gotenks: 400
-- SS: 2,000
-- SS2: 4,000
-- SS3: 16,000

Ultimate Gohan: 22,000

Super Boo: 14,000
-- Gotenks Absorbed: 30,000
-- Gohan Absorbed: 36,000

Vegetto: 900
-- SS: 45,000
-- SS2: 90,000
-- SS3: 360,000

SSG - 600,000
-- 80% - 480,000

Beerus - 1,000,000
-- 70% - 700,000
-- 10% - 100,000

Whis - 1,500,000

[Birusu16]

My power level list for the characters is as follows.

Whis - 15

Beerus - 10

God Goku 6

SSJ3 Vegetto - 5

SSJ2 Vegetto - 1.25

Beerus 10% - 1

SSJ Vegetto. 0.625
Goku realised that Beerus was too much for Vegetto. Considering Beerus was even more surpressed than he was against Vegeta it means Vegetto has to be below 10% Beerus to me.

Enraged Vegeta - 0.2-0.3
Vegeta couldn't draw any blood from Beerus, or cause any real damage. When characters who have held a 2x-3x advantage over their opponent allow themselves to be hit it usually causes noticeable damage. Vegeta was one shotted once Beerus decided to hit him back. Very, very casually at that. I do believe Beerus was allowing himself to be knocked around by Vegeta aswell.

Ultimate Gohan - 0.02-0.03
Yep, I give Vegeta a 10x boost over Ultimate Gohan. To go a bit deeper I have Gohan 15-20x over SSJ3 Goku Z. So unless Gokus gotten a lot stronger he's not worth putting on this list, and I don't know if he has. Id like to think he's closed the gap between him and Gohan a bit.

Base Vegetto - 0.0125. I used to have base Vegetto equal to Ultimate Gohan, but for that to work Vegeta would need to be like 20x Ultimate Gohan IMO. With Gokus comments about him
not knowing a world like SSJG could exist, and Goku knowing Vegetto couldn't beat Beerus after Beerus had shown him below 10% of his power, and a hell of a lot lower IMO, I just can't put Vegetto any higher when using the SSJ multipliers.

The powers are getting stupid, I'm just glad I don't follow base Gotenks being above SSJ3 Goku. The SSJ multipliers are a bastard to fit in this list. It makes everything worlds apart.
This list might seem stupid to some, but I'm trying to stick with what I believe from the manga. Infect the list would be much easier if I put everybody besides Vegeta, Godku, Beerus and Whis lower, but I didn't want to put Vegeta to far above Ultimate Gohan. Putting Vegeta above Vegetto didn't seem logical to me either, even though it would've been the easier thing to do.

Well then shouldn't you have Vegeta above Vegetto? Vegeta forced Beerus to use 10%. Goku thought a Beerus using an even lower percentage was too much for Vegetto.

[SaiyanGod117]

Here's what I think I really don't feel like going into detail so I won't.
Whis:15
Beerus:10
Golden Frieza: 8.5 or 8
SSGSS: 8 or 7.5
SSG: 6
Vegito SSJ3: Way below SSG
I don't care about the 10% statement, it could have been a mistranslation and, if it wasn't I still won't believe it.

[Sora Saiyan]

I really want too, Birisu16. If I do then I'll drop Ultimate Gohan and Vegetto really low down the list and then the list will look ridiculous to a lot of people, including myself. Even though it's probably more accurate to me.

The lower part will look like this.
SSJ3 Vegetto 1.2
SSJ2 Vegetto- 0.3
Vegeta -0.3
SSJ Vegetto- 0.15
Gohan- 0.0048
It looks a bit low for Vegetto.

[Chiki]

Edit: poor translation. Kanzenshuu said he used 10%, not 1%.

So, that would make SSJ2 Vegeta around a 1 if Goku is a 6 and Beerus is a 10. SSJ3 Goku is probably around a 0.5. Base Goku is 0.5/400 so Base Goku going SSG gives him a x4800 power boost. Around a x5000 power boost then, and x100 more powerful than a Super Saiyan. Only x12 more powerful than SSJ3 Goku. In other words, Beerus is only 20x more powerful than SSJ3 Goku.

I'm glad this makes the power levels more realistic, but this proves that SSJ3 Vegito could probably take on Beerus, probably even defeat him.

[LightBing]

How is SS3 Vegetto a 5,75? If you go by the official multipliers, he's a 14 by your numbers. Vegeta has to be stronger than SS Vegetto at the very least.

Spoiler:

Vegeta: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- Enraged SS2: 80,000

Goku: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- SS3: 2,000

Fat Boo: 1,700
Grey Boo: 1,020
Mr. Boo: 680

Kid Boo: 2,050

Gotenks: 400
-- SS: 2,000
-- SS2: 4,000
-- SS3: 16,000

Ultimate Gohan: 22,000

Super Boo: 14,000
-- Gotenks Absorbed: 30,000
-- Gohan Absorbed: 36,000

Vegetto: 900
-- SS: 45,000
-- SS2: 90,000
-- SS3: 360,000

SSG - 600,000
-- 80% - 480,000

Beerus - 1,000,000
-- 70% - 700,000

Whis - 1,500,000

He's 5,75 because I'm stupid. My own multipliers( I don't use official sources) don't fit. Trying to find logic in this insanity is hard... I'll refrain from using numbers until the BoG arc is done. We could have more % talk until the end of it.

[ZombieVito]

Whis: 15
Beerus: 10
SSG Goku: 6
SSJ3 Vegetto: 3.60
SSJ2 Vegetto: 0.90
Rageta: 0.60
SSJ Vegetto: 0.45
Buuhan: 0.15
Gohan: 0.09
SSJ3 Gotenks: 0.072
SSJ3 Goku: 0.036

This is what I'm rolling with at the moment.

[Chiki]

Whis: 15
Beerus: 10
SSG Goku: 6
SSJ3 Vegetto: 3.60
SSJ2 Vegetto: 0.90
Rageta: 0.60
SSJ Vegetto: 0.45
Buuhan: 0.15
Gohan: 0.09
SSJ3 Gotenks: 0.72
SSJ3 Goku: 0.36

This is what I'm rolling with at the moment.

There's no way SSJ Vegito is only 0.09 above SSJ3 Goku. The gap between SSJ3 Goku and SSJ Vegito is massive. Let's say SSJ3 Goku is a 1, Ultimate Gohan is a 1.5 and Super Buu is a 1.2. Buuhan, who absorbed Gohan's power would be around 2.5. SSJ Vegito should be a lot more powerful than Buuhan, so about 5-7.5. So Vegito is at least 5 times as powerful as SSJ3 Goku.

If SSJ Vegito is x5 SSJ3 Goku, so that SSJ Vegito is around 2 or a 2.5, then an SSJ2 boost will make him between 4 or 5 since an SSJ2 is x2 more powerful than SSJ. SSJ3 is x4 over that, so Vegito is a 16 or a 20.. easily defeating Whis. .______.

The only way to explain this is if as MaGyunia said, SSJ boosts don't increase your power level as much if your base power level is at a certain point.

Beerus using 10% kinda messed all the power levels up, because now Vegito has a chance at beating Beerus and even Whis.

[ZombieVito]

Forgot a 0 for Goku and Gotenks.

[SaiyanGod117]

Whis: 15
Beerus: 10
SSG Goku: 6
SSJ3 Vegetto: 3.60
SSJ2 Vegetto: 0.90
Rageta: 0.60
SSJ Vegetto: 0.45
Buuhan: 0.15
Gohan: 0.09
SSJ3 Gotenks: 0.72
SSJ3 Goku: 0.36

This is what I'm rolling with at the moment.

There's no way SSJ Vegito is only 0.09 above SSJ3 Goku. The gap between SSJ3 Goku and SSJ Vegito is massive. Let's say SSJ3 Goku is a 1, Ultimate Gohan is a 1.5 and Super Buu is a 1.2. Buuhan, who absorbed Gohan's power would be around 2.5. SSJ Vegito should be a lot more powerful than Buuhan, so about 5-7.5. So Vegito is at least 5 times as powerful as SSJ3 Goku.

If SSJ Vegito is x5 SSJ3 Goku, so that SSJ Vegito is around 2 or a 2.5, then an SSJ2 boost will make him between 4 or 5 since an SSJ2 is x2 more powerful than SSJ. SSJ3 is x4 over that, so Vegito is a 16 or a 20.. easily defeating Whis. .______.

The only way to explain this is if as MaGyunia said, SSJ boosts don't increase your power level as much if your base power level is at a certain point.

Beerus using 10% kinda messed all the power levels up, because now Vegito has a chance at beating Beerus and even Whis.

Vegito beating Beerus and Whis seriously doubt that he can't even beat SSG Goku.

[Birusu16]

Whis - 15
Beerus - 10
Golden Freeza - 8
SSGSS Goku - 7
SSGSS Vegeta - 7
SSG Goku - 6
SSJ3 Vegetto - 5
SSJ2 Vegetto - 1.50
Beerus 10% - 1
Enraged Vegeta - 0.70
SSJ Vegetto - 0.50-0.60

Something like that anyway

Edit: Vegetto still isn't touching Beerus or Whis.

[Chiki]

Whis: 15
Beerus: 10
SSG Goku: 6
SSJ3 Vegetto: 3.60
SSJ2 Vegetto: 0.90
Rageta: 0.60
SSJ Vegetto: 0.45
Buuhan: 0.15
Gohan: 0.09
SSJ3 Gotenks: 0.72
SSJ3 Goku: 0.36

This is what I'm rolling with at the moment.

There's no way SSJ Vegito is only 0.09 above SSJ3 Goku. The gap between SSJ3 Goku and SSJ Vegito is massive. Let's say SSJ3 Goku is a 1, Ultimate Gohan is a 1.5 and Super Buu is a 1.2. Buuhan, who absorbed Gohan's power would be around 2.5. SSJ Vegito should be a lot more powerful than Buuhan, so about 5-7.5. So Vegito is at least 5 times as powerful as SSJ3 Goku.

If SSJ Vegito is x5 SSJ3 Goku, so that SSJ Vegito is around 2 or a 2.5, then an SSJ2 boost will make him between 4 or 5 since an SSJ2 is x2 more powerful than SSJ. SSJ3 is x4 over that, so Vegito is a 16 or a 20.. easily defeating Whis. .______.

The only way to explain this is if as MaGyunia said, SSJ boosts don't increase your power level as much if your base power level is at a certain point.

Beerus using 10% kinda messed all the power levels up, because now Vegito has a chance at beating Beerus and even Whis.

Vegito beating Beerus and Whis seriously doubt that he can't even beat SSG Goku.

I doubt it too, but that's what follows from the 10% they gave us.

[Doctor.]

I don't know why you guys are making such a big fuss out of this. There's one simple way this can all fit: SS2 Vegeta is stronger than SS Vegetto. That's it, everything else can fit. Just take a look at my list below and you can see. It's stupid that Vegeta got so strong, but that's just how it has to be in order to keep the SSG > Vegetto thing intact.

How is SS3 Vegetto a 5,75? If you go by the official multipliers, he's a 14 by your numbers. Vegeta has to be stronger than SS Vegetto at the very least.

Spoiler:

Vegeta: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- Enraged SS2: 80,000

Goku: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- SS3: 2,000

Fat Boo: 1,700
Grey Boo: 1,020
Mr. Boo: 680

Kid Boo: 2,050

Gotenks: 400
-- SS: 2,000
-- SS2: 4,000
-- SS3: 16,000

Ultimate Gohan: 22,000

Super Boo: 14,000
-- Gotenks Absorbed: 30,000
-- Gohan Absorbed: 36,000

Vegetto: 900
-- SS: 45,000
-- SS2: 90,000
-- SS3: 360,000

SSG - 600,000
-- 80% - 480,000

Beerus - 1,000,000
-- 70% - 700,000
-- 10% - 100,000

Whis - 1,500,000

[LightBing]

The gaps seem enormous but it's standard in Dragon Ball, for comparison:

Raditz arrival
Vegeta - 18
Nappa - 6,8 (personal opinion)
Raditz - 1,2
Goku - 0,41
Piccolo - 0,40
Tenshinhan - 0,25
etc...

[Birusu16]

I don't know why you guys are making such a big fuss out of this. There's one simple way this can all fit: SS2 Vegeta is stronger than SS Vegetto. That's it, everything else can fit. Just take a look at my list below and you can see. It's stupid that Vegeta got so strong, but that's just how it has to be in order to keep the SSG > Vegetto thing intact.

How is SS3 Vegetto a 5,75? If you go by the official multipliers, he's a 14 by your numbers. Vegeta has to be stronger than SS Vegetto at the very least.

Spoiler:

Vegeta: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- Enraged SS2: 80,000

Goku: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- SS3: 2,000

Fat Boo: 1,700
Grey Boo: 1,020
Mr. Boo: 680

Kid Boo: 2,050

Gotenks: 400
-- SS: 2,000
-- SS2: 4,000
-- SS3: 16,000

Ultimate Gohan: 22,000

Super Boo: 14,000
-- Gotenks Absorbed: 30,000
-- Gohan Absorbed: 36,000

Vegetto: 900
-- SS: 45,000
-- SS2: 90,000
-- SS3: 360,000

SSG - 600,000
-- 80% - 480,000

Beerus - 1,000,000
-- 70% - 700,000
-- 10% - 100,000

Whis - 1,500,000

That's pretty much what I've been saying. Just put Vegeta above Vegetto and everything works fine. The problem people have is that it's extremely unrealistic for Vegeta to become that strong through a simple rage boost and so they look for other ways to fit it instead of powering Vegeta up that much, but then again DB never was realistic.

[SaiyanGod117]

I doubt it too, but that's what follows from the 10% they gave us.[/quote]
No it's doesn't you gave SSJ3 Goku a one ,we all know that isn't true cause Beerus beat, SSJ3 Gotenks quite easily.

[Chiki]

I don't know why you guys are making such a big fuss out of this. There's one simple way this can all fit: SS2 Vegeta is stronger than SS Vegetto. That's it, everything else can fit. Just take a look at my list below and you can see. It's stupid that Vegeta got so strong, but that's just how it has to be in order to keep the SSG > Vegetto thing intact.

How is SS3 Vegetto a 5,75? If you go by the official multipliers, he's a 14 by your numbers. Vegeta has to be stronger than SS Vegetto at the very least.

Spoiler:

Vegeta: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- Enraged SS2: 80,000

Goku: 5
-- SS: 250
-- SS2: 500
-- SS3: 2,000

Fat Boo: 1,700
Grey Boo: 1,020
Mr. Boo: 680

Kid Boo: 2,050

Gotenks: 400
-- SS: 2,000
-- SS2: 4,000
-- SS3: 16,000

Ultimate Gohan: 22,000

Super Boo: 14,000
-- Gotenks Absorbed: 30,000
-- Gohan Absorbed: 36,000

Vegetto: 900
-- SS: 45,000
-- SS2: 90,000
-- SS3: 360,000

SSG - 600,000
-- 80% - 480,000

Beerus - 1,000,000
-- 70% - 700,000
-- 10% - 100,000

Whis - 1,500,000

No, it's too unrealistic and stupid. We can't just accept something so unrealistic just to make everything else fit.

We could just accept MaGyunia's explanation that after a certain point, SS powerups increase you by less than x50, or x2 or x4, for SSJ and 2 and 3 respectively.

[Chiki]

No it's doesn't you gave SSJ3 Goku a one ,we all know that isn't true cause Beerus beat, SSJ3 Gotenks quite easily.

No, reread my post. I gave SSJ3 Goku a 0.5.

I gave SSJ3 Goku a 1 when compared to Buuhan.